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In reply to the discussion: Germans illuminate message on US embassy [View all]Divernan
(15,480 posts)44. A stasi comparison is quite valid, according to a loyalist's own post
Poster Californee above provides an undocumented, unlinked, unsourced quote describing the Stasi, ending with the challenging question, "does that sound like anything going on in this country?" As long as she is happy to skip any citations, let's just give her the benefit of the doubt and hoist her on her own undocumented petard.
My reply, "it absolutely does!" and I highlight portions of her own "defense" to prove my point.
"The Stasi perfected the technique of psychological harassment of perceived enemies known as Zersetzung a term borrowed from chemistry which literally means "corrosion" or "undermining".
"By the 1970s, the Stasi had decided that methods of overt persecution which had been employed up to that time, such as arrest and torture, were too crude and obvious. It was realised that psychological harassment was far less likely to be recognised for what it was, so its victims, and their supporters, were less likely to be provoked into active resistance, given that they would often not be aware of the source of their problems, or even its exact nature. Zersetzung was designed to side-track and "switch off" perceived enemies so that they would lose the will to continue any "inappropriate" activities.
"Tactics employed under Zersetzung generally involved the disruption of the victims private or family life. This often included breaking into homes and messing with the contents moving furniture, altering the timing of an alarm, removing pictures from walls or replacing one variety of tea with another. Other practices included smear campaigns, denunciation, provocation, psychological warfare, psychological subversion, wiretapping, bugging, mysterious phone calls or unnecessary deliveries, even including sending a vibrator to a target's wife. Usually victims had no idea the Stasi were responsible. Many thought they were losing their minds, and mental breakdowns and suicide could result.
(D)oes that sound like anything going on in this country?
Absolutely! Specifically, what we see ad nauseum by the administration & its enablers are: side-tracking, smear campaigns, denunciation, provocation, and by NSA, wiretapping and bugging.
And a perfect example of stasi like behavior is seen right in this thread where the OP is attacked for posting a story which originated with a Russian news source, but also broadcast on NPR. The attackers cannot deny that this incident actually occurred, so they try their classic defense strategy of side-tracking & denunciation of the messenger. I have several friends (2 of whom just won SDX awards for investigative journalism from the Society of Professional Journalists at the National Press Club last month) who report for NPR, and believe me, they meticulously verify via multiple sources before broadcasting news stories. How conservative must you be to attack NPR as too liberal to be trustworthy?
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Please--when what's in the "cloud" are movies that haven't been released to DVD yet,
MADem
Jul 2013
#29
Really? What did you see that was "different?" You're saying he didn't steal intellectual property?
MADem
Jul 2013
#46
1992 called and wants their "Blah blah called and wants blah blah back" line back...
MADem
Jul 2013
#91
You can't say that "N" word in Germany--they'll arrest you in "Stasi-like" fashion.
MADem
Jul 2013
#7
I think they use that "Stasi" word as a sneaky substitute, for the purposes of insulting people...
MADem
Jul 2013
#80
Jesus Christ, that is not Godwin's Law. How many times must I explain this?
Gravitycollapse
Jul 2013
#11
And it's not a law, but that doesn't matter when you're tasked with trying to defend
Egalitarian Thug
Jul 2013
#17
As Germans they should have more respect for the people who suffered under the Stasi
Californeeway
Jul 2013
#9
Well let's see... there's MKultra, Cointelpro, and this guy from my neighborhood
Waiting For Everyman
Jul 2013
#22
"But when you claim that we are in a police state" Really? Where did I say that?
Waiting For Everyman
Jul 2013
#38
Hey, the Stasi wasn't intercepting my phone calls here in the USA back in the day
Fumesucker
Jul 2013
#67
Ahh, pious lectures to foreigners that they're not using their own history in a way you like... (nt)
Posteritatis
Jul 2013
#87
If I were an actor, producer, director, key grip, makeup artist, best boy, craft services provider,
MADem
Jul 2013
#24
I don't disagree that much of what Hollywood churns out is dreck, but I'll also bet that
MADem
Jul 2013
#56
Of course it's not the "primary" loss leader, but it is one--and for you to compare it to a seal is
MADem
Jul 2013
#81
Yes, because the messenger has been indicted for intellectual property theft. YAWN... nt
MADem
Jul 2013
#48
I can hear the Church Choir already. Outraged lectures to the Germans coming in 4,3,2,1...
Catherina
Jul 2013
#23
The NSA has gathered more information, renditioned more people, than the Stasi ever did
Catherina
Jul 2013
#42
+100000 "If you don't want to be compared to the Stasi, quit acting like it."
woo me with science
Jul 2013
#49
My personal favourite Choir Hymn "it's disrespectful to REAL victims of ....". One word - Hypocrites
idwiyo
Jul 2013
#60
Yep. "How dare they invoke their experiences in a way that makes us uncomfortable?!" (nt)
Posteritatis
Jul 2013
#88
If they're that worried about disprespecting REAL victims, they can address Guantanamo
Catherina
Jul 2013
#113
Except that the Patriot Act didn't disturb habeas corpus, the right to be publicly accused,
geek tragedy
Jul 2013
#82
Patriot Act, expanded byMilitary Commissions Act,National Defense Authorization Act & SCOTUS
Divernan
Jul 2013
#84
Yes, and the NDAA explicitly states that it doesn't change the law regarding detainee
geek tragedy
Jul 2013
#93
You're aware that Congress can't overrule a constitutional ruling by the SCOTUS, right?
geek tragedy
Jul 2013
#101
Nope, I just had much better professors than you when I attended law school.
geek tragedy
Jul 2013
#109
These germans... Accusing the NSA of Stasi tactics without asking our permission first!
Democracyinkind
Jul 2013
#76
Germans have every right to make idiotic comparisons to their own past. nt
geek tragedy
Jul 2013
#83