General Discussion

Samantha

(9,314 posts)

142. I believe the short answer is that a defense attorney's job is to obfuscate the evidence

Fri Jul 12, 2013, 01:20 AM

Jul 2013

It has done what I see earns it an A for effort and an E for results. Nothing changes the fact that a man with prejudices operating under a neighborhood watch umbrella in which he was to do nothing more than call the police if he observed something suspicious chose to stalk a teenage African-American young man. He ignored the police's statement that they did not need him to follow the young man since an officer was being dispatched. But follow the young man he did, against the police advisory. Profile and stalk him he did. Everything that ensured thereafter, the defendant in this case is responsible for instigating.

No obfuscation of the evidence or contradictory testimony by experts or friends and family can change that. Trayvon Martin is not on this earth today because Zimmerman initiated the chain of events which resulted in the young man's death. Zimmerman should be found guilty of manslaughter if there is any justice to be had. He was the catalyst for this tragedy.

Sam

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I'm really disheartened reading comments all over the web about this trial... [View all] dorkzilla Jul 2013 OP

Trayvon fought for and ultimately lost his life Skittles Jul 2013 #1

If anyone has the right to claim self-defense it was Trayvon. dorkzilla Jul 2013 #20

... ellisonz Jul 2013 #108

Here is my take on the trial Sherman A1 Jul 2013 #2

You're absolutely right it IS meaningless to the outcome. Let me clarify my point... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #8

I understood your point very clearly Sherman A1 Jul 2013 #148

+1 for A1 davidpdx Jul 2013 #111

Didn't he also tell Hannity that it was god's will? Little Star Jul 2013 #3

Beat me by that much! Just Saying Jul 2013 #5

He told Hannity it was Just Saying Jul 2013 #4

I was thinking the same thing! Little Star Jul 2013 #6

Thank you for your post. It says it all. nt kelliekat44 Jul 2013 #7

I can't remember a time when I was so close to tears... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #10

Do you think Singlemalt Jul 2013 #9

Prey tell, who are you quoting in your "gunner bigot" reference? Not all bigots have guns n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #11

I learned it here as I see it used all the time by other posters. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #12

And it won't get an answer because its presumptuous and pointless. BYE!!! n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #13

No, my question goes to the heart of your OP. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #16

Because every racist person I know and every racist person online Zoeisright Jul 2013 #101

There is a middle ground... Pelican Jul 2013 #157

And who were you last incarnation? uppityperson Jul 2013 #14

LOL I was JUST ABOUT TO EDIT MY LAST RESPONSE to say... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #15

Prescient does not mean what you seem to think it means. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #17

Do you think Zimmerman is innocent? hrmjustin Jul 2013 #18

Maybe you should re-read my posts. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #22

Where you a former member here before? hrmjustin Jul 2013 #25

No. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #58

You came on very strong and and seemed to know names of posters. That is very uncommon for new hrmjustin Jul 2013 #59

Was not in the courtroom. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #60

He should be found guilty! hrmjustin Jul 2013 #61

Of both charges? Singlemalt Jul 2013 #64

Both. He is guilty as sin. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #65

Another try Singlemalt Jul 2013 #67

Manslaughter and 2nd degree murder. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #68

Thanks for answering Singlemalt Jul 2013 #70

Look I am not a legal scholar but I do want to see him jail. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #71

I am not a legal scholar either. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #74

Fine then they should find him guilty on whatever gives him a longer jail term. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #76

That's nice. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #77

The evidence supports it. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #81

The evidence supports it? Singlemalt Jul 2013 #86

Well it is what I believe. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #87

If I were a juror Singlemalt Jul 2013 #94

No need to be nasty to me. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #98

I am not being nasty to you. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #106

I think I and Du is being rather patient with you. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #113

I could post Sid's graphic but I bet it isn't needed. uppityperson Jul 2013 #126

The Zimmerman trolls are coming out in force. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #127

I was on MIRT after the grade school shooting massacre, it was awful. I bet they are uppityperson Jul 2013 #128

There's it is "the disagree with the "DU" position. Get kicked ceonupe Jul 2013 #159

I never alerted on him. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #166

The old liberals and 'emotional' right wing tripe. Kingofalldems Jul 2013 #175

Based on what you have seen, read, heard, what do you think the correct verdict should be? uppityperson Jul 2013 #69

I do not play a fool's game. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #72

You do not know what I want unless you can read minds. I am looking for your opinion. uppityperson Jul 2013 #79

Did you read my reply at all? Singlemalt Jul 2013 #84

Let me try again. This is a discussion board. We share opinions and discuss things. I am looking for uppityperson Jul 2013 #90

Does one need an opinion to find out the opinion of others? Singlemalt Jul 2013 #92

Asking your opinion make you "have to be the fool"? I do not think that word means what you think it uppityperson Jul 2013 #93

Derivative Singlemalt Jul 2013 #96

I like peach pie. nt uppityperson Jul 2013 #99

Me too! Singlemalt Jul 2013 #102

Post 92. You did say it. uppityperson Jul 2013 #103

You're correct. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #109

Why would she want you to say something? hrmjustin Jul 2013 #85

Um, yes it does. and you're not looking for a conversation, you're looking for an argument. dorkzilla Jul 2013 #19

Suuuuurrrre you have. Why are you non-responsive to my question? uppityperson Jul 2013 #51

When you kill the only other eye-witness, of course there is doubt NoOneMan Jul 2013 #124

I am sick of the DUers who can't see it was TRAYVON who was using self defense Skittles Jul 2013 #151

Another DU poster has a sig line that can answer your question... Scootaloo Jul 2013 #176

Gun humpers tend to stick together Hugabear Jul 2013 #21

Right! That statement and the "these assholes always get away"... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #24

And ONLY IN AMERICA DearAbby Jul 2013 #23

Yup! dorkzilla Jul 2013 #27

That tells us a lot that we have not progressed as an humanitarian nation. lumpy Jul 2013 #75

Um no the nra did not members may have ceonupe Jul 2013 #160

Ah, so you want Zimmy to walk? Kingofalldems Jul 2013 #174

Our justice system is based on the presumption of innocence davidn3600 Jul 2013 #26

I'm not questioning the justice system.n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #28

Exactly what my questions were getting at. Singlemalt Jul 2013 #54

The fact that racism and bigotry is still in flower can affect how well the justice system works. lumpy Jul 2013 #82

OK, I'll see your point and raise you one DonCoquixote Jul 2013 #138

"Zimmerman did not even have to make bail" is not true Lurks Often Jul 2013 #172

If your attitude is "fuck reasonable doubt" then you won't understand why people think dkf Jul 2013 #29

(sigh) sorry, I didn't mean that exactly... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #32

Except the forensic evidence shows TM was on top when shot, showing dominance. dkf Jul 2013 #36

That's just ridiculous. How could it be self defense if GZ was pursuing TM??? dorkzilla Jul 2013 #38

you heaven05 Jul 2013 #42

Its like Freepers have invaded DU! LOL xoxo thanks! n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #45

They have. Just Saying Jul 2013 #112

Agree most heartedly. The Sanford police should be held accountable for their delibrate lumpy Jul 2013 #91

Just look at the rate of incarceration in the AA community dorkzilla Jul 2013 #95

Small world: Lumpy was my son's dog nickname. lumpy Jul 2013 #163

That's really funny! n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #164

You are pulling it back too far in time from the incident. dkf Jul 2013 #66

again, this was not a commentary of the judicial system n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #83

Then we may be on the same page but are debating two different things. dkf Jul 2013 #88

Very possibly! n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #89

Not entirely true. Just Saying Jul 2013 #115

If there was any evidence TM was pulling back then that would be a problem. dkf Jul 2013 #119

I really don't think the prosecution has claimed much of anything. Just Saying Jul 2013 #123

You hit it on the nose. They have poked holes but dkf Jul 2013 #133

the dominant person was the one with the gun TorchTheWitch Jul 2013 #120

Thank you! dorkzilla Jul 2013 #122

What part of the prosecution's case is in doubt to you? reusrename Jul 2013 #137

TRAYVON WAS FIGHTING FOR HIS LIFE Skittles Jul 2013 #140

So you do think TM was slamming Z to save his own life? dkf Jul 2013 #145

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Skittles Jul 2013 #146

You do realize you've just given Z grounds for self defense? dkf Jul 2013 #147

TRAYVON STOOD HIS GROUND AGAINST AN ATTACKER Skittles Jul 2013 #150

Both have right to defend themselves. dkf Jul 2013 #152

nope Skittles Jul 2013 #153

Your facts are iffy and unproven. dkf Jul 2013 #155

LOL Skittles Jul 2013 #171

I'm tired of people saying he should have run faster. bravenak Jul 2013 #30

'i'm in fear of my life therefore I am getting out of my safe car... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #34

Exactly! bravenak Jul 2013 #35

Yup. YarnAddict Jul 2013 #31

Sickening, isn't it? n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #33

Sure is. YarnAddict Jul 2013 #37

Me too, I'll be 48 in 5 weeks, and I agree it seems to be getting worse. Or maybe... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #40

amerikkka heaven05 Jul 2013 #52

I was lucky enough to learn this as a child dorkzilla Jul 2013 #62

yep heaven05 Jul 2013 #162

I've noticed that for months everywhere on the internet. It's horrible. yardwork Jul 2013 #78

Its KILLING me. Especially since (and I can't find the link right now...) dorkzilla Jul 2013 #97

No we haven't progressed, only gotten worse, a lot of it stoked by fear of losing white power. lumpy Jul 2013 #100

The fact that blacks and women have gained influence in positions of leadership and influence lumpy Jul 2013 #114

If you think of it that way, its the death knell dorkzilla Jul 2013 #130

Many people have not been endoctrinated or seriously influenced by racism and bigotry, lumpy Jul 2013 #134

DISGUSTING and IMO the A-Hole Zimmerman will get off! nt Raine Jul 2013 #39

I think for many defendants, "reasonable doubt" is viable Nevernose Jul 2013 #41

+1 dorkzilla Jul 2013 #43

That witness was more believable and made more sense, even moreso than the defense 'experts'. lumpy Jul 2013 #121

If you in your car with your gun..... TNNurse Jul 2013 #44

...and that's all this is about. Race. n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #47

Zimmermans ambition to prove that he is a super crime fighter cop and his obsession with the idea lumpy Jul 2013 #129

dont read them. Liberal_in_LA Jul 2013 #46

The most simple solutions are the best! n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #48

Someone said that Z was justified because of stuff stolen SaveAmerica Jul 2013 #49

What.The.Fuck. dorkzilla Jul 2013 #50

That's what this is all about. White people claiming their right to kill any black man. yardwork Jul 2013 #80

Really. And burglary is punishable by death now? Zoeisright Jul 2013 #105

Just read this article, it describes the situation to a T SaveAmerica Jul 2013 #139

In My Neighbor Hood, BillyRibs Jul 2013 #53

Depending on what part of NJ you're from, they'd see the white guy... dorkzilla Jul 2013 #56

That is what a reasonable person would do. Zimmerman is one warped individual and should be lumpy Jul 2013 #131

As I said in another thread, GZ is guilty as sin. No doubts whatsoever. Owl Jul 2013 #55

but wait, Owl, you have to let the justice system do its job, because dorkzilla Jul 2013 #57

Zimmerman is an MMA wannabe punk who failed at becoming s cop. Apophis Jul 2013 #63

If Trayvon were a white kid zeeland Jul 2013 #73

I'm not setting foot in that state again Zoeisright Jul 2013 #107

It's the only power for injustice we have left. zeeland Jul 2013 #110

I used to teach students only a year or two older than Trayvon, so I have HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #118

The Sanford police really thought they had this all wrapped up with a pretty bow. zeeland Jul 2013 #135

I don't understand why people treat Zimmerman's story like avebury Jul 2013 #104

That, dear Avebury, is exactly what I am talking about. dorkzilla Jul 2013 #117

Fock, haven't laughed that hard in a long time. Hoyt Jul 2013 #116

Hoyt, we ALL know you're not "Gun Friendly"!!!! LOL! dorkzilla Jul 2013 #125

I haven't seen any hatred thrown towards Martin here. Not once Captain Stern Jul 2013 #132

you haven't been here very long noiretextatique Jul 2013 #167

Zimmerman's demeanor tblue Jul 2013 #136

The web brings out the worst in people GiaGiovanni Jul 2013 #141

there are so-called progressives IN THIS THREAD who want Zimmerman to walk Skittles Jul 2013 #154

I don't know if that's the NRA culture or the fact that the prosecution did such a poor job GiaGiovanni Jul 2013 #165

the idea you cannot walk on a public road, minding your own business Skittles Jul 2013 #170

I'm with you on that. If Zimmerman had just called the cops GiaGiovanni Jul 2013 #173

I believe the short answer is that a defense attorney's job is to obfuscate the evidence Samantha Jul 2013 #142

You had me at "Fuck the "reasonable doubt"" cthulu2016 Jul 2013 #143

It's the same 100 guys pounding away on every site they can find. bluedigger Jul 2013 #144

+1 uponit7771 Jul 2013 #156

I'd love to believe that but there's too many of them n/t dorkzilla Jul 2013 #158

Pro gun rights here but this rant is righteously right. nt Jasana Jul 2013 #149

Dunning Kruger effect -- a small percentage of people post comments KurtNYC Jul 2013 #161

welcome to ameriKKKa! noiretextatique Jul 2013 #168

Racism is an ugly thing Amaya Jul 2013 #169