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In reply to the discussion: This message was self-deleted by its author [View all]Pholus
(4,062 posts)110. Okay. Let's put this "everybody does it" thing to bed here. It's simply morally repugnant.
What would you prefer? The status quo? For this all to go away? For the "haters" to just STFU? Yeah, that's easier but that's because it's the wrong decision.
By adopting this weak "everybody does it" position you are in effect admitting that there are two Apple Computer Companies:
1) the Apple of all the marketing hype -- wonderful caring creative throughful people. You know, all the stuff you'd like to be.
2) the Apple of reality -- a relatively ruthless business fixated on the bottom line just like every company.
They are sitting on gobs of cash -- more than they can apparently spend or invest -- and they can't see fit to improve the conditions for the people who made this money for them?
Really?
Oh yes, I'm sure the chocolate ration is quite generous for these workers COMPARED TO OTHERS. But these are still working like dogs for no reason other than someone can force them to in circumstances that seem quite unpleasant. I certainly wouldn't want to labor in those conditions for those hours for that pay, even if you rescaled it to US wages. The quality of life is simply appalling. I want to SEE my family more than 1 day out of every two weeks. Of course, that's why our jobs are over there now. Because somebody figured out you COULD treat these people like dogs and pay them like crap. What a WONDERFUL achievement. Bonuses for everyone! Apple stock splits again! Woohoo!
And yet you're seeking a pass for this behavior on the grounds that these complaints unfairly single out your favorite company? Why? Isn't the fact that it's occuring most of the problem instead of who gets the negative PR?
Apple is being paid a compliment here. They spend a lot of time bragging about how great they are and how successful they are. You should be HAPPY that your company, who is in the most logical position to DO something about this problem is being asked to step up to the plate. They should, and if they did others would follow merely to emulate their success.
Unless you recognize the reality of this -- which is that Apple doesn't give a crap as long as their bonus checks roll in on time and the people buying their products can be pacified or kept ignorant. If that's true, you're more cynical than even I am.
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The related post is the Scheer article which was discussed elsewhere this morning...
Pholus
Feb 2012
#9
Great point "the physical conditions are way, way above average of the norm."
grahamhgreen
Feb 2012
#13
That's easy. Make students sign a no-suicide pact with financial penalties for their survivors.
Pholus
Feb 2012
#82
Fascinating. North Korea also has a similar law, if you kill yourself, your entire family suffers.
joshcryer
Feb 2012
#88
Begs the question - how bad is the norm? We need to end the Costly Trade Agreements, increase tariff
grahamhgreen
Feb 2012
#12
Way, way? Is that some professional lingo? Is 'way, way' twice 'way' or 10x 'way'?
Bluenorthwest
Feb 2012
#14
It's a professional term: Way, way is "way to the way'th power" In other words EXPONENTIALLY. nt
Pholus
Feb 2012
#17
Your points are logical, and well reasoned, I do not expect a coherent response.
joshcryer
Feb 2012
#57
I'm glad you pointed out the required technical conditions, I probably would've overlooked that.
joshcryer
Feb 2012
#64
I'm simply amazed how things like this can ever be justified. Or that people even try...
Pholus
Feb 2012
#87
Sounds to me like "Hey, there *might* be a *surprise* inspection on Tuesday at 6:30 a.m." n/t
Earth_First
Feb 2012
#25
The board of the "Fair Labor Association" is full of corporate CEOs. What a joke!
Romulox
Feb 2012
#42
It's a significant amount, to be sure. I consider it dishonest not to disclose this fact
Romulox
Feb 2012
#47
IMHO, some of this raises questions about using DU for commercial promotion. nt
Romulox
Feb 2012
#48
So anyone who uses an electronic device has no business being concerned about the working conditions
Incitatus
Feb 2012
#58
Yes. I imagine you thought this comeback was a real winner. THEN YOU RAN ACROSS ME...
Pholus
Feb 2012
#90
I thought you said I wasn't worth debating with. I'll counter that Walmart sells loads too.
Pholus
Feb 2012
#121
Incidentally, that does prove you ran out of arguments when you resorted to "neener neener" talk.
Pholus
Feb 2012
#122
I appreciate the tactics which were brought to bear to make this happen. Very classy. See #82.
Pholus
Feb 2012
#83
Okay. Let's put this "everybody does it" thing to bed here. It's simply morally repugnant.
Pholus
Feb 2012
#110
Oh yes. People fight hard when desperate. Fundamental tenet of the "cheap labor" movement.
Pholus
Feb 2012
#112
Apple says that you too hold a blacksmith's hammer in the brave new "global economy."
Pholus
Feb 2012
#114
You make no sense. Why would ruining a perfectly functional TV make this better?
Pholus
Feb 2012
#116
Not enough? Too many? Who counts? Just call me an Apple hater; I like it.
cherokeeprogressive
Feb 2012
#80