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eppur_se_muova

(37,585 posts)

99. I wonder if those urban planners were disciples of Robert Moses ...

Mon Jul 22, 2013, 10:07 PM

Jul 2013

Moses, the "master builder" of New York's infrastructure, had a particular conception of highways which influenced city planners throughout the US at the time, and it didn't leave much room for the great unwashed whom he hardly ever even had to see from the comfort of his limousine. Many of the people he trained played a role in the planning of highways in other large cities, which is why so many seem to follow a standard model.

I believe his disciples were responsible for the spaghetti mashup in downtown Pittsburgh (actually pretty mild compared to others) and the elimination of a historic black neighborhood there. Certainly Moses himself was responsible for the gutting of Little Syria and other neighborhoods in NYC to make room for highways.

If you haven't ever read it, this is a great read, if a bit long:
http://www.powells.com/biblio/9780394720241

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OK, born and raised a Detroiter. Over 60, and here's my take on what happened. [View all] Faygo Kid Jul 2013 OP

Thank you for this bit of history, my dear Faygo Kid. CaliforniaPeggy Jul 2013 #1

Thank you, CaliforniaPeggy, for always being there for all on DU. Faygo Kid Jul 2013 #3

Gutting of Globalization liberalmike27 Jul 2013 #61

I agree, liberalmike27 JDPriestly Jul 2013 #69

i have always wondered if japan was literally 'given' the small car market. i ran across an HiPointDem Jul 2013 #75

Being a tad older than Faygo Kid ... GeorgeGist Jul 2013 #110

i'm old enough to remember that too. but appearances can be deceiving. HiPointDem Jul 2013 #111

I have lived in small towns and rural areas all of my life but the cities were something roguevalley Jul 2013 #26

Industry and national trade gave rise to cities. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #70

looks more like urban life is going to become a gated community, & suburbs the hell. suburban HiPointDem Jul 2013 #76

Depends on how you define "suburb." JDPriestly Jul 2013 #77

I think there's a standard definition for suburb though. I assume that's the one researchers are HiPointDem Jul 2013 #79

Interesting. I live close to the inner city. My area is being gentrified, but they want to build a JDPriestly Jul 2013 #83

i thought those cubicle apts were targeted at 20-somethings who don't want roommates & are HiPointDem Jul 2013 #98

K&R pscot Jul 2013 #2

I spent much of that time in Boston Warpy Jul 2013 #4

Well said. I forgot to mention Poletown in Detroit. Faygo Kid Jul 2013 #6

There were white elephants in Boston, too Warpy Jul 2013 #11

I wonder if those urban planners were disciples of Robert Moses ... eppur_se_muova Jul 2013 #99

What about the instances where that doesn't happen? Heywood J Jul 2013 #22

Those aren't going through dense, east coast city neighborhoods. Warpy Jul 2013 #25

You're correct. The last three are dense, (vaguely) midwest city neighborhoods in a city founded in Heywood J Jul 2013 #39

Why not have public transportation -- trains -- instead? JDPriestly Jul 2013 #71

That's not a blanket answer that works everywhere. ag_dude Jul 2013 #88

Trains are desirable to have as well, but trains only work in certain places. Heywood J Jul 2013 #95

the freeways are for us foreigners, at least partly hfojvt Jul 2013 #100

You have two ways to get to Windsor from Detroit navarth Jul 2013 #102

If you don't mind taking a slight detour... DissidentVoice Jul 2013 #103

That is more than a slight detour to get to Windsor navarth Jul 2013 #106

They are DissidentVoice Jul 2013 #109

Only thing that is different Warpy is that TO is not on the coast. ConcernedCanuk Jul 2013 #46

Wow! - 400, 401 - Don Valley Parkway, even snuck the CN Tower in there! ConcernedCanuk Jul 2013 #45

Great post. Scurrilous Jul 2013 #5

I was born 11 years after you and grew up 3-4 miles north of you. etherealtruth Jul 2013 #7

Hoping to complete the circle, and retire back to Michigan next year Faygo Kid Jul 2013 #9

The DIA is still incredibly wonderful! etherealtruth Jul 2013 #12

Love the Perry Hotel, and everything Petoskey Faygo Kid Jul 2013 #20

What a sad irony. surrealAmerican Jul 2013 #8

Detroit ain't "killed" - just struggling ConcernedCanuk Jul 2013 #49

My first car was Honda civic, great front wheel drive. xtraxritical Jul 2013 #57

Took the North American auto industry decades to catch on ConcernedCanuk Jul 2013 #58

I watched it happen. xtraxritical Jul 2013 #66

I saved some "Detroit Metal" though ConcernedCanuk Jul 2013 #89

Detroit was damaged by its economic model. Blanks Jul 2013 #63

What an amazing story DainBramaged Jul 2013 #10

Thanks, as well, from a fellow motorhead Mopar151 Jul 2013 #44

Speaking of pretty cars, this was mine ConcernedCanuk Jul 2013 #50

I Used to Drive liberalmike27 Jul 2013 #62

I lived in Southfield in the 50s... First Speaker Jul 2013 #13

Ah, the Chevy Vega. Brigid Jul 2013 #14

Quite honestly, I really liked my Vega. kwassa Jul 2013 #41

It could be worse, it could have been a Pinto! xtraxritical Jul 2013 #68

My ex brother in law still has his Pinto! 7962 Jul 2013 #104

I'll never forget the Pinto DissidentVoice Jul 2013 #114

I grew up in the western suburbs of Detroit. sufrommich Jul 2013 #15

Actually, that comes from people that knew Coleman well Faygo Kid Jul 2013 #18

East Town Theater, Cobo Hall, Joe Lewis Arena, etc. Holly_Hobby Jul 2013 #16

I grew up in the Flint area, and now live near Detroit. GreenEyedLefty Jul 2013 #17

K & R !!! WillyT Jul 2013 #19

China(mid70s): GHWBush, Prescott Bush, and Jackson Stephens plot with Chinese industrialists to move blm Jul 2013 #21

Googled the Bushes and Jackson Stephens... BornLooser Jul 2013 #34

It was the trade-off that paid off....for Bill. blm Jul 2013 #53

Brought into the fold. Vetted, controlled and owned by Bilderberg_Carlisle, etc. BornLooser Jul 2013 #87

Wait till you realize what a dog and pony show the whole Whitewater 'investigation' blm Jul 2013 #91

I've seen it and much more cover being given... BornLooser Jul 2013 #96

google stephens & the clintons as well. stephens (now jr) has tentacles in both parties. HiPointDem Jul 2013 #72

I'm reading the docs, statements, quotes, old news reports, etc., BornLooser Jul 2013 #85

I have: Global Fascism. Corporate empires ruled by powerful elite. blm Jul 2013 #90

For a long time now...keep 'em distracted with gadgets, gimmicks and guile. BornLooser Jul 2013 #97

Missed a big point...black people in Detroit pelister Jul 2013 #23

I think you missed my reference to that. And welcome to DU. Faygo Kid Jul 2013 #24

Some racism was brought up the Hillbilly Highway FarCenter Jul 2013 #31

Yup, racism deancr Jul 2013 #54

Once a Detroiter, always a Detroiter nt MrScorpio Jul 2013 #27

I tell people to go to a radom spot in Detroit and then in Windsor. It was intentional. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2013 #28

Brilliant and thanks. Maybe low rent/artists will help bring it back? KittyWampus Jul 2013 #29

Thank you for the story! Vinnie From Indy Jul 2013 #30

The way the Detroit politicos are playing this is telling SleeplessinSoCal Jul 2013 #32

This message was self-deleted by its author silvershadow Jul 2013 #33

great thread, thanks ! nt steve2470 Jul 2013 #35

Interesting. Thanks for your insight. Arugula Latte Jul 2013 #36

Thanks you for this post, Faygo. spartan61 Jul 2013 #37

One thing nebraska has right is annexation laws joeglow3 Jul 2013 #38

Thank you for that lovely overview. SheilaT Jul 2013 #40

excellent insight! kwassa Jul 2013 #42

Born in Detroit, 1952, dad worked for GM ... kwassa Jul 2013 #43

Rec'd for a post which is really well put together. dipsydoodle Jul 2013 #47

Born in William Beaumont hospital bluedeathray Jul 2013 #48

Regarding freeways... NWHarkness Jul 2013 #51

I'm right there with you FaygoKid! JNelson6563 Jul 2013 #52

In the Fifties, Robert Moses pretty did the same thing to the Bronx. no_hypocrisy Jul 2013 #55

Great post! Thank you so much! LiberalLoner Jul 2013 #56

Governor George Romney, father of the evil spawn, Mittens.. mountain grammy Jul 2013 #59

Many good times in Detroit. Cobo Hall, Masonic Temple, Ford Auditorium concerts L0oniX Jul 2013 #60

That photo of Northland The Blue Flower Jul 2013 #64

This article almost brought tears to my eyes. gholtron Jul 2013 #65

Well since all the Detroiters are checking in..... navarth Jul 2013 #67

kick kentuck Jul 2013 #73

History! Great stuff, Faygo Kid! calimary Jul 2013 #74

I personally think there were underlying factors that were more important than the ones in the HiPointDem Jul 2013 #78

Just curious? kentuck Jul 2013 #80

Um, I blame it on the war on unions and the working class and outsourcing, but, whatever, grahamhgreen Jul 2013 #81

+1 n/t Populist_Prole Jul 2013 #92

Hudsons downtown at Christmas was amazing... Bay Boy Jul 2013 #82

'Nother rust-belter. Cleveland - Akron - Pittsburgh. toby jo Jul 2013 #84

Great post Faygo, thanks, and thanks to those who added. Scuba Jul 2013 #86

I've called the Detroit area home for 21 years now..... llmart Jul 2013 #93

I guess there is no need to say much Faygo Kid!!! mstinamotorcity2 Jul 2013 #94

I wonder if they could lessen some of the poverty by converting some of the abandoned buildings back cstanleytech Jul 2013 #101

I believe there was a plan to do just that not too long ago 7962 Jul 2013 #105

Mixed messages going on GigiMommy Jul 2013 #107

No Mention of Redlining? Noslenca Jul 2013 #108

also low-interest & racially-targeted loans for homes in the suburbs v. the city. HiPointDem Jul 2013 #112

I now understand your ID: Faygo Kid emsimon33 Jul 2013 #113