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BlueStreak

(8,377 posts)

206. The only thing I don't understand is why the DLCers object to the word "authoritarian"

Sat Aug 17, 2013, 11:03 PM

Aug 2013

I mean, that is what this NSA business is, by definition. If one supports that, then it follows that one's political philosophy is authoritarian.

If that is who you are, then own it. Don't go around whining that somebody just calls it like it is. If one thinks authoritarian policies are right for this nation, then rather than attacking those who note the illegality and unconstitutionality of those policies, simply make the case for those authoritarian policies.

It isn't complicated.

I have yet to hear a single one of the authoritarians on this this site actually argue the validity of their philosophy. all they want to do is do ad hominem attacks on Greenwald, Snoden, Manning, and Assange. Leave the personalities. Make your case on its own merits.

We're listening. Please explain why all this illegal spying is the right course for America.

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Strange how the same people running around calling everyone Authoritarians [View all] JaneyVee Aug 2013 OP

Lots of paranoid people around here. Rex Aug 2013 #1

The fools. Igel Aug 2013 #18

I remember back in the day when it was just Agent Mike Rex Aug 2013 #19

Its the sequestration... Historic NY Aug 2013 #68

But they don't announce when, so you can't safely take advantage of the fact. Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #135

Thankfully there's still some reasonable posters here. Just Saying Aug 2013 #2

Thanls for posting this, Janey. lumpy Aug 2013 #67

True, Ma'am The Magistrate Aug 2013 #3

Nice to see you here, Sir Hekate Aug 2013 #91

Free tip: Union Scribe Aug 2013 #4

get in line. I get bullied and mocked every day for being a liberal. liberal_at_heart Aug 2013 #5

Really? Just Saying Aug 2013 #8

I guess you're not reading the right threads, LWolf Aug 2013 #183

Well if you saw 2 or 3 today how about a link or 2? Just Saying Aug 2013 #193

You must not read all that carefully. LWolf Aug 2013 #238

Despite the tone of your answer I'll respond. Just Saying Aug 2013 #239

You are correct in one thing, of course. LWolf Aug 2013 #241

This message was self-deleted by its author PowerToThePeople Aug 2013 #6

You should have started with your 4th paragraph . . . MrModerate Aug 2013 #7

It seems like the flaming hair response Just Saying Aug 2013 #10

If we had had more panic and outrage about this program and if we had asked more questions JDPriestly Aug 2013 #79

+ 1,000 cantbeserious Aug 2013 #101

Panic and outrage might get you a fan club here at DU Just Saying Aug 2013 #111

"Panic & Outrage" ? bvar22 Aug 2013 #149

Do you just read the title and then go off? Just Saying Aug 2013 #155

I really don't care whether YOU or the OP "take me". LOL bvar22 Aug 2013 #161

I was writing my reply when you posted HangOnKids Aug 2013 #164

Thanks. bvar22 Aug 2013 #171

Oh the poor dears HangOnKids Aug 2013 #172

So cute when the clique has a love in! Just Saying Aug 2013 #174

The Clique? HangOnKids Aug 2013 #175

Oh, NOW there is a conspiracy of people at DU making him look bad. bvar22 Aug 2013 #190

Oh sorry, Just Saying Aug 2013 #194

You certainly seem more interested in tossing out insults than having a debate. EOTE Aug 2013 #250

And the pacifier HangOnKids Aug 2013 #195

But SHE quoted someone HangOnKids Aug 2013 #199

Isn't funny how certain posters who have an entire forum to theirselves... last1standing Aug 2013 #205

I'm supposed to feel badly about posting occasionally Just Saying Aug 2013 #207

Maybe you should ask your clique those questions. last1standing Aug 2013 #210

I just read this conversation again Just Saying Aug 2013 #213

Ok. You're absolutely innocent of everything. last1standing Aug 2013 #214

Yeah you didn't read it. Just Saying Aug 2013 #217

You have a nice night as well. last1standing Aug 2013 #218

They have a private room... SidDithers Aug 2013 #242

Yeah sorta like Puglover Aug 2013 #243

! dionysus Aug 2013 #245

Your response indicates a big ole yes to my question. Just Saying Aug 2013 #166

I'm sure he doesn't care if you take him seriously HangOnKids Aug 2013 #162

Oh we're gonna be frank now? Okay. Just Saying Aug 2013 #167

Great! Glad To See You Posting! HangOnKids Aug 2013 #168

No, correcting grammar is what snarky people do when they don't have anything of substance to say. Just Saying Aug 2013 #173

You are too boring to converse with HangOnKids Aug 2013 #176

Bummer. Just Saying Aug 2013 #177

This message was self-deleted by its author HangOnKids Aug 2013 #165

+1 ... 1StrongBlackMan Aug 2013 #200

+100 Katashi_itto Aug 2013 #138

X1000 bvar22 Aug 2013 #147

Thank you for the well reasoned and thoughtful post. JEB Aug 2013 #182

The only thing I don't understand is why the DLCers object to the word "authoritarian" BlueStreak Aug 2013 #206

I also need to ask you, what do you think would be effective ways to deal with the problem JDPriestly Aug 2013 #81

Very good. I agree and I want to emphasize that many of us feel that this is way bigger than the Ed Suspicious Aug 2013 #88

So... KharmaTrain Aug 2013 #100

If democrats force democratic candidates to stick to a progressive platform it just sort of takes Ed Suspicious Aug 2013 #115

So if "democrats force democratic candidates to stick to a progressive platform"... KharmaTrain Aug 2013 #121

No one should stay home in 14 and 16. Who suggested that? JDPriestly Aug 2013 #152

So The NSA Could Rig Elections?? KharmaTrain Aug 2013 #215

Have you seen this Bill Moyers video? JDPriestly Aug 2013 #222

I'd Prefer Facts... KharmaTrain Aug 2013 #224

Part of the genius of the crimes of the NSA and the FISA court are that their deliberations JDPriestly Aug 2013 #226

Lots Of Speculation... KharmaTrain Aug 2013 #229

"Senator Wyden and other members of Congress hold the power JDPriestly Aug 2013 #232

This a fundamentally dishonest response.... markpkessinger Aug 2013 #191

+1 ... 1StrongBlackMan Aug 2013 #202

For starters, take a breath and look at all the information. Just Saying Aug 2013 #119

Protest itself has become a lost art. randome Aug 2013 #122

True enough. Just Saying Aug 2013 #156

+1 ... 1StrongBlackMan Aug 2013 #204

Thanks Just Saying Aug 2013 #216

Yes ... 1StrongBlackMan Aug 2013 #223

I agree with you. JDPriestly Aug 2013 #73

Spot on. nt malokvale77 Aug 2013 #159

None of the people you complain about are putting up photo spreads of Guy Fawkes Fumesucker Aug 2013 #9

is that 'another person', the President? and is that 'group' the BOG? Whisp Aug 2013 #12

I haven't come into those threads making snarky comments Fumesucker Aug 2013 #16

Oh you sweet thing Whisp! sheshe2 Aug 2013 #26

Believe it not... awoke_in_2003 Aug 2013 #56

I suggest you need to catch up on a month or two of news stories quinnox Aug 2013 #11

did the Washington Post lie about the Iraq war? Whisp Aug 2013 #14

So who can we trust? Fumesucker Aug 2013 #20

Read up about China's GhostNet Whisp Aug 2013 #23

Yeah, I bet he orders up a random drone strike to take the edge off after a hard day in Congress Fumesucker Aug 2013 #28

Are you actually defending lying to Congress now? /nt Marr Aug 2013 #62

Looks like it doesn't it. Some people have principles and some do not. nt Mojorabbit Aug 2013 #90

why of course! and I eat small ponies for brekkie! Whisp Aug 2013 #110

So THAT's where Jackpine Radical Aug 2013 #136

Maybe you "can't handle the truth of cyber warfare"... ljm2002 Aug 2013 #128

and when did I say I speak for You? Whisp Aug 2013 #129

You said, and I quote: ljm2002 Aug 2013 #133

you can put 'maybe' in bold too. Whisp Aug 2013 #139

If the name-calling stuff does not apply to me... ljm2002 Aug 2013 #140

The SnowGlenn thing was so cute! HangOnKids Aug 2013 #163

And GG??? sheshe2 Aug 2013 #32

I admire Glenn Greenwald's reporting quinnox Aug 2013 #35

I didn't read it that way creeksneakers2 Aug 2013 #50

would you still feel the same if a republican were president right now? liberal_at_heart Aug 2013 #52

Good question creeksneakers2 Aug 2013 #108

Obama Implemented the Oversight that Bush Ignored Skraxx Aug 2013 #254

K/R CakeGrrl Aug 2013 #13

You're so brave ecstatic Aug 2013 #15

Thanks to the tips being fed to them by the SOD nebenaube Aug 2013 #17

Way to prove the OP's point. Just Saying Aug 2013 #29

"Both of you Pentagon trolls can fuck off as far as I am concerned" No thanks for Cha Aug 2013 #31

yeah, well, thanks for the Alert... nebenaube Aug 2013 #49

I didn't alert on your nasty personal attack. Cha Aug 2013 #57

if you took it personally it must have been on target. nebenaube Aug 2013 #63

If you don't care then quit digging. Cha Aug 2013 #71

The hate teachers on this site have done a great job turning this once intelligent forum into lumpy Aug 2013 #75

Whatever. Cha didn't, but I did. Hekate Aug 2013 #93

... and our esteemed jurists already decided 3-3 to let it stand. Hekate Aug 2013 #95

Holy crap. I was just reading that and saw the note about alerting but figured no one could have Number23 Aug 2013 #187

Apparently you missed the "firebagger/tea-libertarian" comment in the post Marr Aug 2013 #65

All flaws are on one side, the other side has all warrant to do and say anything in any way Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #114

Indeed. Marr Aug 2013 #124

While I may the escatic is playing it down a bit.. awoke_in_2003 Aug 2013 #59

GFY. JTFrog Aug 2013 #212

I never tell anybody how to vote or what to think. I simply state how I feel and vote. liberal_at_heart Aug 2013 #21

I could've written that. tblue Aug 2013 #76

So the OP starts by accusing others... ljm2002 Aug 2013 #44

+1 So sick of that intentionally divisive "firebagger" shit. cui bono Aug 2013 #96

How about "Surveillance State Apologist"? CakeGrrl Aug 2013 #178

Um... no. Do you really think so? cui bono Aug 2013 #234

Well Done. bvar22 Aug 2013 #151

If you are not concerned about the NSA and the current admin's attitude cui bono Aug 2013 #92

Who Said "Vote 3rd Party?" HumansAndResources Aug 2013 #231

"If you don't march in lockstep to their worldview"... ljm2002 Aug 2013 #22

+1000. I'm afraid the OP is just factually wrong. Besides that lawsuit, the ACLU also is suing quinnox Aug 2013 #25

+1000 JV has not been paying attention, it seems. Th1onein Aug 2013 #34

+1 Marr Aug 2013 #66

+ a gazillion! chervilant Aug 2013 #99

Well said. Oakenshield Aug 2013 #208

The OP calls for "sane, rational voices" mick063 Aug 2013 #24

no more compromise. no more grand bargains. Now is the time to fight for the 99%. liberal_at_heart Aug 2013 #27

"our country's demise"? this is why all the derision--it's not just the blatant denial, MisterP Aug 2013 #30

Kicked and Recommending! sheshe2 Aug 2013 #33

A lot of us are long time anti-establishment types.... Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2013 #36

One has to wonder what the OP knows about things like The Gulf of Tonkin or Kent State... cherokeeprogressive Aug 2013 #53

Not to mention the Red Scare and the McCarthy era. All Right Wing in origin. Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2013 #55

Uh, 58,000 Americans died in Vietnam. Along with one or two million Vietnamese. Comrade Grumpy Aug 2013 #64

I shan't. Nor shall I forget that The President LIED us into that war. cherokeeprogressive Aug 2013 #74

Not really, it is clear that the OP is lacking in historical context going back at least to McCarthy Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #117

My guess would be nothing. malokvale77 Aug 2013 #181

Thanks JaneyVee! Iliyah Aug 2013 #37

You bash us for mocking you then say we're running around with our hair on fire. last1standing Aug 2013 #38

LOL - way to prove the OP's point to perfection tjwash Aug 2013 #40

Let's see if the OP condemns your mockery. last1standing Aug 2013 #43

They have no good faith arguments, or else they would use them. Maedhros Aug 2013 #169

What I noticed is that for all the OP's cries of unfair treatment... last1standing Aug 2013 #192

K & R SunSeeker Aug 2013 #39

Yes, pot, the kettle is black Cronus Protagonist Aug 2013 #41

Thanks, JaneyVee. Yes, there do seem to be a number of bullies among the "anti-authoritarians" here. pnwmom Aug 2013 #42

Ya think! Cha Aug 2013 #58

I like being spied on. Its fun. Lets advocate for it! New platform plank NoOneMan Aug 2013 #45

I think it's that sense of "impending doom" that's waking us up 99th_Monkey Aug 2013 #46

i am going to print this so SwampG8r Aug 2013 #47

oh when will DU get a like button? n/t nebenaube Aug 2013 #51

Thanks Janey for your OP.. Cha Aug 2013 #48

Post removed Post removed Aug 2013 #54

"no stories of innocent people being rounded up into FEMA camps" Boom Sound 416 Aug 2013 #60

Who needs FEMA camps when the U.S. already has the biggest prison system in the world? backscatter712 Aug 2013 #69

In other words Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #85

No. Buts that's kinda funny Boom Sound 416 Aug 2013 #106

You can cheerlead for the surveillance state. That's your right. backscatter712 Aug 2013 #61

Those people are every bit as much my enemy Maedhros Aug 2013 #170

When lying to Congress and the American people is claimed asna right, MannyGoldstein Aug 2013 #70

Look the other way. The party will protect you. Until they're no longer in power that is... cherokeeprogressive Aug 2013 #72

So the real objection to the NSA is a paranoid fantasy ConservativeDemocrat Aug 2013 #209

Don't surveil me without cause. cherokeeprogressive Aug 2013 #227

Unlike many people here, I don't alert. ConservativeDemocrat Aug 2013 #237

You don't alert because you think it's an abuse of the system? cherokeeprogressive Aug 2013 #240

If there's anything I'm proud to be intolerant of LittleBlue Aug 2013 #77

don't be sorry grasswire Aug 2013 #84

"lets wait for facts and evidence" tblue Aug 2013 #78

Authoritarians are those who side with authority. They take direction. Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #80

Well said. nm rhett o rick Aug 2013 #82

thank you, the OP doesn't seem to understand what authoritarian means quinnox Aug 2013 #83

A good many of us here were taught a core value: QUESTION AUTHORITY grasswire Aug 2013 #87

I was taught to question authority from two people who it would have Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #89

Very well-written OP. Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #86

My grandson would rip this OP to pieces. malokvale77 Aug 2013 #184

I hope this doesn't ruin your evening, but Summer Hathaway Aug 2013 #225

Why are you turning your lack of concern for our democracy and constitution into an attack cui bono Aug 2013 #94

See you want oversight and I want it stopped. dkf Aug 2013 #97

What is unconstitutional that you want stopped? randome Aug 2013 #118

IT, they demand that IT be stopped. JoePhilly Aug 2013 #137

"In Jewel v. NSA, EFF is suing the NSA and other government agencies on behalf of AT&T customers" muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #98

I think a lot of people like to believe that conspiratorial sufrommich Aug 2013 #102

Educate yourself. 99Forever Aug 2013 #103

If it walks like a duck, swims like a duck, has feathers and quacks like a duck hobbit709 Aug 2013 #104

+1,000,000! Authoritarians hate being called authoritarians. n/t backscatter712 Aug 2013 #113

"mocked, shamed, insulted, and called names" like "randroid racist Obama haters"? Warren Stupidity Aug 2013 #105

Easy solution. If you're happy with the NSA and the administration, snappyturtle Aug 2013 #107

This is the overly simplified attitude that creates the schism CakeGrrl Aug 2013 #179

Really? Over simplified? Nope. I won't give an inch on the 4th Amendment. nt snappyturtle Aug 2013 #230

How much bull would a woodchuck chuck... whatchamacallit Aug 2013 #109

Good post malaise Aug 2013 #112

+1. nt bemildred Aug 2013 #116

I'm really sick of the sermons about other people's errors and sins. I don't care what the 'side' is Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #120

+1000 n/t ljm2002 Aug 2013 #132

right on, JV! bigtree Aug 2013 #123

K&R BumRushDaShow Aug 2013 #125

Talk about hyperbole! Quantess Aug 2013 #126

Just because you want Corporations/Government to have strict oversight and control over everyone's Zorra Aug 2013 #127

Can the OP support this 'same people' assertion by giving mulitple examples of such or is this Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #130

It looks like classic projection. nm rhett o rick Aug 2013 #148

I am glad you posted this. I welcome a discussion of authoritarianism. rhett o rick Aug 2013 #131

"more oversight is never a bad thing" TBF Aug 2013 #134

So let's open the discussion on whether or not we should investigate the NSA and Booz-Allen. rhett o rick Aug 2013 #141

If I might add... malokvale77 Aug 2013 #185

Authoritarians love their authoritarian leaders like Clapper, Alexander, Mueller, and Comey. nm rhett o rick Aug 2013 #186

Yes, and they seem to lack a certain... malokvale77 Aug 2013 #189

Good point. nm rhett o rick Aug 2013 #219

You made an OP complaining about insults, and then you insult people in the same OP? ZombieHorde Aug 2013 #142

It IS funny. laundry_queen Aug 2013 #144

Fallacious logic. nt ZombieHorde Aug 2013 #145

No sense of irony or hypocrisy at all. bvar22 Aug 2013 #160

You shit-gobbling sons of bitches better cut out the name-calling!!! QC Aug 2013 #247

K&R War Horse Aug 2013 #143

DU rec...nt SidDithers Aug 2013 #146

Things are what they are. Savannahmann Aug 2013 #150

Not sure about in general, but on DU it is the "centrists" who are smug, condescending and arrogant. redgreenandblue Aug 2013 #153

They want to hobble law enforcement and MAKE US LESS SAFE! ...from pot smokers. Warren DeMontague Aug 2013 #154

it's more like almost everyone calling some people authoritarians carolinayellowdog Aug 2013 #157

R#59 & K for, WOW!1 Am re-posting O.P. with highlighting!1 & I for one am willing to WORSHIPJaneyVee UTUSN Aug 2013 #158

An example to support your point CakeGrrl Aug 2013 #180

Do you realize how many posts on DU... malokvale77 Aug 2013 #188

You need lessons in logic. nm rhett o rick Aug 2013 #221

Unsolicited advice MFrohike Aug 2013 #196

No, there's nothing strange about the designations stupidicus Aug 2013 #197

truth to power grasswire Aug 2013 #203

thanks stupidicus Aug 2013 #236

You know, sometimes there are not two sides to a story hueymahl Aug 2013 #198

Such a republican argument. FreeBC Aug 2013 #201

They dont even bother to look up the definition of authoritarian before they use the rhett o rick Aug 2013 #220

I actually had a cop visit damnedifIknow Aug 2013 #211

Did you get this from your copy of tiger beat? RetroLounge Aug 2013 #228

Personal insult. Lisa D Aug 2013 #244

Was I talking to you? RetroLounge Aug 2013 #246

I hope you find everything you want and need in your life. Lisa D Aug 2013 #249

Oh, does god bless me and will you pray for me too? RetroLounge Aug 2013 #252

People have long ago made up their mind how to deal with those who disagree with them davidpdx Aug 2013 #233

K&R B Calm Aug 2013 #235

I disagree with your opening quite a bit! Vinnie From Indy Aug 2013 #248

I stopped posting in any "hair on fire" threads... I wish they would go start a new website. DontTreadOnMe Aug 2013 #251

Strange how those people who deny facts call others paranoid and engaging joeybee12 Aug 2013 #253