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Showing Original Post only (View all)What do "left" and "right" mean to you? [View all]
I read a piece by Noah Millman in the American Conservative a while ago that kind of summed up how I use the terms:
I do not believe there is a conservative party in America. There is, rather, a right-wing and a left-wing party, in each case relatively speaking. The Republican Party is relatively right-wing and the Democratic Party is relatively left-wing.
Im using my own idiosyncratic definition of right and left here, but its an idiosyncrasy Im increasingly fond of. The distinction between right and left in my view has to do with the relationship to winners and losers in society. The right is more interested in rewarding winners. The left is more interested in helping out losers.
I should be clear that winners and losers are not moral terms. If the game is rigged, then both winners and losers can be undeserving. You can make a moral case for helping losers on precisely the grounds that the game is rigged against them, and they deserve better than they are getting. But you can also make a case for helping losers entirely on the grounds of need, or on the grounds that inequality as such retards social progress, without regard to desert. Similarly, you can make a moral case for increasing the reward to winners on the grounds that the game is not rigged, and they deserve everything theyve earned. But you can also make a case entirely on the grounds of dynamism, that rewarding winners is how you get a more successful society in aggregate, regardless of desert.
But the party of the right is going to be more concerned with the interests of groups that are winning (or have won in the past), whether fairly or unfairly, and the party of the left is more concerned with the interests of groups that are losing (or have not won in the past), again whether fairly or unfairly. Thats a political definition that, in my view, works pretty well over long stretches of time and through various permutations of winners and losers.
Im using my own idiosyncratic definition of right and left here, but its an idiosyncrasy Im increasingly fond of. The distinction between right and left in my view has to do with the relationship to winners and losers in society. The right is more interested in rewarding winners. The left is more interested in helping out losers.
I should be clear that winners and losers are not moral terms. If the game is rigged, then both winners and losers can be undeserving. You can make a moral case for helping losers on precisely the grounds that the game is rigged against them, and they deserve better than they are getting. But you can also make a case for helping losers entirely on the grounds of need, or on the grounds that inequality as such retards social progress, without regard to desert. Similarly, you can make a moral case for increasing the reward to winners on the grounds that the game is not rigged, and they deserve everything theyve earned. But you can also make a case entirely on the grounds of dynamism, that rewarding winners is how you get a more successful society in aggregate, regardless of desert.
But the party of the right is going to be more concerned with the interests of groups that are winning (or have won in the past), whether fairly or unfairly, and the party of the left is more concerned with the interests of groups that are losing (or have not won in the past), again whether fairly or unfairly. Thats a political definition that, in my view, works pretty well over long stretches of time and through various permutations of winners and losers.
I think this is a good point, and is a separate question from whether one is progressive or conservative.
One can be a right-wing progressive (Herbert Hoover comes to mind): that would be belief that government should align itself with society's winners, and the temperament that big sweeping changes are more effective than adapting existing institutions. One can be a left-wing conservative (dare I say it, Barack Obama comes to mind): that would be the belief that government should align itself with society's losers, but that gradual change and adapting of existing institutions is the best course of action.
Anyways, I just think of this every time I see the libertarian-focused "Political Compass" brought out as inevitably seems to happen every so often: there are a lot of ways to divide the political spectrum into different axes.
EDIT: also, can anybody confirm that I'm correct that the actual origin of the terms is where the various estates sat in Louis XVI's court?
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Right, we both are on the left so we think "reward the winners" is a bullshit sentiment
Recursion
Aug 2013
#3
Well, Millman isn't particularly interested in left or right as he calls them out here
Recursion
Aug 2013
#10
The bulk of his career has been on the Street as a trader in derivites. He cashed out 3 years ago
Bluenorthwest
Aug 2013
#32
He's an incrementalist, his interest in in the status quo which serves him, his 'thinking' is faith
Bluenorthwest
Aug 2013
#25
The author is a lifelong Wall Street trader who cashed out in 2010 to 'write' for American
Bluenorthwest
Aug 2013
#35
I think you nailed it well with 'vapid'. I'd also add self serving to his own status and story.
Bluenorthwest
Aug 2013
#42
Note the similarities to Charlie 'I'm Winning' Sheen, unearned gigs, nepotism and cash...
Bluenorthwest
Aug 2013
#48
Charlie Sheen and other spoiled brats have previously claimed that money = winning = everything.
Bluenorthwest
Aug 2013
#40