General Discussion

MFrohike

(1,980 posts)

215. I honestly have no idea

Tue Aug 20, 2013, 09:36 PM

Aug 2013

However, the question of being an accessory is completely unrelated to the link you posted. The link you posted concerned unauthorized access to a computer, not possession of stolen property, not possession of classified material, and not accomplice liability. I pointed out that your link was irrelevant to the question and the usual practice, in America and probably England, of separating the crimes of theft and possession. You were confusing the question of potential charges for Snowden with the relevant authority, and potential charges, for holding Miranda. These are completely separate issues.

I said I hope you're not a solicitor because you didn't read your own link. If you're going to play internet lawyer, which everyone tries to do at some point, then do it right.

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David Miranda was employed as a messenger to carry stolen government documents. [View all] ProSense Aug 2013 OP

And he wasn't charged with a crime because he's so handsome cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #1

You wanted him "charged with a crime"? ProSense Aug 2013 #5

Yes. Is it really so hard to accept that they got NOTHING. GeorgeGist Aug 2013 #16

You have a rather quaint notion of information as a tangible object. cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #18

You have no point. ProSense Aug 2013 #29

Oh, so it is prior-restraint of publication you are cheering? cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #37

Oh please. The outrage that this was an innocent person being detained ProSense Aug 2013 #61

Oh, so it is prior-restraint of publication you are cheering? cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #65

I'm "cheering" the apparent melt down related to the initial hype. ProSense Aug 2013 #70

So you are cheering the idea of prior restraint? cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #139

In my experience there is no logic allowed in these types of threads KurtNYC Aug 2013 #69

Just dreeeaamy! nt Zorra Aug 2013 #144

But if looks could kill. rawr Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2013 #220

That Does Seem The Case, Ma'am The Magistrate Aug 2013 #2

If that was the case and he was carrying stolen materials cali Aug 2013 #15

They probably haven't yet determined what is in the materials. pnwmom Aug 2013 #140

He wasn't arrested so apparently that's not the case. GeorgeGist Aug 2013 #19

Not Necessarily, Sir The Magistrate Aug 2013 #24

Or maybe no evidence to arrest Ma'am. n-t Logical Aug 2013 #90

You seem very comfortable with this detention- unlike many cali Aug 2013 #33

Rights Or Wrongs Of This Aside, Ma'am The Magistrate Aug 2013 #43

let me ask you what I asked the OP: How do YOU or she know what cali Aug 2013 #47

Geez. It was reported in the NYT who got it from Greenwald. Is that "proof" enough for you? MADem Aug 2013 #59

catch up grasswire Aug 2013 #83

You'll need to prove it. There are three attributions to Greenwald in that paragraph. MADem Aug 2013 #94

Because it's stupid not to expect abuse of power. DirkGently Aug 2013 #126

Especially When You Are Engaged In Tweaking It, Sir The Magistrate Aug 2013 #127

No, Sir - they are not 'stolen' muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #53

Now, Ma'am, You Are Just Being Silly The Magistrate Aug 2013 #63

+1 nt MADem Aug 2013 #68

In violation of American law, not German, British or Brazilian muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #74

I Expect, Sir, England Has Laws Against Obtaining Classified Information Without Authorization The Magistrate Aug 2013 #82

It's not UK classified information; and none of Greenwald, Poitras or Miranda muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #89

It Is Quite Possible, Sir, Ms. Poitras And Mr. Greenwald Broke Laws In Obtaining The Material The Magistrate Aug 2013 #92

+1,000 nt MADem Aug 2013 #109

Now we've realised the police have changed the circumstances under which they invoke muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #114

If This Usage Surprised Them, Sir, They Are Not Fit For Their Jobs The Magistrate Aug 2013 #120

This isn't about us, sir, it's about freedom muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #121

Actually, Sir, It Is about The Coming Elections The Magistrate Aug 2013 #124

Conveninent to blame anything on elections within 18 months muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #133

Campaigning Never Ceases Here, Sir The Magistrate Aug 2013 #134

So you're supporting the Cheney/Boehner side muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #137

By That Style, Sir, You Support The Paulite/Randite Looting Side Of The Question The Magistrate Aug 2013 #143

It was you who started trying to define this by which side had some Republicans on muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #148

My Statement, Sir, Is That Snowden Engaged In A Political Operation To Harm President Obama The Magistrate Aug 2013 #152

Is suspected possession of stolen goods against British or Brazillian law? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2013 #111

As I've pointed out, there was no theft under English law muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #117

Don't quit your day job now... MADem Aug 2013 #173

Nothing about 'theft', 'stolen' or 'steal' there muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #174

Whatever gets you through the night, there, Muriel! MADem Aug 2013 #176

I hope you're not a solicitor MFrohike Aug 2013 #213

I don't need to be a solicitor... MADem Aug 2013 #214

I honestly have no idea MFrohike Aug 2013 #215

Look, in USA we have laws against theft. MADem Aug 2013 #217

You're right MFrohike Aug 2013 #219

The bottom line is this--there's no law against having an opinion and expressing it. MADem Aug 2013 #221

You and the Magistrate have given me the first glimmer of hope I've seen on this web site in months Number23 Aug 2013 #216

Thank you. I think if we just refuse to descend to the level of those who would MADem Aug 2013 #218

this x 1000 sigmasix Aug 2013 #160

a lot of hyperbole Capn Sunshine Aug 2013 #156

Snowden is a whistleblower muriel_volestrangler Aug 2013 #159

You say, "Copies of these are fruit of a poisoned tree"... ljm2002 Aug 2013 #136

The Phrase Is Biblical in Origin, Sir, If Recollection Serves The Magistrate Aug 2013 #145

I do admire your ability to remain civil... ljm2002 Aug 2013 #150

Actually, Sir, There Have Been Statements From The Persons Involved The Magistrate Aug 2013 #155

I am not aware of any statement from Greenwald or Poitras.. ljm2002 Aug 2013 #158

This is the hill upon which you've decided to stand? Really? Egalitarian Thug Aug 2013 #146

The Magistrate hasn't changed. Some people here at DU have, but not The Magistrate. MADem Aug 2013 #177

I'm a little disappointed with you, Sir. Hassin Bin Sober Aug 2013 #184

Always defending the Police State Octafish Aug 2013 #3

hey Octafish. I have a package... Whisp Aug 2013 #10

I remember Stevie Wonder: 5 Companies That Make Money By Keeping Americans Terrified of Terror... Octafish Aug 2013 #23

Over these years I've agreed with a lot of what you say, Octafish. Whisp Aug 2013 #50

Truth is what Democracy craves. Octafish Aug 2013 #62

I'm adding that to my journal for permanent reference. robertpaulsen Aug 2013 #128

I love you, Brother robertpaulsen! Octafish Aug 2013 #183

What is the deepest most important conspiracy you know about that we don't? snooper2 Aug 2013 #17

What a profound question. Search my journal and let me know what you need help with: Octafish Aug 2013 #26

Like the Inner Party in 1984, they think they are safe, in fact immune Puzzledtraveller Aug 2013 #166

As the faithful at ENRON... Octafish Aug 2013 #182

Why wasn't he detained in Berlin? leftstreet Aug 2013 #4

really? you're actually claiming to know what he was carrying? cali Aug 2013 #6

I understand it's supposed to be Le Taz Hot Aug 2013 #7

Why wasn't he arrested then? ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #8

Would you have felt better if he had been? n/t ProSense Aug 2013 #12

answer the question instead of trying to weasel cali Aug 2013 #20

They didn't want to arrest him? They confiscated the documents? ProSense Aug 2013 #34

You should feel bad that he wasn't ... GeorgeGist Aug 2013 #21

He was not arrested because what you are saying is not the truth. Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #31

And ProSense Aug 2013 #35

If they found what you claim they found why wasn't he arrested? That article you link does not Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #57

If he was breaking the law, yes. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #54

Because carrying improperly distributed classified material isn't a crime? Recursion Aug 2013 #165

This makes zero sense. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #205

You're imagining a theoretical world Recursion Aug 2013 #209

Miranda was let go Harmony Blue Aug 2013 #9

But the big question. Did he have a healthplan? Safetykitten Aug 2013 #11

So if I have this on my Kindle I should be detained? (more) cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #13

+1 Safetykitten Aug 2013 #14

Genius eom LearningCurve Aug 2013 #22

What a great argument! ProSense Aug 2013 #32

Garnering the dreaded "refutation by LOL" = Winning cthulu2016 Aug 2013 #38

It's the ProSense pattern NuclearDem Aug 2013 #103

Indeed... truebrit71 Aug 2013 #180

what an exceedingly lame refutation of said argument cali Aug 2013 #39

Argument: Well someone has a book titled, "The Pentagon Papers." ProSense Aug 2013 #45

why are you weaseling out of the question you've been asked multiple times? cali Aug 2013 #49

Actually, ProSense Aug 2013 #56

You keep posting that, but it does nothing to support your assertions. Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #60

She believes that by repeating it enough times it becomes fact LondonReign2 Aug 2013 #157

the sentence included is not attributed to Greenwald. grasswire Aug 2013 #91

So you don't trust Glenn Greenwald's word? He's the source of "what was David carrying." MADem Aug 2013 #67

The denials and name calling for acknowledging this fact is a thing to watch. ProSense Aug 2013 #78

Exactly!!! I am just astounded at how some wade in, fists-a-flailing, when they haven't even read MADem Aug 2013 #93

Where in that does Greenwald say the documents were stolen? EOTE Aug 2013 #163

He says he got them from Snowden, and Snowden admits that he stole them in that MADem Aug 2013 #167

He does not specify which documents where given and whether or not they were stolen. EOTE Aug 2013 #169

I tell you what--you believe whatever you need to believe to get through your day. MADem Aug 2013 #170

Ah, so so long as the government has a reasonably good suspicion someone's carrying stolen documents EOTE Aug 2013 #172

Let's try this one more time, since you plainly didn't read what I wrote. MADem Aug 2013 #175

Your "argument" was that Greenwald used Miranda to move stolen documents. EOTE Aug 2013 #185

You need to check yourself, and I'm uninterested in your mating habits, sorry. MADem Aug 2013 #186

I'm just as capable as you are of making unsubstantiated claims. EOTE Aug 2013 #187

You're quite desperate for a fight. You're not going to get it from me, because you don't MADem Aug 2013 #188

I'm not looking for a fight, I'm looking for information. If you don't have it, that's fine. EOTE Aug 2013 #194

I did not make a claim that wasn't backed up. You just didn't like what I said, so you're badgering MADem Aug 2013 #195

OK. I'll ask again. Where does it say that Miranda was carrying stolen documents? EOTE Aug 2013 #196

Here ya go. MADem Aug 2013 #197

Here ya go. EOTE Aug 2013 #199

You can't be bothered to follow the news, so I can't be bothered to continue this charade. nt MADem Aug 2013 #200

LOL. I don't follow the news because I ask you to provide a smidgeon of evidence to back up your EOTE Aug 2013 #201

Yep, and you have a swell day, now! Do some reading, why don't you? nt MADem Aug 2013 #202

Yep, and you have a swell day constructing your own reality. EOTE Aug 2013 #203

He admits no such thing. EOTE Aug 2013 #198

Not just a book, but STOLEN GOVERNMENT INFORMATION! EOTE Aug 2013 #162

This is what you've been reduced to? EOTE Aug 2013 #161

Is he paid by the TROVE? Waiting For Everyman Aug 2013 #25

Apparenly nothing is illegal in the world of make-believe. tridim Aug 2013 #27

What law did he break? ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2013 #55

+1. The defense of the theft is 'If we win, it won't be illegal, as we'll make the rules then...' freshwest Aug 2013 #141

If that was the case he would have been arrested. He was not arrested. This indicates they had Bluenorthwest Aug 2013 #28

+1 Apparently the obvious is lost Harmony Blue Aug 2013 #36

funny how the Labour Party is outraged about it. cali Aug 2013 #42

Well that isn't far from the truth Harmony Blue Aug 2013 #95

Greenwald: Brazil�s Intervention Likely Kept Partner from Being Charged Under UK Terrorism Law ProSense Aug 2013 #123

You do NOT know those documents were stolen. fasttense Aug 2013 #30

You should clearly state in your post that this is nothing more than your opinion. DisgustipatedinCA Aug 2013 #40

When did you see the docs? Coyotl Aug 2013 #41

More lame BS on a subject of which you know nothing. hobbit709 Aug 2013 #44

Obvious trolling is obvious. DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #46

You Are, Of Course, Sir, Referring To Your Own Comment, When You Speak Of Obvious Trolling...? The Magistrate Aug 2013 #52

Says someone... one_voice Aug 2013 #58

And you just happened to look this up? hobbit709 Aug 2013 #66

Yeah, I looked at their... one_voice Aug 2013 #71

The irony of it all. hobbit709 Aug 2013 #72

Yep, I'm a thorn in the side of the propaganda machine. DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #75

You're not a thorn... one_voice Aug 2013 #79

Nope, I'm definitely a thorn calling out the obvious propagandists. DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #84

As You Said Above, Sir: Obvious Trolling Is Obvious The Magistrate Aug 2013 #99

Yep, it is obvious. I'm calling out the propagandists. DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #106

What Is Obvious, Sir, Is That You Are Being Disruptive, By The Judgement Of The Community The Magistrate Aug 2013 #108

We'll have to agree, Sir, to disagree, Sir. DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #112

That The Community Views You As Disruptive And Offensive, Sir, Is A Matter Of Plain Fact The Magistrate Aug 2013 #113

Nope, it means a few people, Sir, on a jury, Sir, DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #118

It Means, Sir, Solid Majorities Among Persons Selected At Random, To Represent The Community The Magistrate Aug 2013 #122

You can't please all the people all the time, Sir, Sir, Sir. DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #130

Always Fun To Fight A Fella Leads With His Face, Sir The Magistrate Aug 2013 #131

Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir, Sir DesMoinesDem Aug 2013 #132

Ha ha ha! Love that film clip! MADem Aug 2013 #168

You'll drive any stagecoach off the cliff whatchamacallit Aug 2013 #48

DU rec...nt SidDithers Aug 2013 #51

Oh great, More Propaganda from NonSense AZ Progressive Aug 2013 #64

"Propaganda from NonSense...It seems that NonSense" ProSense Aug 2013 #76

Nope. ocpagu Aug 2013 #81

Who are you, and ProSense Aug 2013 #97

I'm a DUer. ocpagu Aug 2013 #104

Would you have posted all that you have if there was a President Romney in office Puzzledtraveller Aug 2013 #73

No. Now what? Why are you upset that I posted it? n/t ProSense Aug 2013 #77

So you admit that if there was a President Romney or Mccain Puzzledtraveller Aug 2013 #80

I'm amazed you got such a frank and succinct answer there. Marr Aug 2013 #88

LOL! ProSense Aug 2013 #96

I agree Marr Puzzledtraveller Aug 2013 #100

So you're merely defending this bullshit because it's a democrat doing it? EOTE Aug 2013 #164

No, ProSense Aug 2013 #190

You said you wouldn't have posted your OP if Romney were in office rather than Obama. EOTE Aug 2013 #192

Yes, see my previous comment. n/t ProSense Aug 2013 #193

You squirt out links like an octopus squirts ink. Marr Aug 2013 #204

Nice speculation, I guess that could be true. Rex Aug 2013 #85

I guess there really is nothing you won't defend. /nt Marr Aug 2013 #86

Can i ask a (probably) silly question? SwissTony Aug 2013 #87

You'd have to ProSense Aug 2013 #98

Yeah, but the reports coming out are contradictory. SwissTony Aug 2013 #102

But then they'd have to kill the high school student, torch their digs and send out body doubles. randome Aug 2013 #105

Having your partner detained for 9 hours SwissTony Aug 2013 #107

Ah, the talking points have been distributed. Matariki Aug 2013 #101

What are they? n/t ProSense Aug 2013 #110

A List Of Things To Say, Ma'am, Like Calling What People Who Disagree With You Say 'Talking Points' The Magistrate Aug 2013 #115

Ahh good to see OP is busy in service to the Homeland corporate state Katashi_itto Aug 2013 #125

Straight to the trashcan with this OP. n/t PowerToThePeople Aug 2013 #116

But first, let me post an anouncement. n/t ProSense Aug 2013 #119

It is important at this juncture to listen brisas2k Aug 2013 #129

Wow, you apologists are really grasping at straws! HooptieWagon Aug 2013 #135

You forgot Hitler's Nazis Hooptie. tridim Aug 2013 #142

"MLK had a dream.." Tweets regarding GG's hype Cha Aug 2013 #138

"David Miranda was employed as a messenger to carry..." MrMickeysMom Aug 2013 #147

Do you need some knee pads? nt Incitatus Aug 2013 #149

is this an objective assessment? Enrique Aug 2013 #151

Some posters here on this very site may be employed JEB Aug 2013 #153

I guess as you see it, the Guardian, the NYT and the WaPo Vinnie From Indy Aug 2013 #154

..... TBF Aug 2013 #171

blah blah blah blah blah etc ...give it a rest. bowens43 Aug 2013 #178

Flawed analogy TomClash Aug 2013 #179

Nothing wrong with the analogy ProSense Aug 2013 #189

Of course it is flawed TomClash Aug 2013 #206

I think ProSense Aug 2013 #210

You miss the point, not me TomClash Aug 2013 #223

Nonsense...... Logical Aug 2013 #181

Your rebuttal is a cartoon? ProSense Aug 2013 #191

Most your OPs are a joke, what is the difference? Logical Aug 2013 #207

You're not obsessed with the cartoonist? ProSense Aug 2013 #208

If hte cartoonist posted 10 cartoons about the same fucking topic.... Logical Aug 2013 #211

Yeah, ProSense Aug 2013 #212

Good post. n/t AverageJoe90 Aug 2013 #222