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ProSense

(116,464 posts)
147. Bullshit. Kerry
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 09:21 AM
Sep 2013

was not the President. Bush didn't just lie before the vote. He lied during and after the vote.

There were no UN inspectors in Iraq when Congress voted on the IWR, but they returned shortly after.

July 5, 2002

Iraq once again rejects new UN weapons inspection proposals.

<...>

November 13, 2002

Iraq accepts U.N. Security Council Resolution 1441 and informs the UN that it will abide by the resolution.

Weapons inspectors arrive in Baghdad again after a four-year absence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_disarmament_crisis_timeline_2001-2003


Following the mandate of the United Nations Security Council Resolution 1441, Saddam Hussein allowed UN inspectors to return to Iraq in November 2002. UNMOVIC led inspections of alleged chemical and biological facilities in Iraq until shortly before the U.S. invasion of Iraq in March 2003, but did not find any weapons of mass destruction. Based on its inspections and examinations during this time, UNMOVIC inspectors determined that UNSCOM had successfully dismantled Iraq’s unconventional weapons program during the 1990s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Monitoring,_Verification_and_Inspection_Commission

Bush removed the inspectors before launching the invasion. He had it all planned. He had a Senate that was in complete agreement that Saddam possesed WMD based on the bogus intelligence fed them. The Senate was voting on several versions of the resolution to authorize force, including the Byrd Amendment with an expiration date one year from passage.

Here is the Durbin Amendment, which only got 30 votes, including Feingold and Kennedy.

To amend the authorization for the use of the Armed Forces to cover an imminent threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction rather than the continuing threat posed by Iraq.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=107&session=2&vote=00236


The Byrd Amendment got 31 votes, Kennedy voted for, Feingold voted against.

To provide a termination date for the authorization of the use of the Armed Forces of the United States, together with procedures for the extension of such date unless Congress disapproves the extension.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=107&session=2&vote=00232

Bush only needed a few months to launch the war. Setting a date for the termination of the authorization would still have given Bush enough time to lie and launch a war. And as anyone could see, once the Iraq war was launched, none of these Senators committed to forcing a withdrawal. In 2006, Kerry-Feingold, setting a date for withdrawal, got 13 votes.

After the IWR vote, Bush lied, first in his state of the union:

Hubris: The Selling of the Iraq War - Monday 2/18 at 9 p.m. ET

By Will Femia

Last night Rachel pointed out that this year marks the tenth anniversary of President George W. Bush's State of the Union address containing the now infamous 16 words that turned out to be a very consequential lie:

“The British Government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa .”

Included in a collection of web materials associated with Rachel's upcoming documentary "Hubris: The Selling of the Iraq War," is a longer cut of that 2003 State of the Union address. It's a powerful reminder of how thick the Bush administration laid it on to rally the nation to war in Iraq:

- more -

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2013/02/14/16966287-hubris-the-selling-of-the-iraq-war-monday-218-at-9-pm-et


How Powerful Can 16 Words Be?
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/0720-09.htm

...and then in the bullshit letter and report he sent to Congress claiming a link to the 9/11 attacks.

March 18, 2003

Dear Mr. Speaker: (Dear Mr. President: )

Consistent with section 3(b) of the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002 (Public Law 107-243), and based on information available to me, including that in the enclosed document, I determine that:

(1) reliance by the United States on further diplomatic and other peaceful means alone will neither (A) adequately protect the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq nor (B) likely lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq; and

(2) acting pursuant to the Constitution and Public Law 107-243 is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

Sincerely,

GEORGE W. BUSH

http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2003/03/20030319-1.html

Hubris: Selling the Iraq War - The Rumsfeld memos
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022394769

Bush's signing statement spelled out his intent to ignore the conditional aspects of the IWR. He acknowledged that while Congress agreed that a threat existed, they didn't give him the full support to launch a war unconditionally.

Statement on Signing the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002
October 16th, 2002

<...>


The debate over this resolution in the Congress was in the finest traditions of American democracy. There is no social or political force greater than a free people united in a common and compelling objective. It is for that reason that I sought an additional resolution of support from the Congress to use force against Iraq, should force become necessary. While I appreciate receiving that support, my request for it did not, and my signing this resolution does not, constitute any change in the long-standing positions of the executive branch on either the President's constitutional authority to use force to deter, prevent, or respond to aggression or other threats to U.S. interests or on the constitutionality of the War Powers Resolution. On the important question of the threat posed by Iraq, however, the views and goals of the Congress, as expressed in H.J. Res. 114 and previous congressional resolutions and enactments, and those of the President are the same.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=64386

Statements by Senators at the time.

We Still Have a Choice on Iraq

By John F. Kerry
Published: September 06, 2002

It may well be that the United States will go to war with Iraq. But if so, it should be because we have to -- not because we want to. For the American people to accept the legitimacy of this conflict and give their consent to it, the Bush administration must first present detailed evidence of the threat of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction and then prove that all other avenues of protecting our nation's security interests have been exhausted. Exhaustion of remedies is critical to winning the consent of a civilized people in the decision to go to war. And consent, as we have learned before, is essential to carrying out the mission. President Bush's overdue statement this week that he would consult Congress is a beginning, but the administration's strategy remains adrift.

Regime change in Iraq is a worthy goal. But regime change by itself is not a justification for going to war. Absent a Qaeda connection, overthrowing Saddam Hussein -- the ultimate weapons-inspection enforcement mechanism -- should be the last step, not the first. Those who think that the inspection process is merely a waste of time should be reminded that legitimacy in the conduct of war, among our people and our allies, is not a waste, but an essential foundation of success.

If we are to put American lives at risk in a foreign war, President Bush must be able to say to this nation that we had no choice, that this was the only way we could eliminate a threat we could not afford to tolerate.

In the end there may be no choice. But so far, rather than making the case for the legitimacy of an Iraq war, the administration has complicated its own case and compromised America's credibility by casting about in an unfocused, overly public internal debate in the search for a rationale for war. By beginning its public discourse with talk of invasion and regime change, the administration has diminished its most legitimate justification of war -- that in the post-Sept. 11 world, the unrestrained threat of weapons of mass destruction in the hands of Saddam Hussein is unacceptable and that his refusal to allow in inspectors is in blatant violation of the United Nations 1991 cease-fire agreement that left him in power.

- more -

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/06/opinion/we-still-have-a-choice-on-iraq.html


Feingold on the Senate floor, September 26, 2002:

<...>

The threat we know is real--Iraq's pursuit of weapons of mass destruction or WMD--is unquestionably a very serious issue. What is the mission? Is the mission on the table disarmament or is it regime change? Has anyone heard a credible plan for securing the weapons of mass destruction sites as part of a military operation in Iraq ? Has anyone heard any credible plan for what steps the United States intends to take to ensure that weapons of mass destruction do not remain a problem in Iraq beyond the facile ``get rid of Saddam Hussein'' rallying cry?

Saddam Hussein is a vile man with a reckless and brutal history, and I have no problem agreeing that the United States should support regime change. I agree with those who assert that Americans, Iraqis, and the people of the Middle East would be much better off if he were no longer in power. But he is not the sole personification of a destabilizing WMD program. Once Hussein's control is absent, we have either a group of independent, self-interested actors with access to WMD or an unknown quantity of a new regime. We may face a period of some chaos, wherein a violent power struggle ensues as actors maneuver to succeed Saddam.

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CREC-2002-09-26/pdf/CREC-2002-09-26-pt1-PgS9412-2.pdf#page=1
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CREC-2002-09-26/pdf/CREC-2002-09-26-pt1-PgS9413.pdf#page=1


Kennedy slams Bush on Iraq
'Wrong war at the wrong time'

By Sean Loughlin
CNN Washington Bureau

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- In a stinging rebuke of the Bush administration's foreign policy, Sen. Edward Kennedy predicted Tuesday that a military strike against Iraq would "undermine" the war against terrorism, "feed a rising tide of anti-Americanism overseas" and strain diplomatic ties.

<...>

Kennedy said U.N. weapons inspectors need more time to discover what kind of weapons Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein may be amassing in Iraq.

Bush, however, said Tuesday that Saddam was not disarming his nation and was giving the world community "the runaround." (Full story) ...But in an interview with CNN, Sen. Chuck Hagel, a Nebraska Republican and member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, urged the Bush administration not to rush toward any confrontation with Iraq.

"We need to be patient here; time is on our side here," Hagel said. He added that a "precipitous" move would "endanger not just Americans around the world, but it would endanger this country, our security, stability in the world for a long time to come because we were rash in using our power."

- more -

http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/01/21/kennedy.speech/index.html


Kerry Says US Needs Its Own 'Regime Change'
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/0403-08.htm

Bush lied the country into war. He pulled the trigger despite protests even from members of Congress.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022537683

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

John Kerry is a Good Man [View all] alcibiades_mystery Sep 2013 OP
Last refuge of corporate neocon/neolib talking points: woo me with science Sep 2013 #1
+1000 forestpath Sep 2013 #2
And the attacks lobbed against Kerry weren't personal Skidmore Sep 2013 #3
Preach brutha! Adrahil Sep 2013 #143
You noticed that, huh? RC Sep 2013 #155
LOL, like you never "make it personal"... SPARE US phleshdef Sep 2013 #13
+1,000 nt MADem Sep 2013 #46
&quot;Thread to mourn the passing of the soul of John Kerry&quot; isn't personal? Isn't hate? pnwmom Sep 2013 #36
+1 Marr Sep 2013 #42
Wrong - the op differentiated between policy and individual karynnj Sep 2013 #56
+1 grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #66
Ok, how about he's a kinder, nicer, more loving, War-mongering Devil. Katashi_itto Sep 2013 #83
I preferred his testimony before Congress in 1971 ripcord Sep 2013 #106
Nailed It. bvar22 Sep 2013 #111
+10,000 (NT) Zavulon Sep 2013 #150
I have nno problem with disagreeing. tazkcmo Sep 2013 #4
So he's a good man, who keeps voting for PNAC wars time and time again? Sorry, not buying it. reformist2 Sep 2013 #5
He's a fucking sell-out... MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #6
Why is it an outrage that Teresa Heinz Kerry was there? karynnj Sep 2013 #58
Because, it had nothing to do with justice and everything to do with... MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #85
I seriously do not understand your logic karynnj Sep 2013 #88
Think about it... MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #93
The real outrage was that Flag pin he was wearing... YvonneCa Sep 2013 #62
Any of them wearing it at this point is an embarrassment... MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #86
I judge a man by his actions. avaistheone1 Sep 2013 #7
I think you are NOT - you completely ignore his 8years of engaging blm Sep 2013 #21
John Kerry could have been working on this for 100 years. avaistheone1 Sep 2013 #24
You claim he is deliberately lying. You refuse context. blm Sep 2013 #34
Fuck, blm, give it up. OnyxCollie Sep 2013 #47
And, armed with words referencing other conflicts, wisteria Sep 2013 #72
Your glowing, emotional, non-rational response notwithstanding, OnyxCollie Sep 2013 #90
Horsepoo - yours is the under-informed, irrational response. blm Sep 2013 #97
You ignored the white phosphorus used in Fallujah. OnyxCollie Sep 2013 #107
Take it up with TeamClinton - they were the ones protecting Bush blm Sep 2013 #108
Give up to the LIES being spread about Kerry? No. Lazyminded people blm Sep 2013 #94
YOU keep throwing your little tantrum. OnyxCollie Sep 2013 #98
Baloney - Because I see a BIGGER picture on Snowden's role, and don't accept blm Sep 2013 #100
I guess it was Kerry's little secret then. avaistheone1 Sep 2013 #82
The press DIDN'T CARE. The RW media, however, targeted him blm Sep 2013 #96
Do you get that his work has been resolving conflict... YvonneCa Sep 2013 #65
Which conflicts has he resolved? nt. polly7 Sep 2013 #74
You'd have been happy if we had a full on war in Syria in 2005? blm Sep 2013 #101
Bullshit, we were already spread to the breaking point. No way a front was going TheKentuckian Sep 2013 #132
Then you don't know how close we were. blm Sep 2013 #137
Fingers in their ears, blm. David Zephyr Sep 2013 #130
Exactly. Truth matters. blm Sep 2013 #138
Other than your "gut" what backs up your feeling that he's lying? Adrahil Sep 2013 #144
Thank you mcar Sep 2013 #8
+1 Hekate Sep 2013 #12
You ain't kidding. jessie04 Sep 2013 #30
Exactly. He is a good man. Conflict resolution has been his life's work. And... YvonneCa Sep 2013 #35
I don't hate John Kerry personally. But I do hate the policy that he is advocating totodeinhere Sep 2013 #128
FWIW, I haven't noticed hateful posts... YvonneCa Sep 2013 #131
Absolutely. Grateful for Hope Sep 2013 #38
I think he is a good man. hrmjustin Sep 2013 #9
"You're all better than that." Summer Hathaway Sep 2013 #10
No forum does hair on fire hyperbole better sufrommich Sep 2013 #11
Truly lumpy Sep 2013 #41
Ya know, I've been here for ten liberalhistorian Sep 2013 #61
I'm only going to slightly disagree. No remotely credible forum does hair on fire hyperbole better.. stevenleser Sep 2013 #141
Thanks for that, alcibiades. Hekate Sep 2013 #14
I'm bordered by these Noble men allowing themselves Hutzpa Sep 2013 #15
I disagree, I thank they have something on Kerry and it must be a whopper. Eddie Haskell Sep 2013 #16
+1 leftstreet Sep 2013 #25
Most people are good. Most politicians are people. bhikkhu Sep 2013 #49
Are you being serious? wisteria Sep 2013 #75
Yes Eddie Haskell Sep 2013 #120
I neither know or particularly care cali Sep 2013 #17
He is pushing for a humanitarian strike. wisteria Sep 2013 #73
"humanitarian strike" progressoid Sep 2013 #95
A 'humanitarian strike' based on 'military intelligence' :) - nt HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #148
Anyone with the GALL to use the phrase "humanitarian bombing" woo me with science Sep 2013 #105
+10000 intersectionality Sep 2013 #121
We're going to liberate the fuck out of those Syrians - nt HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #152
fresh frozen jumbo humanitarian strike frylock Sep 2013 #126
Thanks so much. I agree. babylonsister Sep 2013 #18
Kerry is proof that ProSense Sep 2013 #19
LOL, anyone who disagrees with ANYTHING Obama does will be venomously attacked by you! n-t Logical Sep 2013 #23
Reality lumpy Sep 2013 #43
Kerry is proof that anyone who voted for invading Iraq to find WMDs will have a hard time Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #104
+Infinity! - nt HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #153
The fact that he IS a good man makes me weep all the more. Faryn Balyncd Sep 2013 #20
He believes what the administration tells him to believe. n-t Logical Sep 2013 #22
How could a 'good man' be a politician? n/t leftstreet Sep 2013 #26
Puh-leese shenmue Sep 2013 #29
Politicians do not make up the 'government' leftstreet Sep 2013 #33
This is DU shenmue Sep 2013 #27
The ant-government people think we can exist with decisions I guess. lumpy Sep 2013 #44
who are the ant-government (sic) people here that are against the war? frylock Sep 2013 #127
Thank you. + 1,000,000 jessie04 Sep 2013 #28
Thank you. nt. MH1 Sep 2013 #31
He just had a Colin Powell moment Hydra Sep 2013 #32
This post makes a lot of sense. Maedhros Sep 2013 #123
"The evil that men do lives after them; The good HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #154
tyvm! Hydra Sep 2013 #157
why do you love Iran so much?! MisterP Sep 2013 #37
I disagree. QuestForSense Sep 2013 #39
Oye. The same Kerry who protested babylonsister Sep 2013 #53
The same Kerry who makes a lot of money off of defense contracts OnyxCollie Sep 2013 #68
Yeah - Heinz and Pepsi products on bases are HUGE warmongering blm Sep 2013 #109
Yes, he is. QuestForSense Sep 2013 #92
Exactly, alcibiades_mystery. All this "Kerry has no soul".. Cha Sep 2013 #40
And that is the truth. Wonder how some of these people would respond to Canada being lumpy Sep 2013 #45
I agree with this post. Let's dial it back a bit. mountain grammy Sep 2013 #48
+1000% marble falls Sep 2013 #50
He is an honourable man ! Nt Sand Wind Sep 2013 #51
The ones spouting the ugliest crap are the least well informed. KittyWampus Sep 2013 #52
But he ate dinner with Assad!!11! DINNER!!1!!1...nt SidDithers Sep 2013 #54
It's character assisination, plain and simple. baldguy Sep 2013 #55
I grant you this...you are a thinking person who is trying to KoKo Sep 2013 #57
As a MA resident, I've had the opportunity to meet him many times graywarrior Sep 2013 #59
How DARE you post this crap graywarrior Sep 2013 #129
Kerry was an empty suit back in '04, fall guy for George W. Bush blkmusclmachine Sep 2013 #60
Baloney. blm Sep 2013 #102
K&R. David Zephyr Sep 2013 #63
K&R. And it was nice to come home to your post as well, DZ. freshwest Sep 2013 #67
Huzzah! Thank you. cheapdate Sep 2013 #64
I do not share your opinion regarding stiking Syria, but wisteria Sep 2013 #69
"You're all better than that." Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2013 #70
if he truely believes the US should be involved syria then not only is he not a good man bowens43 Sep 2013 #71
Ok, so he's not an asshole LibAsHell Sep 2013 #76
K & R Iliyah Sep 2013 #77
Kick for civility politicasista Sep 2013 #78
The Kerry of today is consistent with the Kerry of the 60's. lexington filly Sep 2013 #79
Were you saying the same thing in the 60's? MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #87
I Doubt John Kerry Threw His Speech in the Air On the Road Sep 2013 #80
"John Kerry is a Good Man" ... Damn straight he is a good man Botany Sep 2013 #81
Kerry is a warmongering scoundrel. Old Union Guy Sep 2013 #84
Kerry would have to be an idiot to be sincere in the arguments he is making, and he isn't an idiot. yurbud Sep 2013 #89
Or maybe he knows what he's talking about, and you can't accept that. n/t ProSense Sep 2013 #91
I am not going to treat a politician different because he has a "D" after his name. 1awake Sep 2013 #99
I reread the OP several times. It says nothing about doing that. nt stevenleser Sep 2013 #142
Sincerely, coming from you this sentiment carries a great deal of of weight Turborama Sep 2013 #103
Thanks alcibiades_mystery Sep 2013 #115
A good man who voted for the Iraq War Downtown Hound Sep 2013 #110
Just curious, but... bvar22 Sep 2013 #112
Was a good man. morningfog Sep 2013 #113
It's the same thing they said about Colin Powell... Romulox Sep 2013 #114
I doubt either Kerry or Obama would have sinister motives IronLionZion Sep 2013 #116
"Democrats do it with far less civilian casualties." Downtown Hound Sep 2013 #117
And since then? IronLionZion Sep 2013 #118
What do you think has been learned and why? TheKentuckian Sep 2013 #134
The Powers That Be have also learned to control the media Downtown Hound Sep 2013 #135
LBJ made his mistakes in Vietnam but by 1968 he wanted out and tried to do so but .... Botany Sep 2013 #140
He's lost something. You can pick what. Union Scribe Sep 2013 #119
So by Kerry's rational Moses2SandyKoufax Sep 2013 #124
How dare you take a moderately measured stand! JohnnyRingo Sep 2013 #122
K & R SunSeeker Sep 2013 #125
I used to think so. I voted for him for President. Beausoir Sep 2013 #133
This message was self-deleted by its author AtomicKitten Sep 2013 #136
Facts my ASS! Kerry testified he has 100% certainty about future. That's witchcraft, not facts. Coyotl Sep 2013 #139
+1000 BklnDem75 Sep 2013 #145
John Kerry has the blood of 1,000,000 Iraqis on his hands. Once you get past that, yeah, HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #146
Bullshit. Kerry ProSense Sep 2013 #147
In 2004 on the campaign trail, Kerry said he would have voted to attack Iraq even if he HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #149
Nonsense. n/t ProSense Sep 2013 #151
The November 2002 vote is defensible. Going to war after the March 2003 UN Weapons inspector reports stevenleser Sep 2013 #156
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