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Response to delrem (Reply #16)

Warren DeMontague This message was self-deleted by its author.

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Let's End the Pledge of Allegiance in Schools [View all] xchrom Sep 2013 OP

I'm all for it. School is about education, not ingraining loyalty to the state NuclearDem Sep 2013 #1

Schools have nothing to do with education. hobbit709 Sep 2013 #8

Correction: schools SHOULD be about education. NuclearDem Sep 2013 #22

Well put. .... spin Sep 2013 #69

I swore allegiance to the Constitution when I was inducted into the military in the early '70s . . . Journeyman Sep 2013 #2

Well said. n/t Laelth Sep 2013 #4

Interesting history at link PADemD Sep 2013 #3

As I understand the original purpose of the pledge ... Laelth Sep 2013 #5

If you really want to piss off a RWer, tell them it was written by a Socialist. hobbit709 Sep 2013 #9

Precisely. n/t Laelth Sep 2013 #13

Not true. The Pledge was in response to the Chicago Worlds Fair pitbullgirl1965 Sep 2013 #37

Tell them anyway. truebluegreen Sep 2013 #41

I don't believe in some stupid fundamentalist/literalist/politicized notion of "God". delrem Sep 2013 #6

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #12

Because the pledge isn't to the Planet Earth, it's to the US republic. delrem Sep 2013 #16

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #25

I don't think it necessarily does. delrem Sep 2013 #42

then change it to Goddess and see how many evangelical Christian heads explode. liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #43

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #45

You're just insulting. No other content. delrem Sep 2013 #50

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #52

That's a valid argument. delrem Sep 2013 #56

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #58

And what makes you imagine that I'm such a "true believer". delrem Sep 2013 #60

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #64

I did NOT argue in favor of the existence of a "soul" or "spirit". delrem Sep 2013 #66

and to imply anything other than that is a provocation. liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #54

But that has no meaning except to be provocative. delrem Sep 2013 #46

Give me a break. I'm not buying it. Fundamentalist Christians want to be able to worship in liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #49

The US Pledge of allegiance isn't a prayer, it isn't an act of worship. delrem Sep 2013 #62

If you think you have a reasonable argument you are fooling yourself. liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #63

The fact that you seem to be calling folks who object to the word "God" in the pledge Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #44

I most certainly did not! delrem Sep 2013 #48

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #51

yeah it sounded like a veiled dig to me. If you don't believe in a spirit or soul you can't have liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #53

That's not what I said. delrem Sep 2013 #59

It is not your so called connotations that is offensive. It is the fact that the people who believe liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #61

What is it that is hurt by "connotations". After all, such "connotations" aren't material. delrem Sep 2013 #55

"People must have a soul because if people didn't have a soul they wouldn't be people", QED Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #57

Where are you from? oberliner Sep 2013 #76

Just Take the God Part Out charlives Sep 2013 #7

Welcome to DU. n/t Laelth Sep 2013 #14

Well, as long as they dont really understand what they are saying quakerboy Sep 2013 #75

I'd prefer more time devoted to teaching critical thinking, and less to pledging blindly to ANYTHING Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #10

Yes.... get rid of the Socialist propaganda whistler162 Sep 2013 #11

I too went to catholic school and did the same thing. ejpoeta Sep 2013 #15

US used Nazi-type salute during pledge of allegiance until 1942 Divernan Sep 2013 #17

Technically it's the Roman Salute telclaven Sep 2013 #72

No, historians disagreewith that explanation. It came from the U.S. Divernan Sep 2013 #74

even as a kid, i never saw the point of saying it every damn day. KG Sep 2013 #18

My daughter came up with a great idea. kag Sep 2013 #19

Lots of kids just stand and say nothing. Igel Sep 2013 #20

Or their religion forbids it. hunter Sep 2013 #24

I've come to really respect Jehovah's witnesses. Their belief in not accepting blood liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #47

I have had JW kids in my class and they never say the pledge and arely staircase Sep 2013 #77

Vowing unquestioning allegiance to anything DirkGently Sep 2013 #21

Especially when you demand it from six year old children Mr.Bill Sep 2013 #31

Yeah. Seems more like brainwashing. DirkGently Sep 2013 #34

It is a forced loyalty oath Mr.Bill Sep 2013 #36

Training children to kneel before an Authority DirkGently Sep 2013 #70

I always think of .. Bigmack Sep 2013 #23

I was a brat, I came up with alternative lyrics to both Warpy Sep 2013 #26

When I went to school, the pledge didn't mention God. Cleita Sep 2013 #27

Remember that the Pledge wasn't originally made with your hand over your heart... backscatter712 Sep 2013 #28

The pledge feels very Prussian LittleBlue Sep 2013 #29

"Patriotism is the most foolish of passions and the passion of fools." Schopenhauer Tierra_y_Libertad Sep 2013 #30

I remember standing and saying the Jenoch Sep 2013 #32

Okay. LWolf Sep 2013 #33

I agree, but this is about #5,879 on my priority list. Quantess Sep 2013 #35

I resented the "under God" part. pitbullgirl1965 Sep 2013 #38

I agree gopiscrap Sep 2013 #39

I had no problem spending 8 years in Catholic school as an atheist bhikkhu Sep 2013 #40

When my daughter became atheist she stopped saying Under God. The more she liberal_at_heart Sep 2013 #65

I find the Pledge to be ludicrous. Live and Learn Sep 2013 #67

+1 forestpath Sep 2013 #78

"I spread the peaches....." DFW Sep 2013 #68

Matt Groening's version FSogol Sep 2013 #71

It should be changed to "I pledge allegiance to the United States of America". FarCenter Sep 2013 #73