General Discussion

hack89

(39,181 posts)

80. So then the focus should be on people, not guns

Tue Sep 17, 2013, 11:13 AM

Sep 2013

because having one gun instead of 10 guns does not make a dangerous person less dangerous.

UBCs, Firearm ID cards, mandatory safety training are all needed.

Couple that with a robust ATF cracking down on illegal gun trafficking and we could make a serious dent in criminal gun violence.

Since two thirds of gun deaths are suicides, we also need single payer health care with full mental health coverage.

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Less guns, less murders--- Care to dispute that? [View all] trumad Sep 2013 OP

So you believe the desire of those killing people pipoman Sep 2013 #1

I believe there would be less murders without guns. trumad Sep 2013 #3

Maybe there would.. pipoman Sep 2013 #16

I can agree with most that you say... trumad Sep 2013 #19

Although pipoman Sep 2013 #35

You are badly in need of a statistics course... DanTex Sep 2013 #44

The statement was/is, "less guns = less murder" pipoman Sep 2013 #52

It's not demonstrably false. It's actually demonstrably true. DanTex Sep 2013 #54

Every single year there are more guns in society than the previous year...every year.. pipoman Sep 2013 #57

As usual, faced with scientific evidence, the NRAer retreats to the safety of talking points. DanTex Sep 2013 #58

Sorry, Dan, the # of guns HAS gone up, and homicides have gone down. Eleanors38 Sep 2013 #83

Sigh. Try to pay attention. DanTex Sep 2013 #84

They would be less effective in killing people. DanTex Sep 2013 #13

The UK is no panacea of violence free living pipoman Sep 2013 #17

Exactly. They have just as much violence, but far less murder. DanTex Sep 2013 #18

The UK has always had pipoman Sep 2013 #30

They don't have "less violence" than us, just less murder. DanTex Sep 2013 #33

That's only one partial solution Orrex Sep 2013 #38

There's a paper I read a couple years ago.. X_Digger Sep 2013 #60

Only 800 for the UK trumad Sep 2013 #23

"Gun deaths" to the exclusion of all else is pretending.. pipoman Sep 2013 #31

Well, I don't think that "cancer deaths" are particularly relevant in a gun debate... DanTex Sep 2013 #34

The difference is actually far starker than trumad's figures muriel_volestrangler Sep 2013 #50

We have also seen more guns and fewer murders hack89 Sep 2013 #2

No it's not.. trumad Sep 2013 #4

Yet we cut our murder rate in half even as gun ownership increased. hack89 Sep 2013 #5

Nice try... trumad Sep 2013 #7

Sure. UBCs, Firearm ID cards, mandatory safety training. hack89 Sep 2013 #12

You mean, as gun ownership has decreased. DanTex Sep 2013 #43

OK. So things are on the right track then. hack89 Sep 2013 #62

What we don't have in common is your total disregard for facts. DanTex Sep 2013 #63

The irony here hack89 Sep 2013 #65

So now you're a culture warrior? Well, that certainly explains the indifference towards facts. DanTex Sep 2013 #68

No - you are. hack89 Sep 2013 #69

And again with the false statements. The only people who ever talk about "culture wars" DanTex Sep 2013 #71

ok hack89 Sep 2013 #72

How low would it be without so many gunz, and gun lovers? Hoyt Sep 2013 #21

Hi Hoyt. How you doing this fine morning? nt hack89 Sep 2013 #25

You are assuming more guns = more people having guns. RC Sep 2013 #79

So then the focus should be on people, not guns hack89 Sep 2013 #80

The focus needs to be on people that think they need guns. All of them. RC Sep 2013 #81

There are many reason to own a gun besides self defense hack89 Sep 2013 #82

Less instruments, less music... onehandle Sep 2013 #6

Straw man on Steroids trumad Sep 2013 #8

I'm agreeing with you. Less guns, less murders. onehandle Sep 2013 #9

Sorry--thanks trumad Sep 2013 #10

It's early. onehandle Sep 2013 #11

Gunsters? Boom Sound 416 Sep 2013 #14

I think Gun Nuts is overused. trumad Sep 2013 #15

I disagree. Heidi Sep 2013 #46

The correct term on this forum is ..... oldhippie Sep 2013 #77

The NRA'ers are blaming Bill Clinton for the Navy-base shooting. tjwash Sep 2013 #20

I'm a proud non gun owner madokie Sep 2013 #22

So you have a Duckhunter935 Sep 2013 #26

What ever madokie Sep 2013 #27

The fundamental problem is that... krispos42 Sep 2013 #67

"Fewer." Robb Sep 2013 #24

I think the answer is right there in the 2nd Amendment in 2 words. safeinOhio Sep 2013 #28

Truth to insanity. 99Forever Sep 2013 #29

80 million people in the US own guns. 1 disturbed man committed a mass shooting. Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2013 #45

There are nations with a higher per capita gun ownership el_bryanto Sep 2013 #32

No, there aren't. The US has the highest per capita gun ownership. DanTex Sep 2013 #37

You are right; must have had some out of date information el_bryanto Sep 2013 #41

Your suspicion is correct. DanTex Sep 2013 #42

You can probably thank Michael Moore's 'Bowling' for that spurious fact. n/t X_Digger Sep 2013 #61

USA: Guns 'R Us.....and we use them. AlinPA Sep 2013 #88

How does one go about reducing the overall number of guns with a 2nd Amendment? aikoaiko Sep 2013 #36

If they were "well regulated" there would be fewer guns. safeinOhio Sep 2013 #39

How so? aikoaiko Sep 2013 #40

One person safeinOhio Sep 2013 #48

Again, the topic is overall number of guns aikoaiko Sep 2013 #70

Seems the current regulations on full autos safeinOhio Sep 2013 #85

Sure. LWolf Sep 2013 #47

That is the bottom line cali Sep 2013 #49

Comparison to other countries? Jeneral2885 Sep 2013 #51

The results don't go "either way". DanTex Sep 2013 #55

Not really.,.. rrneck Sep 2013 #53

That was well worth my time pintobean Sep 2013 #73

You're welcome. rrneck Sep 2013 #74

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #56

Welcome to DU gopiscrap Sep 2013 #76

Might be true krispos42 Sep 2013 #59

Thank you for setting things straight, Krispos42. Eleanors38 Sep 2013 #87

Our society is toxic and dying. Their is no simple solution, and NO--inanimate objects aren't Romulox Sep 2013 #64

Aside from the bad grammar, no NV Whino Sep 2013 #66

That's almost certainly true. Lizzie Poppet Sep 2013 #75

I fully agree! gopiscrap Sep 2013 #78

"Care to dispute that?" EX500rider Sep 2013 #86

Thanks for that post. Clears up a lot of misconceptions. Eleanors38 Sep 2013 #89

I think our homicide rate is about 4.8... krispos42 Sep 2013 #90

Which is precisely why we have the highest homicide rate of any BainsBane Sep 2013 #91

No it's not.. EX500rider Sep 2013 #92

LOL krispos42 Sep 2013 #94

I will dispute that -- it's "fewer," dammit! Fewer guns, fewer murders! Dx n/t devils chaplain Sep 2013 #93