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tblue

(16,350 posts)

187. Lincoln gave his life for something extremely controversial

Tue Sep 17, 2013, 09:49 PM

Sep 2013

There was nothing easy about championing emancipation. There's no other politician who can touch the risk he willingly took and the price he paid for it. I don't compare President Obama to President Lincoln, and I don't expect the same of him. I just expect a president to upholds the Constitution by not giving immunity to war criminals, not holding innocent people in indefinite detention, and not assassinating people without true due process, especially using drones that cause the deaths of innocent people. Obviously your and my priorities are not exactly the same, and I respect your opinion. I'm not putting it down and I would never ask you not to express it. Third Way Democrats are generally liberal on social issues and conservative on fiscal ones. Obama has done some real good on the former, but not so much on the latter. For me, that is not enough. It's just not. If it's enough for you, God bless ya and so be it. But it falls way short for me.

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Your anti-Obama memes are wearing thin. [View all] jazzimov Sep 2013 OP

"Real Liberals have patience"...or..."Real Liberals Do It Longer", I think we have a bumper sticker. Safetykitten Sep 2013 #1

Patience is a virtue. bravenak Sep 2013 #2

+1 and congratulations Hekate Sep 2013 #5

Thank you. bravenak Sep 2013 #25

Patience is indeed a virtue Vanje Sep 2013 #40

Never stop working for the good. bravenak Sep 2013 #47

It seems like... nikto Sep 2013 #171

That pretty well covers it, jazz. K/R Whisp Sep 2013 #3

I am also sick of it. LukeFL Sep 2013 #4

Oh, another space on the Waaaaah bingo card! Daemonaquila Sep 2013 #42

Then go get enough votes for your candidate. nt MH1 Sep 2013 #63

perhaps a new bingo game incorporating insults for fellow Dems? Sheepshank Sep 2013 #115

Obama, always pushing from the rear flank, where it's nice and safe. blkmusclmachine Sep 2013 #175

"Real Liberals have patience." AZ Mike Sep 2013 #6

Welcome to DU BlueToTheBone Sep 2013 #199

Well done jazzimov. sheshe2 Sep 2013 #7

+1234 Jazzimov Hekate Sep 2013 #8

thank you, all! jazzimov Sep 2013 #10

What if Lincoln had run on immediately ending slavery, pro mixed-race marriage, pro integrated... Silent3 Sep 2013 #9

"What's difficult is knowing when patience is a virtue and when patience is a vice." jazzimov Sep 2013 #13

I think I hit the jackpot here Summer Hathaway Sep 2013 #17

Yup, Good Post! It's a Judgement Call, and We Elect Our Representatives to Make Those Judgements Skraxx Sep 2013 #97

Lincoln gave his life for something extremely controversial tblue Sep 2013 #187

You have heard the story of Sherman haven't you? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #226

Black and white zipplewrath Sep 2013 #11

Actually I am arguing AGAINST the "black/white" dichoctomy. nt jazzimov Sep 2013 #14

Well, sort of zipplewrath Sep 2013 #60

You made me LMAO... blue14u Sep 2013 #32

He can't hurry up with a republican controlled house. eom Blanks Sep 2013 #169

Im glad you said many snort Sep 2013 #139

Patience is essential Jamaal510 Sep 2013 #12

Only 57% of eligible voters bothered vote in 2012. Down from 62% in 2008 Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #75

that is NOT stopping people from voting..... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #227

Sometimes on this site to disagree with even one of the President's policies... uriel1972 Sep 2013 #15

look at the post immediately following... Sheepshank Sep 2013 #118

You havent the least idea what liberal means. This president has embraced conservatives at rhett o rick Sep 2013 #16

+1 Marr Sep 2013 #19

It might be a generational thing Art_from_Ark Sep 2013 #28

I think there's a lot of truth in what you say Skittles Sep 2013 #30

I think that's it - a lot of these young folks today are only familiar with social liberalism And in Douglas Carpenter Sep 2013 #43

Absolute agreement here. Nice breakdown - Your post should be its own OP. Thanks! Melinda Sep 2013 #67

well said G_j Sep 2013 #68

Make this an OP... FredStembottom Sep 2013 #107

Exactly. Blue_In_AK Sep 2013 #44

+ 1000000 n/t NRaleighLiberal Sep 2013 #191

I remember that time... WorseBeforeBetter Sep 2013 #195

Do you want to bet that most of those that support Obama are just young? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #228

in real life I do no know any rabid supporters Skittles Sep 2013 #31

This message was self-deleted by its author Vanje Sep 2013 #37

I think you're right. Maedhros Sep 2013 #185

^^^this^^^ blue14u Sep 2013 #33

Very few people in 2013 American politics aren't liberal. And THAT's a problem. HughBeaumont Sep 2013 #69

The OP didn't say he was liberal. joshcryer Sep 2013 #71

Then why are they speaking for them? Dawgs Sep 2013 #114

??? joshcryer Sep 2013 #173

Post removed Post removed Sep 2013 #98

That's it? You have nothing but ridicule? nm rhett o rick Sep 2013 #106

Ridicule??? I Worship You! You Sage of Liberalisness! I Succor at the Font of Your Liberal Wisdom!! Skraxx Sep 2013 #111

Your repeated ridicule indicates desperation. Best of luck to you. nm rhett o rick Sep 2013 #122

Oh Please Save Me From My Desperation, Your High Holy Liberalness! Skraxx Sep 2013 #123

Totally uncalled for. libdem4life Sep 2013 #157

Long Overdue! Skraxx Sep 2013 #158

If your were drowning sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #181

You shouldn't doubt your worthiness. sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #178

Before getting off your kness, sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #180

You, aparently, don't know what liberal means, either. cheapdate Sep 2013 #197

Interesting. Maybe the OP also doesnt understand liberal, as he claims liberals are patient. Did rhett o rick Sep 2013 #202

"Liberals are patient" is a dubious claim. cheapdate Sep 2013 #205

I assume you know that the SCOTUS said that when Obama refused to defend DOMA that made rhett o rick Sep 2013 #213

What is that supposed to be a riddle? cheapdate Sep 2013 #216

The SCOTUS said that Pres Obama made it harder for them to overrule DOMA. Yet some want to give him rhett o rick Sep 2013 #219

That's as ridiculous as blaming Dr. Martin Luther King cheapdate Sep 2013 #222

............. Hotler Sep 2013 #239

A Liberal would accept Conservative ideas rather than trying jazzimov Sep 2013 #259

Real liberals would have known from the beginning that Obama wasn't a liberal. baldguy Sep 2013 #18

The word "Pragmatic" AgingAmerican Sep 2013 #23

The dismissal of the pragmatic is used discount Obama's accomplishments. baldguy Sep 2013 #24

Nice try AgingAmerican Sep 2013 #45

Lily Ledbetter... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #229

Huh? AgingAmerican Sep 2013 #250

asked for an example.....that was one... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #251

Are you sure you're posting in the right thread? AgingAmerican Sep 2013 #252

but but but.. he is blue14u Sep 2013 #34

I must be a real liberal then Blue_In_AK Sep 2013 #36

Exactly the same for me.... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #46

Well, I do think a lot of people let their eyes prejudice them. MADem Sep 2013 #108

Bullshit. The man looked to be a liberal in many ways before becoming President. Dawgs Sep 2013 #121

"but as all of you know....we may not get there immediately" VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #233

Uh, they had both in 2008 & 2009. n/t Dawgs Sep 2013 #242

don't understand your response... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #244

He certainly didnt campaign as a "pragmatic centrist". rhett o rick Sep 2013 #125

I don't remember him saying he was a far left Liberal either... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #230

Obama is and always has been a Chicago Machine Democrat Maedhros Sep 2013 #186

The "Obama = Bush" meme is exactly the kind of horrendous bullshit the OP is criticizing. baldguy Sep 2013 #190

I didn't say that Obama = Bush. Maedhros Sep 2013 #207

If you that's some sort of important distnction, then you're too far gone to reason with. baldguy Sep 2013 #211

I'm not saying Obama is a Neocon. Maedhros Sep 2013 #215

You're saying Obama is a Neocon. baldguy Sep 2013 #258

Foreign policy is one aspect of a Presidential Administration. Maedhros Sep 2013 #263

See post #215 Maedhros Sep 2013 #254

AND you are still wrong.... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #232

See post #215 Maedhros Sep 2013 #255

see post you have lost your mind. did we invade syria or not? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #264

Syria was one of a number of foreign policy incidents. Maedhros Sep 2013 #267

A neocon would have just gone into Syria to start another middle east war VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #231

See post #215 Maedhros Sep 2013 #256

This is a really fine piece of writing, jazzimov Summer Hathaway Sep 2013 #20

Yes a Modern President Did Inherit a 2 Front war and an Economic Mess. BillyRibs Sep 2013 #21

Look up "No true Scotsman" nt DRoseDARs Sep 2013 #22

and his actions have lost my trust hfojvt Sep 2013 #26

I become pretty miffed when I read lexington filly Sep 2013 #27

This President has done more for Liberal values than any other President in history? Not quite! Ford_Prefect Sep 2013 #29

The ACA ranks right up there. Whisp Sep 2013 #38

If Obama did it Summer Hathaway Sep 2013 #51

What health care. It's a sop to the insurance industry. hobbit709 Sep 2013 #55

o my, you still using that old and tired line? Whisp Sep 2013 #94

ACA is about health INSURANCE. hobbit709 Sep 2013 #100

You realize the ACA was a Republican plan, right? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #90

you know, if my child was born with a horrible sickness Whisp Sep 2013 #93

Yes, Clinton was an outstanding Republican President LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #104

There are a lot of people, here on DU Whisp Sep 2013 #105

Obvious chronic case of ODS VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #234

Actually, It Was A Plan Romney Signed, But it Was Mostly Created by the Dem Controlled State Skraxx Sep 2013 #145

"Like many types of bullshit, what you say has a grain of truth distorted beyond comprehension" Capt. Obvious Sep 2013 #155

Please Point it Out The BS Then, Thanks! Skraxx Sep 2013 #156

It's not health care it's insurance. kiva Sep 2013 #162

ask someone here on DU that has been helped by it Whisp Sep 2013 #163

I'm not saying they shouldn't accept that help, kiva Sep 2013 #165

It provides access to health care that wasn't there before for many. Whisp Sep 2013 #166

Some Americans will, others will not. kiva Sep 2013 #168

That nice free Mammogram I got recently considering Republicans are busy shutting down Plannned VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #235

Hospitals have given free mammograms for years kiva Sep 2013 #248

Yes, real change takes time. We have a hard time with that. mountain grammy Sep 2013 #35

But Martin Luther King said 'Justice delayed is justice denied'. Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #77

By the time Martin Luther King spoke those words, African Americans had been without mountain grammy Sep 2013 #86

When you advocate slow change you advocate continued injustice. Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #117

I am not and never have advocated slow change. I know the results.. mountain grammy Sep 2013 #120

You explained it a very few words. Thanks lumpy Sep 2013 #193

"I make not make it to the promised land..." VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #236

of course, that about sums it up. mountain grammy Sep 2013 #271

Give me an example of something on which you disagreed with Obama. Marr Sep 2013 #39

I'm very progressive fadedrose Sep 2013 #41

"I feel for him, because he cares about us." PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #50

LOL! SammyWinstonJack Sep 2013 #76

Great post Power To ThePeople. MuseRider Sep 2013 #159

I'm about to launch into "I Don't Know How to Love Him" again. WorseBeforeBetter Sep 2013 #194

So Obama doesn't have personal monetary concerns, I'm glad he doesn't. I hope he doesn't lumpy Sep 2013 #204

I never said he caused those things PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #208

In effect, and in a sense you were deriding the poster who said Obama cares about us. lumpy Sep 2013 #220

The poster put Obamas "suffering" on a pedestal PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #223

Suffering? Who used that word other than you? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #238

More like PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #247

So who was your past Liberal President Hero... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #237

I never made any claim of that type. n/t PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #246

Good post, fadedrose. Good post. AverageJoe90 Sep 2013 #257

Insurance mandates, domestic spying, multiple proposals to destroy social security... Demo_Chris Sep 2013 #48

Permanent lies for the message board, permanent lies for the message board, permanent lies for the Kolesar Sep 2013 #56

what bs is this post? n/t PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #64

Hi MichaelKelley Sep 2013 #49

Hi Mike! Welcome to Democraticunderground NBachers Sep 2013 #52

Your Obama apologies are wearing thin. bowens43 Sep 2013 #53

+1000 djean111 Sep 2013 #54

No kidding. 99Forever Sep 2013 #59

+1 It's like endless kindergarten recess leftstreet Sep 2013 #83

Please don't try to define to us what a "Real Liberal" is. Th1onein Sep 2013 #57

+ 1 gazillion Caretha Sep 2013 #81

"First of all, I don't always agree with the man." Stupefacto Sep 2013 #58

DU rec...nt SidDithers Sep 2013 #61

The points you use to support Obama aren't very relevant to the major criticisms of him muriel_volestrangler Sep 2013 #62

Yes, you heard me, you are anti-progressive. cherokeeprogressive Sep 2013 #65

Then what is all the plonking and Skidmore Sep 2013 #268

Who are YOU to define what a "real liberal" is? cali Sep 2013 #66

Frankly I'm grateful for this OP. Puglover Sep 2013 #72

I think the best thing Barack Obama has done as president LWolf Sep 2013 #70

First paragraph is definitive of the flaws in your point of view and of the source of Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #73

^^^Nailed IT!!!^^^^ bvar22 Sep 2013 #136

The OP of course does not have a response Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #225

Jesus fucking christ you people are boring Capt. Obvious Sep 2013 #74

He failed. mick063 Sep 2013 #78

Can't wait for you to run and do a better job... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #240

"We are against forcing our opinions on anyone." MNBrewer Sep 2013 #79

Spying... worsening crack down on whistle blowers... How's our freedom going? MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #80

Next candidate I back I am going to vet their ardent exploiters or supporters prior to Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #82

Thank you a million times, bluenorthwest. FredStembottom Sep 2013 #110

This MuseRider Sep 2013 #160

Yep somewhere between 40-65 posters Puglover Sep 2013 #269

"Justice delayed is justice denied." Martin Luther King Jr. Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #84

It looks to me like your definition of liberal is in question. Do you think Sen Sanders is liberal? rhett o rick Sep 2013 #85

2009 called. Starry Messenger Sep 2013 #87

And ponies. We need ponies, stat! n/t QC Sep 2013 #88

I was hoping to run into you here! Starry Messenger Sep 2013 #89

Good seeing you as well! QC Sep 2013 #91

He's new ... takes a little time to get up to snuff. nt TBF Sep 2013 #103

Its more useful to be FOR something, than against everything. IronLionZion Sep 2013 #92

thanks jazz, you've coralled them all in one place. Whisp Sep 2013 #95

Their "he's done nothing big" argument is so astonishingly selfish. great white snark Sep 2013 #96

I know what you mean~ sheshe2 Sep 2013 #206

I make screen shots of the posts that bring out the ODS crowd. macspanicattack Sep 2013 #188

There Are All Types of Liberals, Including One's With No Patience, So I Would Say: Skraxx Sep 2013 #99

I heard your argument sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #183

That's just your 'opinion'. lumpy Sep 2013 #209

Actually, sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #221

"I may not get to the Promised Land..." VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #241

He said that they day before sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #249

lorem ipsum VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #265

No, it took guts. sulphurdunn Sep 2013 #266

I have huge respect and admiration for our guy libodem Sep 2013 #101

"real change TAKES TIME" - except when it doesn't TBF Sep 2013 #102

So are you advocating Skidmore Sep 2013 #137

The poster appears to be observing, not advocating leftstreet Sep 2013 #142

Please re-read my post - TBF Sep 2013 #164

LOL. bvar22 Sep 2013 #109

Well said. Lives are saved by doing what works, not by ideology afflicted with rigor mortis. freshwest Sep 2013 #112

" battling the image of the unconstitutional "Unitary Executive" dictatorship"? grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #113

or LIBYA--how fast they made themselves forget! MisterP Sep 2013 #128

+1000 very nicely put Sheepshank Sep 2013 #116

K&R Bobbie Jo Sep 2013 #119

Enthusiastic K&R BumRushDaShow Sep 2013 #124

There are so many people... shenmue Sep 2013 #126

Obama's hard-right veer into neo-conservatism has worn thin. HooptieWagon Sep 2013 #127

^^^ that is EXACTLY what the OP was talking about... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2013 #243

One quibble jeff47 Sep 2013 #129

I think you are confusing patience with results with patience for timid strategy markpkessinger Sep 2013 #130

"Liberal" - Methinks that word doesn't mean what you think it means quinnox Sep 2013 #131

Once again. All he needed to do was NOTHING, and the Bush tax cuts would have expired. grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #132

Once again. Amnesia sets in among the inhabitants of the Clint Eastwood "empty chair" world BumRushDaShow Sep 2013 #133

Professional Slinking 101 Whisp Sep 2013 #143

Uh, no. grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #153

The bush tax cut would have expired for all taxpayers Gothmog Sep 2013 #144

sometimes I wonder if some people around here are disappointed that he didn't strike Syria WI_DEM Sep 2013 #134

It's probably not the group you think it is. MNBrewer Sep 2013 #135

keep wondering.. frylock Sep 2013 #196

Now THAT is some serious ODS. WorseBeforeBetter Sep 2013 #203

well said my friend SCantiGOP Sep 2013 #138

What a FANTASTIC POST!! Thank you! rivegauche Sep 2013 #140

I also like the original post Gothmog Sep 2013 #141

You have expressed my thoughts exactly. Grateful for Hope Sep 2013 #146

K&R to the zenith jazzimov!!!!!!!!! rury Sep 2013 #147

I personally like and respect Our President. mstinamotorcity2 Sep 2013 #148

Obama the Reagan lover...... BlueJac Sep 2013 #149

One's personal feelings of like or dislike for the President are irrelevant. Maedhros Sep 2013 #150

and yet here you are, like many, trying to "force" an opinion on us stupidicus Sep 2013 #151

That's unfortunate people can 'force' their opinions on you. Whisp Sep 2013 #154

take it up with the OPer stupidicus Sep 2013 #182

Sort of tired of that whole thee dimensional chess master meme, myself. . . Agnosticsherbet Sep 2013 #152

Two words for you: Trans-Pacific Partnership HomerRamone Sep 2013 #161

Nice OP. What a trollish piece of flamebait. xocet Sep 2013 #167

But they put so much effort into the childish insults for Obama and his supporters. great white snark Sep 2013 #170

Sadly we have pretend liberals here. Rex Sep 2013 #172

We have propaganda here - a constant, unrealistic influx of personas spouting the corporate line, woo me with science Sep 2013 #200

"This President has done more for Liberal values than any other President in history." blkmusclmachine Sep 2013 #174

I love President Obama! Mahalo, jazzimov! Cha Sep 2013 #176

Damn Straight,,, Cryptoad Sep 2013 #177

... Cha Sep 2013 #179

Not really relevant to the thread MFrohike Sep 2013 #212

Oh, it's quite "relevant". In spite of all the obstruction from assholes.. Cha Sep 2013 #218

Not quite MFrohike Sep 2013 #260

KICK.. Cha Sep 2013 #262

"Real change" doesn't take time. The NC GOP has destroyed... WorseBeforeBetter Sep 2013 #184

+ a zillion....n/t NRaleighLiberal Sep 2013 #192

+1000! nt adirondacker Sep 2013 #210

Post removed Post removed Sep 2013 #189

cool story, bro frylock Sep 2013 #198

i would add that the collective 'left' cannot say it has obama's back as long as there is certainot Sep 2013 #201

Was this productive? MFrohike Sep 2013 #214

Turned out very productive for me Capt. Obvious Sep 2013 #245

Well, there you go MFrohike Sep 2013 #261

yes, put fud on alert uponit7771 Sep 2013 #270

I keep hearing this MFrohike Sep 2013 #272

K & R Bigredhunk Sep 2013 #217

real liberals doesn't have a nice ring to it... sounds too much like real uhmuricans. georgew Sep 2013 #224

K & R Scurrilous Sep 2013 #253