General Discussion

R. Daneel Olivaw

(12,606 posts)

115. Let's play a game of multiple choice. It's called accountability.

Wed Sep 18, 2013, 11:21 AM

Sep 2013

NAFTA has hurt the American worker. Anybody that tells you differently, well we know where their loyalties lay.

Let's say that everything that has been leaked on TPP is true and once we the people see it what we are allowed in on gets worse from there; that with TPP America (the 99%) are about to be served a giant shit sandwich.

Do you believe that those who hold out for Hope + Change;

1) Will realize that TPP like NAFTA is going to hurt the American worker (those that are left with well paying jobs that is...which amounts to how much of the workfarce) and protest against any congressional approval.

2) Will double down on "you don't know what you are talking about, Cali, he's got this" and post link after link of distracting vanity posts that really lead nowhere.

3) Will remain silent on the subject or bring up another subject completely unrelated to the horrors that await us all...well not those who earn pennies a post.

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The TPP is as bad or worse than NAFTA. The President is pushing it hard. [View all] cali Sep 2013 OP

There is no TPP. WilliamPitt Sep 2013 #1

yeppers. that's it. cali Sep 2013 #2

Who's the phony? Octafish Sep 2013 #52

How many 'most importants' are there Greg? GeorgeGist Sep 2013 #57

Doesn't change the facts, though. Octafish Sep 2013 #60

Truth, to you, must be rather inconvenient. Fantastic Anarchist Sep 2013 #126

Survivor tactic. When you can't argue the facts, attack the messenger. Jakes Progress Sep 2013 #135

All one has to hear are those names, Octafish, and you know... MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #78

Thanks for the background info, Octafish...and thanks to Greg Palast, of course. Raksha Sep 2013 #120

Good article by Greg Palast - just shared it on Facebook. Raksha Sep 2013 #122

Or "professional Liberals". I've heard that laughable insult on DU as well. nt 99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #123

Peace Purists is a funny one too. NealK Sep 2013 #125

lol - yes I saw that too . ~nt 99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #129

5 Recs - I guess some agree TPP is bad FreakinDJ Sep 2013 #3

Most folks here think the TPP is a bad deal cali Sep 2013 #4

Well, i've heard its a good deal. R. Daneel Olivaw Sep 2013 #107

It's all about increasing wealth for the 1%. jsr Sep 2013 #108

The last two letters in the acronym seem apt. Eleanors38 Sep 2013 #67

It will be as bad or worse than NAFTA - TBF Sep 2013 #109

I've talked before about the internationalization of capital ... Fantastic Anarchist Sep 2013 #127

Yup - it's the way I see this all moving. TBF Sep 2013 #131

They'll preserve freedom of speech - theirs only. Fantastic Anarchist Sep 2013 #136

The UN's International Labor Organization 99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #134

Indeed ... Fantastic Anarchist Sep 2013 #138

Long Live the Wobblies! You gotta love 'em. nt 99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #140

And and and.. SUMMERS WAS NEVER THE NOMINEE!11!eleventy! ;-) X_Digger Sep 2013 #5

I haven't seen an actual document related to the TPP. Is all this just based on rumors? pnwmom Sep 2013 #21

Why don't you just ask President Obama for a copy? I am sure he would be transparent in his Vincardog Sep 2013 #23

When has a President ever released working documents while international pnwmom Sep 2013 #24

He has released them to over 600 CORPORATIONS. I wonder why the corporations can have access Vincardog Sep 2013 #25

I'm interested. Do you have a link about that? pnwmom Sep 2013 #27

What they are negotiating is being kept secret from you and me. If I was to post a link to the Vincardog Sep 2013 #29

I mean do you have a link to something showing that 600 corporations have seen pnwmom Sep 2013 #30

You are asking for verifiable proof of a secret negotiation. The constitution gives the powers to Vincardog Sep 2013 #32

Right. You don't know anything about the "600 corporations." You were just making that up. pnwmom Sep 2013 #37

http://www.flushthetpp.org do your own research. What personal attack? Vincardog Sep 2013 #38

I'm not going to wander over that whole site looking for a clear answer to my question. pnwmom Sep 2013 #58

You ask for a link, but refuse to go there? HooptieWagon Sep 2013 #61

A BOGer willfully ignorant? What would give you that idea? L0oniX Sep 2013 #117

It is on the first page. Again you seem willfully dim, or maybe your mind in incapable of change. Vincardog Sep 2013 #66

Willfully indolent. R. Daneel Olivaw Sep 2013 #112

You got a link ffs! cui bono Sep 2013 #77

Lol, awesome sub thread. morningfog Sep 2013 #96

Wander? You were given a link. R. Daneel Olivaw Sep 2013 #111

Vincar called you Aerows Sep 2013 #56

600 corporate advisors PADemD Sep 2013 #98

Parts of it have leaked. Here is one portion. pa28 Sep 2013 #53

Thank you! n/t pnwmom Sep 2013 #64

Thank you. emsimon33 Sep 2013 #80

So let us guess your point. Because we the masses havent seen it must mean it will be rhett o rick Sep 2013 #62

Nope, you're not much of a mind reader. I just want to know what's in it pnwmom Sep 2013 #65

bulloney. If you were actually interested, you'd do a little research cali Sep 2013 #113

do your own research. type in leaks and TPP cali Sep 2013 #83

Come on Cali, that's too hard. You're asking too way too much. R. Daneel Olivaw Sep 2013 #114

I know, but don't you know I'm just mean? cali Sep 2013 #141

Breaking: Google is your friend. n/t L0oniX Sep 2013 #118

That's how it always seems to start. pa28 Sep 2013 #46

So is President Obama (1) stupid; (2) deluded; or (3) malicious? Nye Bevan Sep 2013 #6

Closer to 2 Populist_Prole Sep 2013 #7

This. It troubles me because he seems like such a Keynesian... Ed Suspicious Sep 2013 #13

Agreed Populist_Prole Sep 2013 #19

What Obama says.... sendero Sep 2013 #90

That's what he does; he says one thing to get votes and does another. LuvNewcastle Sep 2013 #92

"says one thing to get votes and does another" = normal politician. n/t L0oniX Sep 2013 #119

Respectfully, I don't think that they ever really thought that "free trade is a net gain," or at AnotherMcIntosh Sep 2013 #40

I don't know. I wish I did. cali Sep 2013 #8

You cannot get a full perspective on something based on leaked information Cali_Democrat Sep 2013 #12

Does it really not bother you that LiberalAndProud Sep 2013 #15

What leaked information? I haven't seen anything but speculation so far. n/t pnwmom Sep 2013 #22

I agree with Elizabeth Warren: ProSense Sep 2013 #39

It's not entirely speculation. LiberalAndProud Sep 2013 #43

Where ProSense Sep 2013 #44

It is specifically targeted at the tobacco industry. LiberalAndProud Sep 2013 #45

But where does it imply what you claim? n/t ProSense Sep 2013 #47

In this language LiberalAndProud Sep 2013 #48

"Preserving" doesn't mean "limit." n/t ProSense Sep 2013 #49

Yes. I know that. LiberalAndProud Sep 2013 #51

Actually, ProSense Sep 2013 #54

The only people speculating are those that are skeptical of our government.Those that blindly follo rhett o rick Sep 2013 #63

Well, ProSense Sep 2013 #70

it's not speculation. There has been infor leaked cali Sep 2013 #91

You mean - Elizabeth Warren Plucketeer Sep 2013 #121

I doubt that. Jakes Progress Sep 2013 #139

Sure you can. ProSense Sep 2013 #33

The corporations privy to closed TPP negotiations are not objecting, are they, "my dear"? Divernan Sep 2013 #36

the writer of that post knows zip about the TPP. It's just reflex defense of his cali Sep 2013 #87

honey, you know zip about this. I know a lot. cali Sep 2013 #82

Let's play a game of multiple choice. It's called accountability. R. Daneel Olivaw Sep 2013 #115

Or another option, that being "under great duress". Scuba Sep 2013 #9

(4) Working for somebody else n/t markpkessinger Sep 2013 #10

As often as not that seems to be the case 1-Old-Man Sep 2013 #35

4) a 1%er obxhead Sep 2013 #17

Yes DJ13 Sep 2013 #26

Likely components of the administration's economic policy towards China pampango Sep 2013 #72

What the GODDAM FUCK does trade have to do with giving vicious amoral-- eridani Sep 2013 #89

I will delete my expletives and proceed. What does the TPP have to do with trade? A lot. pampango Sep 2013 #102

Trade agreements should be about trade, period. No extra baggage whatsoever eridani Sep 2013 #142

He likes farmers selling soybeans and consumer buying cheap shirts Recursion Sep 2013 #84

He works for the 1% - he's just doing his job. nt TBF Sep 2013 #110

(4) Loves his family very much & doesn't want to get "JFK-ed" nt 99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #124

That too - but you'd think he would've figured out TBF Sep 2013 #132

Watch out -- the Prez is thinking about his 'legacy' again! markpkessinger Sep 2013 #11

Because their legacy is measured in their post-political personal wealth. Divernan Sep 2013 #41

You and your anti-Obama memes. Autumn Sep 2013 #14

A what if... Populist_Prole Sep 2013 #16

If they pass it, will he sign it? tblue Sep 2013 #42

Put that way I guess I'll have to believe ( unfortunately ) he'll sign it Populist_Prole Sep 2013 #59

Fight back good senators! ananda Sep 2013 #18

Its ALL part of the brilliant Master Plan. bvar22 Sep 2013 #20

We don't want it! Enthusiast Sep 2013 #28

All your going to hear are crickets. Phlem Sep 2013 #31

TPP mtasselin Sep 2013 #34

Obama is playing ninth-level ninja-mind chess and you are still playing checkers... truebrit71 Sep 2013 #50

He caught the Vapors. Eleanors38 Sep 2013 #69

No, he just likes for farmers to be able to sell soybeans and corn Recursion Sep 2013 #85

This is what the owners want. PeteSelman Sep 2013 #55

The President fails the working man again. mick063 Sep 2013 #68

That's all I've been trying to say. Phlem Sep 2013 #71

All I know is this: mick063 Sep 2013 #74

True Dat Brother Phlem Sep 2013 #75

Who's "the working man?" Some people get screwed by TPP, others get helped Recursion Sep 2013 #86

More bullshit: Farmers? How were farmers helped by NAFTA? Factory "Farmers" cali Sep 2013 #93

Mexican ag was destroyed by NAFTA; American ag did great. Which was the point Recursion Sep 2013 #94

A) Your claim without a single piece of evidence to back it up, is hardly enough cali Sep 2013 #95

Well, do your own research. Ag is the part of policy I know. Recursion Sep 2013 #104

And the third way comes to the rescue. mick063 Sep 2013 #99

Jesus, it's like a parody sometimes. *I DON'T SUPPORT TPP* Recursion Sep 2013 #105

No kidding. Corporate farms. Let's talk about those. R. Daneel Olivaw Sep 2013 #116

The defenses won't start until JoeyT Sep 2013 #73

Stop "thoughtcriming" Obama! cui bono Sep 2013 #76

Keepin it kicked nt Vanje Sep 2013 #79

Responses to this are very interesting and heated. Sherrod Brown & other liberals have warned us emsimon33 Sep 2013 #81

you don't have to take his word for it- cali Sep 2013 #88

Brown said that TPP "represents an opportunity for American workers and businesses" but "American pampango Sep 2013 #103

no real surprise that obama would consider such a proposal... georgew Sep 2013 #97

K&R AnotherMcIntosh Sep 2013 #100

K & R djean111 Sep 2013 #101

Just another Obama failure BlueJac Sep 2013 #106

Bill Clinton signed NAFTA and it went into effect January 1. 1994... kentuck Sep 2013 #128

We've lost 5 million manufacturing jobs in the past 19 years - TBF Sep 2013 #133

The decline in manufacturing jobs started in the 1950's while output has increased steadily. pampango Sep 2013 #137

K&R NealK Sep 2013 #130