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Number23

(24,544 posts)

137. You're right!! Imagine that

Sun Sep 22, 2013, 01:45 AM

Sep 2013

juvenility is a word.

As for TPP, it's not something I've read much about. Sorry to diffuse your obvious and desperate need for confrontation right now.

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Defend this, Defenders! President Obama speaks out on Trade Promotion Authority [View all] cali Sep 2013 OP

Because protectionism works so well intaglio Sep 2013 #1

uh, being opposed to this obscenity is NOT the same as protectionism. duh. cali Sep 2013 #2

You are right, cali. pampango Sep 2013 #6

actually, it does work well. bowens43 Sep 2013 #3

No it does not. It did not work under republicans in the 1920's which is why FDR campaigned against pampango Sep 2013 #4

I'm not arguing for protectionism cali Sep 2013 #5

I should wait a little longer to post my responses. See 6 above. :) pampango Sep 2013 #7

So right. Protectionism is NOT the same as TPP! AllyCat Sep 2013 #9

I'm curious...Does anyone know what the senate dems position on this is? Warren? Sanders winterpark Sep 2013 #65

It kinda depends on what you mean by protectionism. fasttense Sep 2013 #8

I never understood how a nation's "protecting" its workers was bad..Europe protects theirs. whathehell Sep 2013 #107

How does "Europe protect theirs?" Their tariffs are low. They have more "free trade" than we do. pampango Sep 2013 #110

Beyond what you've already mentioned, by restricting employment to EU members only.. whathehell Sep 2013 #123

Tariffs work! They funded our govt for the first 125 years. grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #13

+1000. Thom Hartman speaks often on this. Tariffs were a practical and working GoneFishin Sep 2013 #25

Until they were replaced by the income tax - a progressive victory. pampango Sep 2013 #27

Still need tariff's, or your jobs drain away to the lowest overseas bidder. AtheistCrusader Sep 2013 #31

Might be true if the wealthy and their corporations are actually paying taxes, instead of getting grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #89

"tariffs protect American jobs." That's what republicans said in the 1920's. pampango Sep 2013 #111

If these costly trade agreements were good for Americans, we'd be thriving, not starving. grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #126

^^^^this^^^^ L0oniX Sep 2013 #141

OR if we had progressive taxes, strong unions and an effective safety net, pampango Sep 2013 #158

HAHA. Is your computer made in america? Shoes? Clothes? No, costly trade agreements cost jobs. grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #159

It is true than when countries trade, you end up buying things made in other countries. pampango Sep 2013 #160

It's exactly what Germany does. If costly trade agreements work, 50,000 factories would not grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #162

What is "what Germany does"? Trade is 80% of their economy yet they have stronger unions, pampango Sep 2013 #165

In 2012 Germany exported goods worth 1 097.3 billion euro and imported goods worth 909.1 b euro grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #166

Exactly. And Germany does it with strong unions and high wages. pampango Sep 2013 #170

In 2012 Germany exported goods worth 1 097.3 billion euro and imported goods worth 909.1 b euro grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #167

When has it been otherwise? MNBrewer Sep 2013 #149

True. But there is "doing well" and "doing 'obscenely' well" at the expense of the middle class as pampango Sep 2013 #161

It certainly Does work well for China and S. Korea FreakinDJ Sep 2013 #17

Protecting us is the governments job. bemildred Sep 2013 #35

Funny how they want to protect us, but not our livelihoods, LOL grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #90

Who is talking about protectionism? Could you point it out please?? sabrina 1 Sep 2013 #66

It's waaaay more than that.. whathehell Sep 2013 #106

"protectionism" for who? International corporations? L0oniX Sep 2013 #140

Look over there at the shiny object! MNBrewer Sep 2013 #148

NAFTA casued the loss of 94,000 US factories. Protect that. Katashi_itto Sep 2013 #155

"Defend this, Defenders!" is superfluous and inflammatory pinboy3niner Sep 2013 #10

The TPP is superfluous and inflammatory, LOL grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #12

LOL! pinboy3niner Sep 2013 #16

Must have been mixed up with BTP ...Bad Toilet Paper L0oniX Sep 2013 #142

yes it is. but it gets eyes and comments and raising visibility on this cali Sep 2013 #14

That's actually a fair point pinboy3niner Sep 2013 #20

agreed, and there is no framing of an issue treestar Sep 2013 #63

That is an absolutely spurious claim cali Sep 2013 #79

well you may have researched it treestar Sep 2013 #131

Simply means fewer jobs, lower wages. grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #11

Also higher drug prices, and more corporations can sue a country's taxpayers when a rule or djean111 Sep 2013 #15

And it removes accountability for our politicians. It gives them cover to support a GoneFishin Sep 2013 #28

The goal is lower wages worldwide - TBF Sep 2013 #22

Yup, The Wet Dream of The RW One Percent: A Two Tier Society of Them & Their Slaves whathehell Sep 2013 #108

Exactly. nt TBF Sep 2013 #109

I'll have to just go to with Obama on this one. gulliver Sep 2013 #18

citizen.org - TPP: Corporate Power Tool of the 1% solarhydrocan Sep 2013 #23

You need to do some research - TBF Sep 2013 #24

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #26

Congress will have to vote on it just like they have every other trade agreement. pampango Sep 2013 #29

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #37

"And they will see it before they vote on it." CrispyQ Sep 2013 #50

It also requires a quick vote and eliminates filibuster. pa28 Sep 2013 #101

It's utterly dishonest to make a trade agreement involving workers without consuling Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #30

You'd need to study the actual documents. Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #41

Then do your own research, but trusting Obama is a stupid as trusting an unknown internet source. CrispyQ Sep 2013 #51

Have you even read part of it? WCLinolVir Sep 2013 #59

You mis-spelled your user name: it's g-u-l-l-i-b-l-e. appal_jack Sep 2013 #73

honestly, i think we should just trust our president in every decision he makes frylock Sep 2013 #98

Selling Out The Middle Class One Trade Deal At A Time cantbeserious Sep 2013 #19

If deals have to be made in secret, they are bad deals. truebluegreen Sep 2013 #21

Irrational knee-jerk Obama haters hate everything Obama does. baldguy Sep 2013 #32

Too bad you cannot separate Obama's various policies from Obama himself. djean111 Sep 2013 #34

Obama's supporters aren't the ones who can't separate the man from his policies baldguy Sep 2013 #46

I don't hate Obama. There is no point to hating or loving him, he is a politician. djean111 Sep 2013 #52

Yes, cali's OP title enlightenment Sep 2013 #55

I'd like to see someone point out that knee-jerk Obama hating from the Left is absurd. baldguy Sep 2013 #71

I agree! In fact so much so that I did exactly that! You are right, the left IS absurd Dragonfli Sep 2013 #82

Again, can we stick to the TOPIC of the OP? enlightenment Sep 2013 #86

No, he doesn't. Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #118

Are there irrational knee-jerk Obama lovers who love (or at least tolerate) everything Obama does? Jim Lane Sep 2013 #116

Oh yes they are. I have never said anything hateful about the President or even close cali Sep 2013 #124

Because being against TPP is as reasonable as being a birther... Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #42

Straw man! False equivalency! Re-direction. WCLinolVir Sep 2013 #60

Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #88

HAHAHA! Remember when he was against gay marriage, or you forget already? grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #91

C'mon baldguy, tell us: LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #103

Ever going to come back and address the issue? Union Scribe Sep 2013 #117

Still won't say if you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #127

I apologize if my personal life doesn't fit into your schedule of whiny ineffectual blathering. baldguy Sep 2013 #132

So you stopped in for some insults but not to answer? Union Scribe Sep 2013 #135

Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #139

Do you support Rand Paul for President? baldguy Sep 2013 #157

No, of course not. Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #164

Well, you see Rand Paul doesn't support the TPP either. baldguy Sep 2013 #169

But do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #172

Are you a liar or a fool? baldguy Sep 2013 #173

Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #174

Could it be you're both? baldguy Sep 2013 #175

Do you support the TPP? Could it be you're too chicken to answer? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #176

Sorry to shatter your dreams but Obama isn't a fascist dictator & Rand Paul will never be President. baldguy Sep 2013 #177

Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #179

The making of a fascist world order. It is consistent with his treatment of corporations GoneFishin Sep 2013 #33

he mtasselin Sep 2013 #40

Yep. DOMA etc. are great. But those are dog bones he can throw our way without GoneFishin Sep 2013 #45

Post removed Post removed Sep 2013 #36

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #43

+1000. GoneFishin Sep 2013 #47

"I voted for him twice, I think he is a horrible Democratic president..." ProSense Sep 2013 #48

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #49

Oh, you're just jealous, cuz Pro didn't provide lots of pretty blue links like usual. CrispyQ Sep 2013 #54

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #67

+1000 bobduca Sep 2013 #69

Hey, ProSense Sep 2013 #70

Post removed Post removed Sep 2013 #74

"You know exactly who I am..." ProSense Sep 2013 #77

Post removed Post removed Sep 2013 #80

I should have said, ProSense Sep 2013 #81

Another one bites the dust. William769 Sep 2013 #85

LOL! ProSense Sep 2013 #61

oh boohoohoo. cali Sep 2013 #58

"if you don't like the title that's a great fucking reason not to change it." ProSense Sep 2013 #62

Someone upthread suggested it. I thought about it. try reading, pro. cali Sep 2013 #68

I define real progressives as the people your think tank targets, LOL grahamhgreen Sep 2013 #92

if mtasselin Sep 2013 #38

We the People, they the corporations . . . CrispyQ Sep 2013 #56

K & R !!! WillyT Sep 2013 #39

Perverse, this is so off the charts, shameful. Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #44

The end of the Open Internet woo me with science Sep 2013 #53

What complex trade agreements are EVER negotiated in public? randome Sep 2013 #64

Trust in the corporations who are privy to the deals bobduca Sep 2013 #75

When was the last one that brought more prosperity to the majority of Americans? TheKentuckian Sep 2013 #171

Thanks for the link BuelahWitch Sep 2013 #150

But didn't you see the photo of the pres with a little kid? WCLinolVir Sep 2013 #57

So true - he is very likeable.. polichick Sep 2013 #97

So far, the defenses range from Marr Sep 2013 #72

Don't forget the hopeful gem under my post. woo me with science Sep 2013 #78

lol Marr Sep 2013 #84

"looking forward and not back on war crimes is the compassionate move" MisterP Sep 2013 #104

ACA vs. TPP GeorgeGist Sep 2013 #76

What a great way to get an intelligent discussion started ecstatic Sep 2013 #83

I took it that the OP was calling out to defenders of the TPP to step up & defend it. Demit Sep 2013 #93

Disagreement accompanied by promotion, defense, or silence in solidarity is agreement. TheKentuckian Sep 2013 #102

You are exactly right. And now that so many bashers have been proven wrong on issue after issue Number23 Sep 2013 #112

Did the juvenility keep you from telling us why the TPP is a good idea? Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #119

The behavior of so many posters here keep lots of conversations from even getting started Number23 Sep 2013 #133

Please take the time to enlighten us about how great TPP is. Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #134

You're right!! Imagine that Number23 Sep 2013 #137

I really can't wait for someone to explain TPP's greatness to me. Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #138

So yea why not ask the question in the BOG ...and get banned for it. L0oniX Sep 2013 #143

Lol, sad, funny, and true. Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #151

Cali, thank you for your tireless posting about TPP. woo me with science Sep 2013 #87

Nobody is at your beck and call. Hate on that haters. great white snark Sep 2013 #94

huh? who said anyone was at my beck and call? cali Sep 2013 #96

maybe pics of the first family's dog is more your speed. frylock Sep 2013 #99

Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #100

So why won't you answer? Do you support the TPP? LondonReign2 Sep 2013 #113

Do you support TPP? C'mon it's not that difficult. nt Union Scribe Sep 2013 #136

HE'S NOT THE NOMINEE!!1 frylock Sep 2013 #95

He's going to need Republican support and he'll probably have to bargain for it. pa28 Sep 2013 #105

Thanks to Cali, other "Fringle Left" posters here at DU, and the "Professional Left".. bvar22 Sep 2013 #114

DUrec ...this should be its own op. L0oniX Sep 2013 #145

I love it! "The Church of Free Trade!" We will be the Victims on the Altar! KoKo Sep 2013 #146

He may want it, but if we have anything to say about it, HE WON'T GET IT. CaliforniaPeggy Sep 2013 #115

"The TPP is double plus good but I won't tell you why because you hate Obama and are so juvenile" Democracyinkind Sep 2013 #120

^^^^this^^^^ L0oniX Sep 2013 #144

He originally campaigned that he would look into NAFTA, B Calm Sep 2013 #121

Thanks Cali. Now, everyone who supports the TPP please raise their hand. And state why. Celefin Sep 2013 #122

k and r...nt xiamiam Sep 2013 #125

Went to whitehouse.gov to send an email fadedrose Sep 2013 #128

kick woo me with science Sep 2013 #129

kick woo me with science Sep 2013 #130

I'll kick again, because this is so damned improtant. bvar22 Sep 2013 #147

See post 57. woo me with science Sep 2013 #152

I must have missed that. bvar22 Sep 2013 #156

Aside from "well, we have not seen it yet", I don't think they have been given djean111 Sep 2013 #153

even the loyal obama supporters cannot defend this noiretextatique Sep 2013 #154

k&r nt steve2470 Sep 2013 #163

The Defenders.... Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #168

cali, cali, cali...this a new day, and we need to level the global playing field. Zorra Sep 2013 #178