General Discussion

Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)

113. That's just silly. In the first place, Californians already come to Vegas and nothings going

Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:17 PM

Sep 2013

to stop that.

The train would make money, lots of it. Southern California alone accounts for about 1/3 of all the money that comes into Las Vegas, and 100% of those people would rather not make the drive, especially in the summer, but air travel is a monumental pain in the ass and costs too much these days.

SF to LA would eventually make money as well, but the way they're doing it makes it unlikely it will be completed as the first decade will be spent building a system that will go from BFE to the middle of nowhere. Only then will they start the most expensive and disruptive parts of the project, driving the lines into and connecting with the cities. Of course we must not forget that by that time the cost over-runs and revisions will have put the price tag well over the $60B - $80B currently projected.

Did you follow or are you familiar with LA's light-rail saga?

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52% want (CA) bullet train stopped, poll finds (LA Times) [View all] pinto Sep 2013 OP

Good the more mass transit we have the better gopiscrap Sep 2013 #1

I love high speed rail but there is little justification for a $ 100 billion investment grantcart Sep 2013 #2

LA to SF/Oakland is the second busiest air route in the US with over 6 millon passengers Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #6

but it would take twice as long in travel time grantcart Sep 2013 #29

Not if you count the time required to travel to the airport, sit around, and go through security Lydia Leftcoast Sep 2013 #41

Who cares? Sen. Walter Sobchak Sep 2013 #45

You added extra time to airline travel but not to rail. former9thward Sep 2013 #47

The only security I've seen on high speed rail is on the Eurostar Lydia Leftcoast Sep 2013 #64

This will be in the U.S. not Europe. former9thward Sep 2013 #65

I've seen security at Amtrak in DC. nt MADem Sep 2013 #68

I didn't need extra time for my HSR experience. RexDart Sep 2013 #99

That will not be your experience in the U.S. former9thward Sep 2013 #119

Still not sure. RexDart Oct 2013 #127

None of those were built post 9/11. former9thward Oct 2013 #128

like heck reddread Sep 2013 #78

As BNW indicated, its a busy route, but also, this is part of a well integrated mass transit system. stevenleser Sep 2013 #9

Agree, we need both. Along with other infrastructure upkeep. pinto Sep 2013 #12

"we need high speed trains connecting regional large cities" -- not necessarily grantcart Sep 2013 #27

"This will be the first that links two urban areas that are wide apart...." A HERETIC I AM Sep 2013 #100

I live in San Luis Obispo county between LA and SanFran Cleita Sep 2013 #26

You can take Amtrak for $ 39 grantcart Sep 2013 #28

You still have to go to Bakersfield and then it's still a six hour trip. n/t Cleita Sep 2013 #31

It only costs about $ 120 to fly one way if you buy 10 days ahead. grantcart Sep 2013 #33

The cheapest I could find from here to SFO was $400 Cleita Sep 2013 #34

Thanks for the suggestion though. Cleita Sep 2013 #35

SLO doesn't have Southwest KamaAina Sep 2013 #116

For the cost of the HSR, which will serve tourists and business travellers.... Xithras Sep 2013 #108

not true. doing a major high speed link between major metro areas would be huge Pretzel_Warrior Sep 2013 #115

HS travel requires a corridor of several highly dense urban centeres close together. grantcart Sep 2013 #123

I don't see how it is going forward ripcord Sep 2013 #121

I dunno. A bullet train in an earthquake prone area? MADem Sep 2013 #3

Japan is a pretty earthquake prone area. enlightenment Sep 2013 #4

See post seven! nt MADem Sep 2013 #8

True - enlightenment Sep 2013 #11

I don't really have a position--as I said, I have no dog in this fight. MADem Sep 2013 #15

I understand you're just speaking philosophically enlightenment Sep 2013 #16

I'd like to see us, as a nation, fix up AMTRAK in a big way. I LOVE train travel. MADem Sep 2013 #19

Dang. enlightenment Sep 2013 #38

I've availed myself of Japanese public transit, as well as the European system(s), MADem Sep 2013 #42

Absolutely agree. enlightenment Sep 2013 #49

We have the ACELA to NYC and DC. MADem Sep 2013 #56

That's a shame. enlightenment Sep 2013 #57

The government subsidizes AMTRAK to the tune of something like thirty some odd bucks a passenger. MADem Sep 2013 #61

The truckers, fearing trains? Ha! mwooldri Sep 2013 #74

I was serious. MADem Sep 2013 #75

And yet Japan has pioneered high speed rail.... Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #5

Yeah, they also have a reactor melting down and are in a huge mess. MADem Sep 2013 #7

Shit, in that case, why build anything here? Iggo Sep 2013 #13

Not my point(s), but nice dismissal. MADem Sep 2013 #17

We have freeways all over the state that are engineered to Cleita Sep 2013 #36

As I said, I was in the Loma Prieta quake. Not the worst quake in terms of the numbers, either... MADem Sep 2013 #46

We learned structural lessons from that quake and Cleita Sep 2013 #48

Well, I don't need to "save" my concerns for one thing over the other. MADem Sep 2013 #52

If anyone in California felt as you do, they would Cleita Sep 2013 #53

Well, from the OP article posted, it looks like more than "anyone" feels like you say I do. MADem Sep 2013 #59

Frankly, I'm more concerned about the off shore fracking Cleita Sep 2013 #62

Anything that causes an earthquake, fracking included, would impact this project and would MADem Sep 2013 #67

If the engineers do their job, it would be. n/t Cleita Sep 2013 #69

That's a big "if"--and even if they do due diligence, we don't have a lot of data on exactly how MADem Sep 2013 #70

This isn't Texas. We actually expect more from our Cleita Sep 2013 #71

Well, Loma Prieta wasn't back in the dark ages. And that was some major infrastructure failure. MADem Sep 2013 #72

Those were decades ago.n/t Cleita Sep 2013 #73

There are plenty of more recent examples. MADem Sep 2013 #96

Okay, now I find you are making me repeat myself which Cleita Sep 2013 #97

Well, let me repeat myself as well, then. MADem Sep 2013 #98

it is a circus of compromise reddread Sep 2013 #80

I have driven the 5 and 99 many times over the years and they are Cleita Sep 2013 #95

oh really? reddread Sep 2013 #124

rode that one out at ground zero, where were you? reddread Sep 2013 #81

WOW--you must have been terrified! MADem Sep 2013 #93

wasnt smart enough to be really scared, but two weeks later- reddread Sep 2013 #94

It's a toy for the rich XemaSab Sep 2013 #10

Exactly, but it is highly questionable whether the rich would spend the EXTRA time needed grantcart Sep 2013 #30

You guys make me laugh. The rich fly private jets from airports you don't use. Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #83

divine comedy reddread Sep 2013 #85

The bulk of the SFO/LAX traffic is not "the rich" its business traffic grantcart Sep 2013 #90

its not either/or reddread Sep 2013 #79

Not the rich, but the business class and tourists. Xithras Sep 2013 #106

It is a bad idea that will be poorly executed Throd Sep 2013 #14

My Assemblywoman, Diane Harkey, had only one thing to say in her ballot statement dogknob Sep 2013 #18

Diane Harkey who you are promoting here as reasonable is a right wing Republican Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #86

I guess I am one of the 48% in favor of this project...This connection is going to happen.. Tikki Sep 2013 #20

Good point. pinto Sep 2013 #21

+1 nt Live and Learn Sep 2013 #50

i agree noiretextatique Sep 2013 #105

The person at the LA Times who came up with the title should be fired. stevenleser Sep 2013 #22

Agree. They cherry picked the survey for the headline. There's more to the picture, as you note. pinto Sep 2013 #23

thats why people pay money reddread Sep 2013 #82

No, it's not. They don't buy newspapers to be misled. stevenleser Sep 2013 #88

they BUY newspapers reddread Sep 2013 #89

Has anyone traced the money behind this opposition...? Wounded Bear Sep 2013 #24

The Central Valley is prime for HSR. I agree with other comments about local mass transit, as well. pinto Sep 2013 #25

The money behind the report saying that it is unfeasible? The legislation that passed it: grantcart Sep 2013 #32

Check trucking money, too, if you're going to look at 'cui bono.' MADem Sep 2013 #43

try selling that to Wal-Mart reddread Sep 2013 #87

So perhaps they're part of the anti-train lobby, then... ? nt MADem Sep 2013 #91

no idea reddread Sep 2013 #92

Who Killed the Electric Car reddread Sep 2013 #84

Bottom line: Future Soaring Fuel Costs Will Make The Public Demand Better Mass Transportation System Yavin4 Sep 2013 #37

I don't know enough about all the specifics but certainly our country desperately needs to develop Douglas Carpenter Sep 2013 #39

Calling Bill Maher otohara Sep 2013 #40

Stopped, as thought it were in motion in the first place? Sen. Walter Sobchak Sep 2013 #44

The project is bringing much needed federal funding and will create jobs. Live and Learn Sep 2013 #51

Yep, I agree. Cleita Sep 2013 #55

I suggest building a gimungous kevlar vest, somewhere around King City. Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #54

You'd think with a name like BULLET train, it would get widespread conservative support. JEFF9K Sep 2013 #58

They should call it the Stand Your Ground Train, then! nt MADem Sep 2013 #60

Anything to avoid LAX. Calista241 Sep 2013 #63

I despise LAX, but unfortunately, Lydia Leftcoast Sep 2013 #66

Improving commuter rail would take more cars off the road for less money. LeftyMom Sep 2013 #76

"Variably punctual!" LOL!!! MADem Sep 2013 #101

ordinary Niceguy1 Sep 2013 #109

Running BART into the Sacramento and San Juaquin valleys LeftyMom Sep 2013 #110

I should think it would be cheaper, too....way more bang for buck. nt MADem Sep 2013 #117

What is needed is a line from San Diego to Vancouver BC davidpdx Sep 2013 #77

AMTRAK's Coast Starlight - pinto Sep 2013 #103

Been there, done that davidpdx Sep 2013 #120

How about a referendum diverting the funds from the current, designed to fail project, Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #102

That was an interesting and doable proposal. But who would it serve? pinto Sep 2013 #104

The benefits are significant and numerous; Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #107

Ah, good points. pinto Sep 2013 #118

And it's a good one. If we had anyone left in government working for the people, Egalitarian Thug Oct 2013 #125

Pay to shuttle Californians to Nevada to waste money? LeftyMom Sep 2013 #111

That's just silly. In the first place, Californians already come to Vegas and nothings going Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #113

How about doing both? maxsolomon Sep 2013 #112

I think doing the Vegas > LA leg would make the other(s) more likely to happen. Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #114

Because of right-of-way issues, it's Victorville to Vegas Nevernose Sep 2013 #122

You're right and that was the poison pill they used to kill it. Victorville? Really? n/t Egalitarian Thug Oct 2013 #126