General Discussion

DirkGently

(12,151 posts)

94. If no one was threatening the SUV when it first pulled over

Wed Oct 2, 2013, 11:55 AM

Oct 2013

... I'd agree it's hard to justify taking off in a way that hurt anyone. You can't hurt someone on the basis you imagine they might be dangerous.

But I question the likelihood of a bunch of guys forcing people off the road for their own amusement being all, "Sir, may I have your insurance information, please?" on the side of the road there.

So one question is -- did he try to sit still and wait for the cops, and only gun it when the motorcyclists did something else to make him panic?

Or were the motorcyclists being reasonable and non-threatening, and the SUV suddenly just got scared or angry unjustifiably and callously ran a man down rather than wait for a possible traffic ticket?

I don't think it would require much to show the driver of the SUV reasonably thought that a huge group of guys -- who had just illegally forced his SUV over for kicks -- surrounding the vehicle were a threat he needed to escape, even if it meant possibly harming someone.

If they were just treating the incident as a minor fender bender, why did they surround the SUV in such a way it couldn't drive off without crushing a guy?

Obviously, the specific facts we don't all know yet matter, and crushing a man with your car isn't easily justified.

But I can't help seeing this as a bunch of guys having a great time intimidating people with their bikes, then getting furious when someone they've bullied into a state of panic isn't sufficiently mindful of how fragile bikes and riders are when trying to get away.

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halfway decent human being quiz [View all] d_r Oct 2013 OP

Imagine you are being harrased by a mob of bikers who block your path NightWatcher Oct 2013 #1

Apparently, the man should have taken his ass-kicking right there on the highway. bunnies Oct 2013 #3

You can't hit someone d_r Oct 2013 #4

Youd have jumped out of your car with a gang of bikers beating your vehicle? bunnies Oct 2013 #6

That looks like a pintobean Oct 2013 #9

More like a death-wish quiz. bunnies Oct 2013 #18

honestly I would been out of the car d_r Oct 2013 #31

What makes you think there was time? bunnies Oct 2013 #34

I watched the video d_r Oct 2013 #183

Have you ever been in a car accident? bunnies Oct 2013 #185

exactly d_r Oct 2013 #203

And in none of the experiences you mention kcr Oct 2013 #207

I would have tried to open the door d_r Oct 2013 #211

Yes, you are trying to change it. kcr Oct 2013 #212

kcr, I'm not trying to compare d_r Oct 2013 #214

You're implying it. kcr Oct 2013 #215

The situations you describe are very different from the one we're discussing, though. bunnies Oct 2013 #209

I'm sure he *felt* threatened d_r Oct 2013 #213

except that is not at all what happened d_r Oct 2013 #10

NYPD disagrees with your account. bunnies Oct 2013 #13

No I didn't see that d_r Oct 2013 #20

We'd ALL get out to help but for fear of our lives. bunnies Oct 2013 #22

I imagine many people pretend they know what they would do in any given situation. LanternWaste Oct 2013 #118

You would make a shitty eyewitness Pretzel_Warrior Oct 2013 #86

You didn't watch the same video the rest of us have. CANDO Oct 2013 #136

That is pretty much how a rider with a pack of motorcycles creates separation for the pack. ieoeja Oct 2013 #139

A "good tactic"? CANDO Oct 2013 #182

Because it's their road pintobean Oct 2013 #196

You can see the tire at 3:04 in the video just after it had been ripped off the vehicle cpwm17 Oct 2013 #220

It certainly wasn't wreckless but it was reckless. hobbit709 Oct 2013 #192

DoubleDerp seveneyes Oct 2013 #30

You can if they're holding knives outside your window and your baby is in the car Renew Deal Oct 2013 #40

No these fucking motorcyclists should all fucking land in jail! Pretzel_Warrior Oct 2013 #65

You can if they are threatening you and your family Politicalboi Oct 2013 #169

"I would jump out of the car and try to help the guy I just hit." On the Road Oct 2013 #201

sorry I don't get it d_r Oct 2013 #205

Maybe I Misunderstood the Situation On the Road Oct 2013 #218

I guess it is perception d_r Oct 2013 #219

the biker deliberately applied the brakes in front of the car tk2kewl Oct 2013 #2

I don't think he was trying to be hit d_r Oct 2013 #5

bullshit tk2kewl Oct 2013 #7

so they just picked out this guy d_r Oct 2013 #11

my guess is something happened earlier that isn't on the vid tk2kewl Oct 2013 #14

I agree we don't know context d_r Oct 2013 #21

Reckless dude. RECKLESS tkmorris Oct 2013 #46

yeah you are right d_r Oct 2013 #51

Recless pintobean Oct 2013 #88

Hah! Nice tkmorris Oct 2013 #154

you should follow the links in this post... tk2kewl Oct 2013 #54

thank you for the link d_r Oct 2013 #61

This message was self-deleted by its author Buns_of_Fire Oct 2013 #59

One of the riders claims he pulled up alongside them and started hurling obscenities and threats sir pball Oct 2013 #108

No, if the biker was looking back treestar Oct 2013 #24

yes agreed d_r Oct 2013 #28

Turns out, he caused the accident intentionally. (shocking) bunnies Oct 2013 #37

Yeah I said d_r Oct 2013 #52

ok. So the biker intentionally causes an accident, bunnies Oct 2013 #62

I thought he was looking back d_r Oct 2013 #67

Do you drive? bunnies Oct 2013 #71

yeah I drive all the time of course I drive d_r Oct 2013 #78

*sigh* bunnies Oct 2013 #85

do i just hand them my 2 yr old also? seabeyond Oct 2013 #8

who would you hand your two year old to d_r Oct 2013 #12

you are talking about a real event, an event video'd. and you tie it in with "decent person" seabeyond Oct 2013 #15

not playing a game d_r Oct 2013 #26

a father had good reason to fear the safety of wife and child. that simple. seabeyond Oct 2013 #29

I have children d_r Oct 2013 #32

Even if they were surrounding your car and pounding on your windows? kcr Oct 2013 #42

again I don't see that happening on the video d_r Oct 2013 #47

Oh, right. They were surrounding his car just to check on things. kcr Oct 2013 #49

I don't see it the way you do. d_r Oct 2013 #55

your version of events is completely and utterly fantasy ProdigalJunkMail Oct 2013 #58

may be so d_r Oct 2013 #70

How was he merely assuming they were dangerous and scary? kcr Oct 2013 #77

I don't see it d_r Oct 2013 #79

And that's what makes your opinion on this so cuckoo pants. kcr Oct 2013 #87

another thing that is dangerous d_r Oct 2013 #189

It's especially dangerous kcr Oct 2013 #190

RIght, it didn't have to be that way kcr Oct 2013 #63

serious question d_r Oct 2013 #74

Okay, dude, you're on to us. kcr Oct 2013 #81

Wanna bet this OP has never been in a car accident? bunnies Oct 2013 #91

...AND brandishes knives; slashing your tires. TeeYiYi Oct 2013 #144

The OP and a few others. kcr Oct 2013 #148

You wouldn't check on your wife and child first? pintobean Oct 2013 #95

Would that be the decent human being test? bunnies Oct 2013 #109

You are a friggin' saint. There. Happy now? virgogal Oct 2013 #128

Nah. bunnies Oct 2013 #17

Ya, that. Nt seabeyond Oct 2013 #19

Well, apparently that's what he gets for being biased against bikers. kcr Oct 2013 #90

Exactly. bunnies Oct 2013 #92

And remember, everyone. kcr Oct 2013 #113

And for the Women: bunnies Oct 2013 #119

from information so far, I'd say the biker who brake checked is at fault.... steve2470 Oct 2013 #16

self-defense statute in NY state steve2470 Oct 2013 #35

E.) Escape the people slashing your tires & trying to kill you? DirkGently Oct 2013 #23

I don't see C on the video d_r Oct 2013 #27

Are you purposely being obtuse? HERVEPA Oct 2013 #33

No I am absolutely not d_r Oct 2013 #39

OK. If the driver and his family were being physically threatened (which most people think), HERVEPA Oct 2013 #56

Yes d_r Oct 2013 #66

They have a history of being scum! bunnies Oct 2013 #75

Just what I read. You can see them surrounding the SUV DirkGently Oct 2013 #38

I keep looking at the video d_r Oct 2013 #43

If no one was threatening the SUV when it first pulled over DirkGently Oct 2013 #94

I don't know if it was the guy who was slowing down and got hit d_r Oct 2013 #50

The SUV doesn't "look" like its tires were already slashed... Whiskeytide Oct 2013 #72

After the initial accident, both sides call 911 treestar Oct 2013 #25

If I am involved In a car accident DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #80

Hit and Run rules can be very stringent treestar Oct 2013 #125

but there could be defenses: treestar Oct 2013 #126

The SUV driver called 911 at least four times. DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #131

Yeah, I think if he called 911 from the car treestar Oct 2013 #132

If the driver intentionally hit the guy and fled as the OP suggests DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #133

Scenario 1: Flee with my wife and child from the orcs on those bikes geek tragedy Oct 2013 #36

they aren't "orcs" d_r Oct 2013 #44

Yes, people are biased against violent thugs on motorized bikes terrorizing other drivers nt geek tragedy Oct 2013 #45

So you're going to hang around if dozens and dozens of people DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #48

Damn skippy. reflection Oct 2013 #57

Do you watch 10 hours of Sci Fi Channel every single day? closeupready Oct 2013 #96

No, but if a bunch of thugs were threatening the safety of me and my family geek tragedy Oct 2013 #103

The only fantasy I see in this thread Union Scribe Oct 2013 #105

Hint: "Orcs" aren't real, lol. closeupready Oct 2013 #130

I can certainly understand why you would trivialize a visceral reaction... LanternWaste Oct 2013 #135

smh/nt DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #41

your attempt to justify the bikers' behavior ProdigalJunkMail Oct 2013 #53

then you misunderstood d_r Oct 2013 #64

My friend had this quote which he attributed to Orwell but i can't find confirmation, ergo: DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #68

Your post is ridiculous. Under general circumstances Pretzel_Warrior Oct 2013 #60

I don't understand why that it is so hard for the OP to understand. DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #69

this topic, once again, shows how DU's membership has degraded to closeupready Oct 2013 #73

The OP is out on the limb alone on this one. bunnies Oct 2013 #82

No, he's not. There are at least four of us, by my count. closeupready Oct 2013 #98

Fantastic. bunnies Oct 2013 #106

It appears you and I are the only two people who saw it that way. ieoeja Oct 2013 #76

thank you. d_r Oct 2013 #83

Young people behaving youthfully scares the shit out of a lot of old people. ieoeja Oct 2013 #89

This kids being kids nonsese it absolute bullshit. bunnies Oct 2013 #97

This message was self-deleted by its author closeupready Oct 2013 #101

The other suspect who was arrested is 42. pintobean Oct 2013 #114

Wow. That other "kid" is older than me! bunnies Oct 2013 #122

I guess every city has these "bikers" pintobean Oct 2013 #124

I agree with you re: calling them bikers. bunnies Oct 2013 #127

Count me in, too. I'm thinking I need to move on; DU is conservative closeupready Oct 2013 #93

Being a progressive and acting rationally aren't mutually exclusive DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #104

The video didn't show any of that. ieoeja Oct 2013 #111

Here DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #116

Ah! Because he said so. Whom should I believe, him or my lying eyes? n/t ieoeja Oct 2013 #117

This will all be sorted out in the fullness of time DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #121

Check out video at post #134. ieoeja Oct 2013 #137

I stopped for a couple weeks. But lurked, saw something that I just couldn't *not* comment on. ieoeja Oct 2013 #110

Many commenters are fairly new, and part of me thinks closeupready Oct 2013 #129

This isn't a D/R or left/right issue pintobean Oct 2013 #138

It would be fun if you could actually contribute something closeupready Oct 2013 #141

Thank you Mrs. Potts pintobean Oct 2013 #147

lol, do you have a Ph.D. in wisecracking, closeupready Oct 2013 #156

There are a group of idiots out there... NCTraveler Oct 2013 #84

Not just "out there" apparently. bunnies Oct 2013 #100

We're conservative authoritarians now, too. kcr Oct 2013 #115

I noticed that. bunnies Oct 2013 #120

Your OP, and every subsequent post in this thread, is ludicrous. Sheldon Cooper Oct 2013 #99

This thread gets a big fail bigwillq Oct 2013 #102

This reminds me of the Cheney defense when he shot his hunting partner in the face DemocratSinceBirth Oct 2013 #107

If the bikers felt they were wronged by the driver at the outset of the incident NuclearDem Oct 2013 #112

Isn't it great fun to reduce life to its most simplistic form? lpbk2713 Oct 2013 #123

This video shows how the bikers attacked the SUV before he ran from them. ieoeja Oct 2013 #134

"One person walks up and opens the door" kcr Oct 2013 #140

Probably to give him a piece of his mind. ieoeja Oct 2013 #142

The guy was yanking violently. kcr Oct 2013 #143

You are overreaching. And inserting fantasy here. closeupready Oct 2013 #146

Im sure the door was just stuck. bunnies Oct 2013 #149

First we were conservative and authoritarian. Now we're D&D nerds. kcr Oct 2013 #151

And Racist! Racist-Authoritarian D&D nerds! bunnies Oct 2013 #153

Post removed Post removed Oct 2013 #159

Sexism is AWESOME! bunnies Oct 2013 #162

It goes with the whole orc-y, D&D theme; report, if you wish. closeupready Oct 2013 #170

I dont know what the fuck an "orc" is but I now sexism when I see it. bunnies Oct 2013 #173

Wow, that really solidifies your point of view kcr Oct 2013 #163

Oh, I hope they do. kcr Oct 2013 #160

And now closeupready has pulled the sexism card. bunnies Oct 2013 #166

Did you alert? closeupready Oct 2013 #171

No way. I'd rather leave it out there for everyone to see. nt bunnies Oct 2013 #174

Because you are such a sensitive human being? closeupready Oct 2013 #176

Sexists are SO cool. bunnies Oct 2013 #177

It's honestly funny to juxtapose closeupready Oct 2013 #145

Yeah, I know, how ridiculous kcr Oct 2013 #150

Horrible, yes, I agree - the rest, again, is mostly fantasy. closeupready Oct 2013 #155

You keep saying things are fantasy kcr Oct 2013 #157

You and your ilk here are embellishing - someone 5 minutes ago closeupready Oct 2013 #164

Oh, they called them names? kcr Oct 2013 #168

There do not appear to be many people passing the "halfway decent human being" test on DU. ieoeja Oct 2013 #161

Except that most biker-haters here are psychic, so they know closeupready Oct 2013 #167

Right, because it takes a psychic kcr Oct 2013 #175

Racism now too? bunnies Oct 2013 #152

Do you know what race "bikers" are? pintobean Oct 2013 #165

How do you know I'm not an it? closeupready Oct 2013 #172

? pintobean Oct 2013 #217

Any excuse to call DUers names will do, it seems. bunnies Oct 2013 #179

The biker who was interviewed in that video, reflection Oct 2013 #158

If someone ever tries to open my car door while I'm stopped. I'm flooring it. Deal with that. Pretzel_Warrior Oct 2013 #180

Hopefully if that ever happens none of your loved ones will be in front of your car. ieoeja Oct 2013 #181

I really hope d_r Oct 2013 #186

Your first scenario is missing something... TeeYiYi Oct 2013 #178

That reads more Phentex Oct 2013 #184

but that isn't what happened d_r Oct 2013 #187

You're wrong. kcr Oct 2013 #188

OK d_r Oct 2013 #193

Someone trying to open his car door is reason enough. Yes. kcr Oct 2013 #195

Links... TeeYiYi Oct 2013 #197

Should you ride a motorcycle quiz Taitertots Oct 2013 #191

I don't think anyone has said d_r Oct 2013 #194

You shouldn't be put in a situation where you need to do that Taitertots Oct 2013 #199

I think someone did. pintobean Oct 2013 #200

well I never said it d_r Oct 2013 #210

Have you read anything about the story, or just watched the first 10 seconds of video? DireStrike Oct 2013 #198

I've watched it really closely d_r Oct 2013 #206

I don't think it's really possible to see that in the video DireStrike Oct 2013 #208

you are right d_r Oct 2013 #216

Wow. And I thought I'd seen stupid OPs before. xfundy Oct 2013 #202

This isn't a halfway decent ANYTHING. cherokeeprogressive Oct 2013 #204

They slashed his tire cpwm17 Oct 2013 #221

he ran over motorcycles d_r Oct 2013 #222