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ProSense

(116,464 posts)
174. Your point is absurd
Wed Oct 2, 2013, 03:38 PM
Oct 2013

"It's astonishing. They are flat refusing to admit that there are millions... For whom a hundred bucks is a big-fucking-deal, let alone a hundred a month."

Yes, $100 month is a lot for millions of people, but that doesn't mean that millions of people will opt out of the health care system for that reason. Anyone who believes that $100 a month is too much or they can't afford it likely doesn't have health care at this point.

They can continue to resist participating in the system and will likely be exempt from the penalty. If not, they will be liable for the penalty, which comes out of their tax return, providing they file one.

Silver plans for those who don't qualify for Medicaid will be as low as $40 on average. All the plans are better because the basic benefits are better.

As I said, the point is that health care is always going to come at a cost, even single payer. At one point, the suggestion was a 3.5 percent increase in the payroll tax to pay for a single-payer program (which also required an additional 5 percent and 10 percent tax on the top 5 percent and 1 percent, respectively.

That would be mandated. Period.

There are people who will be eligible for hardship exemptions from the fees. The point is that the health care law establishes a way to make obtaining coverage affordable.

Again, more than half of the uninsured (17 million) will be eligible for Medicaid. This bill is a significant help to low-income Americans.

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0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

This is why I rejected RomneyCare for something better. But, alas, there was no political will in DC blkmusclmachine Oct 2013 #1
All about exemptions: kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #131
I loathe the ACA as it stands to date. Cerridwen Oct 2013 #2
Stop relying on "news sources". Go straight to the facts: kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #132
+1 for this. There's way too much BS flying around. nt IronLionZion Oct 2013 #196
This message was self-deleted by its author lostincalifornia Oct 2013 #228
"because you don't have a couple hundred extra a month, that's what you are going to owe" NYC_SKP Oct 2013 #3
we wouldn't want facts to come in the way of feeling outraged nt cash__whatiwant Oct 2013 #28
Outrage rejects you and your horrible facts! HappyMe Oct 2013 #50
From what I can tell, my cost would be $103 a month for a crappy "bronze" plan if I can get the Erose999 Oct 2013 #59
The "savings accounts" are a fucking scam and joke. NYC_SKP Oct 2013 #71
Yep, you're better off with zero coverage. 100% of medical costs is less than 40%. TroglodyteScholar Oct 2013 #200
They do have a point Tien1985 Oct 2013 #206
Couldn't have said it better myself. Unless I get a 100% subsidy, a pay raise without a hike in Erose999 Oct 2013 #212
What you make doesn't always reflect what you can afford. n/t ohheckyeah Oct 2013 #130
This message was self-deleted by its author lostincalifornia Oct 2013 #230
You fail to mention the benefits to those who don't have enough income Cali_Democrat Oct 2013 #4
Tax for being poor? tinrobot Oct 2013 #5
Thanks. elleng Oct 2013 #27
the stupid is burning too much? dlwickham Oct 2013 #143
Sure is/was. elleng Oct 2013 #186
Or you get nothing. bunnies Oct 2013 #65
The poor are already taxed and have been for eons. It's called capitalism. nt kelliekat44 Oct 2013 #229
What's a little more regressive tax as long as it benefits those on top. nt adirondacker Oct 2013 #6
Seriously? TroglodyteScholar Oct 2013 #203
If you can't afford the insurance, you will almost certainly qualify for Medicaid. Gravitycollapse Oct 2013 #7
Except in the 22 states that didn't expand Medicaid. n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #14
That isn't the fault of the ACA. it is the local governments Motown_Johnny Oct 2013 #18
Not only that - Ms. Toad Oct 2013 #24
+1 ~ GOP states offer little help on buying insurance Zorra Oct 2013 #25
NM's an exception, Republican governor made smart decision Voice for Peace Oct 2013 #110
Surely the ACA could have been fixed. bunnies Oct 2013 #68
By that time it was too late, as Republicans controlled the House and the Democrats PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #138
I still would have like a vote forced. bunnies Oct 2013 #145
Well they're trying to delay the entire PPACA's implementation right now. n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #148
True enough. bunnies Oct 2013 #150
Blame the legislatures of those states. Stop blaming Obama and the ACA. kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #136
People are exempt from the fines in states that didn't expand loyalsister Oct 2013 #195
Even in those states, the formula for qualifying for Medicaid changes in Jan. JCMach1 Oct 2013 #238
You could always get Medicaid if you couldn't afford to pay for your HC. sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #70
Most states Medicaid programs have been running patients through private insurer's plans for years. Hoyt Oct 2013 #79
Which is why we need a National HC system where the money designated sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #89
"You could always get Medicaid if you couldn't afford to pay for your HC." <---- False. winter is coming Oct 2013 #92
For many Medicaid is nothing but a loan with your estate as collateral. duffyduff Oct 2013 #127
This is true. I wonder if that will ever stop being the case? GreenPartyVoter Oct 2013 #207
I make too much for Medicaid, Keefer Oct 2013 #93
I'm sorry. Truly. I don't know the answer. I do know that they have been sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #96
Well... Keefer Oct 2013 #194
You don't need anymore stress. Seems there is a lot of confusion sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #219
Ohioans *never* could get Medicaid if they weren't elderly or disabled Kolesar Oct 2013 #226
Not true, It was rather difficult to get Medicaid before the PPACA expansion. n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #141
How will it work now? sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #156
Well if you are in one of the states that went with the PPACA's expanded Medicaid... PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #163
Thank you. It looks like 22 states are not participating. sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #187
Yes they should still remain on Medicaid. What state in particular is this concerning? n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #188
Arizona where I have a friend who is on their version of Medicaid. She sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #189
Yes it surprised some people here but she did... PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #191
Not in many states Sgent Oct 2013 #231
And how will those Southern States change in this regard now? sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #239
And now, the rest of the story pugetres Oct 2013 #8
A shut off notice? Wow.. now THAT is a loophole Motown_Johnny Oct 2013 #19
The keyword there is "may" Trekologer Oct 2013 #197
Please don't give morons ideas. n/t Chan790 Oct 2013 #199
Don't go introductin' actual facts into a good ol' misinformed outrage...nt SidDithers Oct 2013 #31
If your state didn't accept the medicaid increase, then yeah, you're screwed johnd83 Oct 2013 #9
You wouldn't owe a penalty in that case, however. n/t pnwmom Oct 2013 #53
+1 Agschmid Oct 2013 #114
I posted the numbers they came up with... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #10
I am one who is facing a significant increase in my health cilla4progress Oct 2013 #12
You are leaving out some very important factors of the ACA, Live and Learn Oct 2013 #16
All true. cilla4progress Oct 2013 #60
Sorry you're one of the people standing over the cracks Hydra Oct 2013 #39
I know ... I worked in a bankruptcy law firm cilla4progress Oct 2013 #61
The WA Basic Health plan closed because of severe state budget cutbacks -- pnwmom Oct 2013 #54
I wasn't on Basic Health cilla4progress Oct 2013 #62
The Washington Health Program was part of Basic Health. pnwmom Oct 2013 #64
simple, keep your own insurance larkrake Oct 2013 #135
Yep, and you carefully ignored the exemptions written in the law jeff47 Oct 2013 #20
That's complete nonsense. If so, why have a penalty or mandate at all? nt Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #21
Because the exemptions cover the people you are worried about, not everyone. jeff47 Oct 2013 #22
There is no point going around on this... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #45
Where is your data that, aside from the people who live in the states pnwmom Oct 2013 #63
None of these people would be elegible in ANY state, nor were any of them evil smokers... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #151
I'm sure those people exist, and almost all of them could easily get a waiver. pnwmom Oct 2013 #158
You keep bringing up that I am a smoker, yet none of the numbers I have posted are for smokers... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #164
Because you already told me that your smoking is why you can't afford pnwmom Oct 2013 #169
odd nothing out was singles out as questionseverything Oct 2013 #209
Because smoking causes more, and more expensive health problems jeff47 Oct 2013 #214
i understand the smokers are the dems questionseverything Oct 2013 #221
So....the problem is my casual wording jeff47 Oct 2013 #232
it is not about me at all questionseverything Oct 2013 #234
So now people have to mess with their credit and bills sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #192
We didn't have enough Democratic votes for a public option. pnwmom Oct 2013 #193
It's not that hard. jeff47 Oct 2013 #215
no he opposed mandates questionseverything Oct 2013 #224
And then he bothered to think about it for more than a minute. jeff47 Oct 2013 #233
the snark is why we can not fix stuff questionseverything Oct 2013 #235
Doesn't matter that you bought it for 30 years jeff47 Oct 2013 #236
I find my phone bill "a significant burden" lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #161
Ah yes. Reality. :eyes: jeff47 Oct 2013 #213
It's not nonsense -- you're simply uninformed, even though you've already pnwmom Oct 2013 #56
You need to do some reading so you can stop sounding so foolish and uninformed. kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #140
Exactly! SammyWinstonJack Oct 2013 #30
Because it doesn't affect them, so it can't be possible Hydra Oct 2013 #42
Yes, the cavalier attitude towards anyone who legitimately cannot afford sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #218
That's one of the things that annoys me about the cheering for this Hydra Oct 2013 #220
Because there are many waivers available from the fine pnwmom Oct 2013 #66
If your are paying attention you will see upaloopa Oct 2013 #36
The ordinary people do want single payer Hydra Oct 2013 #43
We won't "make of it what we will" MattBaggins Oct 2013 #48
This message was self-deleted by its author PowerToThePeople Oct 2013 #11
Kiss your tax refund checks goodbye leftstreet Oct 2013 #13
Or break a finger and end up at the emergency room and owe $7,000 pnwmom Oct 2013 #67
That will still happen leftstreet Oct 2013 #72
There will be a lot LESS for the hospitals to write off. pnwmom Oct 2013 #74
Uh, most writeoffs and settlements are for the insured leftstreet Oct 2013 #75
That's because so many people till now had policies with low limits. pnwmom Oct 2013 #76
No. Cost caps have been delayed leftstreet Oct 2013 #77
Most of the policies I have reviewed have out-of-pocket maximums. missingthebigdog Oct 2013 #144
The caps are delayed only for certain plans using multiple-administrators, not for most plans. PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #157
A lot more people will benefit from ACA than not. darkangel218 Oct 2013 #15
Everyone up to 133% of poverty line now qualifies for Medicaid Motown_Johnny Oct 2013 #17
Except in the 22 states that didn't expand Medicaid. n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #57
And they will have any penalty waived if they don't make enough pnwmom Oct 2013 #69
as I said om post #18 Motown_Johnny Oct 2013 #178
Wow! Healthcare.gov has answers, including exemptions from fee due to hardship. ProSense Oct 2013 #23
+1000 nt ecstatic Oct 2013 #116
Thank you Democrats for supporting the Health Insurance and Healthcare industry bailout Puzzledtraveller Oct 2013 #26
Millions will receive care that before they couldn't get upaloopa Oct 2013 #40
I like the expanded medicaid portion Puzzledtraveller Oct 2013 #44
The mandate has a couple of purposes. It will add the young upaloopa Oct 2013 #49
45,000 people dying every year due to lack of health coverage isn't fair Hippo_Tron Oct 2013 #204
Surprise, surprise more anti-ACA lies from a certain crowd, And they are LIES geek tragedy Oct 2013 #29
The new set of talking points have gone out, I guess...nt SidDithers Oct 2013 #32
On Monday it was "hey, why not agree to the Republicans' demand to delay the mandate" geek tragedy Oct 2013 #34
You are not including the subsidies that should be subtracted from the total so that is inaccurate. appleannie1 Oct 2013 #33
This is a rather poor effort at trolling Capt. Obvious Oct 2013 #35
You'll get flak for this Hydra Oct 2013 #37
Part of it depends on the definition of "can't afford." pnwmom Oct 2013 #73
I ran the numbers for my situation Hydra Oct 2013 #80
You hit several nails on the head. Puzzledtraveller Oct 2013 #87
The common thread I've seen on DU Hydra Oct 2013 #91
You're assuming you don't get cancer or some other catastrophic illness Hippo_Tron Oct 2013 #208
Ah, but that's the problem Hydra Oct 2013 #216
Who will die because of the ACA and how? Hippo_Tron Oct 2013 #222
Take the penalty, save up, and immigrate to a country that cares about its citizens NoOneMan Oct 2013 #38
^^this^^ Puzzledtraveller Oct 2013 #46
Don't think of it as a tax for being poor, think of it as poor people hughee99 Oct 2013 #41
That's how a lot of this system works and why rates are going down NoOneMan Oct 2013 #47
Yep. enlightenment Oct 2013 #88
great post nt Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #159
Not necessarily. There is a possible waiver available for people pnwmom Oct 2013 #51
See this post... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #55
All you need is one shut-off notice -- which you can then pay -- pnwmom Oct 2013 #153
Slow down jasper zipplewrath Oct 2013 #172
That must be regional then. pnwmom Oct 2013 #175
Was it your first? zipplewrath Oct 2013 #183
Exemptions from the fine: kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #147
I have NEVER understood the name of this publication "Christian Science" snooper2 Oct 2013 #52
Because of its affiliation with the Church of Christian Scientist PeaceNikki Oct 2013 #58
Yep. The Obama Administration even argued before the Supreme Court that it was a tax. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #78
An absolute lie. Drunken Irishman Oct 2013 #81
Number 2 is dishonest at best Hydra Oct 2013 #83
It's absolutely honest... Drunken Irishman Oct 2013 #84
You haven't done the numbers Hydra Oct 2013 #103
You didn't read my post, then... Drunken Irishman Oct 2013 #198
Well, believe it or not Hydra Oct 2013 #202
I'm not in any hole because I have employer based health insurance. Drunken Irishman Oct 2013 #205
Next, we'll have to solve the problem of homelessness. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #82
A mandate-solution would not be perfect, but it would help some and we could fix it later. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #85
You've definitely struck a chord. It's telling that in all this falderal, no one seems to want to Egalitarian Thug Oct 2013 #86
This is such ProSense Oct 2013 #94
See? Egalitarian Thug Oct 2013 #95
"See" what? ProSense Oct 2013 #97
"...no one seems to want to talk about health care. Egalitarian Thug Oct 2013 #100
Oh please. ProSense Oct 2013 #102
See reality: ProSense Oct 2013 #99
That, plus why disrupt the touch-down dance? Puzzledtraveller Oct 2013 #101
If the penalities are so bad then why are most exchanges jambed... Historic NY Oct 2013 #90
a) there is no collection mechanism. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #98
*lmao* Hydra Oct 2013 #106
You can save it for *now*, if you like. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #111
Scotus says it's a legal tax Hydra Oct 2013 #113
Their only "teeth" is deducting the penalty from any refund you may be entitled. n/t lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #119
Like I said, I'm saving this Hydra Oct 2013 #121
Okee doke. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #124
They keep your tax return money n/t leftstreet Oct 2013 #112
If you get a refund, but choose not to spend it on medical insurance, then good. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #129
Yeah, working class people buys yachts with their returns leftstreet Oct 2013 #134
Thanks. nt adirondacker Oct 2013 #237
2% of the total population will be required to pay the penalty. Raine1967 Oct 2013 #104
DU doesn't understand what it's like to be poor Prism Oct 2013 #105
I've never been so poor that my life wouldn't have been a top 5 priority. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #107
You're fortunate in that way. Prism Oct 2013 #128
Thanks for laying it out so bluntly Hydra Oct 2013 #108
This is insulting, and ProSense Oct 2013 #118
Not so insulting that it stops people from lecturing the struggling. Prism Oct 2013 #125
I don't know anyone 400% or more of FPL who is struggling for any reason other than medical debt. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #133
We're not discussing the same things Prism Oct 2013 #146
You seem to be implying ProSense Oct 2013 #137
It will help some and not others. Prism Oct 2013 #149
Bull shit. Plenty of DUers have serious financial struggles. Some ongoing, some sporadic. kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #152
Just stop Prism Oct 2013 #160
It's astonishing. They are flat refusing to admit that there are millions... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #165
Your point is absurd ProSense Oct 2013 #174
Not indifferent at all. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #167
We seem to be concerned about different population segments n/t Prism Oct 2013 #170
As did the guy who won the election. n/t PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #180
any SPHC system would have likely resulted in across the board tax increases, as well. Warren DeMontague Oct 2013 #211
No system is perfect Prism Oct 2013 #217
I just don't get Sgent Oct 2013 #240
Wouldn't anyone who couldn't afford Obamacare get a subsidy or qualify for Medicaid? ecstatic Oct 2013 #109
Yes. A childless couple making $62,039 without employer provided ins. qualifies for subsidy. nt lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #115
Yes and no Hydra Oct 2013 #117
There are a number of preventive services with no deductibles and copays. If you get really sick Hoyt Oct 2013 #154
It's a matter of scale Hydra Oct 2013 #168
If you need a kidney transplant, do you honestly think most hospitals will say no over $2,500. Hoyt Oct 2013 #173
I'm fine, but there are people who won't be, and I used to be in that category Hydra Oct 2013 #176
I believe more people will be helped. And those that aren't should be on short-list for help. Hoyt Oct 2013 #177
Haha Hydra Oct 2013 #185
Nope. If your state hasn't expanded Medicaid, it's possible to be ineligible for a subsidy winter is coming Oct 2013 #122
I don't think this is true. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #155
I didn't say anything specific about the % of FPL. winter is coming Oct 2013 #166
You're right. I stand corrected. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #171
Yes if you'd be eligible for Medicaid except your state isn't participating you don't have to pay PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #181
Thank you for conveniently omitting the many EXEMPTIONS from the fine. kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #120
You still have to pay back Medicaid if you are 55 and older. duffyduff Oct 2013 #126
You are referring to the Medicaid Estate Recovery program, more info which can be found here... PoliticAverse Oct 2013 #179
They'll just take it out of any refund you may owe. duffyduff Oct 2013 #123
Astonishing. virgogal Oct 2013 #139
Exemptions from the fine/penalty: kestrel91316 Oct 2013 #162
Thanks for that link Post in haste,repent in leisure. virgogal Oct 2013 #182
that's what I thought until I read that under a certain income level you are exempt from the penalty magical thyme Oct 2013 #142
It's a "crack" zipplewrath Oct 2013 #184
I expect to fall through the crack magical thyme Oct 2013 #190
Can anyone familiar with the subject truly take this post seriously? TroglodyteScholar Oct 2013 #201
Facts are facts. You can, if you prefer, live in a fox news type fantasy. That's on you. nt Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #210
Actually, the fact is Sugarcoated Oct 2013 #223
I have posted the NUMBERS... Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #225
This message was self-deleted by its author lostincalifornia Oct 2013 #227
WTF is going on lately? Yet another stupid fucking post, re: ACA! n/t ChisolmTrailDem Oct 2013 #241
I know, right? Facts and information are always stupid. What matters are FEELINGS! nt Demo_Chris Oct 2013 #242
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