General Discussion

moriah

(8,312 posts)

8. Insurance is about management of risk. Health care should be about *care*.

Tue Oct 29, 2013, 01:21 PM

Oct 2013

Health care is going to have to move out of a "risk management" philosophy as the risk pool is eventually widened to 100% of the country. There's no way to make a profit off of betting on whether or not a group of people will get sick or not, when the group is everyone. And when that type of speculation is taken out of the picture and we focus on providing the best care for our dollar, we can actually start to have a real health *care* system.

Auto insurance, however, is highly speculative. They're trying to help people overcome some risk factors if they're willing to get the machines spy on them -- check out Progressive's little thingamagig you put in your car, Esurance also has one. It's allowing rates to be more personalized for the driver, which I think is a good thing.

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Why is it fair for men to pay more for auto insurance? [View all] Kurska Oct 2013 OP

It's not fair. surrealAmerican Oct 2013 #1

It isn't. Puzzledtraveller Oct 2013 #2

I don't believe anyone has said that it is is fair. ScreamingMeemie Oct 2013 #3

They factor in lots of unfair shit, I think... penultimate Oct 2013 #4

Actually, about 95 percent of them use your credit score now. Fawke Em Oct 2013 #53

There's not a single long-term agreement in the world now that doesn't look at your credit score Recursion Oct 2013 #58

Employers that look at credits scores baffle me the most.. penultimate Oct 2013 #71

Same here. I mean, bank teller or something I get Recursion Oct 2013 #75

This message was self-deleted by its author Glassunion Oct 2013 #99

I'd like to know too.... beerandjesus Oct 2013 #5

If they pass the Equal Rights Amendment rating up men will stop. DURHAM D Oct 2013 #6

+1 gollygee Oct 2013 #7

^^ Win (nt) Recursion Oct 2013 #60

ERA should have been passed yesterday Kurska Oct 2013 #91

+1000 ismnotwasm Oct 2013 #92

Insurance is about management of risk. Health care should be about *care*. moriah Oct 2013 #8

I am a man, ergo I will be charged more for auto insurance more than a female. Kurska Oct 2013 #11

No, it's not fair, especially given the mandatory nature of liability auto insurance. moriah Oct 2013 #16

It's not one bit speculative. It's based on national/state driving arrest and conviction statistics. ancianita Oct 2013 #62

What I mean is, insurance is in the business of trying to make money by managing risk. moriah Oct 2013 #65

The math supports the argument that they can make money, yes. It also shows who should pay it. ancianita Oct 2013 #68

Correction, there's lots of good math behind both. moriah Oct 2013 #73

As a woman, don't be quick to hand over your money, since state and national stats are not unfair. ancianita Oct 2013 #78

They're based on traditional gender stereotypes ... Myrina Oct 2013 #9

In my experience, guys got pulled over far more often with me in the car... moriah Oct 2013 #13

It's not based on stereotypes. It's based on statistics. denverbill Oct 2013 #35

No they're absolutely not. You're wrong about the gender stereotype thing. Lots of social stuff is ancianita Oct 2013 #64

No, it's based on statistics, not stereotypes. alarimer Oct 2013 #98

First, because buying auto insurance is only mandated if you CHOOSE to drive a car. djean111 Oct 2013 #10

Tell me how I would go about never "choosing" to drive in the rural south. Kurska Oct 2013 #14

I meant carrying your argument out to a logical conclusion. djean111 Oct 2013 #22

The argument is it is the same argument for both cases Kurska Oct 2013 #36

Because evryone does not drive. djean111 Oct 2013 #38

And not everyone buys health insurance Kurska Oct 2013 #43

Health insurance applies equally because every single one of us WILL NEED HEALTH CARE at some point. ancianita Oct 2013 #66

Every human on this earth spent at least some time IN a uterus. moriah Oct 2013 #85

Too bad. Statistics of car-related crime by gender put the lie to your claims. See my other post ancianita Oct 2013 #57

what about life insurance? MattBaggins Oct 2013 #100

How very un-Democratic of you joeglow3 Oct 2013 #30

In the reality of today's world, yes. djean111 Oct 2013 #37

"the ideal car insurance would be single-payer" ding ding, we have a winner. Kurska Oct 2013 #45

Message auto-removed Name removed Oct 2013 #12

And women require more healthcare Kurska Oct 2013 #15

Gender is not something you can choose MissMillie Oct 2013 #19

I disagree, I've known people who simply shouldn't drive Fumesucker Oct 2013 #40

I think I'm safe enough with four wheels, but not two. moriah Oct 2013 #52

In mercuryblues Oct 2013 #17

It's not fair Politicalboi Oct 2013 #18

It depends on what your concept of "Insurance" is ...... oldhippie Oct 2013 #20

Health and auto insurance aren't comparable BainsBane Oct 2013 #21

Eh, transportation is kind of essential to work, which is pretty essential to live. moriah Oct 2013 #25

I personally resent having to have auto insurance at all BainsBane Oct 2013 #26

So if you are responsible for an accident in which I am injured and/or my car is damaged, djean111 Oct 2013 #33

You have recourse to the courts BainsBane Oct 2013 #46

What if I cannot afford a lawyer? What if you have nothing to take? djean111 Oct 2013 #47

In a just society, you would be permitted to ...... oldhippie Oct 2013 #69

We pay uninsured motorist coverage, don't we? BainsBane Oct 2013 #74

You don't have to have auto insurance, even to drive on public roads ..... oldhippie Oct 2013 #70

This message was self-deleted by its author BainsBane Oct 2013 #86

i am insuring a 16 and 18 yr old. nto fair. lets end it today. nt seabeyond Oct 2013 #23

Insurance companies mercuryblues Oct 2013 #24

husband totalled two vehicles 19 yrs, son one, i none... just a second, gotta knock on some wood... seabeyond Oct 2013 #27

you should see our rates mercuryblues Oct 2013 #42

My parent's are going through that with my little brother penultimate Oct 2013 #76

OMG... lol, ya. all this. my oldest gets no more chances. two. any more, he is off. seabeyond Oct 2013 #79

Insurance companies also set rates based on geography liberal N proud Oct 2013 #28

Our rates dropped in half when we moved from Maryland madinmaryland Oct 2013 #80

We were in northern Missouri, but yes liberal N proud Oct 2013 #87

I see. I assume you would be in the Cleveland area, which would be higher than even madinmaryland Oct 2013 #96

Yep liberal N proud Oct 2013 #103

Our daughter wanted to get out of the driving class at school... cynatnite Oct 2013 #31

Insurance companies, whether health or auto, will underwrite policies based on whatever the law is. denverbill Oct 2013 #29

I'd not object to mandatory liability coverage up to state limits being made gender-neutral. moriah Oct 2013 #48

Two parts jeff47 Oct 2013 #32

"Fair" isn't the issue. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2013 #34

Because ACA doesn't apply to auto insurance. GeorgeGist Oct 2013 #39

Car insurance rates are based on statistical risk. Young males have/cause sinkingfeeling Oct 2013 #41

Why is it fair for people under 25 to pay more for auto insurance? Performance. MADem Oct 2013 #44

Thank you. :) moriah Oct 2013 #49

And it's about US, too! Those "kids" are gonna be wiping our asses and serving us our pudding if MADem Oct 2013 #50

they'll say it's because they get into more accidents gopiscrap Oct 2013 #51

I tell you what: work with us for a nationwide non-profit public auto insurance regime Recursion Oct 2013 #54

It's totally fair. You just haven't bothered to find out why. ancianita Oct 2013 #55

Because a lot of young men do really stupid shit in cars NickB79 Oct 2013 #56

And that's just the high visibility stuff. nt ancianita Oct 2013 #59

It's a carry over from the 'dark days' of the horseless carriage............. wandy Oct 2013 #61

It isn't. n/t pnwmom Oct 2013 #63

Do we really want our health insurance to be based on actuarial tables? cbayer Oct 2013 #67

Actuarial tables and FBI crime stats are maps of reality. Knowing reality is a good thing. ancianita Oct 2013 #72

Even more reason why they should pay more when it comes to car insurance, imo. cbayer Oct 2013 #81

Amen to that. ancianita Oct 2013 #84

i dont think it is fair but it is also not a good comparison to health insurance. nt La Lioness Priyanka Oct 2013 #77

Well... Ohio Joe Oct 2013 #82

I suppose if younger guys' driving behavior Ilsa Oct 2013 #83

My driving record is fine, yet I still pay more. Kurska Oct 2013 #90

Based on data that states men are at a higher risk of being in a car accident? Rex Oct 2013 #88

Your argument is flawed. procon Oct 2013 #89

Men can't choose the gender they are born with either, buddy. Kurska Oct 2013 #93

It's a matter of statistics, not gender. procon Oct 2013 #97

Proven risk profiles. bluestate10 Oct 2013 #94

What are you asking us for? Nine Oct 2013 #95

It's not fair. Cleita Oct 2013 #101

Simple answer... Because it's fair. Glassunion Oct 2013 #102