General Discussion

Peacetrain

(24,302 posts)

155. Horse Hockey

Tue Oct 29, 2013, 05:46 PM

Oct 2013

The Presidents big mistake.. is believing in collegiality.. coming from the senate.. but the NSA spying has been in place long before he took office..and while he may have thought that powers that be, would work as we wish.. just like the old FBI under Hoover..it takes on a life of its own and protects itself.

This President has had to clean up more messes.. and get blamed for more crap that previous administrations installed than I can even recall...

I have seen this so many times I have lost count.. and have seen many pies served up.. only to watch people run to grab something else.. oh he did this..yes yes.

I am going to have to see the fingerprints under analysis of this administration purposefully continued or installed that type of unwarranted surveillance.

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C'mon people. Use your noggin. Obama knew, and approved of it. [View all] MannyGoldstein Oct 2013 OP

good point Manny. I find it very curious that no one has lost their job over the NSA mess. liberal_at_heart Oct 2013 #1

ONLY Snowden was fired and lost his job Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #10

very true. liberal_at_heart Oct 2013 #17

Obama should've hired him to help clean things up asap! polichick Oct 2013 #64

Snowden quit and went to Hong Kong Go Vols Oct 2013 #164

bwahahahahaaa..... i'll use your noggin, and a couple of drumsticks spanone Oct 2013 #2

lol AtomicKitten Oct 2013 #140

BA DUM TSSSHHH spanone Oct 2013 #143

LOL Scurrilous Oct 2013 #159

Afraid to lie, afraid to tell the truth. It's a tough spot. nt bemildred Oct 2013 #3

Who really gives a shit? randome Oct 2013 #4

If the President didn't know about it, it's a hell of a lot scarier. winter is coming Oct 2013 #5

So the actionable result is the knowledge of how scared we should be? randome Oct 2013 #8

I'm missing how dismissing this issue as an "internal kerfuffle" is productive. winter is coming Oct 2013 #20

Tell me why I should care. randome Oct 2013 #28

Clearly, it does register on your radar, or you wouldn't be trying so hard to minimalize it. winter is coming Oct 2013 #115

It doesn't take much effort to type out a post or two. I'm a very fast typist. randome Oct 2013 #118

+8,749 Scuba Oct 2013 #150

+ a gazillion. nt Mojorabbit Oct 2013 #167

So you were on the side of Bush/Cheney when they were caught sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #132

Of course not. randome Oct 2013 #133

No need for you to care. That's for the civic-minded among us. DisgustipatedinCA Oct 2013 #136

You should not care. Don't worry your mind. morningfog Oct 2013 #152

Not exactly "dismissive". He or she actively wants all of us to be dismissive. I'm not buying it. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #60

what you're missing is understanding the latest meme Skittles Oct 2013 #158

Roses, eh? That would explain the odor of fertilizer. n/t winter is coming Oct 2013 #160

No the final resolution should be what the American people voted for sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #32

Not everything that occurs in politics needs to affect me personally for me to be outraged. randome Oct 2013 #37

OK Plucketeer Oct 2013 #51

I'm not satisfied, either. Neither am I outraged. randome Oct 2013 #53

How does that line go..... Plucketeer Oct 2013 #57

Obviously there are some things we DO need to micro-manage. randome Oct 2013 #83

Well, I'm just wary that Plucketeer Oct 2013 #101

So what? AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #62

That's my point. Why should we care HOW spy agencies spy? randome Oct 2013 #90

If you don't care, so what? Explain to us why others should not care. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #92

Already did. randome Oct 2013 #104

That explains nothing. It only lists your priorities. How selfish. This is not about you. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #113

If NSA internal antics rise above what I listed, I think you have a warped sense of priorities. randome Oct 2013 #116

This is not about you nor the things that you don't care about. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #119

Apparently your posts are about the things you DO care about. randome Oct 2013 #121

Seems to me that you are "scared" of the truth. And werent you the one saying that the rhett o rick Oct 2013 #137

Well, clearly, Obama and Alexander do, to name two. nt bemildred Oct 2013 #6

+1 Couldn't agree more! B Calm Oct 2013 #7

I'm sick of seeing Right Wingers like Alexander and Clapper hold positions sabrina 1 Oct 2013 #34

You're correct MyNameGoesHere Oct 2013 #75

There is a point where you let the machinery run itself. randome Oct 2013 #97

Sure they know what's best MyNameGoesHere Oct 2013 #103

I wish I could see your reaction in an alternate reality in which Romney won. dorkulon Oct 2013 #86

I would think the NSA would continue to spy on foreign heads of state. randome Oct 2013 #100

Can you tell me what excesses you speak of? dorkulon Oct 2013 #134

Can't find the link but Bush had the NSA spying domestically. randome Oct 2013 #148

If you didn't care, you wouldn't spend so much time telling us that you don't care. Obviously. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #122

I like debates on difficult issues. So sue me. randome Oct 2013 #123

Ah yes, the "just keep your head in the sand argument." rhett o rick Oct 2013 #135

Our Constitution does not cover Germany nor does it cover anyone outside our borders. randome Oct 2013 #141

LOL. Micro manage. Is that what you call oversight? I bet you think that banks should rhett o rick Oct 2013 #146

They monitor foreign communications. Why is this something to get upset about? randome Oct 2013 #149

Baby Bush alienated all our best allies except GB, which I guess we own. rhett o rick Oct 2013 #157

Now now, don't get a sadz over something that means nothing to you. Rex Oct 2013 #153

The media need people to spread ProSense Oct 2013 #9

You are confusing two different things tablisminster Oct 2013 #33

No, I'm not. I read the reports. n/t ProSense Oct 2013 #36

You "read the reports"? How did you do that? Aren't they classified? AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #68

LOL! News reports. ProSense Oct 2013 #72

welcome to DU gopiscrap Oct 2013 #127

Message auto-removed Name removed Oct 2013 #98

Bush was using the NSA for domestic spying. Obama stopped it. randome Oct 2013 #108

Manny, nobody in the White House knew where all the stuff in the briefing books came from. jsr Oct 2013 #11

Why? ... cause Obama hates America, we all know that. JoePhilly Oct 2013 #12

...and also sibelian Oct 2013 #95

Governments have always used whatever capabilities they MineralMan Oct 2013 #13

Yes, it's old news. Just move along. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #70

See, you added words to my post. MineralMan Oct 2013 #74

No. I did not add words to your post. I added words to my post. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #77

and clarified the obvious intent of that other reply. n/t Egalitarian Thug Oct 2013 #124

Wrong again. The words represent what I said. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #111

That we spy on foreigners is old news. That we spy on AMERICANS is NEWS...nt Jesus Malverde Oct 2013 #99

"We"? It is not old news that the NSA spies upon all telephone conversations. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #112

"We" as in American.. Jesus Malverde Oct 2013 #144

Spy-upon-everyone as UNAMERICAN. Saying "we" and identifying with the spy-masters doesn't excuse it. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #147

-1 GeorgeGist Oct 2013 #125

A Few thoughts Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #14

Feinstein is covering her ass. LuvNewcastle Oct 2013 #21

Like I said .. that's a CONSPIRACY Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #23

Same here. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #71

Thank you, Icarpenter FredStembottom Oct 2013 #128

Use your noggin? Do you think you're talking to children? Avalux Oct 2013 #15

Of course it's possible. And it's a possibility that I find far more worrying. n/t winter is coming Oct 2013 #27

When considering the patronizing tone of the OP you may wish to recall grantcart Oct 2013 #76

I'm not sure what I think about it. LuvNewcastle Oct 2013 #16

I agree with your assessment. Skidmore Oct 2013 #18

I just hope your post don't get Hutzpa Oct 2013 #25

I'd never heard that word was banned. I've seen others use it. LuvNewcastle Oct 2013 #35

I had a post hidden for using that exact same word Hutzpa Oct 2013 #39

Context Tom728 Oct 2013 #48

and some people enjoy being offensive noiretextatique Oct 2013 #129

It's never impossible to dislodge someone from a position. JVS Oct 2013 #29

Compartmentalization Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #46

Plausible deniability haikugal Oct 2013 #58

So, then did Snowden's information break the compartmentalization? KoKo Oct 2013 #89

He was able to see the big picture Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #109

Recommend. KoKo Oct 2013 #165

There are programs that are being run by certain organization Hutzpa Oct 2013 #19

Maybe not... iandhr Oct 2013 #22

Do I have to care? Blanks Oct 2013 #24

It doesn't look good either way. BKH70041 Oct 2013 #26

Yep. It's lose-lose. JVS Oct 2013 #31

No it does not make him look incompetent Hutzpa Oct 2013 #42

It's so important to know how MUCH to piss on the President, isn't it? randome Oct 2013 #45

Yep! forget about the government shutdown Hutzpa Oct 2013 #131

Yeah, I think that's the more accurate assessment. sibelian Oct 2013 #44

I totally disagree. Atman Oct 2013 #30

Of course, the President knew. Laelth Oct 2013 #38

Do you have proof of this? Hutzpa Oct 2013 #40

If I did have that proof, I wouldn't offer it up here. n/t Laelth Oct 2013 #50

There is proof. Snowden told him and the world. Now the question is when did he know. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #78

He's Obama. *you* couldn't possibly know if he was ticked off or not Schema Thing Oct 2013 #52

He wasn't ticked off, as far as I can tell. Laelth Oct 2013 #54

Of course he did LittleBlue Oct 2013 #41

Okay, I thought, and this is what I came up with DonViejo Oct 2013 #43

So a Vice Admiral replaces the General... Anyone have problem with this? KoKo Oct 2013 #110

Alexander was planning to retire BEFORE this hit the fan. grasswire Oct 2013 #120

All this crap just convinces me that since Cheney and Bush put this in place these Autumn Oct 2013 #47

They'll do nothing? Some politicians are going to rake in the cash. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #79

The FBI has the ability to spy on anyone. Your local police officer has this ability. randome Oct 2013 #94

Yep, but they will do nothing to stop or rein them in. Autumn Oct 2013 #105

Yep. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #114

If Bush were still in office, no one here would doubt for a second that Bush (or Pres. Cheney) knew. Marr Oct 2013 #49

If Bush were still in office, it would still be a secret. Also, ProSense Oct 2013 #55

Same as the Crook & Liar Banksters who caused our current KoKo Oct 2013 #117

I would doubt it. But from what I understood it was started under Bush direction and ended under O. vaberella Oct 2013 #162

DC bubble and plausible deniability. L0oniX Oct 2013 #56

What's next? He knew of the Bush/Cheney tortures? He knows of the forced feeding of Gitmo guests? AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #59

Oh, the all-knowing, all-seeing Manny holds forth Pretzel_Warrior Oct 2013 #61

Lol, coming from you? Classic! nt Logical Oct 2013 #88

x2 AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #93

Nailed it...nt SidDithers Oct 2013 #102

Manny is a gawd. n/t Cali_Democrat Oct 2013 #107

More often than not. vaberella Oct 2013 #163

So your argument is Obama knew because he has not fired someone who already quit. jeff47 Oct 2013 #63

Betcha many in the Intelligence Community didn't tell Obama a damn thing.... Spitfire of ATJ Oct 2013 #65

I'll bet some of them still report to Cheney - that's probably how he knew... polichick Oct 2013 #69

I don't find the idea that he didn't know at all comforting BainsBane Oct 2013 #66

The reports are all over the place ProSense Oct 2013 #80

Thanks for the links BainsBane Oct 2013 #82

Under Bush they were busted snooping at the UN. Spitfire of ATJ Oct 2013 #91

? fleabiscuit Oct 2013 #67

The buck stops...somewhere else. Or, Shit Flows Downhill. Tierra_y_Libertad Oct 2013 #73

Snowden's revelations makes it impossible for anyone to say that Obama doesn't know. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #81

And Ollie North and Poindexter never told St. Ronnie about Iran-Contra. Fuddnik Oct 2013 #84

yep my first thought when I read Obama didn't know azurnoir Oct 2013 #87

maybe they'll release the receipts in 2034 MisterP Oct 2013 #130

They probably didnt tell Big Ron but I bet they told Nancy. You didnt want to cross Big Nance. nm rhett o rick Oct 2013 #156

Plausible deniability is an old game. DirkGently Oct 2013 #85

Yes. An old, old game. AnotherMcIntosh Oct 2013 #96

You said it all. If it was only "plausible deniability" I wouldnt be so worried. rhett o rick Oct 2013 #138

There are some dumb comments in this thread. kentuck Oct 2013 #106

+1 GeorgeGist Oct 2013 #126

I had to go back up and Rec the thread because of all the low budget spinning... bvar22 Oct 2013 #142

Have you ever been mesmerized by a murmuration of starlings? Fumesucker Oct 2013 #151

My favorite contortion so far: "Your neighbor has this ability." Dragonfli Oct 2013 #166

The NSA needs the cash to build the Starship Meshuganah MannyGoldstein Oct 2013 #168

We also need to see his garage. jsr Oct 2013 #169

While you're at it, chervilant Oct 2013 #170

I am not sure Manny. I can see the spies giving the President some data rhett o rick Oct 2013 #139

it's impossible for me to imagine.. stillcool Oct 2013 #154

+1 nt Poll_Blind Oct 2013 #145

Horse Hockey Peacetrain Oct 2013 #155

I don't think so. bvar22 Oct 2013 #171

Guess what? I don't care. 6000eliot Oct 2013 #161