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AtomicKitten

(46,585 posts)

158. Your position is emotional fluff and distortion of facts. nt

Reply to Beacool (Reply #110)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 02:27 AM

Nov 2013

Last edited Wed Nov 6, 2013, 12:17 PM - Edit history (1)

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John Kerry: Up to Saudi Arabia to decide if women should be allowed to drive [View all] cali Nov 2013 OP

that'll drive the ethnocentrists crazy gopiscrap Nov 2013 #1

This message was self-deleted by its author Dash87 Nov 2013 #131

Women have a universal human right to drive. That's not ethnocentric at all. Dash87 Nov 2013 #136

I agree that's part of my point (woman whould have every right a man has) gopiscrap Nov 2013 #138

He's right, actually. JNelson6563 Nov 2013 #2

The alternative is public disapproval Matariki Nov 2013 #7

This......... Beacool Nov 2013 #34

Thank you get the red out Nov 2013 #56

So. What happens if the USA disapproves and leaders in Saudi Arabia still don't bluestate10 Nov 2013 #122

An alternative would be to treat them poorly until they treat their women well. Iggo Nov 2013 #10

What if we need them more than they need us? karynnj Nov 2013 #61

I said it ain't gonna happen. Iggo Nov 2013 #67

Alternative? How about Isolate, Sanction and Blockade? seveneyes Nov 2013 #14

That covers an awful lot of ground leftynyc Nov 2013 #44

Countries that discriminate against women and minorities seveneyes Nov 2013 #57

I agree with you leftynyc Nov 2013 #75

I think it's going to be hard to blockade and sanction ourselves. n/t Shrike47 Nov 2013 #105

How would we boycott ourselves? Recursion Nov 2013 #142

I wonder if Secretary Kerry would care to tell us get the red out Nov 2013 #58

John Kerry had a 100% rating on women's rights in the US Senate karynnj Nov 2013 #64

Those are acts of war. nt ecstatic Nov 2013 #71

I agree loyalsister Nov 2013 #16

I think some don't realize this JNelson6563 Nov 2013 #28

CRPD is being heard in committee again today KamaAina Nov 2013 #40

There's also the "hidden abortion agenda" loyalsister Nov 2013 #116

Good point. HappyMe Nov 2013 #19

No one ever invaded South Africa. NuclearDem Nov 2013 #33

Disgusting... ljm2002 Nov 2013 #3

how do you know a few pointed words werent already said leftyohiolib Nov 2013 #5

No one has yet posted those pointed words Fumesucker Nov 2013 #8

what makes you think the words in any meeting had about this would be posted? leftyohiolib Nov 2013 #12

If pointed words are uttered and there's no one there to hear them... Fumesucker Nov 2013 #15

Nailed it. LeftOfWest Nov 2013 #37

because they would have been leaked and they were not. TeamPooka Nov 2013 #31

yea sure ok leftyohiolib Nov 2013 #50

Note what he did say karynnj Nov 2013 #65

What would you propose? And do we Drone Saudi leaders when they ignore bluestate10 Nov 2013 #127

Nonsense... ljm2002 Nov 2013 #139

can't say anything that would upset our good buddies.. frylock Nov 2013 #4

BULLSHIT Matariki Nov 2013 #6

If it was Whites Males not being allowed to drive, the bombs would already be falling on Riyadh. Ikonoklast Nov 2013 #13

omg leftyohiolib Nov 2013 #18

What? HappyMe Nov 2013 #20

Can I haz cheezburger? closeupready Nov 2013 #29

Nonsense RZM Nov 2013 #46

It's not up to the women. tblue Nov 2013 #78

It's different when they have oil. Then we let them do whatever they want. Dash87 Nov 2013 #132

Well isn't that special...? Purveyor Nov 2013 #9

So Russia has a choice when it comes to gay rights? 851-977 Nov 2013 #11

Time to post this again Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Nov 2013 #17

holy shit...that's really clever and well done. Zorra Nov 2013 #22

That was interesting! treestar Nov 2013 #42

I believe it's satire Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Nov 2013 #102

Typical. Hillary Clinton on the other hand - TBF Nov 2013 #21

in 1995 Bill was making a lot of women and childrens lives in Iraq Whisp Nov 2013 #23

Did I mention Bill? TBF Nov 2013 #24

where was Hillary and her humanitarian words then? Whisp Nov 2013 #25

She didn't speak to each country independently - TBF Nov 2013 #36

loved em to death reddread Nov 2013 #43

Peace and Prosperity. From your link: Whisp Nov 2013 #51

Saddam Hussein petitioned the UN for permission AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #53

It was a horrible horrible time for Iraq, and a long string of horror after that. Whisp Nov 2013 #54

how is it hatred to ask why it's okay to kill Iraqi's Whisp Nov 2013 #47

She was in Beijing giving a historic speech, that wasn't very welcome! boston bean Nov 2013 #41

did it end or begin with those three little words? reddread Nov 2013 #144

"working tirelessly" vs. "just a speech" AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #38

''John McCain opposes a woman's right to choose Whisp Nov 2013 #48

by any means necessary ... AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #49

Don't even start - TBF Nov 2013 #69

You didn't explain why a speech by Hillary AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #84

Why should I explain that? I didn't make that claim - TBF Nov 2013 #85

The claim that by virtue of making a speech AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #87

I'll check back with you when she's the nominee. nt TBF Nov 2013 #98

Headed straight for coronation again, eh? AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #100

You're having some reading comprehension problems dear - TBF Nov 2013 #108

The mythical creature is the one that lives in the heads of people like you. Beacool Nov 2013 #101

Horseshit. AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #107

Let me be the first one to inform you that the 2008 campaign finished over 5 years ago. Beacool Nov 2013 #112

so then the speech she gave in 1995 shouldn't come into play either Whisp Nov 2013 #193

How did she get her daughter to play along with that grotesque exaggeration? Whisp Nov 2013 #117

Same B.S. coming from the same haters. Beacool Nov 2013 #99

Keep embellishing her resume and you can AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #104

Keep denying that she has an enviable resume, you're only making a fool of yourself. Beacool Nov 2013 #109

ONE YEAR right out of college - her ONLY nonprofit job. AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #111

Listen genius, she continued her advocay in Arkansas, Beacool Nov 2013 #113

Just as significant is her LGBT speech while serving as SOS. Beacool Nov 2013 #62

Kerry's record on women's rights equals Clintons karynnj Nov 2013 #66

Yes, she did. She spoke to the Saudis in private Beacool Nov 2013 #106

Link to her saying that that she said this to the Prince karynnj Nov 2013 #119

What did she say to Saudis as Sec of State? blm Nov 2013 #89

Her tenure as SOS was confined to AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #97

At this point, what you write is just risible and has no basis in facts. Beacool Nov 2013 #110

Your position is emotional fluff and distortion of facts. nt AtomicKitten Nov 2013 #158

Kowtowing to monarchs that suppress their populations is unseemly. Jesus Malverde Nov 2013 #26

good thing they arent in Burkhas reddread Nov 2013 #27

hijab Jesus Malverde Nov 2013 #32

It's funny to watch Arab women bluedeathray Nov 2013 #39

There are some things that argument works for. NuclearDem Nov 2013 #30

That's about right get the red out Nov 2013 #59

Just keep shipping that oil... bluedeathray Nov 2013 #35

I thought that our foreign policy position on this issue had changed. Beacool Nov 2013 #45

I argued about this up-post a bit TBF Nov 2013 #52

It's always the same crowd and they are tiresome. Beacool Nov 2013 #63

what were Hillary's plans to actually Make That Happen? Whisp Nov 2013 #55

Note that she said that in LONDON to a group that was happy to hear it karynnj Nov 2013 #72

Hillary spoke to the Saudis in private before making her public statement. Beacool Nov 2013 #94

In neither case was she in Saudi Arabia, standing next to the Prince karynnj Nov 2013 #124

London, England is NOT Saudi Arabia blm Nov 2013 #103

Having a problem reading? Beacool Nov 2013 #115

Speaking privately to them is NOT the same as stating that position to the press karynnj Nov 2013 #128

In Pakistan she was being honest with them. Beacool Nov 2013 #175

Conde Nast????? Wonderful source - not karynnj Nov 2013 #176

Privately....yet, some are attacking Kerry when they haven't a clue what is going on blm Nov 2013 #172

Personally, I never criticized Kerry over this issue. Beacool Nov 2013 #173

"It was mentioned" where??? karynnj Nov 2013 #177

In the articles that came out at the time that she made the public statement. Beacool Nov 2013 #195

Kerry didn't change policy - that's the point. It's absurd to imply he did. blm Nov 2013 #184

What exactly wquld you prefer the US's top diplomat say? karynnj Nov 2013 #60

I would prefer that he echo the line that's been expressed by the SD over cali Nov 2013 #68

He actually did that in the first sentence karynnj Nov 2013 #73

He certainly did NOTHING OF THE KIND cali Nov 2013 #76

What are you speaking of - he said that is what we support karynnj Nov 2013 #83

The far Left has it's rose colored glasses on. Kerry clearly said that Saudi women bluestate10 Nov 2013 #129

Not to mention angering the Prince on this would defeat the entire reason he was there - karynnj Nov 2013 #134

Right, and we should suck up to Russia so they don't get more angry at LGBT Russians NuclearDem Nov 2013 #194

Uh, it's the sentence that starts with 'But' that should be an issue for everyone... Violet_Crumble Nov 2013 #151

That's just reality karynnj Nov 2013 #165

What do you mean by "the far left"? Comrade Grumpy Nov 2013 #187

Yea? So? Diplomats are suppose to speak diplomatically when addressing such issues. phleshdef Nov 2013 #150

I hope anyone who disagrees with Kerry's approach will explain how we can force ecstatic Nov 2013 #70

No one suggested "forcing them to do things our way" get the red out Nov 2013 #77

Kerry simply avoided insulting the Prince karynnj Nov 2013 #86

Of course!!! get the red out Nov 2013 #91

uh, no one is fucking talking about "forcing" cali Nov 2013 #79

That's always the claim though, isn't it? get the red out Nov 2013 #80

thats exactly what he said in his first sentence scheming daemons Nov 2013 #95

Sanctions and boycotts. NuclearDem Nov 2013 #82

South Africa didn't have the world economy by the balls the way Saudi Arabia bluestate10 Nov 2013 #133

I never said it was going to happen, and the state we're in NuclearDem Nov 2013 #140

It was up to South Africa to decide if black people had any rights. tblue Nov 2013 #74

ultimately, it didnt change until the South Africans changed it scheming daemons Nov 2013 #88

The global pressure did a LOT to make them change. Matariki Nov 2013 #114

That's a gross understatement. Gravitycollapse Nov 2013 #149

The anti-apartheid movement was one of the largest anti-racist movement in human history. Gravitycollapse Nov 2013 #148

Hey John, is that what you said about South African apartheid as well? 'It's up to them!!!!' Bluenorthwest Nov 2013 #81

You are a poor student of history. blm Nov 2013 #92

ultimately, it was up to them scheming daemons Nov 2013 #93

"It was up to them" covers up the fact that they lost a LOT of disinvestment money over apartheid. ancianita Nov 2013 #167

we better sever ties with Ireland too, while we are at it scheming daemons Nov 2013 #90

He could call for sanctions or an embargo Fumesucker Nov 2013 #121

exactly. we need to sanction Ireland. scheming daemons Nov 2013 #123

I wouldn't have a problem with that Fumesucker Nov 2013 #125

after what happened with SAnctions in Iraq i would be careful with that JI7 Nov 2013 #155

Why then are they not being "careful" with sanctions against Iran? Fumesucker Nov 2013 #160

they should be careful , and the sanctions are because of the nuclear program, but at least JI7 Nov 2013 #161

Sanctions against South Africa weren't because they had a nuclear program Fumesucker Nov 2013 #162

That would be a great way to improve our relations with them - which is why he was there karynnj Nov 2013 #135

They seem to think sanctions will improve relations with Iran Fumesucker Nov 2013 #159

N they don't think that sanctions will improve the relationship with Iran karynnj Nov 2013 #163

Evidently you think threatening people is not an optimum way to get them to do things Fumesucker Nov 2013 #164

No, I pointed out there are a multitude of things the US wants from SA karynnj Nov 2013 #166

You are wrong Mr. Secretary. truebrit71 Nov 2013 #96

Scaredy–cat bullshit. jsr Nov 2013 #118

So, what is wrong with letting a country make that decision? bluestate10 Nov 2013 #120

What beautiful ignorance of reality. We let Saudi Arabia do whatever they want because we need... Gravitycollapse Nov 2013 #147

We "let" as far as it is profitable.In SA's case, we didn't impose sanctions; major groups here dis- ancianita Nov 2013 #169

During times like this Aerows Nov 2013 #126

This message was self-deleted by its author Dash87 Nov 2013 #130

Does anyone really care ProSense Nov 2013 #137

Why is the liberal desire of half this country's population controversial when it comes to a SoS ancianita Nov 2013 #170

Spare me, ProSense Nov 2013 #179

Some? This is another convenient wall of diminishment that reveals subtle sexism. ancianita Nov 2013 #182

I'm a woman, and your comment is absurd. n/t ProSense Nov 2013 #183

What would people rather he say? Recursion Nov 2013 #141

War! Drones! Barack_America Nov 2013 #145

No. ForgoTheConsequence Nov 2013 #153

The reporter who asked his take "on women driving in Saudi Arabia" was grubbing for a headline struggle4progress Nov 2013 #143

So basically what you're saying is his job as SoS is to be a lapdog for whoever he's visiting. Gravitycollapse Nov 2013 #146

That is not at all what this means karynnj Nov 2013 #181

You stated this far better than any of my attempts - Thanks nt karynnj Nov 2013 #178

At the very least we could stop selling them weapons...... ForgoTheConsequence Nov 2013 #152

Stop selling them weapons? That would require a conscience. Gravitycollapse Nov 2013 #154

What did Hillary do that showed guts? karynnj Nov 2013 #168

Here. ForgoTheConsequence Nov 2013 #192

IN London - as a private citizen -saying something close to 100% of Americans agree on? karynnj Nov 2013 #196

In classic male diplomaticspeak, yes. When thought is given to half the populations' struggle there, ancianita Nov 2013 #171

How manly of him. Luminous Animal Nov 2013 #156

Diplomat is diplomatic. TwilightGardener Nov 2013 #157

Read: Male diplomat is diplomatic to male-dominated resource control within and across countries. ancianita Nov 2013 #174

What the hell are you talking about? n/t ProSense Nov 2013 #180

More diplomatic pressure than Kerry gave. What the hell do you think I'm talking about. ancianita Nov 2013 #185

No, you're talking nonsense and playing ignorant, but of course ProSense Nov 2013 #186

Maybe. I can't say that she'd have said anything different, but I still say he was remiss in letting ancianita Nov 2013 #189

The Most Unfair Countries For Women Mosby Nov 2013 #188

They are all Middle Eastern or North African? Comrade Grumpy Nov 2013 #190

Fair questions Mosby Nov 2013 #191

Which one is different? treestar Nov 2013 #197

Ivory Coast Mosby Nov 2013 #198

Thanks. treestar Nov 2013 #199