General Discussion

Lordquinton

(7,886 posts)

59. It can be both

Sat Nov 9, 2013, 03:02 AM

Nov 2013

They are not the same thing. And with the word "Rare" having multiple meanings using it gives credence to the tea party, because they take it as a sign of agreement with their version of the word. By using it you support their position whether you like it or not.

And to sum up:

Abortion is not the same as contraception

they shouldn't be discussed together. Reduced abortions is a side effect of education and access to stuff, the goal is a healthy populace, not the reason we should have it.

Abortion is an important, private, medical procedure that should never be restricted or up for debate.

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I don't understand when someone says "abortion should be rare"... [View all] cynatnite Nov 2013 OP

I agree with all your points, completely. CaliforniaPeggy Nov 2013 #1

Post removed Post removed Nov 2013 #2

What the Hell? Whiskeytide Nov 2013 #5

Only that it's a "undercooked meat/rare" joke. Chan790 Nov 2013 #9

I got that... Whiskeytide Nov 2013 #13

It was inappropriate which was why I ignored it. n/t cynatnite Nov 2013 #16

It was mysteriously: freshwest Nov 2013 #54

IMO the sentiment behind that statement teenagebambam Nov 2013 #3

Speaking for myself, when I say they should be rare Revanchist Nov 2013 #4

A lot of my friends had them and it was a tough decision for all of them Warpy Nov 2013 #6

I can't remember feeling relief, but I never felt any guilt. cynatnite Nov 2013 #17

Here's what your avatar had to say on the subject: Nye Bevan Nov 2013 #7

That was an entire generation ago. a lot has happened since. PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #12

The year 2005 was "an entire generation ago"? Nye Bevan Nov 2013 #30

Shouldn't any expensive or risk medical procedure be rare if it could be avoided with prevention? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #8

Abortions are generally neither. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #10

I actually had a friend who ended up with complications due to a surgical abortion. KittyWampus Nov 2013 #18

I had a life threatning reaction to a common antibiotic. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #24

Abortions are cheaper and safer than condoms? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #22

If you're not going to argue in good faith I wish you a lovely evening. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #25

That is exactly the entire argument you responded to NoOneMan Nov 2013 #26

You compared abortion to open heart surgery, which is what I replied to. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #27

Did I? Beyond being something that could be avoided with prevention, no, I did not. NoOneMan Nov 2013 #31

"Of course they should be rare, just like bypasses." -you, upthread LeftyMom Nov 2013 #33

Yes, ANYTHING that has a less invasive, less costly alternative should be rare NoOneMan Nov 2013 #34

Abortion isn't an alternative to contraception. It's an alternative to PREGNANCY. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #38

So is contraception and education not an alternative/prevention to pregnancy? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #41

Strawman argument Lordquinton Nov 2013 #36

Birth control and eduction is not an alternative/prevention to abortion? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #37

You are confused here Lordquinton Nov 2013 #42

There are lots of ways to make any procedure rare NoOneMan Nov 2013 #47

No one is arguing against preventing pregnancy when it's not desired. cui bono Nov 2013 #58

Birth control is a prevention of unwanted pregnancies. NoOneMan Nov 2013 #65

It can be both Lordquinton Nov 2013 #59

"they shouldn't be discussed together" NoOneMan Nov 2013 #66

You skipped the first paragraph Lordquinton Nov 2013 #105

By surrendering and cowering to a word you are thereby enabling them by giving it power and validity NoOneMan Nov 2013 #106

Abortion is sure cheaper than condoms in UK. And early abortion is not a "surgical procedure". idwiyo Nov 2013 #44

Huh? But the NHS is on the hook for it. It is reflected in per capita health costs NoOneMan Nov 2013 #50

The state shouldn't have anything to do with the actual medical procedure. Her body, Her choice. idwiyo Nov 2013 #60

Of, for fuck's sake. How about the state ensure its legal, safe and rare? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #64

How about state ensure it's safe, legal, on demand, and as often as requested. idwiyo Nov 2013 #68

Rare was part of the Democratic platform! NoOneMan Nov 2013 #75

was. was... as in isn't anymore. PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #91

Change the word YOU use. Leave the rest of the pro-choicers the fuck alone NoOneMan Nov 2013 #92

Simmer down, cheif. Do you not see, even a little, how using the "rare" language can be harmful? PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #93

In a narrow frame, yes, as harmful as any word can be in a narrow frame NoOneMan Nov 2013 #94

Continuing to use harmful language will also draw negative reactions. PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #95

"Calling for it to be "rare" proposes that there is something wrong with abortion" NoOneMan Nov 2013 #96

I never ever ever said you or ANYONE who uses the phrase was such a thing. PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #97

What do you propose to do with women who refuse to take pill? Deny them abortion? idwiyo Nov 2013 #107

Nothing. Not a fucking thing. Its a choice NoOneMan Nov 2013 #108

Choice means abortion should be free, safe, legal, on demand, and as often as requested. idwiyo Nov 2013 #110

I agree on all parts NoOneMan Nov 2013 #111

I question "so often" part. No one actually has any idea what "often" is or isn't. idwiyo Nov 2013 #112

Oh god. Fucking semantics police NoOneMan Nov 2013 #113

Spare me your condescension. By using "rare" and "so often" you ARE implying that there are too many idwiyo Nov 2013 #114

Haha. By suggesting what I am implying you are just creating a strawman NoOneMan Nov 2013 #115

Your "ignore" as a badge of honour! Never mind that you WILL read my responses to your posts. :) idwiyo Nov 2013 #116

I think it's neither "pig" nor ignorant." phylny Nov 2013 #72

take for instance the abortion pill, still an abortion but no knife La Lioness Priyanka Nov 2013 #11

You know... NoOneMan Nov 2013 #40

What do you mean when you say "long, unnecessary cycles of oral contraceptives"? n/t cynatnite Nov 2013 #43

Exactly what I said NoOneMan Nov 2013 #46

I see your point... cynatnite Nov 2013 #52

Maybe when one has sex very infrequently, as one is not in a relationship. idwiyo Nov 2013 #48

Did I miss something? newcriminal Nov 2013 #100

Yes. Her body, her choice. idwiyo Nov 2013 #104

or dangers associated with actually giving birth. nt La Lioness Priyanka Nov 2013 #86

No other medical procedure endangers the lives of the medical professionals involved. Cassidy Nov 2013 #45

This thread is against those that want abortion "safe, legal and rare" NoOneMan Nov 2013 #51

first trimester abortions are the safest of all surgical procedures. CTyankee Nov 2013 #71

They are not safer than other methods of preventing unwanted pregnancies, nor cheaper NoOneMan Nov 2013 #74

I wasn't talking about prevention as much as the safety of the procedure. And since any CTyankee Nov 2013 #76

Of course. Instead you argue a narrow frame to divisively fight with other pro-choice people NoOneMan Nov 2013 #78

well, my bad for writing "any" instead of "no" in that sentence. Shoulda caught that... CTyankee Nov 2013 #88

Got it NoOneMan Nov 2013 #89

well, to be fair, I used to work for Planned Parenthood of CT and folks there were pretty CTyankee Nov 2013 #90

"Rare" in this context means different things to different people. ZombieHorde Nov 2013 #14

Thank you. PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #15

That's the political genius and moral cowardice of the phrase. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #19

there is no moral cowardice. There's mostly an attempt by some to twist the issue away KittyWampus Nov 2013 #21

well said. PeaceNikki Nov 2013 #23

It's never bothered me to hear people say the phrase at all... cynatnite Nov 2013 #35

So why do people want it to mean the worse? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #82

nailed it Vattel Nov 2013 #84

I had not thought of the word "rare" like that... Whiskeytide Nov 2013 #28

You break it down very well, as usual. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #39

Yeeeeeeah. Why is there any kind of snappy phrase hanging round abortion anyway? sibelian Nov 2013 #109

Sorry, the issue are far right control freaks, not liberals trying to improve reproductive choices KittyWampus Nov 2013 #20

Good post, agree with all your points ! nt steve2470 Nov 2013 #29

I believe that it should be safe, legal, rare but always available on demand. xmas74 Nov 2013 #32

Big 'Ol.... DeSwiss Nov 2013 #49

I am sorry you had to make that choice, but TxDemChem Nov 2013 #53

"abortion should be rare" whttevrr Nov 2013 #55

Is an abortion the best, most efficeint, and safest way to reduce the rates of unwanted pregnancies? Agnosticsherbet Nov 2013 #56

"deal with an" suggests a pregnancy already exists NoOneMan Nov 2013 #57

Because I see the loss of life as regrettable but feel the woman's autonomy is paramount LostOne4Ever Nov 2013 #61

"some people here feel the need to talk to us as if we were anti-choice" NoOneMan Nov 2013 #67

Agreed. Xolodno Nov 2013 #62

Unwanted Pregnancies Should Be Rare eShirl Nov 2013 #63

Birth control should be easily accessible to all and rendered shame-free through education alphafemale Nov 2013 #69

I never got the shame of buying protection. Always loved it, actually. sir pball Nov 2013 #77

Pregnancy s/b rare. We've got too many damn people as it is. nt valerief Nov 2013 #70

Undoubtably NoOneMan Nov 2013 #80

In reading the threads on this topic boston bean Nov 2013 #73

It is an invasive medical procedure. Of course it carries risks and can be traumatic NoOneMan Nov 2013 #79

au contraire boston bean Nov 2013 #85

I agree with all of the measures you suggest. bvar22 Nov 2013 #81

This isn't so clear cut NoOneMan Nov 2013 #83

Not Clear Cut???!!! bvar22 Nov 2013 #98

Did you read my response? NoOneMan Nov 2013 #99

Yes I read your response. bvar22 Nov 2013 #101

I don't understand why you would want to make abortion rare if the alternative produces more harm NoOneMan Nov 2013 #102

It looks like you've gotten a lot of explanations. LWolf Nov 2013 #87

Why would anyone want unwanted pregnancies to be common? jberryhill Nov 2013 #103