General Discussion

lumberjack_jeff

(33,224 posts)

156. I'm an advocate for people with disabilities.

Fri Nov 15, 2013, 12:17 AM

Nov 2013

In that job, I don't give a shit about equality. I want more for my people, and I don't try to pretend otherwise. I want the workplace supports that they need due to their particular circumstances. I want funding for DD services so they have enough caregiver time that they can lead fulfilling lives.

But to justify that advocacy I do need to convince people that their individual circumstances require those supports - supports to which you and I are ineligible because we don't need them.

No one has adequately explained to me how fruity shampoo in the women's jail is needed to mitigate the problems that they have that male prisoners do not.

Patriarchy is apparently a world in which even the female felons are actually victims.

And no. Advocacy and equality are mutually exclusive because once you reach equality of a particular policy goal, the efforts don't stop.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

175 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

How Feminism Hurts Men [View all] Matariki Nov 2013 OP

I came into this thread prepared to eviscerate someone. Gravitycollapse Nov 2013 #1

plus 100 Liberal_in_LA Nov 2013 #7

Same here. NuclearDem Nov 2013 #31

;-) Matariki Nov 2013 #41

and heavens, a 45 yr old man might get a whole year in jail for raping an unconscious 16 yr old girl seabeyond Nov 2013 #2

You've got to be kidding? Th1onein Nov 2013 #12

Here: Chan790 Nov 2013 #13

O.M.G. What possible reason for one year in jail? Th1onein Nov 2013 #18

Don't know for certain... Chan790 Nov 2013 #24

That's actually a very interesting point. I hadn't thought of it that way before. n/t nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #106

Worse, he was her teacher. What a horror BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #128

I hope I live long enough to see the day "... women hold over 80 percent of the seats in Congress." Tx4obama Nov 2013 #3

The sad part is... There are men who actually make this claim... Ohio Joe Nov 2013 #4

Some of them are DUers. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #6

I agree. I was really taken aback by some male DUers on VAWA. SunSeeker Nov 2013 #9

Why is it called "Violence against Women Act" if it is gender-neutral? davidn3600 Nov 2013 #14

Dunno, maybe because most of the adults beat up at home are women. SunSeeker Nov 2013 #26

Yeah, we can't catch a break. Iggo Nov 2013 #36

All one has to do is to look at the ratio of deaths and serious injuries, by gender, to understand nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #110

Post removed Post removed Dec 2013 #173

You're cute. Have any links to these studies, or "hundreds" of feminist theorists and publications? arcane1 Dec 2013 #174

It could always be renamed JustAnotherGen Nov 2013 #125

+1 nomorenomore08 Dec 2013 #175

This is why it is so important for the women here at DU to raise hell... CTyankee Nov 2013 #23

there is a du'er here who pushed and got his own forum, who adamantly and repeatedly La Lioness Priyanka Nov 2013 #27

Unfuckingbelievable. Glad I missed that. nt SunSeeker Nov 2013 #28

Yup... Ohio Joe Nov 2013 #44

In several ways BainsBane Nov 2013 #50

I have a name. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #55

"She made me hit her" is one of the most chickenshit things I've ever read/heard in my life. LanternWaste Nov 2013 #62

Where did you read/hear it? lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #88

I read it here. SunSeeker Nov 2013 #113

A direct hit! Look at the straw fly! Smite that strawman! lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #135

except you extend this to domestic violence victims who usually cannot just be surveyed La Lioness Priyanka Nov 2013 #143

Thanks for confirming my point. I see you're still proud of your "reciprocal violence" stand. SunSeeker Nov 2013 #164

In your super-duper sleuthing, you seem to have overlooked one inconvenient detail.. opiate69 Nov 2013 #138

There were several DUers saying or supporting that in that thread. SunSeeker Nov 2013 #162

I wonder... opiate69 Nov 2013 #99

i thought he actually rolled up his sleeves adn loosened his tie and unbuttoned his collar shirt on seabeyond Nov 2013 #104

It goes beyond that BainsBane Nov 2013 #48

I won't and can't be silenced JustAnotherGen Nov 2013 #127

"Some of them are DU'ers in my mind." Bonobo Nov 2013 #15

No, some of them are definitely DUers. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #17

Could be a DU'er that was booted, right? Bonobo Nov 2013 #19

Nope. Still active. Still hates women. LeftyMom Nov 2013 #20

Just say my name. Everyone here knows you're talking about me. Pab Sungenis Nov 2013 #108

John Lauritsen is an AIDS denialist. Just FYI. Starry Messenger Nov 2013 #118

And that diminishes what he said in 1976? Pab Sungenis Nov 2013 #121

Totally up to you. Starry Messenger Nov 2013 #122

Yes. bobduca Nov 2013 #153

I've seen it, and from multiple DU members. Scuba Nov 2013 #21

"The modern feminist is . . . Fred Phelps in a pantsuit." geek tragedy Nov 2013 #30

oh god, that thread. where people should have been kicked off DU and were not. nt La Lioness Priyanka Nov 2013 #32

it was flypaper for misogynists and other rightwing creeps nt geek tragedy Nov 2013 #33

Wow, glad I missed that. NuclearDem Nov 2013 #34

no one should feel ick, shame or hold value judgment with grown men buy schoolgirls soiled panties seabeyond Nov 2013 #35

This message was self-deleted by its author seaglass Nov 2013 #39

it is a man thing? all us little wimminz shouldnt worry our pretty, fragile head over? seabeyond Nov 2013 #40

That's a good question. kcr Nov 2013 #119

Glad I missed that thread Matariki Nov 2013 #52

That has got to be one of the downright silliest things I've ever read, on DU anyway. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #111

More accurately, you fixed it for you. LanternWaste Nov 2013 #64

"Some say" lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #92

. Bonobo Nov 2013 #96

Exactly. n/t lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #101

Yes, it's very noticeable in many instances R B Garr Nov 2013 #114

Yep kcr Nov 2013 #117

Gee, my experience has been the exact opposite. Go figure. freshwest Nov 2013 #5

"Yesterday somebody on Facebook told me that..." flvegan Nov 2013 #8

And the Patriarchy continues to crumble! DeSwiss Nov 2013 #10

LOL Matariki Nov 2013 #43

know what else? BainsBane Nov 2013 #11

Someone didn't read the article Matariki Nov 2013 #42

I did BainsBane Nov 2013 #46

:-) Matariki Nov 2013 #51

Feminism doesn't hurt men, it just ignores men davidn3600 Nov 2013 #16

The dominant culture will fight to stay that way. They will not give up power willingly. ehrnst Nov 2013 #37

this is akin to saying that civil rights group like the NAACP ignores whites La Lioness Priyanka Nov 2013 #38

See number 5 BainsBane Nov 2013 #47

Let me tell you why you are missing the point... davidn3600 Nov 2013 #54

Your schtick on this is clear BainsBane Nov 2013 #56

I dont see the NAACP as a threat to whites at all in any shape or form davidn3600 Nov 2013 #57

Special treatment kcr Nov 2013 #58

Well apparently no one can counter my points.. davidn3600 Nov 2013 #63

You've been on DU over a year kcr Nov 2013 #68

Exactly. He's the one making the broad, sweeping generalization. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #124

Let's explore that point. "Feminism" = "equality" lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #131

I wouldnt expect any coherent response on such a question davidn3600 Nov 2013 #142

Seems like there's no room for shades of gray in your world. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #145

...but it seems OK in your world to treat men like dogshit davidn3600 Nov 2013 #147

you have found 2 or 3 things you preceive you can claim as unfair to men. i can give you a thousand seabeyond Nov 2013 #148

I never said that that particular concern was invalid. It's *not*. I think treatment of inmates nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #151

I'm testing the idea that "equality" means something attainable or even desirable. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #152

Why are "advocacy" and "equality" mutually exclusive? And why are these small, specific examples nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #154

I'm an advocate for people with disabilities. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #156

We may, in part, have different definitions of "equality." I accept that. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #161

I have a dictionary. I'd be happy to share. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #163

I wouldn't be opposed to an Office of Men's Health, since we men do have particular health needs nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #165

fully agree. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #166

are getting tubes tied free? nt seabeyond Nov 2013 #155

Yes. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #157

and you know for sure vasectomies are not covered? that is wrong. something we should speak up seabeyond Nov 2013 #158

preventive care for men, women and children is defined by the USPSTF lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #160

someone made a very good point. this is about preventative. pregnancy effects the womans seabeyond Nov 2013 #159

That one example though shows the problem many have with feminism davidn3600 Nov 2013 #168

Prisoner abuse is one of our country's greatest shames. But why should feminists, specifically, nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #169

This message was self-deleted by its author davidn3600 Nov 2013 #170

then DO something about it. YOU have a problem with feminism cause women are not doing something seabeyond Nov 2013 #171

If people like him actually addressed "women's issues" then I would understand his complaining. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #172

because your "points" are terrible DireStrike Nov 2013 #70

Moreover, the argument that women's rights groups BainsBane Nov 2013 #72

I never said you have to fight for men... davidn3600 Nov 2013 #77

So the NAACP doesn't fight for equality? BainsBane Nov 2013 #79

Wait a minute. kcr Nov 2013 #80

That appears to be exactly what the poster is saying etherealtruth Nov 2013 #82

The key difference BainsBane Nov 2013 #83

Bingo kcr Nov 2013 #84

and THAT would be the point. their ass would be kick off so far if they said this about any group, seabeyond Nov 2013 #85

It's not the same thing.... davidn3600 Nov 2013 #86

Well, because YOU think so... kcr Nov 2013 #89

Translation BainsBane Nov 2013 #91

Exactly...it's an opinion.. davidn3600 Nov 2013 #93

Do people say things like "I'm not a feminist" kcr Nov 2013 #95

we have members of du going around putting up ugly, old women in order to shame us, like that stupid seabeyond Nov 2013 #105

I think it has more to do with divisive politics like with abortion davidn3600 Nov 2013 #109

Hmm. kcr Nov 2013 #112

because you think women have made "enough" progress, we should now help men out with theirs? again seabeyond Nov 2013 #94

I said gender equality has made more progress than racial equality davidn3600 Nov 2013 #97

no. we have not won. not only have we not won, we are in the process of backpedaling. seabeyond Nov 2013 #100

But, but we can vote BainsBane Nov 2013 #102

Yes, you've said it. And it gets dismissed because it doesn't matter. kcr Nov 2013 #116

You made me LOL. Good post! boston bean Nov 2013 #129

We didnt have to fight a civil war in order to get the 19th amendment davidn3600 Nov 2013 #137

So, one may reasonably argue there's a difference in degree, but not in kind. kcr Nov 2013 #140

"Gender issues have made far more progress socially and economically than racial issues." nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #144

this is the most ridiculous argument ever. we have radio hosts that call women sluts and whores and seabeyond Nov 2013 #146

Yeah, what "privilege" really means is all the bad shit that *doesn't* happen to you... nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #149

OK...then lets abolish the selective service davidn3600 Nov 2013 #74

Poor men BainsBane Nov 2013 #87

Abolishing selective service has been a feminist position since at least the 1960s. Gormy Cuss Nov 2013 #90

Lower bail! Lower bail! boston bean Nov 2013 #132

+ a gazillion. n/t chervilant Nov 2013 #133

Then you haven't been given all the talking points DireStrike Nov 2013 #67

Someone hasn't read my posts... davidn3600 Nov 2013 #69

Well you didn't read mine, so that's fair. DireStrike Nov 2013 #71

And how are you so comfortable freely generalizing about so many people? nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #123

Point by point. Gormy Cuss Nov 2013 #81

It shouldn't hurt *that* much though. And as a guy I really get sick of the MRA whining. nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #120

and the jury results are in.... aikoaiko Nov 2013 #103

Paternity (as well as maternity) leave? Readily available, affordable birth control for both sexes? nomorenomore08 Nov 2013 #115

"I say feminists don't care about men." geek tragedy Nov 2013 #60

This is one of the more unintentionally funny posts I've seen in awhile. Sheldon Cooper Nov 2013 #61

we are trying to keep girls from killing themselves, being raped, and beaten to death. nonexisting seabeyond Nov 2013 #78

Yeah, that's why the never ratified amendment was called the Women's Rights Amendment. n/t Gormy Cuss Nov 2013 #49

Judging from your insupportable post, chervilant Nov 2013 #130

This sub thread was even better than the article. LMAO boston bean Nov 2013 #139

it is so beyond absurd. i have been sitting here reading the back and forth and for there to even seabeyond Nov 2013 #150

When a man runs for office ... Scuba Nov 2013 #22

especially when he looks like a fucking turtle snooper2 Nov 2013 #53

Don't fret, Sarah Palin is on your side ProudToBeBlueInRhody Nov 2013 #73

Sarah never met a victim card she didn't like. Scuba Nov 2013 #75

LOL. Iggo Nov 2013 #25

Hilarious. n/t Butterbean Nov 2013 #29

Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Nov 2013 #45

The loss of entitlement hurts worst when you didn't know you had it. Warpy Nov 2013 #59

K&R Solly Mack Nov 2013 #65

I really, truly, hope that this just a really clever piece of witty satire.......nt AverageJoe90 Nov 2013 #66

Funny treestar Nov 2013 #76

Such a load of nonsense, this article Katashi_itto Nov 2013 #98

I must have missed this. Turbineguy Nov 2013 #107

I thought this was the Onion. Tuesday Afternoon Nov 2013 #126

lol seabeyond Nov 2013 #134

aah - Tuesday Afternoon Nov 2013 #141

Not The Onion, but obvious satire. Matariki Nov 2013 #136

It's all very sad. Deep13 Nov 2013 #167