General Discussion

libdude

(136 posts)

225. Ms. In Between

Sun Nov 17, 2013, 09:28 PM

Nov 2013

Very good posts, which after reading the thread and the numerous posts, just confirms my thoughts that voting for Hillary Clinton will do nothing to bring about the progressive changes I believe this country needs. My personal view is she is somewhere between President Obama, a self-described 80's Republican and Gov. Christie. There are a few differences in social areas, but on the general " business party " platform, no difference. I use " business party " as Noam Chomsky assessed the political atmosphere.
If the only reason to vote for Clinton is to keep a Democrat in the Oval Office, that is not a positive reason for me. If the reason to vote for a Democrat is to advance a Progressive agenda for all the people, I can go with that, Sen. Sanders would have my vote, Sen. Warren, possibly, although I would think she can be more effective in her current position.

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The Rising Tide of Populism in the Dem Party Spells Trouble for Hillary [View all] cali Nov 2013 OP

It's encouraging to see the national mood shifting to the left. Laelth Nov 2013 #1

I think Clinton's plan is pretty solid and pretty obvious cali Nov 2013 #2

If she does win the nomination BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #110

I'll vote for her- puking all the way cali Nov 2013 #117

... BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #120

I'm a woman, but I certainly won't support her in the primaries cali Nov 2013 #123

Actually, I've been here BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #129

Yes, I'm deeply angry over the corporate takeover of the party. And I'm not the only one cali Nov 2013 #131

Sure her ties trouble me. BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #221

Frankly I don't care whether the candidate is a man or a woman. So long as they have a RECORD, sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #169

+1. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #223

YES! As you say! RKP5637 Nov 2013 #227

"you seem to be a shit stirrer" Veilex Nov 2013 #136

No. treestar Nov 2013 #144

That's Democracy for you newthinking Nov 2013 #195

This seems like an odd post to me. SoLeftIAmRight Nov 2013 #209

Bill DeBlasio LOVES HRC--he ran her Senate campaign. MADem Nov 2013 #252

Oh, please. People on the left have been disturbed by Clinton's corporatism cali Nov 2013 #268

Well, gee, when you go to the "Ready for Hillary" website, the first face you see is DeBlasio's. MADem Nov 2013 #271

Most DUers certainly find my argument convincing cali Nov 2013 #274

Ooooooooh--a gratuitous slam! A personal insult! Didn't take you long, did it? nt MADem Nov 2013 #275

I like sand. juajen Nov 2013 #277

I've posted numerous links to her enmeshment with corporate interests cali Nov 2013 #280

I think what BOG types have firmly planted is � 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #302

How I wish � 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #301

+1 MADem Nov 2013 #303

I think ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #304

Well, if people have ill will, they'll show it soon enough. MADem Nov 2013 #306

Party before people heh? dotymed Nov 2013 #263

I want a candidate who will win. BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #281

Hello.I'm Oldenufff,and I am a shit stirrer... Oldenuff Nov 2013 #279

Hey Oldenuff BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #285

If Elizabeth Warren is her VP, that would soften the blow - she'd be next in line AAO Nov 2013 #241

In 2016 Warren will be 67; Hillary C.will be 69; after 2 terms, W=75; HC = 77. Divernan Nov 2013 #249

I doubt that will happen. MADem Nov 2013 #253

No more voting for candidates whose "blows" need to be softened. woo me with science Nov 2013 #308

I hope Warren runs against HRC as a Democrat - I'll vote for her. AAO Nov 2013 #309

dear cali q.kobi Nov 2013 #264

dear q.kobi: I have no idea what you are attempting to say. cali Nov 2013 #272

welcome to DU gopiscrap Nov 2013 #292

You seem to forget where you are tavalon Nov 2013 #161

blue to the bone, don't ask that question. you assume that people won't vote for the nom. roguevalley Nov 2013 #211

From talking to dems I know, they will not vote for her if she receives the nomination. They will sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #233

I'm with you. Hillary spells trouble for Hillary. We don't need Rethug lite. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2013 #269

I thikn now is the time for us to say "No we will not support her as the nominee for she is too cui bono Nov 2013 #247

I appreciate you posting blue14u Nov 2013 #179

Is this still up to us? mdbl Nov 2013 #260

mdbl, I understand what blue14u Nov 2013 #293

Ok, I'll try harder... mdbl Nov 2013 #307

I too hope that is the case.. We vote, we try, to bring change and blue14u Nov 2013 #310

When the first Iraq war made Bush I undefeatable, all the tblue37 Nov 2013 #180

Now, Julian Castro might have a chance BlueToTheBone Nov 2013 #216

Did you hear Howard Dean's remarks yesterday? 2banon Nov 2013 #194

He ought to know...he's a smart man! Auntie Bush Nov 2013 #240

He, and a million other people who have already donated to MADem Nov 2013 #254

Yeah, that is unfortunate 2banon Nov 2013 #284

I disagree entirely with every single thing you've said. MADem Nov 2013 #290

Of course you disagree with me. 2banon Nov 2013 #291

Listen to you--so very hard at work with your nasty little label maker! MADem Nov 2013 #305

Good billhicks76 Nov 2013 #248

Dear Noble one q.kobi Nov 2013 #265

Welcome to DU. Laelth Nov 2013 #267

Dear q.kobi ~ Hello In_The_Wind Nov 2013 #273

Premise being Hillary can NOT change policies for the best... Hillary isn't Pol Pot uponit7771 Nov 2013 #3

Premise being that her history is one that reveals her close ties to corporate interests cali Nov 2013 #4

Keyword: History, I'm going to wait and see what her plans are... I don't hate Hillary, I think she' uponit7771 Nov 2013 #7

Fair enough. What would she have to do to earn your trust? cali Nov 2013 #10

try uponit7771 Nov 2013 #38

Well for some just say the right words. zeemike Nov 2013 #47

No doubt. Wilms Nov 2013 #50

Forensic psychologiy's oldest and firmest rule: Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #20

Again, people can change... after seeing Hillary in SOS role I'm willing to give her a chance uponit7771 Nov 2013 #41

Just curious but zeemike Nov 2013 #52

try uponit7771 Nov 2013 #64

"Try", frankly isn't good enough. Veilex Nov 2013 #124

She was a primary force in crafting and backing the TPP cali Nov 2013 #132

If true, then I'm seriously concerned about that. Veilex Nov 2013 #139

For who? uponit7771 Nov 2013 #148

for anyone attempting to understand where you're coming from. cali Nov 2013 #149

Good enough for me and explains a lot, all she has to do is try and make every attempt to stay uponit7771 Nov 2013 #151

Glib responses are an admission that you don't have an answer. /nt Marr Nov 2013 #162

Labeling what's good enough for me is an indicative of purism, I'm not a purist. I'm not going uponit7771 Nov 2013 #191

"Go, adequate!" Marr Nov 2013 #229

Yes, I wish life was full of perfect choice, it's not. On top of all this it sounds like the people uponit7771 Nov 2013 #238

What every SOS does... awoke_in_2003 Nov 2013 #176

What changes have you seen in Hillary? Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #53

Her role as SoS was more conservative than liberal cali Nov 2013 #57

Yes. Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #63

Not tippers for me, FDR would have been hated if you think TPP is bad. What she did as SOS uponit7771 Nov 2013 #65

that's just topsy turvy. the exact opposite of the preponderance of the evidence cali Nov 2013 #71

This is false, FDR had almost 4 terms as president and you think he didn't do ONE THING that uponit7771 Nov 2013 #150

Comment about FDR is a strawman... Veilex Nov 2013 #214

Exactly. treestar Nov 2013 #142

The purist here would throw her out the second she doesn't send every CEO to gitmo save COSCOs uponit7771 Nov 2013 #152

Yes, and the non-worry about the congress of 2017 treestar Nov 2013 #156

Sigh. More codswallop. I'm not even an Elizabeth Warren for President supporter cali Nov 2013 #159

what codswallop. One only hopes that you don't actually believe such nonsense. cali Nov 2013 #158

My problem with these arguments Marr Nov 2013 #165

it is like that game at the fair where you hit a gopher and another pops up cali Nov 2013 #168

Hillarys "extent" you think goes TOO far & others dont..an authoritarian or purist subjects others uponit7771 Nov 2013 #192

I'm hardly a purist. I don't expect that any candidate won't have some corporate cali Nov 2013 #193

I'm a real dem and I accept the ties she has. I'm not going to let others define "real dem" for me.. uponit7771 Nov 2013 #236

Supporters of Hillary could help her immensely by not referring to those who do not, as 'purists', sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #174

If she's trying to earn our trust Cirque du So-What Nov 2013 #42

Given her sucking up to corporate $... HooptieWagon Nov 2013 #127

I see a woman who is and can be flexible. Who's not stupid. Who may well see the trends that are calimary Nov 2013 #137

Well stated. Wish it was an OP. That last sentence. Thanks from I'm guessing quite a few of us. libdem4life Nov 2013 #160

BUT brilliance in the servicee of values and policies I despise is even worse tblue37 Nov 2013 #181

Understood. Hey, I'm one of the legions for whom the Iraq War vote was a nonstarter. calimary Nov 2013 #244

Would you have written this about a male candidate? karynnj Nov 2013 #210

If it was dan quayle, uh, forgive me but - "you betcha"! calimary Nov 2013 #243

I believe the premise is that Hillary wouldn't WANT to change the policies for the best. djean111 Nov 2013 #5

We'll see, I don't see tons of corporatism about her now and even Warren couldn't be a purist in ... uponit7771 Nov 2013 #8

I do cali Nov 2013 #11

I have a higher bar for a corporatist than those issue or even a couple. IMHO a person would have to uponit7771 Nov 2013 #44

Clinton is every bit as much the corporatist as bush was- maybe more so cali Nov 2013 #48

Again, out of Clinton I don't see the same "fuck government, it sucks" sentiment word or deed uponit7771 Nov 2013 #51

But that's not corporatism Proud Public Servant Nov 2013 #84

good post. thank you. cali Nov 2013 #101

+1000. Agreed. n/t GoneFishin Nov 2013 #111

I would like to submit this video as Exhibit 1: bvar22 Nov 2013 #143

bvar22, thank you again!! blue14u Nov 2013 #186

+1 chknltl Nov 2013 #145

There's no need to fear such a possibility DissidentVoice Nov 2013 #220

FDR has actions that fit in that exact definition, he's a corporatist too? The purist would say yes uponit7771 Nov 2013 #154

Back to the FDR strawman... Veilex Nov 2013 #217

False on it's face and a valid comparison seeing FDR would've surpassed Hillary in corporate uponit7771 Nov 2013 #237

You're the only one making the comparison... the topic has nothing.. Veilex Nov 2013 #282

Irrelevant who is making the comparison, the fact is HRC shouldn't be held to a higher bar than.. uponit7771 Nov 2013 #283

Thats a bit naive... Veilex Nov 2013 #286

"Times change" - same can be said about HRC no? tia uponit7771 Nov 2013 #287

Times do change... long practiced habits and behaviors rarely do. Veilex Nov 2013 #288

"rarely do." ... good we agree, RARELY doesn't mean impossible and the reason she deserves uponit7771 Nov 2013 #289

"good we agree" Hardly... Veilex Nov 2013 #296

I think my argument is pretty logical, don't judge Hillary over her tenure by a higher standard than uponit7771 Nov 2013 #297

If that is what your notion of logic is, then we'll have to agree to disagree. Veilex Nov 2013 #298

Ad homs response are an indicator of a poor position uponit7771 Nov 2013 #299

Your absolutely right... Veilex Nov 2013 #300

Yep... I don't see blue14u Nov 2013 #185

Awesome response! EOM Veilex Nov 2013 #215

Hillary helped construct the TPP, and there are links elsewhere on DU for information djean111 Nov 2013 #12

Hillary Clinton's Business Legacy at State Department (leading part in drafting TPP) antigop Nov 2013 #115

Isn't Just Her liberalmike27 Nov 2013 #40

The actual premise is that Hillary Clinton is unable to understand polling and grantcart Nov 2013 #235

Think of Hillary's sacrifice, voting for the Iraq war in order to maintain her electability Fumesucker Nov 2013 #6

I'd like to see people here who support her address the points in the cali Nov 2013 #9

The Iraq war will be an issue if Hillary keeps claiming this Whisp Nov 2013 #96

Conscience? Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #22

Imagine the horror of having to vote for war in 2003 in order to be able to save us in 2016? Fumesucker Nov 2013 #46

I initially believed her vote for Iraq War was to maintain electability magical thyme Nov 2013 #114

All that sublimated rage at Bill has to be directed somewhere. Divernan Nov 2013 #250

We need Clinton like we need Bush. nt valerief Nov 2013 #13

Hillary and The Carlyle Group. Hillary and Goldman Sachs. Hillary the Corporate Crony cali Nov 2013 #14

+1 jsr Nov 2013 #24

Hill and MallWart Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #25

yep. really the list of her corporate ties is impressively long cali Nov 2013 #30

Not to mention HRC's blue14u Nov 2013 #187

It's nice to see that the rank and file are coming around. mattclearing Nov 2013 #15

I tend to agree. DU was to the left of mainstream dems for a long time cali Nov 2013 #27

I think a lot of conservatism was masked by the fact we had a common enemy in Bush. Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #34

That makes sense. Never underestimate the pull of pure partisanshit as well cali Nov 2013 #35

I am almost sure of it. zeemike Nov 2013 #70

Lots of true leftists have moved on from this place warrant46 Nov 2013 #126

Can I suggest that Bill de Blasio winning in NYC does not scale up to a national election? brooklynite Nov 2013 #16

perhaps. perhaps not. cali Nov 2013 #18

But new-blood Dems are mounting credible campaigns everywhere. Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #36

Yes Yes Yes... we are!!! blue14u Nov 2013 #188

Yesterday I read a socialist won a city council position in some city in Washington, I believe. CrispyQ Nov 2013 #39

I hate to expose myself to potential ridicule by making a whole OP about it, but Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #59

I'll rec not ridicule any op you write about this. please do cali Nov 2013 #75

I'll be on the lookout for that OP as well BelgianMadCow Nov 2013 #200

Those in Seattle who want to show they support this change, there's a rally at 2:30 PM today... cascadiance Nov 2013 #175

Hillary is not the only one out of step with majority Dem sentiment... L0oniX Nov 2013 #17

There are a lot of conservadems posting here but hopefully they aren't the majority cali Nov 2013 #19

Lets face it: consrvative Dems cross party lines easier than do liberal GOP. Nixon and Reagan ..... marble falls Nov 2013 #60

Hillary is the very face of the corporate Dems. LuvNewcastle Nov 2013 #21

I am afraid a populist candidate might split the ticket ... It's too early to see how things could YOHABLO Nov 2013 #222

This is the heart of the matter fadedrose Nov 2013 #23

2 main factors in the ratings-- Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #31

When you look at it from raw ambition. 2004 would have been the best time for HC to pounce.... WCGreen Nov 2013 #26

I completely agree. I think Hillary missed her window of opportunity back then. cali Nov 2013 #28

I hope so. n/t PowerToThePeople Nov 2013 #29

from your lips to the goddess's ears (n/t) bread_and_roses Nov 2013 #32

I must say I'm a bit concerned- ruffburr Nov 2013 #32

Well, when you operate from a position of fear WowSeriously Nov 2013 #45

Wow Seriously- ruffburr Nov 2013 #61

There are lots of majority attractive messages. US jobs, living wages, affordable housing are a few. L0oniX Nov 2013 #69

Absolutely- ruffburr Nov 2013 #73

Obama did Oilwellian Nov 2013 #86

I think it time we stop pre settling for lesser candidates. WowSeriously Nov 2013 #138

Frankly, I think ProSense Nov 2013 #37

No surprise there stupidicus Nov 2013 #43

many Americans don't know that Hillary is not a left-wing populist. Even many Democrats - even those Douglas Carpenter Nov 2013 #49

I think the mask is slipping and we can help cali Nov 2013 #56

Might be a good idea to send Sanders a few bucks fadedrose Nov 2013 #203

Let's not forget this nugget from her past: Her connection with The Fellowship cali Nov 2013 #54

Hillary No - DLC No - Progressives Yes - Warren 2016 cantbeserious Nov 2013 #55

k&r Strong post! I hope you're right and I think you are. marble falls Nov 2013 #58

thank you! and love your slogan. cali Nov 2013 #76

I love how it becomes personal hfojvt Nov 2013 #62

how on earth is that "personal" ? I don't even get the point of your post cali Nov 2013 #77

How is "trouble for Hillary" NOT personal? hfojvt Nov 2013 #90

Sorry, I think your post is totally nonsensical cali Nov 2013 #99

still personal, eh? hfojvt Nov 2013 #134

94 %?? But that's Gallup, yes? MADem Nov 2013 #255

2014 will be a strong deciding factor on which brand of Dem the people want. gtar100 Nov 2013 #66

It may well be an indicator of where dems are heading cali Nov 2013 #78

Biggest Trouble For Hillary Is Her Campaign hollowdweller Nov 2013 #67

I think Hillary has a tone deaf quality to her cali Nov 2013 #79

Both Hillary and her campaign staff believed in her 'inevitability' back then, too. Ikonoklast Nov 2013 #184

In order to defeat Hillary, Dems will vote for Ted Cruz and Chris Christie. ZRT2209 Nov 2013 #68

riiight. because that's the only alternative. If we don't nominate conservaHillary cali Nov 2013 #72

are you assuming Hillary will win the primaries? magical thyme Nov 2013 #122

I don't get why conservative dems don't just admit that that's what they are cali Nov 2013 #74

Can you explain why Howard Dean supports her? ProSense Nov 2013 #80

Well, Dean wasn't particularly progressive when he was Governor of Vermont cali Nov 2013 #82

Because Warren isn't running. She has said so over and over. MADem Nov 2013 #256

Post removed Post removed Nov 2013 #81

lol. yeah, people to the LEFT of Hillary are "repukes". cali Nov 2013 #85

Is this a joke? polichick Nov 2013 #89

I will support the left-most candidate, whomever that ends up being. nt silvershadow Nov 2013 #83

Hillary Clinton would make a great adieu Nov 2013 #87

She would make an even better former politician. bvar22 Nov 2013 #146

Yes she would. We don't need dynasties for one thing, particularly when they are right leaning and sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #234

Cali: Please post a link proving this sentence from your post: northoftheborder Nov 2013 #88

Here is a short excerpt of Hill's remarks in Vietnam from the State Dept website-- Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #93

And this� Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #100

people who don't want to believe that Hillary is what she is- cali Nov 2013 #118

She was the Senator from India LongTomH Nov 2013 #153

here: cali Nov 2013 #95

The neoliberals and Wall Street mob are calling the shots in the Democratic Party. duffyduff Nov 2013 #91

Far more than "compromised" I think... polichick Nov 2013 #92

I think that the dem base can wrest that away. I agree with Jackpine cali Nov 2013 #112

Ironically Ms. Clinton will have the full force of Citizens United behind her. rhett o rick Nov 2013 #94

I don't believe that's inevitable- despite CU cali Nov 2013 #97

To think she'd be less corporatist after becoming president ... I can't...this map boggles. ancianita Nov 2013 #98

Shocker: Hill is pro-fracking cali Nov 2013 #102

facepalm SHRED Nov 2013 #105

she's the ultimate corporate shill. I'll give her this: She's damn good at it. cali Nov 2013 #106

not good enough to fool me SHRED Nov 2013 #107

no. thankfully. more and more dems are seeing the corporate influence on the cali Nov 2013 #109

Sometimes I wonder if this DU is interested in... SHRED Nov 2013 #113

there's an awful lot of mindless partisanship here cali Nov 2013 #116

true SHRED Nov 2013 #119

People seem to confuse political parties with sports teams. Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #157

heh, a Milloy endorsement (but I thought gender equality was "woo" to those shills...) MisterP Nov 2013 #295

Hillary lost all ready haydukelives Nov 2013 #103

We are sick of the old DLC bullshit SHRED Nov 2013 #104

laws written by the Heritage Foundation and Big Insurance... MisterP Nov 2013 #294

I don't want her to be President 90-percent Nov 2013 #108

What is her position GP6971 Nov 2013 #121

She's waffled all over the place. you can't pin her down cali Nov 2013 #125

Well........ GP6971 Nov 2013 #128

Hillary supporter are attacking liberals 4dsc Nov 2013 #130

there will be more and more of them cali Nov 2013 #133

Yes, it will get extremely snarky newthinking Nov 2013 #199

Hillary Schmillery wreq Nov 2013 #135

Welcome to DU. What if she is the Dem candidate, who would you vote/campaign for? uppityperson Nov 2013 #140

lol. cali Nov 2013 #141

welcome to DU gopiscrap Nov 2013 #197

Errrrrr....Howard Dean has endorsed Hillary Clinton. MADem Nov 2013 #257

I, For One Would LOVE To See This Happen! ChiciB1 Nov 2013 #147

The rising disgust with Politics-as-usual spells trouble for Hillary. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2013 #155

If Dennis Kucinich gives up his FOX gig he can run again/nt DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2013 #163

another silly non-response to the OP. Now tell me why Hillary is a good candidate cali Nov 2013 #164

Don't forget her role in the NATO invasion of Libya, a country that is now in a tragic state of sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #166

You sure aren't alone cali Nov 2013 #167

Right-it was in much better shape under Gadaffi's leadership brooklynite Nov 2013 #204

that it was in bad shape under Gadaffi is NOT a logical argument cali Nov 2013 #219

Yes, it was. In fact most Libyans had free access to HC, so they were way ahead of us in that dept. sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #232

Been wondering... TRoN33 Nov 2013 #170

I doubt Warren will run. She really doesn't have much to do with my cali Nov 2013 #171

Clearly someone didn't get the memo about how Hillary is the inevitable nominee and hughee99 Nov 2013 #172

I think more and more people will be getting that memo. cali Nov 2013 #173

Yes, they will try to hammer the boot down newthinking Nov 2013 #202

yes, it has changed. And not for the better. cali Nov 2013 #205

Clinton is not my first choice for the nomination but by any objective standard she must be totodeinhere Nov 2013 #177

That's undoubtedly true. cali Nov 2013 #178

2016 is looking more and more like 1896 happyslug Nov 2013 #182

"The revolution of 1896 within the Democratic Party meant short term defeat... polichick Nov 2013 #207

Just a historical clarification wyldwolf Nov 2013 #230

With the loss of Congress the Democratic party turned to the right happyslug Nov 2013 #231

Shhhhhhhh....! MADem Nov 2013 #259

True, and it's largely because of how far to the Right the Tea Party has gone. Frankly, overall, libdem4life Nov 2013 #183

I confidently predict that the Democrats will Progressive dog Nov 2013 #189

Elizabeth Warren isn't the issue here. Of course Hillary is in the running cali Nov 2013 #190

Did you know that Elizabeth Warren said Progressive dog Nov 2013 #196

Yes. I did know that. So? cali Nov 2013 #198

I'd put her as mainstream, Progressive dog Nov 2013 #212

Well, unlike "mystery meat" BHO, HRC is a known entity, a rightie. Send her to the GOP. They need blkmusclmachine Nov 2013 #201

de Blasio is a Clinton guy JI7 Nov 2013 #206

de Blasio is allied with the Clintons, no doubt and has a history with them cali Nov 2013 #213

Here are some Warren quotes. Beacool Nov 2013 #208

lol. fail cali Nov 2013 #218

Hey, support anyone you want, Beacool Nov 2013 #224

I haven't. ever. cali Nov 2013 #278

Ms. In Between libdude Nov 2013 #225

But it's so very important for the populists to have a candidate. nm rhett o rick Nov 2013 #226

I'd like to point out that this is asserted every presidential election cycle wyldwolf Nov 2013 #228

I could Easily Support Hillary Clinton DallasNE Nov 2013 #239

please not Martin O'Malley! Vattel Nov 2013 #261

The Clinton and the Republicans fighting is soooo "Last Century". Spitfire of ATJ Nov 2013 #242

Wooooohoooooo! We can do much better:) grahamhgreen Nov 2013 #245

I'm going to wait for her to declare her candidacy DFW Nov 2013 #246

***Didn't Bill DeBlasio RUN Clinton's NY campaign?*** MADem Nov 2013 #251

yes, of course he did. I'm fully familiar with his ties to the Clintons cali Nov 2013 #266

Well, Bloomberg was a Republican-turned-Independent Mayor. MADem Nov 2013 #270

If we can't do better .. sendero Nov 2013 #258

2016 Obama - Biden Reformed Bully Nov 2013 #262

Welcome to DU. The creative speculation forum is that way cali Nov 2013 #276