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karynnj

(60,865 posts)
32. Sadly, they are serious
Tue Nov 26, 2013, 09:49 AM
Nov 2013

IMO, their tactics are really unhelpful. I remember in 2009, that they had a series of really obnoxious ads - targeting Democrats - that they felt were not for the public option. However, rather than make the case their position, the ads completely attacked their integrity - mostly using campaign finance information.

I got into an email conversation with Green - because surprisingly, he responded to comments that I emailed him - as well as posted. It will surprise no one that the reason was that in addition to the people against the public option, he decided to target John Kerry. (Using the fact that his career sums of money collected was high - ignoring that it was because he had been our nominee.) In sum, he admitted that he included Kerry because having volunteered on the 2004 campaign he was angry that Kerry was not more forcibly fighting for a public option. His goal - for putting out (in his case) internet ads was to get Kerry to step forward rather than to work within the Finance committee to make the bill marginally better where he could.)

I disclose this because it seems his goal is the same here. He wants Hillary Clinton to be the candidate he wants, not necessarily the candidate that her team wants her to be to win or who she really is. To me, BOTH of these actions show a huge amount of chutzpah on his part. In Hillary's case, it also ignores that she is a known quantity. It also ignores that some of the vague outlines we are beginning to see show that Hillary may well run a more progressive campaign. Any shifts that HRC makes MUST be seen as something organic - something true to her - as seen by many comments here, NO ONE will be happy with a HRC suddenly speaking like Alan Grayson!

Two issues seem to highlight changes to the left. One is that she has tied together her advocacy as a recent Yale Law School graduate, her time as First Lady of both Arkansas and the US and her time as SoS - on her record for advocating for women and children. Although this was a theme in 2008, it seems to be far more high profile now. ( The only danger I see here is whether Republicans will push her on whether we should stay in Afghanistan - either backing an unpopular continuation of the war or being open to question on the assurances to Afghan women.)

The second is more surprising as it is not rooted in the past. She has given speeches on both green building and sustainability. These are actually closer to things that have moved John and Teresa Kerry than the Clintons - The Kerrys actually were 2 of the co founders of Second Nature, which they did right after they met before they married and Teresa was a leader in Green building and the reason that Pittsburgh has many green buildings. (I know the Clinton Foundation has done some things on green buildings - but last I read it was more talk, than action.) Bill Clinton had a poor record on the environment in Arkansas and neither were as concerned about global warming as Gore and Kerry. Because this is a new level of commitment, it is actually a sign that on this issue HRC has already moved to the left and it is believable.

It will be interesting to see how she positions herself for 2016. If Obama gets something passed on immigration, there may be two big issues central to Democrats that - because they are partly "fixed" could be less important - health care and immigration. However, it might be the Republicans may run on rolling them back - giving any Democrat very simple positions.

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I don't see what good these people are doing if they're not LuvNewcastle Nov 2013 #1
Different goal onpatrol98 Nov 2013 #2
I don't think much of that goal. LuvNewcastle Nov 2013 #4
She'll say anything to get our votes, anyway. That's basically what all politicians HereSince1628 Nov 2013 #6
Exactly, she'll say anything. That's why I'm not interested in hearing it. LuvNewcastle Nov 2013 #9
At best it is a trick system... ReRe Nov 2013 #40
Understand that but it's not a reason to not try to pin her down. Of course having a progressive rhett o rick Nov 2013 #55
I don't want her pinned down, for that matter I don't want her not pinned down HereSince1628 Nov 2013 #57
I disagree with the name recognition. The Corp-Media wont help any rhett o rick Nov 2013 #65
Being in a year ahead is hardly last minute. HereSince1628 Nov 2013 #67
Well said. I wrote to boldprogressives asking if they'd draft and back a prez candidate... polichick Nov 2013 #7
Apparently they aren't serious, which makes me question their credibility as progressives. LuvNewcastle Nov 2013 #10
Sadly, they are serious karynnj Nov 2013 #32
The most important issue facing Americans today is the disparity in wealth between rich and JDPriestly Nov 2013 #79
It's early - have patience TBF Nov 2013 #12
Good post. Laelth Nov 2013 #23
Exactly. TBF Nov 2013 #24
Ding ding ding! riqster Nov 2013 #82
I read about this blue14u Nov 2013 #80
You summed that up blue14u Nov 2013 #71
"she'll say just about anything to get our votes" Exactly! L0oniX Nov 2013 #35
I agree. "Storming" her meetings will only give her sympathy from the "centrist' wing; 7962 Nov 2013 #16
Hello? JackRiddler Nov 2013 #19
Elizabeth Warren's Issues? 2banon Nov 2013 #68
I would like to see a draft Warren group nominate her at the convention. JDPriestly Nov 2013 #75
Better Hurry billhicks76 Nov 2013 #81
“Elizabeth Warren is the North Star of where our party should be going and is going,” Scuba Nov 2013 #3
Exactly. HappyMe Nov 2013 #5
Please let me know if there is blue14u Dec 2013 #85
YEP!!! No doubt blue14u Nov 2013 #72
I both support this effort and oppose those who might demonize Hillary in the process Tom Rinaldo Nov 2013 #8
Agree dreamnightwind Nov 2013 #11
I've noticed that about Sanders also Tom Rinaldo Nov 2013 #13
Of course he'd probably run 3rd party dreamnightwind Nov 2013 #18
That's an interesting question. I hadn't assumed that he would run third party Tom Rinaldo Nov 2013 #21
There's no need to demonize her. JackRiddler Nov 2013 #20
Yes she did Tom Rinaldo Nov 2013 #22
I have no doubt either! I agree mountain grammy Nov 2013 #31
Some Dems will never vote for Clinton. Don't expect them to be quiet. L0oniX Nov 2013 #36
I don't. They shouldn't expect me to be quiet about my view either Tom Rinaldo Nov 2013 #84
k&r for Elizabeth Warren. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #14
PCCC. LOL... SidDithers Nov 2013 #15
Wow. The PCCC sounds like a scam. Thanks for the liinks. SunSeeker Nov 2013 #27
The 2012 cycle is pretty good too... SidDithers Nov 2013 #44
Dayum. Sounds like they borrowed Newt's business model. LOL nt SunSeeker Nov 2013 #47
Who will you be voting for??? L0oniX Nov 2013 #37
... SidDithers Nov 2013 #41
Alleged "Left Wing" Nobodies Begin Trading On Elizabeth Warren's Name gulliver Nov 2013 #17
We need more left wing "nobodies" speaking out in the Democratic Party raindaddy Nov 2013 #26
^^^^this^^^^ L0oniX Nov 2013 #39
That's the group that supported Warren's candidacy and got her elected... polichick Nov 2013 #50
Well, $1 million isn't chicken feed. gulliver Nov 2013 #58
43 million. FogerRox Nov 2013 #59
It depends on what you decide to count. gulliver Nov 2013 #62
Most of any Senate race in 2012, Brown self funded 20 million. FogerRox Nov 2013 #64
The idea that candidates associated with the left aren't viable... polichick Nov 2013 #83
It doesn't matter who runs, within weeks many DUers will turn on him or her. George II Nov 2013 #25
LOL. So true. nt SunSeeker Nov 2013 #29
Somebody has to lose to Hillary Renew Deal Nov 2013 #28
It's just that overly confident, HappyMe Nov 2013 #33
I agree Renew Deal Nov 2013 #42
There isn't any competition YET. HappyMe Nov 2013 #43
"The only way that she can win is if she plans to appeal to the republican-lite crowd." Renew Deal Nov 2013 #45
I know that the base isn't from the 'out there' crowd. HappyMe Nov 2013 #46
Who is this "far left" of which you speak? bvar22 Nov 2013 #48
Ha. That's what they said to Obama! nt PassingFair Nov 2013 #49
What I see with all the attention now on Hillary is a sideshow, being billed as the main attraction. RC Nov 2013 #30
That IS the plan! L0oniX Nov 2013 #38
I dont think working to get a progressive running for president in 2016 will detract from rhett o rick Nov 2013 #56
Suggestion 90-percent Nov 2013 #34
divide and lose MFM008 Nov 2013 #51
Oh noes!!1 HappyMe Nov 2013 #52
Liz is great, but it's Hillary's time. USSoS and Bill in the WH working 24/7 again. ffr Nov 2013 #69
Don't Sleep On Brian Schweitzer colsohlibgal Nov 2013 #53
I'd be happy to settle for Bernie Sanders. Another "not as bad" candidate like Hillary? Nope. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2013 #54
A Bernie Sanders-Matt Damon ticket would get my vote. n/t truedelphi Nov 2013 #60
Bernie Sanders is the real deal. He has a proven record woo me with science Nov 2013 #61
I don't believe in an annointed one whose turn it is rustydog Nov 2013 #63
If you are ok with Christie, then go ahead and nominate Clinton. nm rhett o rick Nov 2013 #66
Hillary, Queen of the Blue Dogs, Triangulation, "Centrism," "bipartisanship," Third Way, "New Dems," blkmusclmachine Nov 2013 #70
"Just say no" is spot on!!! blue14u Nov 2013 #74
We have been needing a North Star for a long time. avaistheone1 Nov 2013 #73
Warren For President 2016 cantbeserious Nov 2013 #76
dont know why folks are so upset iamthebandfanman Nov 2013 #77
Message auto-removed Name removed Nov 2013 #78
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