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longship

(40,416 posts)
28. There's a bit of begging the question, too.
Wed Nov 27, 2013, 03:45 PM
Nov 2013
Begging the question, not in the casual sense of the phrase's use, which I always phrase as "invites the question", but in the more formal logical argument sense, where it means assuming the conclusion in the premise.

The argument here is indeed a classic case of excluded middle, but it also touches on begging the question because the argument is set up such that it presents a choice, either Jesus was God or was bad, that no believer would choose the latter. That's begging the question.

I agree with Immoderate, the primary fallacy is "the excluded middle" "false dichotomy" in the premise which makes the entire argument fallacious.

Happy to respond to fun stuff like this.
R&K

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Begin with a false assumption ..... Coyotl Nov 2013 #1
Either I am a bad person or I am god. WTF? nt kelliekat44 Nov 2013 #59
False Premise but logically valid Vox Moi Nov 2013 #2
logically valid? 2banon Nov 2013 #11
Not so fast. immoderate Nov 2013 #14
I mean that sound logic can be applied to a false premise Vox Moi Nov 2013 #23
The problem is that the original premise contains a fallacy. It is not valid or sound. immoderate Nov 2013 #24
Fishwax - Poster #15 - is working the same idea Vox Moi Nov 2013 #41
Fishwax set me straight. We're all friends here. immoderate Nov 2013 #56
The premise is faulty. MineralMan Nov 2013 #3
A pantload indeed! arcane1 Nov 2013 #4
It assumes that because the gospels attribute to Jesus claims of divinity... antigone382 Nov 2013 #5
All authoritarian arguments are rooted in a false premise, and this one is an easy example. Egalitarian Thug Nov 2013 #6
The first sentence violates "the law of the excluded middle." immoderate Nov 2013 #7
+1, n/t RKP5637 Nov 2013 #12
Christ, where to start? EOTE Nov 2013 #8
The premise is ridiculous and hence the contrived result. n/t RKP5637 Nov 2013 #9
false premise AND possibly false assertion lapfog_1 Nov 2013 #10
Love is blind FatBuddy Nov 2013 #13
Now, that is logic! riqster Nov 2013 #26
But Stevie Wonder! hootinholler Nov 2013 #39
it's a valid argument, but that doesn't make it sound fishwax Nov 2013 #15
Logic police here: NO! It violates the "law of the excluded middle." immoderate Nov 2013 #19
The first premise is flawed, to be sure, but that doesn't change the validity of the argument fishwax Nov 2013 #25
OK, I get you. immoderate Nov 2013 #34
Thanks, Fishwax Vox Moi Nov 2013 #60
Jesus is either a can of tuna or a bad man. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2013 #16
Is this a comment on transubstantiation? longship Nov 2013 #30
At least it wouldn't be cannibalism....unless those indulging are also tuna. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2013 #31
You can apply a second logical tautology showing Person A is not a bad man and is not God Pretzel_Warrior Nov 2013 #17
I like it better this way. postulater Nov 2013 #18
Then you don't know what it's like to be the bad man, to be the sad man. riqster Nov 2013 #27
You're right. I have brown eyes. postulater Nov 2013 #50
Excellent. riqster Nov 2013 #51
Where to begin but it has already been answered mynaturalrights Nov 2013 #20
Faulty premise. Ain't no god. nt valerief Nov 2013 #21
Everything relys on the first premice which needs proof before upaloopa Nov 2013 #22
There's a bit of begging the question, too. longship Nov 2013 #28
It is a trick question, logic cannot be used to prove or dissprove faith. Rex Nov 2013 #29
Tell that to William Lane Craig. longship Nov 2013 #33
By his logic Rex Nov 2013 #35
Evil Spock was ALMOST good FiveGoodMen Nov 2013 #42
Well then Jesus was ALMOST God. Rex Nov 2013 #46
If evil Spock is almost good, does that mean good Spock is nearly evil? JVS Nov 2013 #57
The latter FiveGoodMen Nov 2013 #70
Where to begin. Cleita Nov 2013 #32
If that's logic Aerows Nov 2013 #36
In the real world there is no "either/or" Dan de Lyons Nov 2013 #37
"In the real world there is no "either/or"" ithinkmyliverhurts Nov 2013 #38
That's called disjunctive syllogism: it's generally been considered a valid argument form struggle4progress Nov 2013 #40
Is the intial premise a complete statement of all the real possibilities? Dan de Lyons Nov 2013 #45
I merely said it's considered a valid argument form: I made no claim about the truth struggle4progress Nov 2013 #47
This message was self-deleted by its author Recursion Nov 2013 #65
God is not an agreed upon fact. Logic requires fact to function seveneyes Nov 2013 #43
Boy oh boy..... Sheepshank Nov 2013 #44
This is an excellent example of a "Forced Dichotomy or Dilemma" Sivafae Nov 2013 #48
Where does boosh's 'they hate us for our freedoms' fall?…seems to me it was never logically... Tikki Nov 2013 #52
What Bush said was worse FiveGoodMen Nov 2013 #72
This message was self-deleted by its author Warren Stupidity Nov 2013 #49
It appears to be a use of False Dichotomy Agnosticsherbet Nov 2013 #53
This also falls under the logical fallacy "begging the question" Agnosticsherbet Nov 2013 #54
Message auto-removed Name removed Nov 2013 #55
No God. No good or bad. Concepts. All human concepts. RagAss Nov 2013 #58
Either I am a banana or I am on an airplane. Warren DeMontague Nov 2013 #61
Therefore, you're all my sockpuppets. nt bananas Nov 2013 #62
DANCE, LITTLE MAN, DANCE! Warren DeMontague Nov 2013 #68
This message was self-deleted by its author Recursion Nov 2013 #63
This is essentially the argument used by C.S. Lewis to prove Christ's divinity. Sognefjord Nov 2013 #64
D'oh. I read it wrong the first time. It's a perfectly valid syllogism Recursion Nov 2013 #66
Warm beer is better than nothing. Iterate Nov 2013 #67
Proud of DU... I have a Master's in Philosophy (though not focused on symbolic logic)... Democracyinkind Nov 2013 #69
I wonder if that goober believes that himself or is just brainwashing the kids. bemildred Nov 2013 #71
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