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hfojvt

(37,573 posts)
63. I would
Mon Dec 9, 2013, 01:23 PM
Dec 2013

because I think it is too generic.

"It's tougher being black than white" seems false to me in the same way that "W is greater than B" seems false to me IF I can easily find examples where B is greater than W. And not just one or two examples - multiple millions of them.

So going back to black and white. Would you, and most DUers agree that "It's tougher being poor than being rich"?

So now I pull out the census of wealth for 2011 where I find that a whopping 3.2 million black households have more than $250,000 in wealth. And I also find that there are 16.9 million white non hispanic households with less than $5,000 in wealth.

True or false? The statement "It is tougher being black than white" means that those 3.2 million blacks have it tougher than those 16.9 million whites. That somehow W (with less than $5,000 in wealth) is greater than B (with more than $250,000 in wealth).

If false, then how?

One might object and say "I am only comparing blacks and whites with the SAME income/wealth when I make that statement about race. So don't compare yourself to Tiger Woods or Oprah, look at the guy down the street. Look at the fact that 48% of black households have less than $5,000 in wealth compared to only 20.5% of WNH households. Right THERE is your white privilege (dammit)!"

Okay, let me try a crude analogy. Imagine that 20.5% of white people are living 50 feet underground, in a big hole where other people dump their excrement. (being poor means life deals you a LOT of crap) and that 48% of black people are down in this hole too. (By the way that means that the population of the hole is STILL 70% WHITE). Then you are asking that person in the hole to just IGNORE, to pay no attention to, all those people NOT living in the hole. Just look around and bask in the fact that you are lord of the hole. What a privilege THAT is.

Bring in the numbers again. You are then asking these white people who are poor to just ignore the 73 million people (60% of the US population) who are substantially better off than they are to show that "white privilege" exists. Yep, they are privileged if you ignore 60% of the country and just look at their fellow poor people. Or maybe look at all the rich white guys in Congress and corporate board rooms (like their whiteness trickles down to other white people).

I don't see how a statement can be true, if proving it requires you to ignore 60% of the data.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

With respect, this poll is too vague and leaves much open to speculation. badtoworse Dec 2013 #1
I agree MissMillie Dec 2013 #3
This message was self-deleted by its author CreekDog Dec 2013 #5
Oh please. Get over yourself CreekDog Dec 2013 #4
I thought I said that in my post badtoworse Dec 2013 #7
yes, they would CreekDog Dec 2013 #8
I'll think of you when I see that argument being made here badtoworse Dec 2013 #9
I would hfojvt Dec 2013 #63
I think you are over-analyzing this badtoworse Dec 2013 #132
but the statement is not about two people hfojvt Dec 2013 #142
You are certainly making valid points badtoworse Dec 2013 #150
I had to google Geno hfojvt Dec 2013 #163
When I saw the Jet's logo, I assumed you were a fan badtoworse Dec 2013 #164
Hellz yeah. It was easier to get out of a trailer park riqster Dec 2013 #2
Because I'm white, it's easier to pass. BlueToTheBone Dec 2013 #35
No matter how disadvantaged you were, I can guarantee before Cleita Dec 2013 #6
Nonsense. riqster Dec 2013 #42
+1 the law did not contribute to that. Bradical79 Dec 2013 #49
If you say so. However, if you are of a certain age and was in the work Cleita Dec 2013 #53
Your post said that the laws raised the bar for AA workers. riqster Dec 2013 #56
Call BS on it then. You aren't the first who refuse to believe that Cleita Dec 2013 #57
Confusing. riqster Dec 2013 #58
Don't bother to reply to this. Cleita Dec 2013 #59
Shrug. riqster Dec 2013 #61
I think her point was that pre-affirmative action, there was no reason needed Gormy Cuss Dec 2013 #71
Plausible. Thanks! riqster Dec 2013 #73
Thank you. That's what I meant. Cleita Dec 2013 #103
You are right. I have witnessed racial and gender discrimination. The people that bluestate10 Dec 2013 #96
People don't want to believe it exists because it's Cleita Dec 2013 #102
It is there and it is a scourge that any person running a company that wants the company bluestate10 Dec 2013 #107
I am a white person who grew up with precious few disadvantages... MadrasT Dec 2013 #10
I spent years attempting to explain white privilege to the mr.... me b zola Dec 2013 #11
If Barack Obama had been born white, would he have still become president? Nye Bevan Dec 2013 #12
wow, another white person (I'm white too), who thinks the exception proves the rule CreekDog Dec 2013 #13
Are you implying that he was aided by his skin color? Gormy Cuss Dec 2013 #14
Why not? Starry Messenger Dec 2013 #15
So, Nye, you praise Thatcher, say that Obama got elected because he was black... CreekDog Dec 2013 #17
+1000 JustAnotherGen Dec 2013 #51
Most certainly treestar Dec 2013 #26
Because it's so easy to become president when you're black Cali_Democrat Dec 2013 #27
What's your freeper handle? Cali_Democrat Dec 2013 #28
If Barack was white CFLDem Dec 2013 #29
agreed, it would have been Hillary n/t Bacchus4.0 Dec 2013 #36
Hypotheses are not truth. They are possibly true. Nt. riqster Dec 2013 #43
No CFLDem Dec 2013 #45
Nevertheless, all you have is an opinion based on a hypothesis. riqster Dec 2013 #46
Weak truth CFLDem Dec 2013 #47
Still, neither is a valid truth, because neither has supporting data. riqster Dec 2013 #48
Barak Obama wouldnt be Barak Obama if he was white. Bradical79 Dec 2013 #50
Barack CreekDog Dec 2013 #123
hmmm, sounds like there's some good logic in this... I wanted total opposite of Bush too uponit7771 Dec 2013 #143
I would wager, yes ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2013 #30
yes gollygee Dec 2013 #32
With his biography sans, certainly yes. bluestate10 Dec 2013 #108
The biggest factor in determining future wealth is the wealth of your parents Taitertots Dec 2013 #16
it is inequality, but it is also race CreekDog Dec 2013 #18
Do you think disadvantaged groups benefit by having a tiny cabal of them join the 0.1%? Taitertots Dec 2013 #19
why are you arguing with me? racism is still with us in institutional and other ways CreekDog Dec 2013 #20
Do you really believe this? gollygee Dec 2013 #34
Holy shit Number23 Dec 2013 #22
I love when I fall down JustAnotherGen Dec 2013 #52
Yeah, but it was SATURDAY when I typed that post! Number23 Dec 2013 #74
While true, you ignore the racial distribution of wealth Scootaloo Dec 2013 #77
White privilege definitely exists. We can't *know* what the path not taken looks like, however... lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #21
there are cultural differences between white and black that shape how we react to things? CreekDog Dec 2013 #23
Nope. That's not what was written. Here: NYC_SKP Dec 2013 #24
In a question about black and white, he refers to cultural explanation CreekDog Dec 2013 #25
So... I answered your question. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #75
There was a thought provoking article posted on the topic here about a week ago. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #37
Thanks for the link greatlaurel Dec 2013 #40
White people can never understand the racism non-whites undergo on a daily basis HipChick Dec 2013 #31
That is getting more and more obvious gollygee Dec 2013 #33
I got a lol out of this post. Glassunion Dec 2013 #38
you can take part in this poll, if you cannot, that is your own limitation CreekDog Dec 2013 #39
I'm not upset in the least. It gave me a good chuckle at the irony. That's all. Glassunion Dec 2013 #55
I didn't say you were upset CreekDog Dec 2013 #60
I could, however it would be a lie for me to answer the poll. Glassunion Dec 2013 #62
quit with the bullshit, the poll isn't limited to any racial or ethnic group CreekDog Dec 2013 #64
Oh for fuck sakes, lighten up. Glassunion Dec 2013 #65
you're disrupting this thread CreekDog Dec 2013 #66
Ok. So I read your post wrong. Glassunion Dec 2013 #67
you disrupted, you misread the post then spammed the thread with nonsense CreekDog Dec 2013 #68
I disrupted? Glassunion Dec 2013 #69
you disrupted when you misread the post claiming I only wrote it to exclude your participation CreekDog Dec 2013 #70
You need to take a breath. Really. You are reading way too much into this. Glassunion Dec 2013 #72
people posting conservative things are always giving me advice about breathing CreekDog Dec 2013 #79
Here we go pintobean Dec 2013 #82
It's your idea, you do the paperwork CreekDog Dec 2013 #83
It's your game pintobean Dec 2013 #84
No, you tried to give me orders and make me do your dirty work CreekDog Dec 2013 #86
See post #81. /nt pintobean Dec 2013 #87
No I don't see it CreekDog Dec 2013 #89
Trifecta! Glassunion Dec 2013 #85
It's been like this for years. pintobean Dec 2013 #90
His goal isn't discussion or understanding, but the opposite. Skip Intro Dec 2013 #94
I see you've made a new friend CreekDog Dec 2013 #99
for the people answering that it would be easier if black CreekDog Dec 2013 #41
I noticed that. WTF indeed. DLevine Dec 2013 #44
Fucking trolls Feral Child Dec 2013 #54
Why did you ask a question in which any of the answers are wrong? lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #76
the polls show DU to be a very progressive place...this poll shows that as well CreekDog Dec 2013 #78
For someone uninterested in answers, you ask a lot of questions. n/t lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #80
i'm uninterested in *your* answers because it was heading in an Archie Bunker direction CreekDog Dec 2013 #134
He posts polls to do research on DUers that answer them. Skip Intro Dec 2013 #81
No, I post polls to either gauge overall support of an issue CreekDog Dec 2013 #88
Then what are you talking about here: Skip Intro Dec 2013 #91
what i'm talking about is what I said CreekDog Dec 2013 #92
Why in the world would you be ashamed CreekDog? Thes "polls" do exactly what any push-poll does. bluesbassman Dec 2013 #104
it's a push poll when we ask basic questions about the existence of racism and disadvantage here CreekDog Dec 2013 #105
Oh, I'm sorry... bluesbassman Dec 2013 #109
well if you think we should be through discussing racism and disadvantage on DU CreekDog Dec 2013 #110
Thoughtful and genuine discussions about racism and disadvantage are always enlightening. bluesbassman Dec 2013 #127
actually most of the people arguing with me didn't vote in the poll CreekDog Dec 2013 #128
Well I'm sure the collective Progressive consiousness of DU has been elevated by your poll. bluesbassman Dec 2013 #129
so sorry my polls don't meet your obviously high scientific standards CreekDog Dec 2013 #130
No need to apologize, your polls are sorry enough. bluesbassman Dec 2013 #131
go talk to your friend HopeHoops CreekDog Dec 2013 #133
Post removed Post removed Dec 2013 #140
How can you consider the poll results valid.. Upton Dec 2013 #138
Since you disagree with most DUers on most issues CreekDog Dec 2013 #145
"Since you disagree with most DUers on most issues" Upton Dec 2013 #148
That wasn't a moral observation, but an empirical one CreekDog Dec 2013 #149
As already suggested.. Upton Dec 2013 #151
i don't keep a dossier and i don't keep track of the people who vote stupidly in my polls CreekDog Dec 2013 #152
" to encourage unity on that which nearly all DUers agree" pintobean Dec 2013 #153
Yes, it is. CreekDog Dec 2013 #154
AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service Capt. Obvious Dec 2013 #156
yes, they are alerting most of my posts CreekDog Dec 2013 #157
thanks for the alert! CreekDog Dec 2013 #158
LOL Capt. Obvious Dec 2013 #159
With my simplistic and limited ability pintobean Dec 2013 #160
+1 lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #165
The problem is "we" are refusing to discuss it. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #136
Why would you consider your posts a "dossier" on you? CreekDog Dec 2013 #146
As of now, I'm as uninterested in your questions as you are in my answers. n/t lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #147
you should thank me. i probably stopped you from getting banned. CreekDog Dec 2013 #161
Why don't you tell me what I think about racial subcultures? lumberjack_jeff Dec 2013 #162
The Meta threads were much better pintobean Dec 2013 #93
Oh yeah. Skip Intro Dec 2013 #95
if you feel so strongly about this, feel free to post a poll asking members here CreekDog Dec 2013 #97
I'm sorry I can't be more like you and Skip Intro CreekDog Dec 2013 #98
What does that bs have to do with pintobean Dec 2013 #100
why don't you post my "Meta disaster" so everyone can decide what they think CreekDog Dec 2013 #101
. pintobean Dec 2013 #106
afraid to let others judge whether it really is a "disaster"? CreekDog Dec 2013 #111
ROFL! n/t Skip Intro Dec 2013 #112
Wow. You are laughing pretty hard considering what you pulled in Meta last Christmas: CreekDog Dec 2013 #113
You're linking to a poster pintobean Dec 2013 #114
honestly, that you're defending this person is really a strike against them CreekDog Dec 2013 #115
Do you miss the toadies? pintobean Dec 2013 #116
This message was self-deleted by its author CreekDog Dec 2013 #117
if you don't like this place or liberal causes, nobody is forcing you to give liberals a hard time CreekDog Dec 2013 #118
No, it's about you. pintobean Dec 2013 #119
You follow me around, how could i get lonely? CreekDog Dec 2013 #120
maybe you can go support Skip Intro when he calls Trayvon Martin a racist CreekDog Dec 2013 #122
Link or you're lying. (You're lying). Skip Intro Dec 2013 #126
CreekDog lies. Skip Intro Dec 2013 #155
hey pintobean, here's what you're doing here --now everyone will understand CreekDog Dec 2013 #124
so you know that Skip did that which was described CreekDog Dec 2013 #121
enjoy the laugh, i understand you need one CreekDog Dec 2013 #125
Not That I Ever Had Much Money... ChiciB1 Dec 2013 #135
Why the fuck did I even open this Meta mess. HappyMe Dec 2013 #137
Nobody expects the inquisition rrneck Dec 2013 #139
is anybody forcing you to post here? CreekDog Dec 2013 #141
Okay. rrneck Dec 2013 #144
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