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0rganism

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112. "forever" clause aside, Marx's "opium of the people" quote deserves a second look

Thu Dec 26, 2013, 02:45 PM

Dec 2013

Especially in late 20thC America, with our "War On Drugs" mentality, it's easy for religious people to think Marx was demonizing religion. It's important to remember that at the time Marx wrote that, opium was an essential medicine and pain killer, not just the degrading junky maker it's commonly portrayed as today. i think Marx's quote is more appropriately viewed as an observation that the proletariat is generally afflicted with suffering, real pain that would lead swiftly to widespread uprisings against the capitalist ruling class were there not something in place to assuage this suffering. Marx's quote can be seen as an acknowledgement of the power of religion and its use-value to the bourgeoisie, not some blind excoriation of religion and demand for atheism.

That's my take anyway.

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Atheists, Work With Us for Peace, Pope Says on Christmas [View all] jsr Dec 2013 OP

Pretty sure it's not atheists that are the source of most world conflict... SidDithers Dec 2013 #1

Well, I'll give him one thing... Wounded Bear Dec 2013 #2

They are still a small minority. I'm sure they cause conflict pnwmom Dec 2013 #3

small but growing passiveporcupine Dec 2013 #119

Given that China and Russia were atheist forever, no one gets off. Everyone roguevalley Dec 2013 #6

Russia and China were atheist forever? MattBaggins Dec 2013 #36

State atheism SpartanDem Dec 2013 #40

and that was forever? MattBaggins Dec 2013 #46

"forever" clause aside, Marx's "opium of the people" quote deserves a second look 0rganism Dec 2013 #112

+100 demosincebirth Dec 2013 #56

Did they war in the name of atheism? Nevernose Dec 2013 #70

+ a million Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #8

do you really think the profiteers from the military industrial complex are actually "religious"? KittyWampus Dec 2013 #10

Yes , they just don't really believe in anything but $$$$$$ orpupilofnature57 Dec 2013 #51

Yes...nt SidDithers Dec 2013 #91

So when you went and read the Popes message he was strictly lecturing atheists? el_bryanto Dec 2013 #15

Name any modern "catholic wars". Matariki Dec 2013 #19

how does that change whether they are religious, like the duck dynasty piece of shits , they JI7 Dec 2013 #26

If you follow the thread you'd be able to answer your own question Matariki Dec 2013 #29

i don't view being a corporate capitalist separate from being religious JI7 Dec 2013 #31

The purpose of modern wars is more or less profit - not to kill non-believers Matariki Dec 2013 #38

+1000 CrawlingChaos Dec 2013 #53

You might put Franco in Spain in the category of a 'Catholic war' muriel_volestrangler Dec 2013 #131

What part of 'Let us all unite" do you find exclusive of Catholics? Drahthaardogs Dec 2013 #75

Fault, it sounds like . orpupilofnature57 Dec 2013 #79

Ugly post. n/t Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 #126

I find religion ugly...nt SidDithers Dec 2013 #128

Maybe so 1awake Dec 2013 #133

Many of us have been for years. Years that the church has been dealing with hiding LuckyLib Dec 2013 #4

As an Atheist, I don't need Mr.Bill Dec 2013 #5

he is making a gesture toward everyone that has been missing from his roguevalley Dec 2013 #7

His "gesture" although probably well-meaning is condescending. Mr.Bill Dec 2013 #13

Yup "even" atheists HERVEPA Dec 2013 #103

The perpetually offended will be offended. Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 #127

Same here. SammyWinstonJack Dec 2013 #22

Maybe the church should lead by example before asking for my help. Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #9

Dear pope, most atheists I know have always worked for World Peace�it is kind of our thing. Tikki Dec 2013 #11

There is nothing inherently anti-war about atheism CrawlingChaos Dec 2013 #18

+1 Matariki Dec 2013 #21

There is nothing inherently pro-war about atheists either... Tikki Dec 2013 #23

Where has Sam Harris called for a preemptive nuclear strike on the Muslim world? MNBrewer Dec 2013 #39

It's in his book "The End of Faith" CrawlingChaos Dec 2013 #41

So you lied when you said he called for a pre-emptive nuclear strike, then. MNBrewer Dec 2013 #43

Care to expound on that utterly nonsensical remark? CrawlingChaos Dec 2013 #44

Even more on Sam Harris, this time in his OWN words MNBrewer Dec 2013 #45

Yes, I've read his backpedalling drivel. Got anything substantive? CrawlingChaos Dec 2013 #48

I've always admired Hedges, but to find that he's slandering Harris is disturbing MNBrewer Dec 2013 #49

Chris Hedges was clearly exactly right cpwm17 Dec 2013 #65

Calling for something vs. positing it as a likely US response are not the same thing MNBrewer Dec 2013 #93

Sam Harris wrote it as a fantasy cpwm17 Dec 2013 #95

Baloney! There is a HUGE difference, even IF your characterization were true MNBrewer Dec 2013 #100

Sam Harris (and Hitchens, outspokenly) support for the neocon's aggressive war agenda cpwm17 Dec 2013 #114

Reading and comprehension are distinct things MNBrewer Dec 2013 #122

Actually I don't follow Harris much. MNBrewer Dec 2013 #50

most people don't know who those 2 are and they don't have much influence JI7 Dec 2013 #47

Bullshit. Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #60

"Bullshit. Atheism is peaceful." rug Dec 2013 #63

Oh right. Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #66

I must check to see how often Gandhi buttressed his callls for pacifism with "Bullshit!" rug Dec 2013 #68

Grow up. Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #72

Wise up. rug Dec 2013 #89

Atheism is inherently anti-war Major Nikon Dec 2013 #81

+1 progressoid Dec 2013 #96

No it is not hack89 Dec 2013 #106

I spent 10 years in the military with atheist on my dog tags Major Nikon Dec 2013 #109

Sam Harris is a fraud and the defenders of his pseudo intellectualism LittleBlue Dec 2013 #120

I know many conservative atheists from my time in the Navy hack89 Dec 2013 #105

Me too... Tikki Dec 2013 #113

As an atheist, he should be asking Christians to desire peace. Vinca Dec 2013 #12

Shouldn't atheists being doing those things also? former9thward Dec 2013 #14

That's not historically accurate and pretty offensive el_bryanto Dec 2013 #16

How hard? former9thward Dec 2013 #28

none atheist? el_bryanto Dec 2013 #30

atheists don't have churches and other organized groups the way others do JI7 Dec 2013 #32

He was still working that religion thing�he saw himself as the ultimate authority... Tikki Dec 2013 #33

Nazis were religious. earthside Dec 2013 #34

You are stretching back into the Middle Ages? former9thward Dec 2013 #35

Some say the catholic church in the last 100 years targeted the even more venerable.. Tikki Dec 2013 #37

Seriously? earthside Dec 2013 #69

Those compare with the tens of millions killed by Stalin and Hitler and Mao and Pol Pot? former9thward Dec 2013 #82

Still, the totality ... earthside Dec 2013 #98

I guess you don't recall Mao and Stalin, both atheist. What the last number 2-3 million demosincebirth Dec 2013 #62

north korea worships the fucking dear leader who is supposed to be some higher power type JI7 Dec 2013 #74

They are still Atheist. demosincebirth Dec 2013 #124

and they still aren't killing non atheists in the name of atheism , it's mostly their own who are JI7 Dec 2013 #125

Dictators set themselves up as gods or godlike figures. nyquil_man Dec 2013 #118

Sorry, not valid nt demosincebirth Dec 2013 #123

I'm glad to see someone's making the best of the discussion board. nyquil_man Dec 2013 #130

Do we have a big gold A on our atheist uniform? Tikki Dec 2013 #20

also there have been a few cases where help from atheists was rejected JI7 Dec 2013 #24

Me, too... Tikki Dec 2013 #27

Wow - I'm astonished at your comment. Vinca Dec 2013 #76

Christian militias have killed tens of millions? former9thward Dec 2013 #83

Did you know Adolph Hitler considered himself a Christian? Vinca Dec 2013 #97

No he did not. former9thward Dec 2013 #99

Read "Mein Kampf." Vinca Dec 2013 #101

I have. former9thward Dec 2013 #102

I don't think so. And where, exactly, did I say tens of millions? Vinca Dec 2013 #104

#36 former9thward Dec 2013 #115

You've reminded me why I stopped posting here and I'm wondering why I returned. Vinca Dec 2013 #121

Hitler certainly enlisted Christianity in his efforts Major Nikon Dec 2013 #107

Atheism was the state religion of the Soviet Union and Communist China. former9thward Dec 2013 #116

All of those regimes murdered a lot of people Major Nikon Dec 2013 #117

I would argue that Communism was the state religion of the USSR and China UtahJosh Dec 2013 #135

Congratulations! progressoid Dec 2013 #80

Another attempt to ignore history. former9thward Dec 2013 #84

maybe he was thinking of the Ayn Rand worshippers although most of them are not atheist JI7 Dec 2013 #17

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Dec 2013 #25

Or how about, we'll work for peace, inclusively ... ananda Dec 2013 #42

Imagine if we really did learn to ALL work together for the common good CrawlingChaos Dec 2013 #52

Most of us already do Warpy Dec 2013 #54

geez I can't believe how many posts on here don't appreciate the inclusiveness. liberal_at_heart Dec 2013 #55

The Pope is taking away their thunder. demosincebirth Dec 2013 #58

no shit...it really is getting bad madrchsod Dec 2013 #78

Here is what Francis has actually said about marriage equality. Inclusive? Bluenorthwest Dec 2013 #90

+1 MNBrewer Dec 2013 #110

We're way ahead of him. Hey Pope, stop sheltering child rapists. Demo_Chris Dec 2013 #57

Everyone has moved past that except, maybe, you. demosincebirth Dec 2013 #59

I'm funny that way. nt Demo_Chris Dec 2013 #61

I wasn't thinking "funny." demosincebirth Dec 2013 #64

No, you were thinking and all but saying, "Shut up about raped kids already." Demo_Chris Dec 2013 #73

Yeah. Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #67

Moved past child rape? Tien1985 Dec 2013 #77

Jesus said Bluenorthwest Dec 2013 #87

Really? Is that a subject we should just "move on" from? theHandpuppet Dec 2013 #111

There's a lot of RW war mongering self-identified Christians just like George W. Bush out there. Zorra Dec 2013 #71

Here is what Francis has actually said about marriage equality, someone explain Bluenorthwest Dec 2013 #85

As an atheist I disagree with him on every fundemental edhopper Dec 2013 #86

to "invite even nonbelievers to desire peace" might sound a bit condescending mountain grammy Dec 2013 #88

Here is what Francis has actually said about marriage equality how is it 'inclusive'? Bluenorthwest Dec 2013 #92

Be nice if you could provide a link and/or a date.. mountain grammy Dec 2013 #94

He hasn't changed. theHandpuppet Dec 2013 #108

I applaud the sentiment. Oakenshield Dec 2013 #129

Me too. I'll work (no exceptions) with any religion calling for peace. (nt) anti partisan Dec 2013 #132

In context, I don't think it was condescending muriel_volestrangler Dec 2013 #134