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hfojvt

(37,573 posts)
29. that's kinda hard to believe
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 10:51 PM
Dec 2013

my own wealth has been steadily growing.

Especially since I started working full time in October 2011. Since then, I have put $18,000 in my IRA.

In 1983, my net worth was probably only about $5,000. I was a junior in college.

The OP says "From 1998 to 2009, fully 80% of American families LOST wealth. They had to borrow to stay afloat."

Again, hard to believe. That would put me in an elite 20%. 1998 happens to be the year I sold my bookstore. I worked about three years, most of the time as a factory temp. Then got a job at a major corporation in August 2001 from which I was fired in March 2002 and was unemployed until August 2002 when I got a part-time janitor job.

This, after I bought a house in November 2001.

And the laundromat/apartments I bought in 1998 for $35,000 I sold in 2003 for about $9,000.

Ouch. Ouch. Ouch.

And still, I gained wealth over the period from 1998 to 2009. Got a full time job, finally, in May 2004, paid off my house by October 2005.

Still, in spite of a $27,000 loss in real estate, I still gained wealth over the period. The house I put $8,000 down on in 2001 was paid for by 2006. That's the $27,000 back.

It just does NOT make sense that a part-time janitor can gain wealth while 80% of the country loses it.

I think that statistic is mis-leading. That 80% who lost wealth is probably some sort of net. Meaning that within that group, 30% of households lost wealth while 50% of them gained wealth. But if you combine the two, the losses of the losing group cancel out the losses of the gaining group.

I bet the same thing is true of this

"This first fact is nearly ungraspable: In 2009 the average wealth for almost half of American families was ZERO (their debt exceeded their assets)."

Because the 2011 census of wealth showed only 18.1% of households with less than zero net worth.

However, the negative net worth of that 18.1% is more than enough to cancel out the net worth of the next two groups. The 9.1% which had positive net worth less than $5,000 and those with less than $10,000 and more than $5,000, which were 4.8%. So, it is possible that the lowest 38% of households in 2011 had a combined net worth of zero.

BUT

within that group, there is
A - 2.4% - $5,000 to $7,113
B - 2.4% - $7,113 to $9,999

and with 118.7 million households, that means
the net worth of Group A is AT LEAST $14 billion
the net worth of Group B is AT LEAST $20.3 billion

there's even group (A-) - 4.55% - $1,679 to $4,999
which has AT LEAST $9 billion in net worth

Granted $50 billion in net worth is a long way from a trillion, but it is also a long way from zero.


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Under a Democratic president. nt LWolf Dec 2013 #1
During a recession caused by Wall Street jsr Dec 2013 #3
and what repercussions have they faced? frylock Dec 2013 #18
None--they are Swilling at the trough warrant46 Dec 2013 #31
I voted for Obama because he said he would send the banksters to jail. Octafish Dec 2013 #7
+1 a whole bunch.......nt Enthusiast Jan 2014 #56
The President said, "Corporate taxes are too high." Enthusiast Jan 2014 #55
That's what Reagan and two Bushes said, too. Octafish Jan 2014 #58
Grover Norquist has little Reagan statues on an altar in his mother's basement. Enthusiast Jan 2014 #66
The good news is this is unsustainable 1000words Dec 2013 #2
NOTHING they do is sustainable G_j Dec 2013 #5
Historically, yes. That doesn't mean it will hold in the future. Octafish Dec 2013 #8
They are fearless MattBaggins Jan 2014 #47
Sociopaths don't think that way. zeemike Dec 2013 #15
They only have cornered wealth because Americans allow them to get away with it. Hopefully, RKP5637 Dec 2013 #27
Capitalism, by its nature is unsustainable. RoccoR5955 Jan 2014 #45
But in the meantime. civillawyer Jan 2014 #67
And how many of rrneck Dec 2013 #4
That's what all the police are for. Octafish Dec 2013 #9
Yep. Twenty first century Pinkertons. nt rrneck Dec 2013 #14
Portrait of a police state! n/t RKP5637 Dec 2013 #28
What so amazing is that so many here --- want to disarm the Proletariat warrant46 Dec 2013 #33
If you think that its guns that made people powerful... daleanime Jan 2014 #43
Nice try warrant46 Jan 2014 #44
And you think the second amendment has something to do with this? DireStrike Jan 2014 #46
Obviously not.... daleanime Jan 2014 #52
Yes, it's something asserted be people who are completely clueless about seizing & holding power... Lizzie Poppet Jan 2014 #68
........ daleanime Jan 2014 #69
Nah. Obama's 30,000 Drones are for the 99%. blkmusclmachine Jan 2014 #36
The plutocracy chugs on, despite who is in office Rex Dec 2013 #6
We the People now are -- officially -- on the hook for the Wall Street casino, Rex... Octafish Dec 2013 #11
As long as there are no rules to stop them, they will keep on keeping on. Rex Dec 2013 #22
Sad sigh. And a sadder K&R. Thanks Octafish... I think... riderinthestorm Dec 2013 #10
Sorry, riderinthestorm. The truth is depressing. Octafish Dec 2013 #12
some brainiac thought sticking in FATCA in the jobs bill would catch these Americans Abroad tax riverbendviewgal Jan 2014 #50
Dems will spend ALL of their political capital begging for a 3% change.... Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2013 #13
Time for New Deal 2.0 Octafish Dec 2013 #19
Don't you have anything good besides hate for Obama!? Phlem Dec 2013 #16
Really, I do think the world of the President. Octafish Dec 2013 #20
As I. Phlem Jan 2014 #34
Recommend: And a Happy New Year to You "Octafish" KoKo Dec 2013 #17
Thank you, KoKo! Here are all my JFK Conference threads... Octafish Dec 2013 #23
Thank You...Have Bookmarked! KoKo Dec 2013 #25
Excellent post, again. Thanks. Scuba Dec 2013 #21
The word 'Austerity' missing from US news coverage. Octafish Jan 2014 #51
We need long term solutions...... Cryptoad Dec 2013 #24
The New Deal created the Middle Class... Octafish Jan 2014 #57
So when does the trickle down happen again? n/t ybbor Dec 2013 #26
Silly you. MattBaggins Jan 2014 #49
Never. Octafish Jan 2014 #61
that's kinda hard to believe hfojvt Dec 2013 #29
Happy for you! Octafish Jan 2014 #62
it happens to be the only example I have detailed knowledge of hfojvt Jan 2014 #74
Thanks Octafish, for the on-going education. May you have a safe and peaceful New Year! Mnemosyne Dec 2013 #30
Happy New Year to You and Yours, Mnemosyne! Octafish Jan 2014 #63
No problem.. SoCalDem Dec 2013 #32
Remember when citizens could deduct credit card interest payments from federal taxes? Octafish Jan 2014 #64
I sure do.. there used to even be a reliable renter's tax credit too SoCalDem Jan 2014 #65
Change! The kind that rattles around in your pockets. blkmusclmachine Jan 2014 #35
And now, we get to hope to get some of it. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jan 2014 #59
du rec. xchrom Jan 2014 #37
Paul Buchheit Octafish Jan 2014 #70
President Obama ProSense Jan 2014 #38
All that is well and good, but it's Year Six and there's still no New Deal for the 21st century. Octafish Jan 2014 #71
Given that's a ProSense Jan 2014 #80
The wealthy are wondering durablend Jan 2014 #39
K&R. The shocking work of this administration on behalf of the One Percent woo me with science Jan 2014 #40
You make Obama sound like an intern at the world's largest corporate law firm. Coyotl Jan 2014 #41
"Lest we forget:" ProSense Jan 2014 #42
Yep. There it is again. lonestarnot Jan 2014 #48
Entering Year 33 of Trickle Down... Octafish Jan 2014 #76
It has taken its toll and everything else down to the last crumb. lonestarnot Jan 2014 #81
EVERYTHING POSSIBLE has been done to bolster the wealthiest of the wealthy democratisphere Jan 2014 #53
Austerity is working. Octafish Jan 2014 #75
we need to start stamping that on all the 1's and 5's! CarrieLynne Jan 2014 #54
kick. rec. save. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Jan 2014 #60
K&R - I was doing somewhat okay until I got sick... Jasana Jan 2014 #72
Thank you for sharing, Jasana. You have expressed what the vast majority of this nation now face... Octafish Jan 2014 #87
R#135 & K for, thanks for arming me with this to slap the "REDISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH" wingnuts UTUSN Jan 2014 #73
Forbes summed, heh, it up well... Octafish Jan 2014 #84
"Today our wealth gap is worse than that of the third world" snagglepuss Jan 2014 #77
Tee vee seldom, if ever, mentions that important news. Octafish Jan 2014 #85
In 1988 after first reading about the fabulous wealth in Dubai, snagglepuss Jan 2014 #78
Petromonarchs and their Toadies Live and Fly Large Octafish Jan 2014 #79
"petromonarchs" What an apt term snagglepuss Jan 2014 #88
kick woo me with science Jan 2014 #82
kick woo me with science Jan 2014 #83
The President is getting his FAST TRACK OF THE TPP! woo me with science Jan 2014 #86
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