General Discussion

beevul

(12,194 posts)

54. You're asking the wrong question.

Wed Jan 1, 2014, 12:20 AM

Jan 2014

No doubt you'll get answers that are themselves true and factual answers to your question, yet are only answers to the question you asked, rather than a clear picture of whats really going on.

With any issue, there are multiple sides. Here on DU there are certain issues that are contentious and have more than one legitimate point of view. It is issues that fall under that umbrella, which are the wellspring of the symptoms you've made mention of.

Within those issues, posters form into two main camps, and vie for control of the issue here on DU. Control of the language pertaining to that issue, control of the establishment of perceived legitimacy of points of view on those issues, and control of the message via control of the messenger via abuse of the jury system, are some but not all facets of this. The gender wars and gun rights vs gun control are demonstrable examples of this.

When the jury system went live, it handed unscrupulous people the tools with which to to wage these wars, which I believe was completely unintended by the admins.

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Why is DU in a gender war anyway? [View all] davidn3600 Dec 2013 OP

There are cliques at DU who seem to crave drama 1000words Dec 2013 #1

Totally agree. nt demosincebirth Jan 2014 #59

Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! AgingAmerican Jan 2014 #69

It got this way in the lounge once... n/t leeroysphitz Jan 2014 #134

lol... "once". yeah, once. let's go with that. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #207

Front row seat. DeadEyeDyck Dec 2013 #2

Did you bring the bourbon? Fuck the popcorn...WHERE IS THE BOURBON??? nt msanthrope Dec 2013 #6

ppppfffftttttt. wheres the stoly. loli phabay Dec 2013 #8

Overpriced. Svedka. Run it through an almost blown brita filter and put it in a Grey Goose bottle. msanthrope Dec 2013 #11

lol, just like stoly, habit i suppose. loli phabay Dec 2013 #12

Hey...you can run the Svedka, and put in in the Stoli bottles! Das Vidanya! nt msanthrope Dec 2013 #13

lol nyet tovarich.. though there is a cheap vodka from the balkans i like, cant remember the name loli phabay Dec 2013 #17

Cheap vodka from the Balkans? You didn't notice what was being put into the gas tank???? nt msanthrope Dec 2013 #18

rofl, probably, still good stuff though round a camp fire when its cold. loli phabay Dec 2013 #20

Stoli? Svedka? Fuck that shit. Give me some American distilled Titos any day! Initech Dec 2013 #37

I like Snow Queen vodka Packerowner740 Jan 2014 #70

Five Wives LadyHawkAZ Jan 2014 #76

Knob Creek, please. 1000words Dec 2013 #14

You said "knob".... huh..... sorry.... msanthrope Dec 2013 #16

LOL 1000words Dec 2013 #19

I have been blessed....a client reserved a cask in my name. nt msanthrope Dec 2013 #23

dont like the drink but the cigars i like. loli phabay Dec 2013 #21

Sorry, I'm going with the Bacardi 151. Obliterate my memory of any gender war on du!! madinmaryland Jan 2014 #57

Post removed Post removed Jan 2014 #94

Who needs butter? I've got plenty!! Initech Dec 2013 #35

Embedded trolls are taking over DU. onehandle Dec 2013 #3

bwa-hahahaha. aikoaiko Dec 2013 #9

Yep. rrneck Dec 2013 #24

Um... cherokeeprogressive Dec 2013 #39

General "Buck" Turgidson: discntnt_irny_srcsm Jan 2014 #97

... beevul Jan 2014 #48

I do think that a group of ultra right wingers are here masquerading as liberals notadmblnd Jan 2014 #52

I think they can only go so far, then their stupidity surfaces and off they go. Banished! demosincebirth Jan 2014 #60

Gun control: Like corn sweetener, it creeps into everything. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #108

For some, conflict is a drug. Vinnie From Indy Dec 2013 #4

I couldn't have said it better demosincebirth Jan 2014 #61

I am not so sure that everyone posting here wants the things you list. Curmudgeoness Dec 2013 #5

Trash and ignore are your friends nadinbrzezinski Dec 2013 #7

You are so very right customerserviceguy Dec 2013 #33

Happens all the time here. DocMac Jan 2014 #63

below DocMac Jan 2014 #64

I see what you're doing. BKH70041 Dec 2013 #10

Oh, I see how devious this is NoOneMan Dec 2013 #15

Sorry, but NO ALWAYS MEANS NO MannyGoldstein Dec 2013 #22

You don't know me ... but I love you, Manny. 1000words Jan 2014 #82

OMG wish me luck but I'm going to answer this! gollygee Dec 2013 #25

Well said. nt redqueen Dec 2013 #26

wish I could rec this post. niyad Dec 2013 #27

Gonna have to disagree with you here... one_voice Dec 2013 #29

Aren't you referring to the "Fly Trap" thread? NoOneMan Dec 2013 #30

Let's look at that thread gollygee Dec 2013 #31

Yep, the self-admitted Fly Trap thread NoOneMan Dec 2013 #36

men are just supposed to say +1, or +1,000 or knr hfojvt Jan 2014 #67

But it is posted over and over that everyone in DU IS in agreement that Squinch Jan 2014 #96

^^^ Exactly. MH1 Jan 2014 #111

It's amazing, isn't it? Squinch Jan 2014 #115

"and is seen as a trap" NoOneMan Jan 2014 #119

I believe you were the first that I saw calling it a trap. The OP has nothing in it about traps. Squinch Jan 2014 #123

Huh? I am quoting the poster of that thread: "Fly trap my friend" NoOneMan Jan 2014 #128

Um, yes. That's what I said. Squinch Jan 2014 #130

Huh?? (I'm new here. To the so-called "gender war at DU" anyway) MH1 Jan 2014 #110

"1) what was it about the o.p. of that thread that suggests..." NoOneMan Jan 2014 #118

That trumad post looks to me to be a description of what the thread degenerated into, to a large Squinch Jan 2014 #124

He called his thread a Fly Trap. NoOneMan Jan 2014 #125

After it had clearly turned into one. After the flies swarmed. Squinch Jan 2014 #126

Have you ever heard the expression " like flies sufrommich Jan 2014 #138

Again, if trumad had said, "Rick Perry is a moron" Squinch Jan 2014 #143

Sorry. I think I misread your post! Squinch Jan 2014 #155

That thread was also shortly after pintobean Jan 2014 #153

Buzz, buzz, buzz... PassingFair Jan 2014 #205

At the time you posted your (THE) first response to that thread MH1 Jan 2014 #133

Actually, when I read that "flytrap" post, I took it to mean that a reply to the OP tblue37 Jan 2014 #187

Well thank you for completely ignoring... one_voice Dec 2013 #43

"...if someone thought it was directed at the people of DU" NoOneMan Jan 2014 #49

I didn't see the part of that thread about men as rape victims BainsBane Jan 2014 #50

The problem is downstream from the "original post" Renew Deal Dec 2013 #32

+1000 RC Dec 2013 #40

Really? Point to posts where anyone said BainsBane Dec 2013 #45

This message was self-deleted by its author Renew Deal Dec 2013 #47

The Litmus Tests? alphafemale Jan 2014 #87

Brilliantly said! Katashi_itto Jan 2014 #154

I don't think "whaaa! the poor menz!" is the fault of people posting mens perspectives either. lumberjack_jeff Jan 2014 #142

+1. historylovr Jan 2014 #160

Beautiful! Amaril Jan 2014 #214

You still see those MRA-ish arguments treestar Dec 2013 #28

The outrage machine has become self aware. Initech Dec 2013 #34

oh we had better watch out lol Niceguy1 Dec 2013 #46

And better not cry! Initech Jan 2014 #51

I've seen a lot of dismissiveness and cluelessness.... bloom Dec 2013 #38

It is not a gender war. Women and especially feminists here are not at WAR with men. boston bean Dec 2013 #41

The question is why do some have such a problem with feminist points of view? BainsBane Dec 2013 #42

How quickly it's forgotten we were told to put on a burqa if we didn't want the leering, sexual boston bean Dec 2013 #44

this needs to be its own OP. and ya... more. nt seabeyond Jan 2014 #65

That's quite a comprehensive list. Good work. Ghost Dog Jan 2014 #84

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2014 #78

Show me where I have created thread after thread attacking men? BainsBane Jan 2014 #85

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2014 #88

So why is it that you don't take the threads about congress or bankers as a personal attack? BainsBane Jan 2014 #90

Post removed Post removed Jan 2014 #91

Hmmm JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #92

There is some baiting going on though. A-Schwarzenegger Jan 2014 #93

You seem to post that video at least once pintobean Jan 2014 #129

Gosh,you mean the feminists in HOF predicted sufrommich Jan 2014 #135

It deserved a much wider audience, and most DUers were very happy it was posted here. redqueen Jan 2014 #141

It does deserve a huge audience. I've now sufrommich Jan 2014 #144

Because men are intrinsically evil cthulu2016 Jan 2014 #53

LOL! Someone alerted on your post. last1standing Jan 2014 #72

You're asking the wrong question. beevul Jan 2014 #54

I dunno, seemed to be so predictable at the time as to be a near lock. I tend to find it difficult TheKentuckian Jan 2014 #156

As a male i have not once read anything from feminist that offended me or i disagreed with. Notafraidtoo Jan 2014 #55

your name fits. thank you notafraidtoo... that is a wonderful thing to hear. seabeyond Jan 2014 #62

you're my kind of guy, Notafraidtoo Skittles Jan 2014 #79

Good, and there is no reason you should BainsBane Jan 2014 #86

Let it go. trumad is taking a break from DU. nt madinmaryland Jan 2014 #56

Seem like most here on DU do not like to be contradicted and continue to argue their point right to demosincebirth Jan 2014 #58

There's a "gender war" on here because of OP's like this. Captain Stern Jan 2014 #66

No kidding. Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #71

Once threads get to a considerable length they become a real pain to follow Fumesucker Jan 2014 #237

What if "they" gave a gender war and nobody came? MrMickeysMom Jan 2014 #68

Long story short? Because it has zippitydoodah to do with rape, equal rights or feminism LadyHawkAZ Jan 2014 #73

well yeah, that too (nt) Captain Stern Jan 2014 #74

I do believe you have stated it quite well The Straight Story Jan 2014 #75

/end thread Egnever Jan 2014 #80

for me it has everything to do with the issues you mention. boston bean Jan 2014 #89

Good post. TransitJohn Jan 2014 #95

Nailed it, LadyHawk! +1000. polly7 Jan 2014 #100

Oh, there's certainly some misogynists here... LadyHawkAZ Jan 2014 #172

You could be right, I do miss a lot here and am often surprised. polly7 Jan 2014 #173

Hammer meets Nail seveneyes Jan 2014 #101

Someone alerted this 5-1 to allow it to stay..... Logical Jan 2014 #107

I expect a whine fest about this pintobean Jan 2014 #116

ffs, this is what its coming to NoOneMan Jan 2014 #120

Alerter need to be made public. Less stupid alerts. n-t Logical Jan 2014 #121

That's probably a good step. NoOneMan Jan 2014 #122

Yes. People need to own their alerts. That would put an end to these crap alerts. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #149

So true. n-t Logical Jan 2014 #151

I would love to see that. polly7 Jan 2014 #159

I just asked Skinner on the ask the admin forum. We will see. n-t Logical Jan 2014 #161

Especially in light of this sort of thing... Waiting For Everyman Jan 2014 #165

Woah I missed that hootinholler Jan 2014 #202

I know BainsBane Jan 2014 #236

Yeah, right. The ends justify the means and DU is the center of the universe. rrneck Jan 2014 #240

So you're allowed to have sockpuppets? bonzaga Jan 2014 #206

That's a surprise to me. In_The_Wind Jan 2014 #231

If you have something to say to me BainsBane Jan 2014 #235

I don't take orders from you, BainsBane. Waiting For Everyman Jan 2014 #241

I am sorry that you feel unable BainsBane Jan 2014 #242

I don't care about your call outs, your criticisms, or what you like or approve of. Waiting For Everyman Jan 2014 #243

you can't tell who wrote that alert based on writing style? snooper2 Jan 2014 #198

someone alerted on it lo fucking l arely staircase Jan 2014 #158

Wow. I thought LadyHawke's post was good and am shocked to see it alerted on... Violet_Crumble Jan 2014 #170

LOL! Being a woman on the Internet, it sure is a dog's life. LadyHawkAZ Jan 2014 #171

Some people pretend to have people on ignore pintobean Jan 2014 #176

Funny you mention that hootinholler Jan 2014 #203

I thought it was a good post. In_The_Wind Jan 2014 #232

Well said. 99Forever Jan 2014 #109

Um yes. Feminism is on my agenda and I have few scruples about pushing it. Luminous Animal Jan 2014 #183

Classy, as always. 99Forever Jan 2014 #184

I do. I have great and wonderful friends. Luminous Animal Jan 2014 #188

My life doesn't.. 99Forever Jan 2014 #192

This message was self-deleted by its author Glassunion Jan 2014 #112

Bingo. I'm glad a woman said it. /nt pintobean Jan 2014 #117

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2014 #136

welcome to DU gopiscrap Jan 2014 #139

who were you? hrmjustin Jan 2014 #140

LOL! Squinch Jan 2014 #145

Wellmposts like these will attract former members. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #146

Like the family, coming home for the holidays! Squinch Jan 2014 #147

well they will be back. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #148

yep nt arely staircase Jan 2014 #157

Exactly. If discussion was wanted Waiting For Everyman Jan 2014 #162

Some people like to divide. JNelson6563 Jan 2014 #77

Can't we just shoot all the gun nuts? DontTreadOnMe Jan 2014 #81

It's so simple.....a child can explain it......... thelordofhell Jan 2014 #83

There is no gender war on DU. seaglass Jan 2014 #98

^^^ This right here ^^^ MadrasT Jan 2014 #102

+1000 Woohoo Seaglass, knocked it out of the park! nt boston bean Jan 2014 #104

+1 redqueen Jan 2014 #127

yes Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #131

I don't think this actually explains all of it. RainDog Jan 2014 #179

Whatever happened to just putting down the toilet seat? badtoworse Jan 2014 #99

Why won't women just leave the toilet seat UP? ConcernedCanuk Jan 2014 #103

Good question! badtoworse Jan 2014 #106

Well in that case... no1uno Jan 2014 #132

I have one good, commonsense answer to that. polly7 Jan 2014 #137

Why do you hate men? And women? Orrex Jan 2014 #163

LOL! nt. polly7 Jan 2014 #174

Because that would make it more difficult to... pintobean Jan 2014 #164

errrr ....... polly7 Jan 2014 #175

Happy New Year polly pintobean Jan 2014 #178

I would be happy if MIL would just flush the fucking thing snooper2 Jan 2014 #199

THAT would be gross ConcernedCanuk Jan 2014 #204

We are equal, man and woman madokie Jan 2014 #105

There is a war!?!?! Glassunion Jan 2014 #113

Insecurity. Iggo Jan 2014 #114

There is an incivility war. JVS Jan 2014 #150

Want to stop the gender war? Try listening rather than responding defensively. Gormy Cuss Jan 2014 #152

Exactly right. Thank you! (nt) Ino Jan 2014 #169

Boom! All done here! Squinch Jan 2014 #228

Oppressed minorities often point out inequities or institutionalized/enculturated behaviors Zorra Jan 2014 #166

+1 n/t JTFrog Jan 2014 #211

Because single women overwhelming voted for Obama in 2012 and the GOP applegrove Jan 2014 #167

Being dismissive of half the members is always a good way to start. Egalitarian Thug Jan 2014 #168

I'm just watching the tennis game, back and forth, back and forth ... RKP5637 Jan 2014 #177

Uhm, there is a MRA Group on DU. Jamastiene Jan 2014 #180

I can't find the DU MRA Group pintobean Jan 2014 #181

Ooh... the're much too clever for that! lumberjack_jeff Jan 2014 #229

I never looked for the subforum. In_The_Wind Jan 2014 #234

There isn't a gender war. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #182

Terms like "male privilege" and "rape culture" is what causes divisons davidn3600 Jan 2014 #185

Sorry, but privilege enjoyed by the male gender = male privilege NuclearDem Jan 2014 #186

It is what it is.. davidn3600 Jan 2014 #190

Neither of those terms are an attack on men. Dash87 Jan 2014 #191

Pretty much. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #193

Those terms mean whatever the person using them wants them to mean Major Nikon Jan 2014 #194

You do have a point about male privilege. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #195

nice post Locrian Jan 2014 #196

Illegal discrimination has to do with civil rights Major Nikon Jan 2014 #221

Yikes, I hadn't seen those statistics on prison rape. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #222

Agreed Major Nikon Jan 2014 #223

There isn't. It's just more pointless forum drama. The type nobody cares about. Dash87 Jan 2014 #189

I notice a lack of commitment to broad-based equality and populism in general from many Romulox Jan 2014 #197

No disagreement here. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #200

In fact, transwomen are also (by certain segments)... Shandris Jan 2014 #239

You hit the nail on the head davidn3600 Jan 2014 #210

Well, there are obvious advantages rrneck Jan 2014 #219

It isn't accidental LadyHawkAZ Jan 2014 #224

+1 Well said. nt rrneck Jan 2014 #225

I really appreciate this response. Well put. nt Romulox Jan 2014 #227

This post and the one above it are the two most insightful things I've read here this week. n/t lumberjack_jeff Jan 2014 #230

Divide and (try to) Conquer tridim Jan 2014 #201

MUST PROTECT OBAMA Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #208

Yes, I will defend the best president of my lifetime on this DEMOCRATIC forum. tridim Jan 2014 #213

Here's a term you're familiar with Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #215

So you think it's funny to trash our Democratic President on Democratic Underground. tridim Jan 2014 #217

That's what this thread is all about Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #220

Because Obama didn't have any goddamn thing to do with the subject! NuclearDem Jan 2014 #218

Not every subject here has to involve Obama. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #209

He begs to differ Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #216

I know this won't cover everything, but starting an argument with "Shut up and listen" hughee99 Jan 2014 #212

Boredom BeyondGeography Jan 2014 #226

Divide and conquer. Skidmore Jan 2014 #233

All we need is Love...da dee da dee dum. nt BootinUp Jan 2014 #238