General Discussion

el_bryanto

(11,804 posts)

171. Actually you do make a strong case

Fri Jan 10, 2014, 08:02 PM

Jan 2014

It is fairly clear what some people on this board think of believers; and I think the post I was responding to shouldn't have been in GD and shouldn't have been allowed to stay, but perhaps I responded overly harshly as well.

I do think it's a fine line to say one can criticize a religion or the concept of religion without criticizing the people who make up that religion, but I grant that they look pretty different to you.

That said I am reaching a point where I think that believers/religious folk and atheists, at least at this board, really don't have anything to say to each other on the subject of religion. Our frames of reference are too far apart. We can talk about a lot of other things, but what can we meaningfully say about religion to each other?

Bryant

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Agree or Disagree - Religious DUers are "satisfied with not understanding the world." [View all] el_bryanto Jan 2014 OP

How about "Bullshit Poll" - period? badtoworse Jan 2014 #1

Why is it a bullshit poll? nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #2

Because it's the same kind of question as "Have you stopped beating your wife?" badtoworse Jan 2014 #4

No it isn't. el_bryanto Jan 2014 #6

What other one? badtoworse Jan 2014 #7

OK - than the other post was insulting as well? el_bryanto Jan 2014 #8

Dwakins quote is about the religions, you ask about the people, not about the religions. Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #12

I think that comes close to saying that el_bryanto Jan 2014 #14

No, what I am saying is that discussing what is taught by a faith not the same as Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #21

I'm just repeating a quote by Richard Dawkins el_bryanto Jan 2014 #27

But Bryant, you are not repeating his quote, his quote is about the religions, yours is about Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #37

That's your assertion; I'd comment that many look at it differently than you el_bryanto Jan 2014 #38

I'm talking about the verbiage of your post, about people on DU and the verbiage Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #41

Two seperate but interesting points el_bryanto Jan 2014 #45

You're wasting your time skepticscott Jan 2014 #160

I think it would have helped if you provided more information in your OP. badtoworse Jan 2014 #52

Did you know you are literally made up of stardust? snooper2 Jan 2014 #10

Wow, you are blowing my mind! Puzzledtraveller Jan 2014 #26

I believe Sagan's term was hfojvt Jan 2014 #50

Did you mean the "Big Bang"? badtoworse Jan 2014 #53

No LOL, our solar system is only about 4.6 Billion years old snooper2 Jan 2014 #55

There was a book published by Scientific American that described the whole Big Bang sequence badtoworse Jan 2014 #61

We know how our Sun was formed, you are correct snooper2 Jan 2014 #63

Thanks, Looks like a good read. badtoworse Jan 2014 #67

Because it assumes a point and leads the response toward that assumption. /nt demwing Jan 2014 #34

I chose "totally disagree" TroglodyteScholar Jan 2014 #3

I agree ... LisaLynne Jan 2014 #5

Other - the SOP is useless. /nt pintobean Jan 2014 #9

Ain't that the truth. Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #13

What does SOP stand for? Standard Operating Procedure? nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #15

Statement Of Purpose of General Discussion excludes both religion and complaints about Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #16

Ah yes; well I agree that this should be off topic el_bryanto Jan 2014 #19

I'm all for getting religious subjects out of a political forum, including the other one Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #39

Agree, though at least sarisataka Jan 2014 #40

There are many non-religious people "satisfied with not understanding the world." hack89 Jan 2014 #11

Well said!! Puzzledtraveller Jan 2014 #22

And it's a shitty thing for a Du'er to say about another DU'er Marrah_G Jan 2014 #17

This sort of thing get the red out Jan 2014 #18

If you are going to say it about religious folk in general el_bryanto Jan 2014 #23

No, all religious people are not of the same mind get the red out Jan 2014 #28

So you disagree with the Dawkins quote? you think it goes too far? nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #30

Sounds like it get the red out Jan 2014 #32

are there really more than six "religious DUers"? hfojvt Jan 2014 #20

Now that would be a good subject for another poll. As long as the doors are open el_bryanto Jan 2014 #25

Depends on the definition of "religious" get the red out Jan 2014 #29

Please tell me that is a joke. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #42

a joke? hfojvt Jan 2014 #43

This message was self-deleted by its author hrmjustin Jan 2014 #44

Thank you for responding. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #46

See you haven't figured out the difference whistler162 Jan 2014 #24

No, not at all. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #31

ANYONE who thinks the world can be so simplistically divided between the smart atheist and Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #33

Well stated loyalsister Jan 2014 #147

Silly straw man skepticscott Jan 2014 #187

that is the implication of what is being implied when someone suggest "- Religious DUers are Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #189

In the first place, no one suggested that skepticscott Jan 2014 #190

19 people so far have voted that they completely agree with that statement and several Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #191

I think many individuals are satisfied with not understanding the world. Xyzse Jan 2014 #35

"Einstein diasassociated himself from the label 'atheist'......." Nye Bevan Jan 2014 #36

agnostic though, is NOT an alternative to atheist hfojvt Jan 2014 #47

"Agnosticism, in fact, is not a creed, but a method," Nye Bevan Jan 2014 #51

Why? Certainly they are admitting hfojvt Jan 2014 #54

"I don't know" is very different from "I don't care" (nt) Nye Bevan Jan 2014 #62

but if a person cared then hfojvt Jan 2014 #64

I agree with a) LostOne4Ever Jan 2014 #179

Deeply flawed definition skepticscott Jan 2014 #188

I am an atheist, hard core one. "I KNOW there is no god" doesn't describe me or atheistm. idwiyo Jan 2014 #134

Atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #122

In other words LostOne4Ever Jan 2014 #181

not a religious person myself, but i'm certain i'm going to die before "understanding the world" 0rganism Jan 2014 #48

I am a religious DU'er. hamsterjill Jan 2014 #49

I think we can all agree that this is a bullshit poll, but that other post is fine. ieoeja Jan 2014 #56

That is a fine line isn't it? el_bryanto Jan 2014 #58

Yes, if your definition of "fine line" includes the width of the Mississippi River at St Louis. n/t ieoeja Jan 2014 #59

So "Atheists are assholes" is not the same as "Atheism teaches people to be assholes?" nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #60

Yes. Those are two clearly different statements. n/t ieoeja Jan 2014 #66

No, it's not, for several reasons. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #80

The latter LostOne4Ever Jan 2014 #184

Winner! cleanhippie Jan 2014 #78

Well, that saved me some typing. Thanks. n/t LadyHawkAZ Jan 2014 #96

No, I don't agree CrawlingChaos Jan 2014 #135

Thank you. nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #136

This poll is petulant cthulu2016 Jan 2014 #57

"I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world." el_bryanto Jan 2014 #68

Is there something wrong with that quote, its true isn't it? Humanist_Activist Jan 2014 #70

It appears your personal definition definition deviates from both the classical and the contemporary LanternWaste Jan 2014 #69

I don't check my brain at the door when I go to church, nor do I feel like my religion is against hrmjustin Jan 2014 #65

You've stated that you believe a man was literally resurrected from the dead. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #71

My crtical thinking is just fine. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #73

Even when you think a person literally rose from the dead? cleanhippie Jan 2014 #74

How does what work? hrmjustin Jan 2014 #75

Using critical thought and thinking a person literally rose from the dead? cleanhippie Jan 2014 #76

It works just fine. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #77

Yet you are unable, or unwilling, to show just how that works. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #79

How do you want it explained? hrmjustin Jan 2014 #81

Just use your own words. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #83

God did it. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #85

Right. That's not critical thought. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #88

That is a matter of faith and a mystery of faith. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #90

I agree. It's not critical thought, it's faith. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #97

Then kindly demonstrate just how well, won't you? cleanhippie Jan 2014 #82

My silence? hrmjustin Jan 2014 #84

Apparently you are satisfied with not understanding the post you reference. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #72

DU Atheists are such cowards when it comes to this sort of thing, I've noticed. nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #86

Have you really? cleanhippie Jan 2014 #89

"Your religion teaches you to be satisfied with not understanding the world." el_bryanto Jan 2014 #92

I have no idea whether you are satisfied with not understanding the world. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #94

What? No distinction between spiritual and religious? Egalitarian Thug Jan 2014 #87

The quote was about religion, not spirituality. nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #93

But your poll is about people, not religion. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #95

People make up a religion el_bryanto Jan 2014 #98

It's apparent that you understand very little. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #99

I think I understand pretty well el_bryanto Jan 2014 #100

If you say so... cleanhippie Jan 2014 #104

Way to go keeping it about issues, not people. rug Jan 2014 #106

Just following your lead. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #107

That must be why you chastised him. rug Jan 2014 #109

That must be why. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #110

OK - thank you for responding to what I said el_bryanto Jan 2014 #113

Anything to make you feel better about yourself. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #143

Glad to see that those who scream the loudest and insist on demeaning others liberal_at_heart Jan 2014 #91

I love that this bigoted thread only has one rec. n/t Skip Intro Jan 2014 #101

How is this thread bigoted? nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #102

That you don't understand why is the problem. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #108

Let's turn to the dictionary el_bryanto Jan 2014 #115

It's backwards jberryhill Jan 2014 #103

Stupidest. Flamebait. Poll. Ever. 99Forever Jan 2014 #105

Thanks for your contribution el_bryanto Jan 2014 #114

You're welcome. 99Forever Jan 2014 #116

Yep - because attacking religion at DU is just fine and dandy el_bryanto Jan 2014 #117

Exactly. 99Forever Jan 2014 #119

Thanks for clearing that up. el_bryanto Jan 2014 #120

I do what I can. 99Forever Jan 2014 #124

What do you think of us that defend our religions? hrmjustin Jan 2014 #121

Ya mean ... 99Forever Jan 2014 #123

What is your opinion of progressive people of faith? hrmjustin Jan 2014 #125

Nunya. 99Forever Jan 2014 #127

I am not familiar with that response. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #129

Magic isn't real. 99Forever Jan 2014 #130

You don't have to believe it. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #131

I don't. 99Forever Jan 2014 #132

Thank you for you responses and time. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #133

+1 mahina Jan 2014 #154

The only way for me to know for sure about this is to read everyone's palms. Zorra Jan 2014 #111

I thought it was a good poll. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #112

Religious DUERs seem to be a grounded group of people. nt bluestate10 Jan 2014 #118

I'm sure glad some of my fellow DUer's who are atheist fully understand the world. CAG Jan 2014 #126

you can be religious and understand the world Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #128

Oh good! More division! JNelson6563 Jan 2014 #137

I'd say most religious people want to understand the world... MellowDem Jan 2014 #138

So most religious folk are intellectually dishonest? or did I misread? nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #139

Yes, by definition... MellowDem Jan 2014 #141

That's just bullshit; people don't mind being called intellectually dishonest? el_bryanto Jan 2014 #142

It's possible they know it and don't care... MellowDem Jan 2014 #146

Can people literally be resurrected from the dead? cleanhippie Jan 2014 #148

Explain your reasoning to me? el_bryanto Jan 2014 #149

One that believes that the laws of physics and the natural laws if the universe can be magically cleanhippie Jan 2014 #150

The kind of intellectual dishonesty explained above el_bryanto Jan 2014 #152

Thank you for your response. I'll stand by my post above. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #155

It does seem that to a number of DU Atheists to be a believer is to be intellectually dishonest el_bryanto Jan 2014 #156

I've noticed you using "DU Atheists" quite a lot. cleanhippie Jan 2014 #157

I think it's because of the way they act el_bryanto Jan 2014 #158

Why are you making shit up? skepticscott Jan 2014 #161

I'm pretty sure I won't be able to to your satisfaction either. el_bryanto Jan 2014 #163

No need to "pretend" that you've missed the point skepticscott Jan 2014 #169

Actually you do make a strong case el_bryanto Jan 2014 #171

The fact that you seem to spend skepticscott Jan 2014 #175

I'm sorry el_bryanto Jan 2014 #177

I don't assume that nothing has been accomplished skepticscott Jan 2014 #183

OK - well i can't exactly wish you good luck, but I hope you find it satisfying. nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #185

I agree with El Bryanto kwassa Jan 2014 #182

His alert failed 0 - 6. rug Jan 2014 #164

Thanks for the heads up. nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #165

I don't know where to vote, I am agnostic. Rex Jan 2014 #140

Equivocation. Orsino Jan 2014 #144

Atheists want to pretend there's a huge difference between the two el_bryanto Jan 2014 #145

MORON FreakinDJ Jan 2014 #151

I am not interested in making general assertions abou DUers to pick a fight. mahina Jan 2014 #153

Why do the religionists in DU skepticscott Jan 2014 #159

This is in response to another thread el_bryanto Jan 2014 #162

I've noticed you using "religionists in DU" quite a lot. rug Jan 2014 #166

He likes that term. I hate it. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #168

I'm an atheist and I love not knowin' stuff! leeroysphitz Jan 2014 #167

Religious people don't want their beliefs challenged, even if those beliefs are shown to be false. Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #170

DO you believe that GD is the place to challenge those beliefs? nt el_bryanto Jan 2014 #172

No. Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #173

I generally agree; but was responding to a post in GD el_bryanto Jan 2014 #174

I would say that is true with a good number but not all. hrmjustin Jan 2014 #180

I think religious and non-religious would both say... shenmue Jan 2014 #176

I am catholic and a liberal... So there LukeFL Jan 2014 #178

I was going to vote "Totally Disagree," ZombieHorde Jan 2014 #186