General Discussion

U4ikLefty

(4,012 posts)

19. pretty disturbing to see on DU

Reply to uppityperson (Reply #14)

Sat Jan 11, 2014, 05:20 PM

Jan 2014

sick and waaaay too common

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

336 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Family of dead, pregnant woman is suing Texas for using her body as an incubator. [View all] pnwmom Jan 2014 OP

I am disgusted at the hospital's action. CaliforniaPeggy Jan 2014 #1

I thought it was state law alarimer Jan 2014 #20

A number of prominent ethicists say that they are misinterpreting the state law. pnwmom Jan 2014 #116

Just what I was thinking MattBaggins Jan 2014 #238

Interesting point. eom Maraya1969 Jan 2014 #277

How in the heck is a fetus growing normally in her? Maraya1969 Jan 2014 #278

It's not, but the *idea* of a baby is the important thing. We're not dealing with sane people here - nomorenomore08 Jan 2014 #305

Incubator is right. So sad to hear this is how we treat women in this day and age. bettyellen Jan 2014 #2

The family needs to get ready for the Death Threats that will come from the Pro-LIfers. n/t freshwest Jan 2014 #3

They've already had them. I think DevonRex Jan 2014 #5

Okay, so they have gotten the death threats already... This is sick. I'm wondering how the child freshwest Jan 2014 #13

I hope it isn't born. The effects DevonRex Jan 2014 #18

Nobody knows if fetus has sustained any damage until tests are run on it. LisaL Jan 2014 #29

The fetus went through everything the mother went through. DevonRex Jan 2014 #38

So why did other brain dead women manage to produce normally developing children? LisaL Jan 2014 #43

Perhaps they died of head trauma & babies were 8 mos DevonRex Jan 2014 #56

No. LisaL Jan 2014 #77

Links. DevonRex Jan 2014 #80

Here is what appears to be a most recent case. LisaL Jan 2014 #90

There's no indication that woman suffered a lack of oxygen that Marlise had riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #107

More than 3, despite what the article said. LisaL Jan 2014 #108

You use and article as proof yet say the article is wrong. And that is ethical? uppityperson Jan 2014 #117

Story about brain dead pregnant woman is quoted from associated press. LisaL Jan 2014 #144

The article says 3, you claim it is credible, yet is wrong "More than 3, despite what the article... uppityperson Jan 2014 #149

Again, this article just quotes associated press on a brain dead pregnant woman. LisaL Jan 2014 #159

"More than 3, despite what the article said." So, is the article credible or wrong? uppityperson Jan 2014 #161

The stroke cut her oxygen off, but not for an HOUR. The amount of time pnwmom Jan 2014 #132

There is a critical difference that you're ignoring. This woman didn't stop breathing for an hour pnwmom Jan 2014 #130

It's the first time I posted this link. LisaL Jan 2014 #147

There's a big difference that cannot be ignored. Boudica the Lyoness Jan 2014 #227

She was kept on life support much longer than two days after she was declared brain dead. LisaL Jan 2014 #228

The Texas woman was found dead. Boudica the Lyoness Jan 2014 #234

She wasn't found dead. LisaL Jan 2014 #235

Lisal I don't understand what you're saying. Are you arguing that it's okay to ignore the OregonBlue Jan 2014 #293

Well, she's refused to answer us others when we've asked those questions, KitSileya Jan 2014 #297

I always thought they were male, from what they write and support. uppityperson Jan 2014 #301

That was my bad assumption - KitSileya Jan 2014 #303

Yup. They are careful to never answer a direct question but indeed, do advocate non-self determinati uppityperson Jan 2014 #307

Not impressed? I am disgusted. KitSileya Jan 2014 #309

Since I don't know you, I frankly couldn't care less how you feel about me. LisaL Jan 2014 #316

I am pro-choice. LisaL Jan 2014 #315

Why won't you answer the question. Are you okay with the State using this woman as an incubator? OregonBlue Jan 2014 #333

Most of those other rare cases were in a vegetative state, not brain dead. pnwmom Jan 2014 #123

Women ARE NOT just an INCUBATOR. alphafemale Jan 2014 #138

Thank you! drmeow Jan 2014 #236

However ann--- Jan 2014 #103

Fetus is alive. LisaL Jan 2014 #106

Suppose fetus is born quasi-"normal" but requires constant care for rest of its life. MH1 Jan 2014 #115

Are you for real? LisaL Jan 2014 #163

Did you vote for those who put this law in place? uppityperson Jan 2014 #166

Seriously? What do you think? LisaL Jan 2014 #224

No, all we know is that the fetus has a heartbeat, like the mother. The mother has a heartbeat pnwmom Jan 2014 #133

Having a heartbeat isn't equivalent to being alive. You don't speak for the hospital. pnwmom Jan 2014 #148

If the fetus wasn't alive the hospital wouldn't have to keep the mother's body on life support. LisaL Jan 2014 #158

1. A fetus is not a person. 2. they have no clue if the fetus' brain works. nt DevonRex Jan 2014 #175

"Alive" does not mean able to ann--- Jan 2014 #312

Any cases where the mother's skin was already starting to feel "rubbery" six weeks before pnwmom Jan 2014 #119

I have no clue how, but it has happened in a number of cases. LisaL Jan 2014 #165

Link to a baby being delivered from a decaying corpse? And not the one you say is credible but wrong uppityperson Jan 2014 #167

What in the world are you talking about? LisaL Jan 2014 #183

"I have no clue how, but it has happened in a number of cases." uppityperson Jan 2014 #185

Brain dead woman on life support are not "decaying corpses." LisaL Jan 2014 #190

No, I did not make that claim. Another swing and a miss. I quoted you so you did say that. Whoosh! uppityperson Jan 2014 #192

Have you ever cared for a brain dead individual on a ventillator? I have. w8liftinglady Jan 2014 #329

"death threats�from Pro-Lifers" volstork Jan 2014 #65

This, and another case like it, made news this week. dixiegrrrrl Jan 2014 #4

And who, if a baby were somehow produced with massive damage, would pay for its care? n/t pnwmom Jan 2014 #134

I know this is a weird question and I ask it cause I'm not always the smartest person in the world Arcanetrance Jan 2014 #6

The fetus must still be developing, that's easy to check. But they won't know TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #8

They're judging by heartbeat, last I heard. But the heart can be beating and the brain dead. There freshwest Jan 2014 #12

It's horrific. It should be up to the family. The state should not have the power TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #15

I agree... But the state regards the fetus as a Person with all due rights until born. If the GOP freshwest Jan 2014 #17

"She" is not a person shaayecanaan Jan 2014 #63

No, she is a person. There's no such thing as a "viable corpse". TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #94

She is dead, TwlightGardener. Brain-dead is still dead. Her heart is only beating pnwmom Jan 2014 #140

I do draw a distinction between brain death and actual death (heart stops, all cells die). TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #146

Her father says her skin is already feeling rubbery. Isn't that dead enough for you? pnwmom Jan 2014 #150

The ventilator doesn't make a heart beat. It forces oxygen into the lungs, but the heart TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #157

Poor Tissue Perfusion. Sounds like a reasonable Ilsa Jan 2014 #193

Medically that is incorrect MattBaggins Jan 2014 #279

She's ventilator-dependent because she has no respiratory drive. TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #281

I would disagree on the term of corpse. MattBaggins Jan 2014 #286

OK. That's your call. TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #287

I agree, calling them corpses or remains is not needed. They are a body, but still a person deservin uppityperson Jan 2014 #151

You see dead people? shaayecanaan Jan 2014 #176

Yes, I have worked with a lot of people who have died, who were dying. Some on mechanical support uppityperson Jan 2014 #178

Some would say the same for fetuses... shaayecanaan Jan 2014 #182

Congratulations for not giving me the "what about evil people" line but instead going for fetuses uppityperson Jan 2014 #187

I remember when Kennedy died the media refered to him as a corpse and that Auntie Bush Jan 2014 #217

Then life begins at conception shaayecanaan Jan 2014 #171

OK. TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #174

in terms of rights, the DNR should be respected, PERIOD. bettyellen Jan 2014 #120

What if they needed to preserve the corpse... shaayecanaan Jan 2014 #172

what if your question had ANYTHING to do with this situation? bettyellen Jan 2014 #181

You can frame it in terms of the husband's right. He has the legal right to control pnwmom Jan 2014 #139

Not really... shaayecanaan Jan 2014 #179

It is a legal right with the exception of when an autopsy must be performed. pnwmom Jan 2014 #188

It isn't. The earliest possible date at which this fetus would be termed viable is at 24 weeks. pnwmom Jan 2014 #113

Yikes, I assumed she was much further along. I guess the state's plan is to wait TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #118

fetal viability the ability of a fetus to survive outside the uterus with artificial aid. Not devel uppityperson Jan 2014 #125

Yes, I know that. I was imprecise in my language--corrected it. TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #128

No worries, it shows that legal and medical terms and how we use them in daily life all can uppityperson Jan 2014 #129

They plan to test her in February at 22 or 24 weeks and then decide what to do. pnwmom Jan 2014 #143

The record time for a brain dead pregnant woman being on life support is 107 days. LisaL Jan 2014 #164

Machines are not keeping her heart beating. They are keeping her lungs breathing, and since the kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #194

If her brain stem is dead, then her heart isn't beating either -- not on its own. pnwmom Jan 2014 #195

False false false false false. kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #202

The heart does not beat independently of the brain STEM. The brain STEM controls automatic pnwmom Jan 2014 #203

Yes, it will beat independently. Briefly. If you stop the vent, O2 levels will drop and the heart uppityperson Jan 2014 #206

"Briefly" is the key word. As in minutes. The heart could not continue pnwmom Jan 2014 #210

Yup, briefly, until the oxygen level drops and the heart nerves die. The brain stem does control uppityperson Jan 2014 #213

Okay, that makes sense. pnwmom Jan 2014 #214

False again. The heartbeats are generated entirely by the sinoatrial node. kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #207

The fact that the heart can be made to beat while on mechanical breathing support pnwmom Jan 2014 #209

I know that. Jesus. I am NOT arguing that a brain dead person is alive. kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #212

I was using the term "make" loosely. But the fact remains that a functioning brain stem pnwmom Jan 2014 #215

Yes it does beat independently MattBaggins Jan 2014 #282

But you're not saying the heart can beat without either a brain stem pnwmom Jan 2014 #283

Yes it will beat until the oxygen and energy stores MattBaggins Jan 2014 #285

But that time is measured in minutes, not hours -- and certainly not months. pnwmom Jan 2014 #292

The vent oxygenates the blood. It doesn't make the heart beat. But once the vent is stopped, the uppityperson Jan 2014 #204

Thank you. Correct. When oxygen levels drop too far, the cells in the sinoatrial node kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #208

It can be confusing because while it may not make the heart beat, stopping it then causes the heart uppityperson Jan 2014 #211

Doctors can provide whatever hormones the body needs. LisaL Jan 2014 #223

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha. OK, now I understand, you are just joking around! And we took you uppityperson Jan 2014 #232

WTF is so funny? LisaL Jan 2014 #239

You are. Is it ethical to do this against the wishes of the woman and the family? uppityperson Jan 2014 #243

The woman's body lasted six weeks already. LisaL Jan 2014 #248

No the lungs are keeping the heart going MattBaggins Jan 2014 #280

The fetus is not viable enlightenment Jan 2014 #121

No, I'm going to correct that, I used the wrong word. TwilightGardener Jan 2014 #124

Thanks. enlightenment Jan 2014 #127

only her brain is dead hfojvt Jan 2014 #10

I thought this was sarcasm until I read your other post. Good grief. uppityperson Jan 2014 #14

pretty disturbing to see on DU U4ikLefty Jan 2014 #19

It is "awesome" to have a state over ride the parent's wishes. As for the rest, what the fuck uppityperson Jan 2014 #24

It's not clear at this point if the fetus will ever be viable. LisaL Jan 2014 #25

wow, such ignorance and disrespect toward women's autonomy is sad to see at DU bettyellen Jan 2014 #40

This woman had a living will and health directive about this riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #49

No she didn't. LisaL Jan 2014 #59

These articles indicate otherwise. If someone does, the state can ignore it. Is that ethical? uppityperson Jan 2014 #66

I am going by what her family members said. LisaL Jan 2014 #70

Is. It. Ethical. To. Ignore. Family. Wishes? uppityperson Jan 2014 #75

Give me a fucking credible link that says DevonRex Jan 2014 #84

She was an EMT as is her husband ann--- Jan 2014 #109

Her brother died last year, prompting them to talk more about it. uppityperson Jan 2014 #111

Here's another link that says she had a living will. riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #96

Read the actual freaking story in New York Times. LisaL Jan 2014 #156

It doesn't mention it at all so that means she didn't have one? riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #177

Does New York Times article say the woman had a living will? LisaL Jan 2014 #186

No, the body is a corpse. It isn't being kept artificially alive. It has only been given pnwmom Jan 2014 #145

The difference between coma, vegetative state and brain death is "some brain activity." LisaL Jan 2014 #220

No, I don't. The father has reported that her skin feels like that of a mannequin, pnwmom Jan 2014 #222

Have a gander at this... Boudica the Lyoness Jan 2014 #233

I read it already. LisaL Jan 2014 #237

And you have no idea how revolting this is do you? Boudica the Lyoness Jan 2014 #247

I never said I think all dead bodies should be kept in best shape possible. LisaL Jan 2014 #259

It's my understanding that the fetus is too young to test Beaverhausen Jan 2014 #16

The hospital can test the fetus in about 2 weeks. LisaL Jan 2014 #23

Do you feel that makes it OK to violate her body and wishes MattBaggins Jan 2014 #284

There is almost no chance that a fetus that was oxygen deprived at 14 weeks for an hour pnwmom Jan 2014 #135

How much are you willing to bet on it? LisaL Jan 2014 #160

The father is willing to let it die if it is still alive. uppityperson Jan 2014 #162

Ever heard of CEREBRAL PALSY? Lack of oxygen DevonRex Jan 2014 #170

It is not up to me to bet. Only the family should be able to make this decision. pnwmom Jan 2014 #191

How is it an experiment since it has been done before? LisaL Jan 2014 #226

Of course it�s an experiment. The fact that it isn�t entirely without precedent pnwmom Jan 2014 #229

Certainly different? LisaL Jan 2014 #231

The medical team of the Texas woman said that they thought it was an hour OR MORE. pnwmom Jan 2014 #244

As far as I know medical team said nothing. They aren't allowed to talk because of privacy laws. LisaL Jan 2014 #246

But the father and his in-laws aren't bound by privacy laws, pnwmom Jan 2014 #252

The family seem like nice sincere people. LisaL Jan 2014 #254

The medical team is talking to the husband, and he is telling the press what they said. pnwmom Jan 2014 #258

Here is the father saying "they" (I presume the medical team) doesn't know how long the LisaL Jan 2014 #261

They don't know exactly how long she was without oxygen. But the hospital told the family pnwmom Jan 2014 #263

I see these statements as inconsistent. LisaL Jan 2014 #295

Same way as the woman, artificially. uppityperson Jan 2014 #311

If she is brain dead, then she isn't considered alive. LisaL Jan 2014 #314

Backing up, how do they know the fetus is "alive"? And you still miss the BIG issue uppityperson Jan 2014 #317

They could have but they haven't, for reasons of their own. pnwmom Jan 2014 #321

They're not inconsistent. The husband says they didn't know, and it was true pnwmom Jan 2014 #320

You would want to know MattBaggins Jan 2014 #288

If that was so, one would think she would have been unplugged already. LisaL Jan 2014 #294

You seem to deny the basis of this story in every post you make - KitSileya Jan 2014 #298

THAT is the problem. Even if she did, they would not allow it. Her family wants to stop the machines uppityperson Jan 2014 #310

I am kinda surprised at the husband and the parents hfojvt Jan 2014 #7

Who are you to ask that type of question? Humanist_Activist Jan 2014 #11

It's unethical to keep body alive with no hope of recovery even when this body is pregnant? LisaL Jan 2014 #22

It's unethical to do this against the family's wishes. Is it that difficult of a concept to understa uppityperson Jan 2014 #26

Is it unethical to turn the ventillator off if the family insisted it should be on? LisaL Jan 2014 #27

It depends on if the person is totally dead or only part way dead. I am not comfortable turning uppityperson Jan 2014 #28

Brain death is considered totally dead. LisaL Jan 2014 #30

"totally dead" is not a legal concept, hence can have different meanings. IMO, family wishes uppityperson Jan 2014 #31

Those seem to be your own definitions. LisaL Jan 2014 #36

Yes, those are my definitions, obviously. You still didn't answer what's your opinion, ethically? uppityperson Jan 2014 #39

Did you miss this? Waiting for you to answer about ethics, your opinion and maybe you missed it uppityperson Jan 2014 #68

Good luck on getting any answers from that corner. nt KitSileya Jan 2014 #72

No that is not unethical MattBaggins Jan 2014 #289

I have been a nurse to a few of those patients. w8liftinglady Jan 2014 #328

^^^ This^^^ I wish LisaL would respond to this. Thanks for weighing in w8liftinglady nt riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #334

Withdrawing this post! I addressed it to the wrong person, am so embarrassed. n/t Judi Lynn Jan 2014 #33

Did you reply to the right person as I fully support the family? It is unethical to keep uppityperson Jan 2014 #34

Oh, jeez. I misfired! Very, VERY sorry about that! Judi Lynn Jan 2014 #52

No problem, they are something. that makes sense, about their anti-abortion stance. uppityperson Jan 2014 #57

She had a DNR and a living will that is being willfully disregarded simply because she was pregnant. KitSileya Jan 2014 #42

No. She didn't have anything in writing. LisaL Jan 2014 #48

A living will is not a regular will, but advance directives. Educate yourself here.. uppityperson Jan 2014 #54

Did you miss the part about "written instructions?" LisaL Jan 2014 #60

According to some news reports, she did. Are you ok with ignoring family wishes, IF it was written? uppityperson Jan 2014 #71

If so, I am mistaken, but it wouldn't have mattered. KitSileya Jan 2014 #58

That's correct. LisaL Jan 2014 #61

You still haven't answered my question. KitSileya Jan 2014 #62

Is that ethical, in your opinion? To ignore that if in writing? uppityperson Jan 2014 #78

SHE HAD A LIVING WILL. HOSPITAL HAS DNR. nt DevonRex Jan 2014 #73

Please post a credible link to this claim. LisaL Jan 2014 #79

Here are 2 links. uppityperson Jan 2014 #81

Don't you think her husband knows if she had a written will? LisaL Jan 2014 #86

Since news media says she did, why do you keep saying she didn't? Credible link for your statement? uppityperson Jan 2014 #88

I am going by what her family members said. LisaL Jan 2014 #97

No, you are going by what NYDaily News reports, I am going by what NY Times reports. uppityperson Jan 2014 #99

New York Times report does not say anything about her having a living will. LisaL Jan 2014 #153

Is it ethical to force life support on someone who has said, whose family says, no? uppityperson Jan 2014 #155

Is it ethical to turn off life support if family wants it on? LisaL Jan 2014 #249

Do you ever directly answer a question? uppityperson Jan 2014 #250

It doesn't seem like it. KitSileya Jan 2014 #260

Look upthread. Others already did. DevonRex Jan 2014 #82

Her own husband's word is that they discussed it but never got around to it. LisaL Jan 2014 #83

credible link to that. I gave you links showing otherwise. uppityperson Jan 2014 #85

I already posted a directo quote from the husband that they never got around to it. LisaL Jan 2014 #87

If you did, you should have no problem posting it now. Link? uppityperson Jan 2014 #89

I alredy posted it. LisaL Jan 2014 #93

Excuse me for not keeping up with your edits. Is. It. Ethical? uppityperson Jan 2014 #98

This message was self-deleted by its author DevonRex Jan 2014 #95

Is there anything which kept you from noting the family itself is suing to take her off Judi Lynn Jan 2014 #55

I meant medically unethical, generally... Humanist_Activist Jan 2014 #110

It's a fetus, not a child. Even at this point it likely lacks... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #35

What are you talking about? LisaL Jan 2014 #37

She was 14 weeks pregnant when she died. NT KitSileya Jan 2014 #45

She is now at 20 weeks gestation. LisaL Jan 2014 #46

So, her wishes don't matter, huh? KitSileya Jan 2014 #51

Per our laws, family wishes aren't considered in cases of brain dead persons. LisaL Jan 2014 #64

What about living wills? KitSileya Jan 2014 #69

You sound like a pretty big fan of such laws. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #242

Judging by McMath threads, most on here don't have a problem with turning life support off LisaL Jan 2014 #251

I'm not talking about anyone else but you. You a pretty big fan of laws... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #253

My poll says otherwise. You have never answered, will you? I doubt it. Want to vote? uppityperson Jan 2014 #255

You should be a bit clearer with the choices in that poll MattBaggins Jan 2014 #291

It is not "life support" MattBaggins Jan 2014 #290

Cases as in a couple out of millions of births. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #126

I'm not surprised that the hospital's lead attorney is a well known right-to-lifer. n/t Gormy Cuss Jan 2014 #74

Being without oxygen for over an hour ann--- Jan 2014 #104

HIgh probability that the fetus is damaged and will suffer. MH1 Jan 2014 #122

They are trying to respect the well-known and strong wishes of the mother AND pnwmom Jan 2014 #142

If the baby is born severely disabled, who pays? Is ecstatic Jan 2014 #184

Of course the poor father will be stuck with a disabled child -- you don't Nay Jan 2014 #331

I don't think their willingness to accept fate or God's will (whatever you call it) kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #196

That law needs to be done away with LittleBlue Jan 2014 #9

Gruesome, ghoulish, it's a nightmare. What a ghastly beginning for a fetus. Judi Lynn Jan 2014 #21

The Fundies see all women as incubators. nt SunSeeker Jan 2014 #32

And they'd prefer that we all be brain dead from the get go. kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #197

Of course. That's why they want us uneducated. nt SunSeeker Jan 2014 #201

Who is going to foot the hospital costs assciated with doing this benld74 Jan 2014 #41

That's a good question. LisaL Jan 2014 #44

Because she's dead, I anticipate her insurance company declining to pay squat after her date of deat kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #198

We don't even know if she was actually diagnosed as brain dead. LisaL Jan 2014 #221

The hospital is defying her living will and DNR. DevonRex Jan 2014 #76

In 12 states, including Texas, a living will is set aside by law if the patient is pregnant. KitSileya Jan 2014 #92

I am aghast at Colorado law. DevonRex Jan 2014 #101

It is such a horrific prospect. KitSileya Jan 2014 #114

If there was justice? The religious wackos would pay. alphafemale Jan 2014 #274

Terri Schiavo, Part III blkmusclmachine Jan 2014 #47

Schiavo was not brain dead. LisaL Jan 2014 #50

No,not at all. The parents and husband are in complete agreement. pnwmom Jan 2014 #152

Correct - thought she did pull off a pretty good imitation. kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #199

Intensely sad story karynnj Jan 2014 #53

My understanding if testing shows fetus isn't vialbe hospital can turn off the ventillator. LisaL Jan 2014 #67

That would make complete sense as there is then no argument that the baby karynnj Jan 2014 #100

I think the family should have been able to unhook her from the very beginning, pnwmom Jan 2014 #219

I hadn't connected it to abortion, but at 14 weeks the mother could karynnj Jan 2014 #266

This is why the right is fighting so hard on these cases, even though they're so rare. pnwmom Jan 2014 #267

This is really sad Gothmog Jan 2014 #91

And what happens if the child is born and is disabled? riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #102

Texas Repub lawmakers don't care ann--- Jan 2014 #105

Having worked with developmentally disabled adults HockeyMom Jan 2014 #136

Cerebral palsy at a minimum. DevonRex Jan 2014 #173

Failure to thrive me b zola Jan 2014 #112

Growing a 4 oz baby inside a dead woman for months DevonRex Jan 2014 #131

Outright ghoulish me b zola Jan 2014 #137

Another Science Experiment propagated by a Religious Nut Job State Government warrant46 Jan 2014 #180

Would it be creepy if her family wanted to have it done? LisaL Jan 2014 #225

Yes it would be creepy Boudica the Lyoness Jan 2014 #241

Well I guess the relatives of these women didn't think so. And neither do I. LisaL Jan 2014 #245

I do have to wonder about that rebecca_herman Jan 2014 #262

Something else... DevonRex Jan 2014 #296

This is like a HORROR story/movie. Only, it's real. I can't believe the hospital would go against BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #141

Really? Is it a good thing thing that a hospital could potentially be removed from the community? Lost_Count Jan 2014 #154

No, but all the persons running the hospital need to be removed and sued/prosecuted/ kestrel91316 Jan 2014 #200

All those local people with their medical degrees lying around... Lost_Count Jan 2014 #216

Methinks the Newbie doth protest too much. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #257

You should write a FAQ... Lost_Count Jan 2014 #269

I look forward to your years of harmonious contributions to DU. Orrex Jan 2014 #271

An all or nothing approach is *bound* to make you popular here, LC. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #275

Are you being purposely obtuse? BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #256

Well... Lost_Count Jan 2014 #270

Well... BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #276

How about we make the state of Texas sponsor the upbringing of the unborn baby? MrMickeysMom Jan 2014 #168

I think they're both responsible. A number of legal experts have said that the pnwmom Jan 2014 #169

That's probably not by coincidence... MrMickeysMom Jan 2014 #189

That is a sicko way to treat someone after declared dead( and their family wishes ) lunasun Jan 2014 #205

I know that if it was my daughter OwnedByCats Jan 2014 #218

This. Is. Obscene. Hekate Jan 2014 #230

I don't blame them. I would slap a lawsuit on their ass so fast their heads would spin. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #240

this story is an amazing addition to the abortion debate. Sirveri Jan 2014 #264

The mother was a paramedic who had strongly made her wishes known to her parents and husband. pnwmom Jan 2014 #265

yeah, she was out for an hour without O2... Sirveri Jan 2014 #300

You are arguing that the fetus is a person with all the rights of a citizen. KitSileya Jan 2014 #306

I am not saying that, I am playing Devil's advocate and engaging in moral relatavism. Sirveri Jan 2014 #322

I guess playing devil's advocate with real persons just doesn't appeal to me. KitSileya Jan 2014 #327

The state owes no duty to a non-viable fetus because it has no existence independent of its mother. pnwmom Jan 2014 #318

I agree, if non viable, however... Sirveri Jan 2014 #323

There's another legal right you're forgetting. pnwmom Jan 2014 #324

Well yes, but where do I rank them? Sirveri Jan 2014 #325

The SCOTUS position on abortion was that women had the choice because of the right pnwmom Jan 2014 #332

While I like the right to privacy established by the 14th, I prefer the 13th amendment defense. Sirveri Jan 2014 #335

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2014 #268

This is all part of a sinister agenda to dehumanize women. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #272

She is dead, so they're not even keeping her alive. It's not possible to keep her alive. pnwmom Jan 2014 #273

She's not dead according to the article, which clearly says....... WillowTree Jan 2014 #299

She is brain dead. Her heart is kept beating because she is getting oxygen from the ventilator KitSileya Jan 2014 #302

I understand that. But then, for the sake of accuracy....... WillowTree Jan 2014 #304

Her family considers her dead. KitSileya Jan 2014 #308

But according to the article, the hospital is "keeping her alive". It is what it is. WillowTree Jan 2014 #313

This might help you understand w8liftinglady Jan 2014 #330

The reporter misspoke. The machines are giving her the semblance of life, pnwmom Jan 2014 #319

I hope those two lawyers are outstandingly good, and fight this all the way Hekate Jan 2014 #326

probably too late to change the outcome in this case rebecca_herman Jan 2014 #336