General Discussion

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)

100. This is a great thread. Globalization means world wide leveling of living standards for the lower

Fri Jan 17, 2014, 08:47 PM

Jan 2014

classes. But just because China and India have large populations doesnt mean they will be capable of sustaining the current movement in capitalism. We are in the end-game of this round of capitalism, as I see it unless we discover untapped cheap resources that can be exploited to keep the pyramid alive.

When the living standard levels, it may go up slightly for but it must go down for the west. NAFTA is a great example of how standard of living leveling works. The lower standards will stay the same and the higher will go lower. Those millions in China and India can not purchase products if they arent making decent wages. And the corporations wont pay decent wages. We are in a capitalism death spiral. It's a pyramid game and it's coming to the end. The only way to prevent the implosion is to redistribute wealth downward. That will reset the death spiral and buy some time.

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My Wife Believes American Workers Being Positioned To Accept Lower Living Standard. [View all] TheMastersNemesis Jan 2014 OP

As the unions go, so goes the worker. United We Thrive, Divided We Beg...have seen this somewhere libdem4life Jan 2014 #1

Yep. That's what the "right to work" meme was all about theHandpuppet Jan 2014 #16

Right to work...for peanuts, if we're lucky. libdem4life Jan 2014 #75

Lower? yeoman6987 Jan 2014 #29

Yes, lower: No paid vacation, no contract, and flex scheduling. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #45

It used to take one income to raise a family and keep up a home. Now two, and given the cost of libdem4life Jan 2014 #79

Leisure time is for the 1%. Proles gotta work 24x7. CrispyQ Jan 2014 #92

Remember Bushiebaby's response to a woman elzenmahn Jan 2014 #140

I remember. CrispyQ Jan 2014 #145

And there are the ones who claim the vehicles and TV are luxuries too... Pholus Jan 2014 #119

No, they want us to have TV's arikara Jan 2014 #133

Yet TV's are mentioned as a sign that we are not truly impoverished... Pholus Jan 2014 #143

Yes, unions are our only hope. One blip in history in which a middle class boomed gtar100 Jan 2014 #127

Great point. With Taft-Hartley and it 'right-to-work' unions are undercut at every turn. Countries pampango Jan 2014 #144

It's been happening since Reagan. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #2

Why does the GOP hate Americans? n/t Beartracks Jan 2014 #101

It is the party of sociopaths and sadists. The republican party loves to see RKP5637 Jan 2014 #111

We get in the way. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #141

Reminds me of a movie called "Bounty Killer." Beartracks Jan 2014 #142

Reagan hyper-accelerated the decline. But it started under Nixon with the start of the decline bluestate10 Jan 2014 #114

WHO are these business people who are pro worker...... socialist_n_TN Jan 2014 #115

I agree with her. I remember trublu992 Jan 2014 #3

It's a pretty good hypothesis. defacto7 Jan 2014 #4

This is exactly the plan. It is a fact. I have worked around and been around very powerful people Lint Head Jan 2014 #5

The problem with a lot of companies Art_from_Ark Jan 2014 #10

The global corporate fat cats aren't competing with their workers anymore, but each other. Sky's the freshwest Jan 2014 #11

"Why can't [they] be satisfied with [just] a profit?" GOod question. Beartracks Jan 2014 #102

Yeah. The profit is what keeps the business alive. I realize it has to be a profit that keeps up Lint Head Jan 2014 #105

Sadly, the average Joe can't just raise his own price. Beartracks Jan 2014 #106

Remember Romney's "47%" speech? lob1 Jan 2014 #6

What turned my blood is that no one in his audience (all "savvy investors")... JHB Jan 2014 #22

The Yes Men slavery proposal prank confirms this deutsey Jan 2014 #43

She's right laundry_queen Jan 2014 #7

That is a good synopsis RobertEarl Jan 2014 #14

We need to stop the trade deals while we can. That is the only hope for us to live decently. JDPriestly Jan 2014 #17

I agree RobertEarl Jan 2014 #20

Most Americans do not understand what it is to use an outhouse any more. JDPriestly Jan 2014 #24

And good luck to anyone who tries avebury Jan 2014 #30

This is very important and I am glad you wrote it: JDPriestly Jan 2014 #72

This is a great thread. Globalization means world wide leveling of living standards for the lower rhett o rick Jan 2014 #100

"They do not know what it is like to have to walk miles at a time for supplies" CrispyQ Jan 2014 #98

scarily insightful. BlancheSplanchnik Jan 2014 #103

Food riots. Is that what it's gonna take to wake people up from their iWhatever bliss? CrispyQ Jan 2014 #95

Or we can just expropriate the wealth that's there........ socialist_n_TN Jan 2014 #118

This.... sendero Jan 2014 #33

That sums it up. The eco courses I took in the late 60s? Dead letters. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #47

It's good to occasionally read such frank, clear headed pieces/replies. Thank you. Egalitarian Thug Jan 2014 #91

I agree. Lots of ignorance and apathy. And denial. nt laundry_queen Jan 2014 #135

What we forget about countries like China and India is that there is a finite amount of time where okaawhatever Jan 2014 #96

Yep, the law of diminishing returns laundry_queen Jan 2014 #134

it's already happened for many JI7 Jan 2014 #8

Well... awoke_in_2003 Jan 2014 #9

Yes, that has been going on for a while. merrily Jan 2014 #12

I absolutely agree! SoapBox Jan 2014 #13

Classic Reagan Era crap. Claim the boss would LOVE to give you a raise but can't afford it. Spitfire of ATJ Jan 2014 #15

well, wasn't it Boeing who just accepted riversedge Jan 2014 #18

Being? DeSwiss Jan 2014 #19

it is almost he logical conclusion of, "How are we going to compete with China?' Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #21

I agree with your wife BarackTheVote Jan 2014 #23

Duh! emsimon33 Jan 2014 #25

The politicians don't think. They just do as they are told by their betters. jtuck004 Jan 2014 #26

Cut the Min Wage And The Sky's The Limit timothywcrane Jan 2014 #27

Sadly that is pretty much the state of things - TBF Jan 2014 #36

I'm in agreement with her JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #28

A lot of countries that don't insist on pouring avebury Jan 2014 #31

The US taxpayer is paying for the developed world's military The2ndWheel Jan 2014 #69

Kind of like our army? avebury Jan 2014 #90

You completely missed the posters point. Europe and Asia was constantly in major wars bluestate10 Jan 2014 #116

The problem with that argument avebury Jan 2014 #122

That seems to have been the "elite consensus" since the 70s JHB Jan 2014 #32

Conservatives goal is cheap labor. That's why I B Calm Jan 2014 #34

I've actually had a conservative friend of mine from the working class say deutsey Jan 2014 #40

It's amazing how simple and stupid some people can be. Do B Calm Jan 2014 #42

I call it "Steinbeck Syndrome." Brigid Jan 2014 #89

What Reagan And The GOP Have Done Is Crystal Clear. Yet The GOP Is Still Viable. TheMastersNemesis Jan 2014 #35

This about sums it up n2doc Jan 2014 #50

I know so many people like this it isn't even funny. Great cartoon. nt Nay Jan 2014 #55

lol Love it. ctsnowman Jan 2014 #107

Why do those kids look sad? hunter Jan 2014 #108

Well, I would say it's sort of the reverse - TBF Jan 2014 #37

Competition will drive down the cost of anything and labor is no exception badtoworse Jan 2014 #38

Except when labor organizes. Like during the Depression. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #48

The world was very different then badtoworse Jan 2014 #49

This assumes the "altetnative" to American labor won't Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #99

And that is why we socialists are organizing globally - TBF Jan 2014 #54

The so-called "Reagan Revolution" was actually a massive right-wing Reaction deutsey Jan 2014 #39

+1,000,000 Dawson Leery Jan 2014 #80

That is how this global free market fascism works. ananda Jan 2014 #41

I think so too gollygee Jan 2014 #44

They likely think that real poverty looks like the worst of Black Africa or .. ananda Jan 2014 #87

Think of that car ad where a car brings a baby home and is later given to her as a graduation gift. bklyncowgirl Jan 2014 #46

She is right get the red out Jan 2014 #51

Gen X'ers will have a lower standard of living than Baby Boomer's liberal N proud Jan 2014 #52

All part of the Bilderbergers plan MO_Moderate Jan 2014 #53

FFS. We don't need to look to conspiracy - TBF Jan 2014 #56

Lets see now MO_Moderate Jan 2014 #59

Are you saying the Bilderberg Group is a CT? ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2014 #67

I'm saying capitalism itself is the problem. nt TBF Jan 2014 #68

NO, that is NOT what you said. You said BG is a "conspiracy". You jumped in here so, please... ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2014 #71

You seem to have difficulty TBF Jan 2014 #81

and you have heard about the possible new law in Wisconsin......a 7 DAY WORK WEEK.... a kennedy Jan 2014 #57

The 7-day week is a reality in the IT industry LiberalEsto Jan 2014 #63

Some states are working to diminish child labor laws. CrispyQ Jan 2014 #104

There are some huge truths in that. Xyzse Jan 2014 #58

We live on a finite planet The2ndWheel Jan 2014 #60

There are roughly 4 billion "bottom of the pyramid" workers that unskilled Americans compete with FarCenter Jan 2014 #61

I'm surprised this isn't patently obvious to everyone. lumberjack_jeff Jan 2014 #62

I remember hearing years ago about how the very wealthy were upset Jazzgirl Jan 2014 #64

Current GD threads related to the big picture... ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2014 #65

Thanks for those links bananas Jan 2014 #112

Your wife is correct. KamaAina Jan 2014 #66

I agree with her but the powers that be had better understand that we the people will not agree to jwirr Jan 2014 #70

Yes, Americans WILL allow themselves to be left homeless, hungry, etc. Indeed, we already ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2014 #73

Shh I do not want to think that way. It is too scary. jwirr Jan 2014 #74

It's the war on the Middle Class. lpbk2713 Jan 2014 #76

Long term plan coming to fruition. JNelson6563 Jan 2014 #77

She is correct. They want us to compete for our jobs with the Chinese labor force. OregonBlue Jan 2014 #78

Here's an interesting article found in 2naSalit Jan 2014 #82

When Reagan was elected, raven mad Jan 2014 #83

That's the Truth from the Wharton Private Equity folks cap Jan 2014 #84

I agree with your wife. It's been happening since Reagan. liberal_at_heart Jan 2014 #85

Yes, as is discussed upthread. Reagan, and ever since. Kurovski Jan 2014 #88

The op reminds me of a conservation I had with my dad who's very conservative back in the 90s, deafskeptic Jan 2014 #86

My DH used to say I was paranoid in my thoughts that corporations Bettie Jan 2014 #93

IMO Mr Dixon Jan 2014 #94

That much is clear. And they want to drive the TPP nail into that coffin. marmar Jan 2014 #97

When most of are reduced to living like this then we will be able to compete. ctsnowman Jan 2014 #109

Perhaps it is time to just disconnect en mass from the whole mess. n/t RKP5637 Jan 2014 #110

Some of us workers like in the steel industry figured that one out doc03 Jan 2014 #113

No need to believe it. It's so obvious, it doesn't require faith. nt valerief Jan 2014 #117

I live in one of the 2 poorest states in the country. . . BigDemVoter Jan 2014 #120

Your wife is not wrong. Thom Hartmann has played quotes on Cleita Jan 2014 #121

I think that there is a grain of truth to that observation Proud Liberal Dem Jan 2014 #123

Karl Marx said much the same thing Alcibiades Jan 2014 #124

'we need to bring the US wages more in line with the Chinese Grassley(R-IA-BCBS) IADEMO2004 Jan 2014 #125

K&R Boomerproud Jan 2014 #126

Since the Members of Congress do nothing and get nothing constructive done..... democratisphere Jan 2014 #128

I knew that years ago but you know how that would've played. Phlem Jan 2014 #129

They want high unemployment so wages stay down and workers stay desperate. Skeeter Barnes Jan 2014 #130

Wife Believes American Workers Being Positioned To Accept Lower Living Standards blkmusclmachine Jan 2014 #131

Yup. We are all Bob Cratchit, now. MsPithy Jan 2014 #132

Smart woman. You should marry her! n/t aggiesal Jan 2014 #136

I Did - We Both Have Felt This Way About The Economy For A Long Time. TheMastersNemesis Jan 2014 #139

its true. politicman Jan 2014 #137

Yes. It explains the wilfull destruction of the public school system, and allowing the Arugula Latte Jan 2014 #138

Catch-22 writ large. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2014 #146

"...brought down to a level closer to the rest of the globe." Hah. Quantess Jan 2014 #147

Barack Obama(2006): "This is not a bloodless process." woo me with science Jan 2014 #148

kick woo me with science Jan 2014 #149