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RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
177. List of my posts in thread: Starfish dying in NW Pacific
Sun Jan 26, 2014, 09:50 PM
Jan 2014

Fukushima-related radioactive materials measured across entire Northern Hemisphere

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/04/110407121343.htm

""Since the double disaster of the 9.0 magnitude earthquake and tsunami that affected hundreds of thousands of people and seriously damaged the Fukushima Daichi power plant in Japan on 11 March 2011, minute traces of radioactive emissions from Fukushima have spread across the entire Northern Hemisphere. A monitoring network designed to detect signs of nuclear explosions picked up these traces from the stricken power plant. To date, more than 30 radionuclide stations that are part of the International Monitoring System have provided information on the spread of radioactive particles and noble gases from the Fukushima accident.""

*************************

Point being it is adding up, this radiation

There is more and more of it in the oceans. Some previous wasting could have been because of Chernobyl and weapon testing. Pretty much anywhere in the N. Hemisphere. Those deposits could be contributors. The DoE report below details that they still find traces in the sea life from Alaska tests.

Now we have Fukushima. Not only did it make deposits via air transport, but it now has been found in the NW pacific as described in another link below.

It is adding up. Spreading. The whole N. Pacific is now contaminated. Not making this up, it is all real science as linked below in follow up replies of mine.

*********************
In this report from the DOE, US government, it is described why they test for radioisotopes, where they test, when they test and some test findings. Note the excerpted listing for plutonium found in the mussels that were tested. This finding confirms the idea that plutonium can be passed up the food chain to the starfish.

http://www.lm.doe.gov/Amchitka/Sites.aspx

Title: Department of Energy: Biological Monitoring at Amchitka Appears to Show Impacts from Fukushima Dai-ichi Incident.

The U.S. Department of Energy Office Legacy Management (LM) has a long-term stewardship mission to protect human health and the environment from the legacy of underground nuclear testing conducted at Amchitka Island, Alaska, from 1965 to 1971. Atmospheric monitoring in the United States showed elevated cesium activities shortly after the nuclear incident. LM scientists anticipated that atmospheric transport of cesium would potentially increase the cesium activities in the 2011 biological samples collected near Amchitka. Because cesium-134 has a relatively short half-life of 2 years and indicates leakage from a nuclear reactor, it is a clear indicator of a recent nuclear accident.

Because the Amchitka 2011 sampling event occurred soon after the Fukushima nuclear accident, the biota impacted by atmospheric precipitation showed the greatest impact (e.g., species that live in freshwater or shallow ocean waters) when compared to marine biota living in deeper water. This is because ocean currents are a slower transport process than wind currents. LM scientists anticipate that the marine biota will show the impacts of Fukushima during the next sampling event, currently scheduled to occur in 2016.

(One snip from report about the amounts found pg 226)

* Plutonium-239 — 4.194 pCi/kg Horse Mussel tissue

******************

Starfish facts


Diet of the starfish >> source wikipedia

Most species are generalist predators, eating microalgae, sponges, bivalves, snails and other small animals. Some species are detritivores, eating decomposing organic material and faecal matter. The crown-of-thorns starfish consumes coral polyps. The processes of feeding and capture may be aided by special parts; Pisaster brevispinus, the short-spined pisaster from the West Coast of America, can use a set of specialized tube feet to dig itself deep into the soft substrate to extract prey (usually clams). Grasping the shellfish, the starfish slowly pries open the prey's shell by wearing out its abductor muscle, and then inserts its inverted stomach into the crack to digest the soft tissues. The gap between the valves need only be a fraction of a millimeter wide for the stomach to gain entry.


*****************
Ecological impact of starfish >>>> source wikipedia

Starfish devouring mussel
Pisaster ochraceus consuming a mussel in central California

Starfish are keystone species in their respective marine communities. Their relatively large sizes, diverse diets and ability to adapt to different environments makes them ecologically important. The term "keystone species" was in fact first used by Robert Paine in 1966 to describe a starfish, Pisaster ochraceus. When studying the low intertidal coasts of Washington state, Paine found that predation by P. ochraceus was a major factor in the diversity of species. Experimental removals of this top predator from a stretch of shoreline resulted in lower species diversity and the eventual domination of Mytilus mussels, which were able to outcompete other organisms for space and resources. Similar results were found in a 1971 study of Stichaster australis on the intertidal coast of the South Island of New Zealand. S. australis was found to have removed most of a batch of transplanted mussels within two or three months of their placement, while in an area from which S. australis had been removed, the mussels increased in number dramatically, overwhelming the area and threatening biodiversity.



Survival of ocean warming and ph change for mussels

A 2009 study found that P. ochraceus is unlikely to be affected by ocean acidification as severely as other marine animals with calcareous skeletons. In other groups, structures made of calcium carbonate are vulnerable to dissolution when the pH is lowered. Researchers found that when P. ochraceus were exposed to 21 °C (70 °F) and 770 ppm carbon dioxide (beyond rises expected in the next century), they were relatively unaffected. Their survivability is likely due to the nodular nature of their skeletons, which are able to compensate for a shortage of carbonate by growing more fleshy tissue.


******************

Links and other sources

Lead Researcher: Fukushima pollution may be causing sea star epidemic on West Coast — Sea urchins, sea cucumbers also affected — “Something’s making them susceptible”… “It’s unlike anything we’ve seen”… “Populations go locally extinct overnight, literally”
http://enenews.com/lead-researcher-fukushima-pollution-a-cause-of-epidemic-wiping-out-starfish-along-west-coast-sea-urchins-and-sea-cucumbers-also-affected-something-is-making-them-susceptible-infection-it

Experts: Fukushima can’t be excluded as factor in sea stars turning to goo along West Coast; It hasn’t been ruled out — They’re “particularly proficient” at absorbing radioisotopes; 1,000 times more plutonium than fish
http://enenews.com/colonies-of-starfish-turning-to-mush-disintegrating-into-white-goo-experts-we-cant-exclude-fukushima-radiation-it-hasnt-been-ruled-out-starfish-particularly-proficient-at-absorbing-ra


*************************

Newest report of Fukushima contamination in the Pacific

This report describes how radionuclides from Fukushima were found in the water offshore in the Pacific. The report is the first to detail this fact. It goes on to say that the contamination is due to reach shore this year. And that much more sampling must be done.

http://www.pices.int/publications/presentations/PICES-2013/2013-MEQ/MEQ-1700-Smith.pdf

*************
At this site is a request for funding for more pacific research of Fukushima contamination:
http://phys.org/news/2014-01-radioactive-ocean.html

***********************

From a counter opinion site

At the following link from Deep Sea News, in the comments section, one commenter offered up some good suggestions to the scientists there.

http://deepseanews.com/2013/12/three-reasons-why-fukushima-radiation-has-nothing-to-do-with-starfish-wasting-syndrome/

*****************Quote:

Epidemiologically, are not the factors you have raised direct evidence of the impact of potassium/caesium and Calcium/Strontium ionic replacement? Four points:

1. Perhaps more so than any other sea creature, K and Ca are the critical minerals for starfish. Starfish have complex K and Ca exchange, uptake and shedding mechanisms.

2. Sr and Cs are notorious Ca and K emulators respectively.

3. A single Sr90 or Cs137 atom resident in a starfish for a few days would release enough energy to create soft tissue trauma (mutative effects inclusive). Biological response? Uptake K to attempt a heal, and more K to attempt to shed the damaged arm. Effect? More potential Cs and Sr intake. What happens when the starfish gets multiplicitous shed messages from 10-20 atomic trauma centres throughout its whole body? It melts.

3. Sr and Cs are found in trace levels in every one of the places that SWS is now occuring, and have been for a number of years now. This is as a direct consequence of the US Government nuclear policies, and its shoddy and slipshod waste management practices. Sure, Fukushima is a slow moving toxic tidal wave, and you haven’t even started to see the true effects. But the killer genie was out of the bottle years ago.

4. Go and run some tests. Get relatively pure water from the deep South Pacific, and healthy starfish from the same region. Put a sick starfish in with the healthy ones. Then try adding some radioactive isotopes at trace levels. Break the story.

***********************

The ocean ecologists are alarmed

Here is a link to a research study concerning the starfish.

http://www.eeb.ucsc.edu/pacificrockyintertidal/data-products/sea-star-wasting/



Starfish dying in the NW Pacific [View all] RobertEarl Jan 2014 OP
Happening in the Atlantic as well and also happened in the 80's. Bonobo Jan 2014 #1
I guess you missed his post about Fukushima zappaman Jan 2014 #3
First weapons testing, then Chernobyl, now Fukushima RobertEarl Jan 2014 #32
Point being it is adding up, this radiation RobertEarl Jan 2014 #33
I noticed that too DFW Jan 2014 #54
How many times are you going to post this NONSENSE? zappaman Jan 2014 #2
Bobby Brown goes down. nt Bonobo Jan 2014 #5
Flakes. Nt zappaman Jan 2014 #7
Jumbo go away. nt Bonobo Jan 2014 #14
Dumb All Over. zappaman Jan 2014 #16
You won (this time). nt Bonobo Jan 2014 #27
I know you guys think you are clever Generic Other Jan 2014 #49
Except that's not the claim RobertEarl was making. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #58
"scientists can’t rule out nuclear pollution..." Generic Other Jan 2014 #61
Fukushima radiation is not the sole cause of the starfish die off. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #65
Could starfish immune systems be compromised by radiation? Generic Other Jan 2014 #68
Honestly, I'm not well-versed enough in marine biology or radiation to say. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #76
of course immune systems are compromised by radiation questionseverything Jan 2014 #77
It's also technically impossible to rule out alien attacks on our starfish. Yo_Mama Jan 2014 #98
Interesting RobertEarl Jan 2014 #103
If you believe it's nonsense, then either post arguments that prove that it's nonsense, rhett o rick Jan 2014 #83
" I think I can tell nonsense with out their help." zappaman Jan 2014 #86
So now you've lowered yourself to stating that I "need help". You seem certain that you know the rhett o rick Jan 2014 #109
Again and again and again Brother Buzz Jan 2014 #4
Like clockwork... bhikkhu Jan 2014 #13
Indeed, one needs to respond to nonsense Brother Buzz Jan 2014 #19
At this point, it's spamming. zappaman Jan 2014 #23
Starfish wasting predates Fukushima and is happening in other oceans besides the Pacific. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #6
The starfish die-off started well before Fukushima, and has happened fairly regularly bhikkhu Jan 2014 #8
"Unless one believes there is a massive multi-national conspiracy to cover up the evidence." Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #10
Apparently so bhikkhu Jan 2014 #17
People think 6 dump truck loads of thermite were snuck into each WTC tower. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #20
DoE testing found Plutonium in Mussels RobertEarl Jan 2014 #9
ENEnews again, eh? zappaman Jan 2014 #11
LOLOLOLOL Berlum Jan 2014 #40
Maybe chemtrails are killing the starfish... SidDithers Jan 2014 #56
Is this your main souirce for your persistence on this issue? passiveporcupine Feb 2016 #194
Don't read it today RobertEarl Feb 2016 #195
You are the one who shouldn't be reading it. passiveporcupine Feb 2016 #197
Sorry to bother you. RobertEarl Feb 2016 #198
This message was self-deleted by its author Journeyman Jan 2014 #12
It's a disease that's killing them off. Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #15
Starfish facts RobertEarl Jan 2014 #18
Robert ... Fukushima is a terrible ongoing accident ... we all agree on that point ... MindMover Jan 2014 #21
It's no use with this guy. longship Jan 2014 #35
Newest report of Fukushima contamination in the Pacific RobertEarl Jan 2014 #22
From a counter opinion site RobertEarl Jan 2014 #24
you know, I live in the NW Pacific and nobody, absolutely nobody here is talking about this at all Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #25
The ocean ecologists are alarmed RobertEarl Jan 2014 #26
They are alarmed. Although not for the same reasons you are. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #28
those articles do not even mention Fukushima - they maintain a virus is killing them Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #29
Hilarious, since UC Santa Cruz mentions fukushima like zero times nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #104
Yep RobertEarl Jan 2014 #106
Really? Claiming persecution? NuclearDem Jan 2014 #118
Funny thing is, the absence of evidence of such persecution will be seen as evidence that it exists. X_Digger Jan 2014 #119
Fish tank RobertEarl Jan 2014 #120
Care to address the time-travelling, ocean-hopping "cause" in post #115? X_Digger Jan 2014 #121
With you? Why? RobertEarl Jan 2014 #124
Lol, can't quote that entire para, can you? X_Digger Jan 2014 #125
Here's another theory RobertEarl Jan 2014 #126
Bull. Union Scribe Jan 2014 #133
Still no response, eh? X_Digger Jan 2014 #134
Are you just pissed off you don't have one? zappaman Jan 2014 #136
Maybe it's chronoton radiation, that travels back in time.. X_Digger Jan 2014 #143
No problem RobertEarl Jan 2014 #137
So.. before Fukushima, therefore.. work with me here.. fukushima can't be the cause, right? X_Digger Jan 2014 #142
You call that logic? RobertEarl Jan 2014 #150
A precedes B, therefore B can't cause A. X_Digger Jan 2014 #151
Why is my user name relevant? NuclearDem Jan 2014 #123
I guess the folks at UC Santa Cruz are part of a huge conspiracy then nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #141
From your link passiveporcupine Feb 2016 #196
It was reported by the local TV news in November Generic Other Jan 2014 #43
Check the studies from UC Santa Cruz nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #105
That is where I checked Generic Other Jan 2014 #117
Deep Sea News says the same RobertEarl Jan 2014 #122
Yes, they had the same problem back in the 80s nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #140
I tend to think you are correct Generic Other Jan 2014 #144
And that is where bioconcentration with migratory nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #146
Wrong on both, nadine RobertEarl Jan 2014 #153
Please, quit spreading falsehoods. nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #154
They don't know what is causing it RobertEarl Jan 2014 #156
Let's see if you finally get it, latest update nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #161
You telling me to stop? RobertEarl Jan 2014 #163
As I expected, you got personal nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #165
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha! longship Jan 2014 #30
I thought that was how one defended one's arguments on a DU Generic Other Jan 2014 #47
Sometimes ridicule is the only appropriate response. longship Jan 2014 #62
It is to the point that I will save the UCSC statement on this nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #167
Yup! There is plenty of science on this. longship Jan 2014 #170
And we both worry about the actual science of this nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #172
;-) longship Jan 2014 #175
Fukushima-related radioactive materials measured across entire Northern Hemisphere RobertEarl Jan 2014 #31
How Quickly Did Fukushima Radiation Reach North America, And When Will It Peak? passiveporcupine Feb 2016 #199
This belongs in the woo forum. hobbit709 Jan 2014 #34
I blame Nazi metadata Orrex Jan 2014 #36
Wow... SidDithers Jan 2014 #37
Well, it's obvious what's happening here. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #38
. Berlum Jan 2014 #39
I'll see your 'drippy thing' and raise you a 'Starro the Conqueror'. randome Jan 2014 #42
OK. I'll see your Starro, and call you. Lay your melted stars on the table? Berlum Jan 2014 #44
I fold. randome Jan 2014 #46
Thanks for posting, RobertEarl. Octafish Jan 2014 #41
The reason it's being mocked is because it's just plain wrong. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #45
Really? Octafish Jan 2014 #48
Are you serious right now? NuclearDem Jan 2014 #50
... Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #53
Oh good god. Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #51
I get it that we need to maintain a skeptical attitude Generic Other Jan 2014 #55
... NuclearDem Jan 2014 #60
Again I would rather discuss why some claims are "ludicrous" Generic Other Jan 2014 #64
The only legitimate response to PRATT has to be ridicule. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #66
Do you reply to all the spam email you get? Union Scribe Jan 2014 #74
I used to post articles too Generic Other Jan 2014 #78
Sometimes people get tired responding to the same debunked claims. longship Jan 2014 #67
I dont think you appreciate the gift of certainty of those knowing what is right vs. what is wrong. rhett o rick Jan 2014 #85
I would hope you realize that sometimes "right or wrong" is subjective and open for rhett o rick Jan 2014 #82
Right or wrong is not subjective in this case. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #88
+1000 zappaman Jan 2014 #90
In my OP it cleary states RobertEarl Jan 2014 #91
No, your OP implies that it is plutonium from Fukushima that is responsible. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #93
No you haven't RobertEarl Jan 2014 #95
All you've been able to do is cite ENENews, NuclearDem Jan 2014 #97
Thanks for the sanity Yo_Mama Jan 2014 #100
" there is no "subjective" in scientific claims. " You dont seem to know much about rhett o rick Jan 2014 #107
First of all, "hypothesis", not "theory." NuclearDem Jan 2014 #110
A simple calendar proves the hypothesis wrong. X_Digger Jan 2014 #111
That is simple and I guess that's your criteria. nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #114
Does tepco's radiation move backward through time?!? X_Digger Jan 2014 #115
That's more damning of Robert's hypothesis than anything else. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #116
Even the UCSC study that ironically Earl cited as evidence nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #145
BS RobertEarl Jan 2014 #155
If there's one thing you're an expert on, it's BS. hobbit709 Jan 2014 #157
Grow up. RobertEarl Jan 2014 #158
I'm not the one indulging in childish make believe hobbit709 Jan 2014 #159
I wonder if he "checks out the chicks"? zappaman Jan 2014 #162
I will repeat this again so you can understand this nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #160
You go tell this to the folks telling you star fish are not dying due nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #193
When a poster keeps posting the same bullshit over and over and keeps being told why they are wrong zappaman Jan 2014 #89
I am not surprised that you try to justify your mocking and ridicule. You never do it rhett o rick Jan 2014 #113
Thanks Octafish RobertEarl Jan 2014 #70
shocking you like this post. n-t Logical Jan 2014 #75
Especially the folks doing the research on the matter nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #171
Let's not forget the sardine die off.... Bennyboy Jan 2014 #52
You, personally, are making a mockery of the fukushima event. NCTraveler Jan 2014 #57
Yes they are, but it has nothing to do with Fukushima. MineralMan Jan 2014 #59
Very nice, mm RobertEarl Jan 2014 #79
Why thanks! MineralMan Jan 2014 #80
Shallow advice RobertEarl Jan 2014 #81
Not this shit again.. X_Digger Jan 2014 #63
There's no scientific evidence of your claim alarimer Jan 2014 #69
Plutonium found in mussels RobertEarl Jan 2014 #71
.000000000004 Ci/kg in some mussels Union Scribe Jan 2014 #132
For fuck sake! longship Jan 2014 #164
Thanks for the kick RobertEarl Jan 2014 #166
When all your kicks ridicule your post I will bet you still won't stop. longship Jan 2014 #168
I say we see this exact same post for the 6th time within 10 days. zappaman Jan 2014 #169
No way, my friend. longship Jan 2014 #173
Yup! It's a double down. longship Jan 2014 #192
I personally am not going to worry about Fukushima Blue_In_AK Jan 2014 #72
That's understood RobertEarl Jan 2014 #73
I think that this is an interesting theory but I would have to see proof before rhett o rick Jan 2014 #84
Thanks RobertEarl Jan 2014 #87
Those in their denial bubbles are afraid of the truth. There and many reactors rhett o rick Jan 2014 #135
That's the problem RobertEarl Jan 2014 #138
Oh for God's sake. A single reactor at Three Mile Island suffered a partial meltdown. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #139
I would not quite say zero instances nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #147
I don't see any conclusive evidence that TMI's radiation caused cancer. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #148
There have been a few nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #149
Will this ridiculous meme ever die? Yo_Mama Jan 2014 #92
You are in denial? RobertEarl Jan 2014 #94
The DEFINITIVE link....Not going to copy/paste it, beware those on dial-up uppityperson Jan 2014 #96
LOVE IT. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #99
Get a bowl and a bottle of milk because these claims are Cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. nt longship Jan 2014 #101
Thanks for the information. democratisphere Jan 2014 #102
Thank you, democratisphere RobertEarl Jan 2014 #108
The government, like many here, won't even acknowledge the possibility of radiation contamination. democratisphere Jan 2014 #112
Living in the Tampa Bay area we have this discussion often with experts in the field of Harmony Blue Jan 2014 #127
Yes. Worth their salt. Good term RobertEarl Jan 2014 #128
+1 Absolutely Harmony Blue Jan 2014 #129
Or rising sea temperatures. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #130
Rising sea temperatures isn't likely Harmony Blue Jan 2014 #174
Except rising sea temperatures have been the cause of previous starfish die offs. NuclearDem Jan 2014 #176
Something seems off this time around Harmony Blue Jan 2014 #180
Here's another discussion idea RobertEarl Jan 2014 #131
Yup nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #179
YiKes gopiscrap Jan 2014 #152
List of my posts in thread: Starfish dying in NW Pacific RobertEarl Jan 2014 #177
As promised nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #178
Octafish post, Thanks Octafish RobertEarl Jan 2014 #181
From the idiots doing the research nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #182
Oh my God, this thread just never stops! NuclearDem Jan 2014 #184
I think he believes that if he keeps repeating it in spite of being disproven, it'll stick. X_Digger Jan 2014 #191
Summary RobertEarl Jan 2014 #183
From the clueless folks ACTUALLY DOING THE RESEARCH nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #185
It's really cool how the radiation went backward in time to make the sea stars sick. LeftyMom Jan 2014 #186
I am working on a fictional FTL drive nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #190
You're really planting your flag on this one, aren't you? NuclearDem Jan 2014 #188
This thread should be in creative speculation... SidDithers Jan 2014 #187
Arrrrrgh!!!!!!! longship Jan 2014 #189
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Starfish dying in the NW ...»Reply #177