General Discussion

Armstead

(47,803 posts)

71. There are many true liberals...it's a very mainstream philosophy

Mon Jan 27, 2014, 02:17 PM

Jan 2014

I've done what I can to support true liberal alternatives...and then supported the "better than the GOP" candidates when that became the only choice.

Personally, I don't believe the liberal instinct really faded away.

I think most people -- at least a majority subtracting the outright crooks and the misguided grass roots wingnuts -- still ascribe to the basic principles and many specific policies of liberalism.

Instead the label was successfully demonized by the GOP and was abandoned and sold out by the Democrats.

In my opinion it boils down to pushing to restore true liberalism -- not a corporate ass-kissing brand of centrism that pushes abominations like corporate "free trade," total deregulation, etc.

I would put people like Sherrod Brown, Elizabeth Warren (so far), Bernie Sanders and others of that ilk as liberals to be emulated. They are working within the system to make the system better -- not to support its abusive excesses,

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Hypothetical Question: Would Obama and the Clintons be as successful if they were actually Liberal? [View all] Armstead Jan 2014 OP

Yes, clearly ProSense Jan 2014 #1

if we accept the false premise that Obama is not a liberal. But, Obama is a liberal and Coyotl Jan 2014 #150

not likely. unfortunately, liberals just don't have enough institutional power these days. unblock Jan 2014 #2

I think Obama (and Clinton) were elected largely on a liberal agenda Armstead Jan 2014 #3

Democrats are our own worst enemy. The so-called "corporatists" and conservatives in the House Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #8

What a line of crap. If we need our democrats to be republicans to get elected, well what's the Ed Suspicious Jan 2014 #63

Thank you, Ed. My thought exactly. Maybe the dems SHOULD start grooming Nay Jan 2014 #72

No. Maybe Dems should not attacking their own and run more progressive candidates for office. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #119

^^^^this^^^^ L0oniX Jan 2014 #115

So you're saying that there are no conservative or corporate Democrats? How is it crap? Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #118

It's way worse than that. lark Jan 2014 #65

Irony of ironies is that you name yourself "Liberal_Stalwart..." at the same time denigrating Ed Suspicious Jan 2014 #68

No way, sure. I voted for Nader over Clinton. Twice. I voted for him over Gore a third time. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #120

only partly, and this is where the dearth of institutional liberal power comes in unblock Jan 2014 #17

Yes they were, and Hillary lost because when it came down to who was more Liberal on issues like sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #35

Read Chris Hedge's book... zentrum Jan 2014 #56

We don't have institutional power because elected Dems keep putting Pubs in Nay Jan 2014 #75

We lack the power because we keep ceding it. Scootaloo Jan 2014 #127

I agree with what you said Armstead Jan 2014 #136

Would Obama be more popular? No! We liberals will always find something else to raise the bar... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #4

+100! "failing to understand the degree of Republican obstruction" FSogol Jan 2014 #6

God forbid we should actually discuss anything on a discussion board Armstead Jan 2014 #13

So, why are you in this thread trying to stifle discussion? FSogol Jan 2014 #18

"complaining on a message board isn't doing anything" Armstead Jan 2014 #97

I don't think that disagreement with your premise is the equivalent of denying discussion LanternWaste Jan 2014 #94

Disagreement with my premise is fine. It's just the "you shouldn't complain..." Armstead Jan 2014 #98

Well then he has a chance now to take the bull by the horns regarding spying on the American people. sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #36

Yes - even when Democrats controlled the House, Senate and Presidency, Maedhros Jan 2014 #55

Exactly! Phlem Jan 2014 #82

Bingo. Scuba Jan 2014 #102

"(and some of the left, too!) will always hate him because he's black." Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #9

The truth hurts, eh?...nt SidDithers Jan 2014 #14

The truth never hurts. But baseless lies do. They hurt this country. So who do you know sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #37

I am a black woman who saw racism in the liberal community with my own two eyes!! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #45

There is racism everywhere, but you are claiming that when people disagree with this President sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #69

i agree Armstead Jan 2014 #74

That was not the claim ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #103

She's a fucking liar! That is it. She knows I said no such thing. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #122

Talk to your friend Sid. Do you agree with him?? If so, then my premise is correct. I did not sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #128

This is flamebait. You're on full ignore. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #132

Just as I thought. Thank you! n/t sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #133

And so did the jury LS JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #154

Yep and yep. Give your time to those that deserve it. Number23 Jan 2014 #156

NO I AM NOT AND SAID NO SUCH THING!!! You know it! Where did I assert that ANYONE who doesn't Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #117

come on. you always make up arguments to attribute to other people, arguments they never made. nt dionysus Feb 2014 #160

Bravo. Bobbie Jo Jan 2014 #79

You denying that it's true? That truth must really hurt something awful. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #20

LOL Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #21

I don't see anything funny about laughing about racism. Nothing funny at all. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #51

Back it up AgingAmerican Jan 2014 #87

Why is it that white people always want black people to prove racism? Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #116

You were called the N word and spat upon by Democrats for supporting Obama? AgingAmerican Jan 2014 #134

You don't have to believe it. You live in a world where you don't want to believe it. That's sad. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #135

Please... AgingAmerican Jan 2014 #140

Please name specifically some of these 'people on the Left' who hate the President sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #38

Tavis Similey....oh wait.... Armstead Jan 2014 #42

I'm not referring to commentators. I'm talking about voters. Democratic voters during the primaries. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #46

That's odd, because Obama was elected by a huge margin over McCain. You would think that the 'haters sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #61

I don't doubt or question your experience. I doubt people who pose as the "liberal left" then spew GoneFishin Jan 2014 #66

So who are these people? On every single Liberal Blog I've ever been on, bigoted comments are sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #109

I have not seen any. My only point is that such racists are not like any liberals I know. GoneFishin Jan 2014 #139

Okay, I misunderstood then, thank you. My apologies and thank you for your civil response. sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #141

No problem. We are nearly always on the same page. I was trying to be delicate and I muddled GoneFishin Jan 2014 #143

This is a discussion board. The purpose is to discuss. Armstead Jan 2014 #12

Oh, please with this victimhood mentality. No one is trying to shut down debate. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #19

You have every right to knock it down Armstead Jan 2014 #22

Don't sell him short Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #26

Joke all you want. There is racism in the Democratic Party and on the political left. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #47

That's rather insensitive of you Capt. Obvious Jan 2014 #49

Or, you'll do what? You're insinuating that I will accuse someone on this board of hating the Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #52

LS JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #155

Yep. This thread has been nothing short of jaw dropping and illuminating. Number23 Jan 2014 #157

Interesting. Conservatives knock anyone who isn't "pure" like them. I'm a liberal. A proud liberal. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #27

It is phony in the big picture Armstead Jan 2014 #32

Maybe some folks aren't as desperate as others tblue Jan 2014 #44

We've already won the right elections and it didn't happen Armstead Jan 2014 #57

From 2008 - 2010 the Democrats held majorities in the House and Senate Maedhros Jan 2014 #91

Again, nothing in Obama's two books, nothing in his voting record, nothing in his ENTIRE speech Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #50

Let's just say I disagree withn your interpretation of their message and strategy Armstead Jan 2014 #59

Fine. Disagree all you want. We'll leave it at that. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #111

Oddly enough loyalsister Jan 2014 #95

I think he was very naive to believe that the Republicans (and some Democrats) wanted to work with Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #112

Yes! It's all about betrayal Distant Quasar Jan 2014 #108

Glad you aren't resorting to any "epitaphs." LuvNewcastle Jan 2014 #64

I don't understand your post...and neither do you. :) Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #124

Well then let's discuss what you brought to the discussion. Please name the sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #43

Post removed Post removed Jan 2014 #125

'Fucking liar'. That's not an argument. See Sid's interpretation of your meaning and then get back sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #129

Post my exact words that I either implied or explicitly stated that ANYONE who disagreed with Obama Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #131

You lost me at 'fucking liar'. Speaking of flamebait. sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #137

Best comment in this thread, by far MrScorpio Jan 2014 #39

It's not the Lack of Liberalism, but the Lying about it that bugs me. Demeter Jan 2014 #67

^^Thread win right here ^^ Jamaal510 Jan 2014 #126

LiberalStalwart left DU over this thread. But the support she's gotten from EVERY black poster Number23 Jan 2014 #158

Wow that's too bad. Jamaal510 Jan 2014 #159

BOG: Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated. L0oniX Jan 2014 #5

"LET IT SINK" or "SWARM" bobduca Jan 2014 #24

How'd that primary of Obama work out in 2012? JoePhilly Jan 2014 #58

Liberals/Progressives played ball in 2012....and of course you have to criticize them for that too Armstead Jan 2014 #60

There were lots of them here on DU screaming for a primary. JoePhilly Jan 2014 #70

Thats one of the things DU is for...complaining and venting and arguing.... Armstead Jan 2014 #73

Seems to be the one of the primary things DU is "for" then. JoePhilly Jan 2014 #77

That's a pretty good summary. Thanks, JoePhilly. n/t pampango Jan 2014 #81

Complaining is the great American pastime, but..... Armstead Jan 2014 #86

So Putin made Obama supprt the gays? JoePhilly Jan 2014 #105

I'm fine with most of what you wrote in this Armstead Jan 2014 #121

Message to left: We don't need your votes. L0oniX Jan 2014 #85

What I actually said is ... JoePhilly Jan 2014 #107

Well, maybe there was a reason for the complaints? And yes, we are getting the message sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #142

You seem confused ... JoePhilly Jan 2014 #145

I'd be happy if your constant whining about Democrats turned into better candidates. sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #146

So take the party then ... please. JoePhilly Jan 2014 #147

Well we supported Buono in NJ, you know, the Dem Candidate. sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #148

And unfortunately, she lost. JoePhilly Jan 2014 #149

No, she didn't 'lose' she was a victim of the Third Way who have managed to tell the lie sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #151

You are pretty hilarious. JoePhilly Jan 2014 #152

I have to run, got more important things to do than sit around whining about Progressive Democratic sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #153

I suspect many of us Dems are asking ourselves this question lately... KoKo Jan 2014 #7

To my knowledge, neither of them considered nor called themselves "liberals". And if we had Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #15

The sales piutch was liberal.. Armstead Jan 2014 #25

My friend, you simply didn't learn about his ENTIRE political philosophy. You picked out a few issue Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #29

My stabnce was similar to yours Armstead Jan 2014 #34

True. Nothing pissed Bill Clinton off more than being called the L-word. Boomerproud Jan 2014 #90

Of course! I'd happily attend a $10,000 a plate fundraiser if only they were more liberal. n/t lumberjack_jeff Jan 2014 #10

Or loyalsister Jan 2014 #11

You appear to miss the point of the OP Armstead Jan 2014 #16

I don't think so loyalsister Jan 2014 #96

One of the things i always liked about Obama was his pragmatism and willingness tro compromise Armstead Jan 2014 #101

oops loyalsister Jan 2014 #104

The basic principle is the same Armstead Jan 2014 #106

And all the while loyalsister Jan 2014 #110

Really Armstead Jan 2014 #123

Yes, I'll answer. I was a Kucinich fan. I supported him before finally moving over to Obama. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #23

There's a big difference between moderation/ compromise and driving in the wrong direction Armstead Jan 2014 #28

Well, that too is a matter of opinion. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #30

Exactly my point loyalsister Jan 2014 #93

You are so right! Oh, my God. The brainwashing, anti-government, hyper-individualism has Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #114

Obama more so, Clinton no. MannyGoldstein Jan 2014 #31

Both are political opportunists whose primary aim is to win office. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2014 #33

Political Science 101: That is the aim of EVERY politician. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jan 2014 #53

Yep. The rest is just advertising. They take whatever position is convenient. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2014 #54

the political consensus from the last three to four decades has excluded liberals and progressives Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #40

I'd agree except to say that a lot of that was manufactured concensus Armstead Jan 2014 #41

if clintons and obama were liberals RedstDem Jan 2014 #48

Where are the true liberals? I don't see very many anymore... Sancho Jan 2014 #62

There are many true liberals...it's a very mainstream philosophy Armstead Jan 2014 #71

And the question is...do Brown, Warren, and Sanders have the ability to win a Presidential election? Sancho Jan 2014 #76

He's had plenty of support for becoming more liberal -- but he bats it away Armstead Jan 2014 #83

There is no doubt in my mind that President Obama would have pushed more liberal policies if.. DCBob Jan 2014 #78

I disagree. Armstead Jan 2014 #84

I dont think you understand how negotiations work in Washington. DCBob Jan 2014 #130

any so-called lib/lefty not familiar or that disagrees with stupidicus Jan 2014 #80

Wrong premise. They are liberals. ecstatic Jan 2014 #88

Well true but.... Armstead Jan 2014 #89

OK, that's helpful. Thanks nt ecstatic Jan 2014 #92

Flamebait. They are liberals. treestar Jan 2014 #99

k and r frwrfpos Jan 2014 #100

Yes. Americans are more liberal than our politicians RainDog Jan 2014 #113

Probably not. moondust Jan 2014 #138

Financially? Octafish Jan 2014 #144