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badtoworse

(5,957 posts)

41. Take out the gang bangers if you want to be taken seriously

Reply to Warren Stupidity (Original post)

Mon Jan 27, 2014, 04:16 PM

Jan 2014

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New Study Details Gun Injuries Suffered by Children [View all] Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 OP

du rec. xchrom Jan 2014 #1

Under 20 years old equals child? hack89 Jan 2014 #2

And that is the talking point. nt. Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #3

Do you really consider 19 year olds children? Nt hack89 Jan 2014 #5

uh, yes, so does the medical database used. Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #14

Did you look closely at the charts in that study? hack89 Jan 2014 #21

Screen grab here pintobean Jan 2014 #33

The testosterone really kicks in at 15-19 doesn't it? alittlelark Jan 2014 #173

So it's about numbers? How many child injuries and/or deaths would be acceptable then? 10, 20, 100? sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #175

So zero is the standard? hack89 Jan 2014 #183

The report is titled "Hospitalizations Due to Firearm Injuries in Children and Adolescents" struggle4progress Jan 2014 #34

Then perhaps the OP title should be changed? nt hack89 Jan 2014 #37

Perhaps the editors of the publication cited should be informed? Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #191

I see now that it was VOA that wrote the misleading headline. nt hack89 Jan 2014 #192

Yep. Let's be sure to find a study of gun violence victims kcr Jan 2014 #6

How about drawing the line at 18? hack89 Jan 2014 #15

Because there's such a huge difference between 18 and 19. kcr Jan 2014 #18

Look at the figures in the study hack89 Jan 2014 #23

One whole year? kcr Jan 2014 #25

Well, never mind then. kcr Jan 2014 #4

I understand the desire to pad the numbers hack89 Jan 2014 #8

Pad the numbers? kcr Jan 2014 #13

Padding the numbers is arguing that there is a massive cliff jeff47 Jan 2014 #27

Funny you should mention that hack89 Jan 2014 #35

Funny you should use those statistics jeff47 Jan 2014 #38

They chose that upper limit to incorporate as much criminal activity as they could hack89 Jan 2014 #40

Again, look at your study. jeff47 Jan 2014 #42

I would draw the line at 15 hack89 Jan 2014 #45

Which is why you entered the thread demanding the line be drawn at 18. jeff47 Jan 2014 #52

As the conversation went on, I gave it more thought hack89 Jan 2014 #71

move the line to wherever it favors gun humpers Skittles Jan 2014 #177

Why not draw the line at 12? 5? kcr Jan 2014 #61

Well, golly, let's just draw the line at 40! Lizzie Poppet Jan 2014 #65

I know!!!! Gal Dern it! Why even discuss it at al!!!!!!!!111!!!1!!!1111 kcr Jan 2014 #74

Discuss? Lizzie Poppet Jan 2014 #77

That is an impossible task. kcr Jan 2014 #79

Don't give 'em any ideas. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #132

Look at the study hack89 Jan 2014 #69

You're right. It's the gang bangers kcr Jan 2014 #78

No - Two different problems. Two different solutions. That's all. nt hack89 Jan 2014 #88

So explain to me how leaving them out of the numbers is supposed to help? kcr Jan 2014 #90

You have to separate the issues to solve the issues hack89 Jan 2014 #97

Why? Because you say they are? kcr Jan 2014 #99

Criminal involvement is a huge issue after 15 hack89 Jan 2014 #103

I'm not ignoring anything kcr Jan 2014 #108

They don't need to be eliminated hack89 Jan 2014 #111

But I don't accept that. And how have you changed your view? kcr Jan 2014 #113

Because there is a massive jump in gun injuries after 15 hack89 Jan 2014 #114

Um. Dead kids aren't irrelevant? kcr Jan 2014 #117

We are talking about causes. Stop evading the question hack89 Jan 2014 #119

Look, I know what you're trying to say. kcr Jan 2014 #118

Ok. Nt hack89 Jan 2014 #120

If they had they courage of their convictions, they would come and say it: Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #124

Who is "they," Warren? Race card's out early, isn't it? Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #129

This message was self-deleted by its author kcr Jan 2014 #133

That would be those who want to remove the "gang bangers" from the numbers kcr Jan 2014 #137

So, name them. I'll wait. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #146

What's wrong, your monitor broken? kcr Jan 2014 #147

You're saying Hack is a racist? Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #156

Racism is certainly one explanation for thinking "gang bangers" don't count kcr Jan 2014 #161

So you are accusing Hack of racism? Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #163

lol! kcr Jan 2014 #164

Maybe if we raised the age at which people could own guns, like 25 say, those numbers sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #176

Irrelevant to criminals hack89 Jan 2014 #184

There was no intent to help at all. The idea was to prevent any harm to gun owners. n/t A Simple Game Jan 2014 #102

I think so, too. kcr Jan 2014 #105

Sure they do... Just not as children... Lost_Count Jan 2014 #157

But they do as adolescents. n/t kcr Jan 2014 #158

I've not often seen a severe case of triple-dog dipshittery here. Scootaloo Jan 2014 #166

There is a huge leap in gun injuries at 15 hack89 Jan 2014 #182

Adults are children too.....think about the chillins ileus Jan 2014 #186

Owners should be required to keep their weapons abelenkpe Jan 2014 #7

Some of these children can legally own their own guns hack89 Jan 2014 #11

Well that is a problem. Not responsible enough to buy a beer, responsible enough to own a gun. Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #75

So 18 year olds are children. ok .nt hack89 Jan 2014 #86

Legally yes, I am sure you realize. So case closed. anneboleyn Jan 2014 #151

Link please? hack89 Jan 2014 #185

Responsible enough to vote. Responsible enough to own a gun. nt hack89 Jan 2014 #87

Why did you draw the line at voting and guns and not include - actually, drop - alcohol? cui bono Jan 2014 #101

I support 18 as the drinking age - that is the age I grew up with. Nt hack89 Jan 2014 #106

But that's not the law now. n/t cui bono Jan 2014 #107

What is the number when you take out the people who are obviously not children (18-19)? Taitertots Jan 2014 #9

lets take apart the dataset until we get acceptable results? Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #16

The acceptable result is the rate for children, not intentionally misrepresenting facts by.... Taitertots Jan 2014 #19

The report is titled "Hospitalizations Due to Firearm Injuries in Children and Adolescents" struggle4progress Jan 2014 #24

Do you think a 19 year old is an adolescent? Taitertots Jan 2014 #28

"... Adolescence describes the teenage years between 13 and 19 and can be considered struggle4progress Jan 2014 #32

Does the data set include 18 &19 yo soldiers? pintobean Jan 2014 #20

The data set is constructed from billing record information provided by a number of US hospitals: struggle4progress Jan 2014 #49

I guess I needed the sarcasm thingy. /nt pintobean Jan 2014 #50

Actually you might not. DragonBorn Jan 2014 #116

Where does the National Safety Council put the age? Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #130

"... there were an estimated 7391 .. hospitalizations of children and adolescents due to firearm struggle4progress Jan 2014 #22

The full report is available, you obviously didn't read it because you are misrepresenting the facts Taitertots Jan 2014 #26

"... Adolescence describes the teenage years between 13 and 19 and can be considered struggle4progress Jan 2014 #31

An 18-19 year old is not in adolescence by any legal, cultural, or reasonable standard Taitertots Jan 2014 #39

So they can drink alcohol? jeff47 Jan 2014 #43

Really? kcr Jan 2014 #46

The study is published in PEDIATRICS, the official (and peer-reviewed) journal struggle4progress Jan 2014 #51

You have no idea what you're talking about. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #58

The idea isn't to know what you are talking about, the idea is to prevent A Simple Game Jan 2014 #109

yes, the numbers aren't so bad since 18 and 19 year olds getting killed isn't as tragic I guess... CreekDog Jan 2014 #68

K & R for sad reality Lifelong Protester Jan 2014 #10

I assumed it was keeping track of those under 21.... Sheepshank Jan 2014 #12

Hate to burst your bubble, sked14 Jan 2014 #167

Perhpas re-reading would help you out a little....so no bubbles have been burst..thx Sheepshank Jan 2014 #188

Put in this context, now I understand it. sked14 Jan 2014 #189

Excerpt: struggle4progress Jan 2014 #17

These aren't children, the NRA said so. Kingofalldems Jan 2014 #29

190,000 kids injured. 5,000 killed, 535 a day affected overall The Straight Story Jan 2014 #30

Gee, how did those drinking and driving laws happen? kcr Jan 2014 #36

Think of the children!!! clffrdjk Jan 2014 #44

No, more like think of the children! kcr Jan 2014 #47

No it doesn't work that way clffrdjk Jan 2014 #56

It doesn't work that way why? Because you say so? kcr Jan 2014 #59

So you are seeing serious calls for action against swimming pool, alcohol and car accidents? clffrdjk Jan 2014 #83

Right. I guess I missed the news story kcr Jan 2014 #84

Oh so their lives are more valuable than others, their deaths mean more than others clffrdjk Jan 2014 #92

Awesome complete nonsequitur kcr Jan 2014 #94

Nonsequitur eh clffrdjk Jan 2014 #110

Your conclusion that people should be starting threads about pools kcr Jan 2014 #115

You incorrectly state my conclusion clffrdjk Jan 2014 #122

And that's a ridiculous conclusion kcr Jan 2014 #123

Your going to have to go a little deeper to prove it ridiculous. clffrdjk Jan 2014 #125

It's not about valuing one death over another kcr Jan 2014 #127

If the value was the same the reaction would be the same. clffrdjk Jan 2014 #128

No, that's overly simplistic. Millions of people die every year. kcr Jan 2014 #131

So which is it clffrdjk Jan 2014 #134

How was my last sentence explaining how you're right? kcr Jan 2014 #135

Your last sentence? I didn't say anything about your last sentence. And you know that is not my clffrdjk Jan 2014 #138

Pardon me, last post. But same thing kcr Jan 2014 #139

If you can't make the connection between what I quoted from you and my conclusion clffrdjk Jan 2014 #140

You think the things I'm saying actually agrees with you kcr Jan 2014 #141

Are you done building that straw man? clffrdjk Jan 2014 #144

Death is death. But the causes aren't the same. kcr Jan 2014 #145

You do understand that the first half of that post proves my point clffrdjk Jan 2014 #148

No, I don't kcr Jan 2014 #149

Well then goodnight. clffrdjk Jan 2014 #152

Gee, how did those don't shoot people laws happen? The Straight Story Jan 2014 #53

My point was more about your misdirection than anything kcr Jan 2014 #57

Than it was a poor choice of words on my part The Straight Story Jan 2014 #63

How many stories on the news do you see about massive violent attacks involving alcohol? kcr Jan 2014 #70

It's not an either or situation. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #54

No, the reason behind such things The Straight Story Jan 2014 #60

Oh now the "guns are just a tool" argument. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #64

Take out the gang bangers if you want to be taken seriously badtoworse Jan 2014 #41

You're right. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #76

That segment needs MORE attention, of course. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2014 #82

I don't know that you shouldn't. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #85

Me, either. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2014 #89

Exactly. "Only certain kids count" = Ridiculous. anneboleyn Jan 2014 #154

Yeah, because only people who label and compartmentalize and discard a certain subset of other cui bono Jan 2014 #104

Take the guns out of the hands of the 'gang bangers' and maybe they sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #178

I'm all for it, provided law abiding citizens can keep theirs. badtoworse Jan 2014 #187

Recommend.n/t Jefferson23 Jan 2014 #48

Including 18/19 year adult in this data is the way anti-gunners pad the data aikoaiko Jan 2014 #55

Yep, it's those damn "anti gunners". ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #62

it is what is. aikoaiko Jan 2014 #67

Uh huh. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #72

You accused a DUer of having "a sick mind" You should apologize. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #136

The sentiment was sick. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #150

You said someone had a "sick mind." Bully? Bull. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #153

That's waht I would call someone telling another they have to apologize kcr Jan 2014 #155

I stand by that statement. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #159

You realize that you are accusing fellow DUers in personal explicit attacks. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #162

Please feel free to put me on ignore. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #165

So what do you call du'ers who don't own guns, are not gay, are not female The Straight Story Jan 2014 #174

You brave brave soul. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #179

It has been and continues to be about the rights of fellow citizens The Straight Story Jan 2014 #181

"Children" DragonBorn Jan 2014 #66

This is the same argument Zimmerman supporters used. ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #73

Seriously your throwing out the racist card already DragonBorn Jan 2014 #93

Your minority status does not give your opinion kcr Jan 2014 #95

You have poor reading comprehension skills. DragonBorn Jan 2014 #112

Yes, I did kcr Jan 2014 #121

The legal definition of a child is: .... spin Jan 2014 #80

Was that the legal definition of an adolescent? kcr Jan 2014 #81

The term adolescent was not used in the OP or in the excerpts from the article. ... spin Jan 2014 #96

I know, those 19 years olds they had the nerve to include in that study kcr Jan 2014 #98

The fact that in 2009 7,391 children and adolescents ended up in a hospital and 6% died ... spin Jan 2014 #142

Not discounting the other issues kcr Jan 2014 #143

Yes, we do have an overall problem we need to solve concerning the issue of ... spin Jan 2014 #168

Oh. So much explained. kcr Jan 2014 #169

Well obviously there are some posters here on this thread that do feel that semantics are ... spin Jan 2014 #170

It's not expanding the meaning of the word child to cause more emotional impact. kcr Jan 2014 #172

Well, since it's pretty clear that guns are here to stay, the smart move is to discuss prevention. NYC_SKP Jan 2014 #91

I'd like to see a better study breakout in the data. AtheistCrusader Jan 2014 #100

But what about the hurt feelings of gun enthusiasts... Zenlitened Jan 2014 #126

Shopping Carts Send 66 kids per day to ERs. - Really, here's the link. Skip Intro Jan 2014 #160

shopping carts killed 20 kids in Connecticut in 5 minutes? CreekDog Jan 2014 #180

Well we should do something about that too. Warren Stupidity Jan 2014 #190

... I seem to remember posting something months ago, as part of a larger OP. cherokeeprogressive Jan 2014 #171