General Discussion

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)

42. As someone I am certain you would term as a whistle-blower hater ...

Tue Jan 28, 2014, 07:51 PM

Jan 2014

I will say (for myself and myself only):

I do not hate whistle-blowers or Manning or Snowden (though I, nor the law, would consider either of them "whistle-blowers) ... in fact, I do feel anything, in particular, about them.

What I am concerned with is the reality that from the beginning of this nation, our elected officials (and those charged with the responsible to them) have struggled with the very real challenge of balancing our individual right to privacy with the need to protect the security of those same individuals.

The arguments that I have seen in support of "whistle-blowers" seem to completely ignore that responsibility.

I will also note: No one here will pay, anywhere near, the price should those ignoring the need for balance, get it wrong. IOW ... I don't need a right to privacy, if I'm dead ... and I would gladly trade my telephone data ... hell, a transcript of my every call ... if it would prevent my love one from being killed.

This is the honest reality that I live in ... and it has nothing to do with authoritarianism-lover, fascist-enabler, or any other term you (the generic, "you&quot may wish to apply.

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Why do some citizens have such hatred for whistle-blowers? [View all] rhett o rick Jan 2014 OP

Authoritarians hate boat rockers of any kind Warpy Jan 2014 #1

Good Points... eom. KoKo Jan 2014 #107

and ego precludes them from ever admitting that they could be or have ever been wrong Puzzledtraveller Jan 2014 #137

Snowden is a little skunk ass punk thief Whisp Jan 2014 #2

Oh fuck did he piss in your bed again? HangOnKids Jan 2014 #11

Snowden doesn't fit the whistleblower definition FunkyLeprechaun Jan 2014 #34

Daniel Ellsberg says he is, bvar22 Jan 2014 #41

Well, you sure convinced me. bvar22 Jan 2014 #35

Thankyou, very gratifying to hear that. n/t Whisp Jan 2014 #36

at least that's a more honest attack Union Scribe Jan 2014 #121

I think a lot of them are born with it quinnox Jan 2014 #3

Yeah Populist_Prole Jan 2014 #40

I think it's acculterated. Not unlike the Valley Girls epidemic of the 80's. nt adirondacker Jan 2014 #124

Because they don't want only a Democratic admin... TroglodyteScholar Jan 2014 #4

Yet that's obviously what Obama wants, delrem Jan 2014 #82

Just FYI not all republicans are that way either nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #5

I totally agree that the split is between authoritarians and non-authoritarians. rhett o rick Jan 2014 #6

Again we differ nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #9

I have lived a long time and have found very few if any conservatives that were open-minded. rhett o rick Jan 2014 #12

Perhaps it has to do with covering politics nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #15

Your "Progressive" friends really aren't, Nadine... ReRe Jan 2014 #61

Yes, yes they are nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #66

Uh... ReRe Jan 2014 #70

No, it is fear, and what it does to the mind nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #72

Ahhhh... ReRe Jan 2014 #79

Oh you welcome nadinbrzezinski Jan 2014 #85

Because not everyone believes they are whistleblowers. jeff47 Jan 2014 #7

Flawed analogy. Individuals have a right to privacy. Luminous Animal Jan 2014 #10

So they redacted the names and other identifying information first. jeff47 Jan 2014 #13

Are you serious? Donald Ian Rankin Jan 2014 #39

Should gov't be allowed secret interpretations of laws judged in secret courts, delrem Jan 2014 #86

+1 Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #119

PROPAGANDA. woo me with science Jan 2014 #8

funny that one of the biggest Woo things here is about the NSA. Whisp Jan 2014 #16

I guess you're not too worried about the NSA IveWornAHundredPants Jan 2014 #57

hey, if one is a Stasi-bot, what's to be afraid of, right? Whisp Jan 2014 #80

I remember an interview I saw with Daniel Ellsberg . . . markpkessinger Jan 2014 #14

because Obama is in charge, if Bush were in charge, we'd love these people unconditionally La Lioness Priyanka Jan 2014 #17

Pretty much. neverforget Jan 2014 #30

Hammer meet nail. alarimer Jan 2014 #75

... 840high Jan 2014 #99

They love authority, hate critical thinking and are scared of change. Rex Jan 2014 #18

Yes, but what about the Democrats who have reacted so viscerally to Manning and Snowden? markpkessinger Jan 2014 #21

Yeah seen it from a handful of people that post here. Rex Jan 2014 #28

It really IS a handful BelgianMadCow Jan 2014 #73

yeah, its really important to them, job description, reviews, raises, stuff like that I guess reddread Jan 2014 #136

Not just hatred - its seething rage with some pretty violent rhetoric. riderinthestorm Jan 2014 #19

I thought Daniel Ellsberg was a hero. I think Snowden is a self-aggrandizing punk. 11 Bravo Jan 2014 #20

Daniel Ellsberg disagrees with you n/t markpkessinger Jan 2014 #22

I'm well aware of that. I have the ability to agree with individuals on some matters ... 11 Bravo Jan 2014 #24

On the other hand, Ellsberg's judgement is after experience of putting his life on the line. delrem Jan 2014 #87

I'm not quite sure that having a sound or valid opinion on this discussion is predicated on having o LanternWaste Jan 2014 #126

Then you haven't thought it through. nt delrem Jan 2014 #131

Then by your rules I'm allowed to have an opinion about going to war. Are you? 11 Bravo Jan 2014 #135

You deliberately misinterpret. delrem Jan 2014 #139

Interesting tactic. First claim that you said something you demonstrably did NOT say ... 11 Bravo Jan 2014 #140

This conversation is now officially crazy. delrem Jan 2014 #141

Let's see, you've gone from claiming to have said things you didn't say to claiming that ... 11 Bravo Jan 2014 #142

**BANGS HEAD AGAINST WALL** delrem Jan 2014 #143

Could the difference be based on who was president at the time of the whistle-blowing? nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #62

Nope, the difference is that Ellsberg went to US Senators, the US media, and eventually to trial. 11 Bravo Jan 2014 #67

Shows how times have changed. Ellsberg understands. nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #68

After this, therefore because of this. LanternWaste Jan 2014 #127

Given that they treated Manning incredibly inhumanely, I can hardly blame him. alarimer Jan 2014 #76

the people who side with the authoritarians and right wing assholes frwrfpos Jan 2014 #23

Because Obama. WorseBeforeBetter Jan 2014 #25

They are authoritarians. blackspade Jan 2014 #26

Because... "GET OFF MY LAWN !!!" WillyT Jan 2014 #27

Well said. nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #60

I think for *most* people it's very traumatic when their bubbles are popped. delrem Jan 2014 #94

Great Points, All !!! WillyT Jan 2014 #95

BartCop has lost his shit over Snowden -- Hell Hath No Fury Jan 2014 #29

Indeed. n/t xocet Jan 2014 #50

Well I think it is a bit more nuanced then what you are talking about. iandhr Jan 2014 #31

Authoritarians also feel threatened by people who are smarter than they are and see what sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #32

Wow ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #45

I think she means when they "lash out", kinda like you did in your post. Didnt you rhett o rick Jan 2014 #51

Noting someone's tone and the content of their post is lashing out? n/t 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #65

I know... I had to giggle Whisp Jan 2014 #88

It's pompous to speak about one's experiences with Bush supporters? Are you unaware sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #104

You like Authoritarians? I had the Bush gang in mind. Bush's loyal supporters who sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #100

Not particularly ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #103

So how would you describe Freepers then? sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #105

I don't ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #106

Really? We should be cosidering it is THEIR votes that get people like Bush/Cheney and sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #109

No ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #110

Well, I don't know any Democrats who are 'anti-anything' Democrats do. Who are these sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #111

You. for one ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #114

Ah, the purity test. I wondered how long it would take. You could not answer my question, so you go sabrina 1 Jan 2014 #115

Okay... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #116

Yes, it's your fault. delrem Feb 2014 #144

I don't "Identify" ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2014 #147

I think it's more likely that they lash out because they are afraid. They believe the propaganda rhett o rick Jan 2014 #52

Great post LeftOfWest Jan 2014 #122

Couldn't agree more, and will add one more thing. Waiting For Everyman Jan 2014 #125

I watched a very interesting film regarding this (in a general way) etherealtruth Jan 2014 #33

Sounds interesting. Thanks. nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #37

You will need to dig deeper to find those who truly 'hate' Snowden or other thieves. randome Jan 2014 #38

As someone I am certain you would term as a whistle-blower hater ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #42

I appreciate your decent argument. But the choice isnt between the NSA having your personal rhett o rick Jan 2014 #54

No ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #81

There is no evidence that the NSA program has saved even one life, or prevented anything. alarimer Jan 2014 #78

As with most national security matters ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2014 #84

So if the NSA added an extreme-McAssassination program delrem Feb 2014 #145

"extreme-McAssassination program"? ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2014 #146

No, I didn't just take a "snippet" of your response, delrem Feb 2014 #148

Okay n/t 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2014 #149

they don't treestar Jan 2014 #43

Those that denied that the NSA was spying have had to change their stance rhett o rick Jan 2014 #59

They lack courage and they're reminded of this deficiency by Snowden, Manning, Ellsberg, etc. Smarmie Doofus Jan 2014 #44

I agree. They were raised to follow an authoritarian figure and not think for themselves. rhett o rick Jan 2014 #64

Programming. It starts with the Pledge of Allegiance LittleBlue Jan 2014 #46

Taking the blinders off what the government is actually willing and capable of doing MyNameGoesHere Jan 2014 #47

Fear of scary bogeymen, fear of the people, and fear of rocking the establishment boat. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2014 #48

Has there been some rash of attacks on Michael Hastings? struggle4progress Jan 2014 #49

You bring up exactly what I am talking about. Immediately after his crash rhett o rick Jan 2014 #58

hahahahahaha! Whisp Jan 2014 #90

I notice that you guys really have no come back. You think that ridicule and mocking is rhett o rick Jan 2014 #101

Bwhahahahahahaha! zappaman Jan 2014 #93

No DU isnt authoritarian. Again you must lower yourself to lies. You dont support positions just rhett o rick Jan 2014 #102

Lol! zappaman Jan 2014 #112

oh myyy, I didn't see that till now. Whisp Jan 2014 #117

There is no woo like NSA woo here. Whisp Jan 2014 #89

. Bobbie Jo Jan 2014 #133

... heh Whisp Jan 2014 #134

i love whistle blowers iamthebandfanman Jan 2014 #53

+1 nt Adrahil Jan 2014 #91

A big factor is also widespread acceptance of The Big Lie that "We Are At War" Maedhros Jan 2014 #55

Well said.nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #56

You have laid out the basic problem quite clearly RC Jan 2014 #69

+1. nt bemildred Jan 2014 #77

Something to do with equating them with tattletales and snitches. alphafemale Jan 2014 #63

Mushrooms hate the light whatchamacallit Jan 2014 #71

LOL this wins for most passive aggressive post evah! Adrahil Jan 2014 #74

"other issues" bobduca Jan 2014 #96

I can see you to are playing the same game. Adrahil Jan 2014 #97

It was the premise of the OP bobduca Jan 2014 #98

I had assumed you agreed with that characterization... Adrahil Jan 2014 #108

I think Bill Maher said it best ecstatic Jan 2014 #83

Why do some supposed "liberal Democrats" have such hatred for a sitting Democratic president? baldguy Jan 2014 #92

the truth is SO much worse than we can guess or expect, with secrecy we have no bearings reddread Jan 2014 #113

The only thing Snowden blows is chunks. He is no whistleblower. Whisp Jan 2014 #118

I couldn't agree more! What did he reveal that we didn't already know? B Calm Feb 2014 #150

Best I can tell there are three types. JoeyT Jan 2014 #120

I think you covered it pretty well. nm rhett o rick Jan 2014 #123

well said...Recommend! KoKo Jan 2014 #132

Not all whistle-blowers are created equal. riqster Jan 2014 #128

While I may disagree with some specifics, I do agree with your overall point. rhett o rick Jan 2014 #129

I think to some degree that ignorance is a manifestation of misplaced trust. riqster Jan 2014 #130

Depends on if said whistleblower(s) makes their idol look bad. Puzzledtraveller Jan 2014 #138