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In reply to the discussion: Why your childhood memories may not actually have happened. [View all]Igel
(37,692 posts)48. There was such a case in a private daycare in the '80s.
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Child+Testimony+in+Day+Care+Center+Sexual+Abuse+Cases
It's a reasonable summary. Testimony about things that were impossible. Difficulty separating fact from fantasy.
False memories can happen quickly in childhood. It makes child testimony a legal minefield.
Add to that the little problem that we revise memories when we access them--it's not like reading a book where the print is unchanged during the reading. We activate the memories in the parts of the brain where they're stored. We pick them up. Look at them. Turn them over. And there's feedback, so as we realize that the memory's skewed or incomplete we can add to them. This isn't conscious. It happens--and it makes memories open to suggestion unless there's collaborating physical evidence.
When we recall the memory again we recall the revised memory; we recall what we recalled, not necessarily the original. The best witness is a person who, on the stand, has never considered what s/he's giving testimony about. It's jumbled, but there's no chance of revision. If there are inconsistencies, there are inconsistencies--rather than a consistency manufactured days, weeks, or months after the event, informed by all sorts of other information.
This isn't my speculation. You marry a psycholinguist, you go to psychology seminars, you learn a thing or two. Does it happen every single time? Of course not. But if you're going to convict somebody--even in the court of public opinion--you have to know how memory works. Otherwise you're basically conducting a private kangaroo court.
So the best attitude when it's he-said/she-said is to be agnostic. Is it just to the accuser? Of course not. But accepting the accuser's word at face value is also unjust. Justice is very elusive in these kinds of situations.
It's a reasonable summary. Testimony about things that were impossible. Difficulty separating fact from fantasy.
False memories can happen quickly in childhood. It makes child testimony a legal minefield.
Add to that the little problem that we revise memories when we access them--it's not like reading a book where the print is unchanged during the reading. We activate the memories in the parts of the brain where they're stored. We pick them up. Look at them. Turn them over. And there's feedback, so as we realize that the memory's skewed or incomplete we can add to them. This isn't conscious. It happens--and it makes memories open to suggestion unless there's collaborating physical evidence.
When we recall the memory again we recall the revised memory; we recall what we recalled, not necessarily the original. The best witness is a person who, on the stand, has never considered what s/he's giving testimony about. It's jumbled, but there's no chance of revision. If there are inconsistencies, there are inconsistencies--rather than a consistency manufactured days, weeks, or months after the event, informed by all sorts of other information.
This isn't my speculation. You marry a psycholinguist, you go to psychology seminars, you learn a thing or two. Does it happen every single time? Of course not. But if you're going to convict somebody--even in the court of public opinion--you have to know how memory works. Otherwise you're basically conducting a private kangaroo court.
So the best attitude when it's he-said/she-said is to be agnostic. Is it just to the accuser? Of course not. But accepting the accuser's word at face value is also unjust. Justice is very elusive in these kinds of situations.
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Very much so, false memories can come from dreams. They can even come from media like movies.
Kurska
Feb 2014
#6
I counted 15 but may have missed one when the person in the fake fur suit got in the way. There w
uppityperson
Feb 2014
#7
Nope. I can't remember the stat, but I think it was something like 40-50% of those
Common Sense Party
Feb 2014
#18
I was just thinking or wondering rather...would men or women be more or less likely to see the
VanillaRhapsody
Feb 2014
#81
It's a good question. As a guy, I know I am woefully oblivious to changes in detail
Common Sense Party
Feb 2014
#87
Thanks for adding to that. It will certainly get a laugh during our study group discussions.
KittyWampus
Feb 2014
#148
got the fifteen passes, may not have seen the gorilla if someone had not posted it before i watched.
loli phabay
Feb 2014
#22
You had me until your last 2 sentences. Unfortunately, the nature of hidden abuse is that
uppityperson
Feb 2014
#4
OP defines what was meant by "solid evidence" further downthread. Take all allegations
uppityperson
Feb 2014
#47
To me, discount means not believing a person when they say what happened. Or not believing it
uppityperson
Feb 2014
#84
If you call anything but absolute trust, with little or no room left for doubt, "discounting"...
Silent3
Feb 2014
#85
my daughter often adamantly states that she has been to places that she has not
loli phabay
Feb 2014
#13
On the other hand, this woman that everyone is certain is either a liar or deluded, may have
Squinch
Feb 2014
#14
So all those boys who were under the impression that they were molested by priests
Squinch
Feb 2014
#20
take a step back, you believe her and thats okay but it clouds your response much the same as
loli phabay
Feb 2014
#24
Thank you, that makes more sense. You may want to edit your op because without
uppityperson
Feb 2014
#34
And yet, in your OP, you never once raised the possibility that this woman's memory - which was
Squinch
Feb 2014
#29
Ah, just random thoughts about false childhood memories, nothing to do with the case that everyone
Squinch
Feb 2014
#33
So you're not taking sides, but your comment is that childhood memories are likely not true.
Squinch
Feb 2014
#39
Some people have just made up their minds and anyone who disagrees is supporting pedophelia.
cui bono
Feb 2014
#60
Someone is putting well though out ideas about why one party in this conflict is wrong.
Squinch
Feb 2014
#116
I included links that would be readily understood by most people and provide a general introduction.
Kurska
Feb 2014
#59
What do you have to see about the frequency of child abuse vs. the rarity of false accusations?
BainsBane
Feb 2014
#66
"It means that we should be cautious when we examine such allegations and nothing more or less."
JTFrog
Feb 2014
#129
Wow that is a brutal selective quoting. Why on earth didn't you quote the ENTIRE SENTENCE.
Kurska
Feb 2014
#131
I can't believe this forum right now. I wish I hadn't come back into GD and seen this, and the other
redqueen
Feb 2014
#74
I have a very clear childhood memory that could never have happened..
likesmountains 52
Feb 2014
#23
So clearly, the only thing we can conclude then is kitchens never existed in your childhood.
kcr
Feb 2014
#38
The other problem with the false memories idea is that she first reported it right after it had
Squinch
Feb 2014
#42
"assumption that Dylan Farrow is either lying, delusional, or deranged." No you're wrong
Kurska
Feb 2014
#76
I just know that if someone asked me if this had happened I would say yes..
likesmountains 52
Feb 2014
#57
And yet there are children who were most definitely sexually abused and when they finally decide
justiceischeap
Feb 2014
#52
Thanks to you also for wading through all this sewage in order to try to shed some light. nt
redqueen
Feb 2014
#124
I have several siblings. When we get together, we talk about our childhood memories.
JDPriestly
Feb 2014
#82
It does suggest that SOME adults who remember being abused as children have false memories.
Kurska
Feb 2014
#106
A friend is going through a very horrible and nasty divorce and custody battle
Horse with no Name
Feb 2014
#105
Dylan's experiences were documented at the time. So there's less chance than with most of us.
pnwmom
Feb 2014
#108