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Armstead

(47,803 posts)

17. Yes, I agree denial is a factor. It's been a drip,drip,drip over the years

Sun Feb 9, 2014, 09:22 AM

Feb 2014

What really gets me (at age 61) is that we now have no ethical expectations of business or politics anymore.

I don't want to idealize the past, but one thing is very clear to me. Business behavior and "values" that would have been considered inconceivable and beyond the pale 40 years ago are commonplace now.

Like the contrast between the wages of those at the top and the middle and bottom. There have always been the wealthy -- but the difference between what the wealthy get now and then is staggering. Especially when contrasted with what has happen to overall incomes for the rest of us.

If someone from back then were to come here now, they wouldn't believe it -- and they wouldn't believe we accept it.

Somehow we've got to reverse the drip,drip,drip that got us to this sorry state.

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A serious question about Bernie Sanders [View all] Armstead Feb 2014 OP

It's possible that the politics haven't quite caught up to the reality most people face. Smarmie Doofus Feb 2014 #1

"it is hard to make a man understand... awoke_in_2003 Feb 2014 #80

Excellent post! Enthusiast Feb 2014 #83

Great post! YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #91

I agree with your assessment. glinda Feb 2014 #2

I think the thing about speaking straight is important Armstead Feb 2014 #14

I think you already answered it. It's the money. All the money that's spent to pave the Dark n Stormy Knight Feb 2014 #3

I agree, it's the money. nm rhett o rick Feb 2014 #6

Yep. Because those with loads of dough continually buy power and influence, Dark n Stormy Knight Feb 2014 #8

Yes but... Armstead Feb 2014 #16

So give me a guess how much percentage of liberal dollars compared to conservative dollars are spent rhett o rick Feb 2014 #62

Not enough, I' ll grant you, but... Armstead Feb 2014 #65

I will never stop fighting but I think that being pragmatic, we are badly losing the war. rhett o rick Feb 2014 #70

Enh, In all honesty I guess it depends on focusing on the donut or the hole Armstead Feb 2014 #73

Yes we win a skirmish or two but what do you see coming down the road? nm rhett o rick Feb 2014 #78

A lot of them do. And hell, look who the Finance Chair of the DNC is cali Feb 2014 #67

There may be some wealthy liberals and they may give their money to Democrats but rhett o rick Feb 2014 #79

I know the money has a lot to do with it, but it's not everything Armstead Feb 2014 #15

And Obama got a lot of support in some traditionally Republican-friendly parts of the country... YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #99

DC is the bubble. blkmusclmachine Feb 2014 #4

Here ya go: DeSwiss Feb 2014 #5

Abso-effing-lutely. Sooooooooo very true and important! Dark n Stormy Knight Feb 2014 #9

k&r nt bananas Feb 2014 #20

Ding Ding Ding! nt. adirondacker Feb 2014 #49

I and many other DUers are asking the same questions. JDPriestly Feb 2014 #7

"I saved a thousand slaves. I could have saved a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves. jtuck004 Feb 2014 #10

Yes, I agree denial is a factor. It's been a drip,drip,drip over the years Armstead Feb 2014 #17

I'm 59, and agree completely. Except I think we are toast. At least jtuck004 Feb 2014 #26

I'm getting to tyhe point of being like my mother used to say... Armstead Feb 2014 #42

I am also beginning to see what she meant. And that is not good. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #85

Forty years ago, the capitalists had a competing system........ socialist_n_TN Feb 2014 #51

You are exactly correct. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #86

Call me crazy, but social democracy seems like a pretty good alternative... Hippo_Tron Feb 2014 #104

Agree 100%. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #84

I've never read that quote from Harriet Tubman. Le Taz Hot Feb 2014 #47

Answer: Money. blackspade Feb 2014 #11

This may sound naive -- But i believe a lot of peope with money agree with Sanders principles Armstead Feb 2014 #19

The limits of economic determinism... Eleanors38 Feb 2014 #31

I agree -- It makes it harder but not impossible Armstead Feb 2014 #35

Your assessment is not off base, but polynomial Feb 2014 #12

Bernie Sanders always gets my vote. democrank Feb 2014 #13

I think I agree. Yes back to basics is important Armstead Feb 2014 #18

Well, ProSense Feb 2014 #21

Yes, we must appease - oops! I mean compromise with - extreme ultra-right wing crackpots! bananas Feb 2014 #24

No, ProSense Feb 2014 #27

A few token democrats to show how much they care abelenkpe Feb 2014 #56

Sanders isn't alone Armstead Feb 2014 #28

I meant ProSense Feb 2014 #29

Yes, things are starting to move in the right direction.... YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #92

Same reason Phil Donohue was kicked off NBC. nt bananas Feb 2014 #22

Most Dem leaders are bought and most Dem followers are, well, followers. Baaaaa polichick Feb 2014 #23

But are they "baaaaaa" or just feeling fatalistic and defeated? Armstead Feb 2014 #38

imo some people in Obama's coalition are still clinging to hope... polichick Feb 2014 #63

True but my point was that the enthusiasm was there and... Armstead Feb 2014 #64

Well, once burned and all that - or in a lot of cases, many times burned... polichick Feb 2014 #69

I see a lot of "somethings" real -- but you're correct in that it's fragile Armstead Feb 2014 #72

I mean they'd rally for a movement that's real... polichick Feb 2014 #75

I agree with you 100 percent on that...(or 90 percent to leave a margin for error) Armstead Feb 2014 #76

Yeah. I've about had it with populist cons by corporate Dems. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #87

"Why" is an oft-repeated theme, here.... Eleanors38 Feb 2014 #25

Yes, I've seen it happen over the last 40 years Armstead Feb 2014 #30

Anyone know if TV viewing rates are significantly different in Vermont compared with the US overall? muriel_volestrangler Feb 2014 #32

I think the smaller population does make politics more personal Armstead Feb 2014 #33

The Party is controlled by corporate money. They get to vet our candidates. That simple. nt Romulox Feb 2014 #34

Not so simple -- We LET them vet our candidates Armstead Feb 2014 #37

Oh nonsense. "We" don't have millions to spend. Hillary 2016! nt Romulox Feb 2014 #40

Hillary 2008! Armstead Feb 2014 #44

They get to vet them because almost nobody participates in MineralMan Feb 2014 #41

And the millions of dollars spent by corporate donors? Merely incidental to the process, I guess. Romulox Feb 2014 #50

A lot of people don't have the free time or resources to do that YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #94

Everyone decides his or her own priorities, of course. nt MineralMan Feb 2014 #106

Maybe because fredamae Feb 2014 #36

That's part of what I'm talking about Armstead Feb 2014 #39

Serious, in depth fredamae Feb 2014 #43

I think the rank-and-file Democrats Le Taz Hot Feb 2014 #45

I agree with that Armstead Feb 2014 #46

Yeah, but I can't change it. Le Taz Hot Feb 2014 #48

How about Dr. Who? he's British and kind of zany Armstead Feb 2014 #52

To be honest, Le Taz Hot Feb 2014 #53

"Das Party"....very funny. lol! glinda Feb 2014 #58

I thought so too. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #88

I agree with this post. YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #97

First we must understand that Democrats are not the Democratic Party. The party is a Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #54

Actually, Pat Leahy is worth even less than Bernie- and Leahy has been in the Senate cali Feb 2014 #71

No - it's becausw MOST people aren't as liberal as he is. brooklynite Feb 2014 #55

And why not? Armstead Feb 2014 #57

On the issues Bernie is dead center. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #89

Gallup Poll might suggest you re-think what you are saying. truedelphi Feb 2014 #90

Most people are more liberal on specific issues YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #93

According to Fox news and the like, liberal means.... Armstead Feb 2014 #103

I love Bernie Sanders but why did he vote for the FARM BILL? dotymed Feb 2014 #59

From his website Armstead Feb 2014 #60

I thought that must be some dotymed Feb 2014 #105

Don't worry about sounding like a fanboy. Most of us are huge fans of his! nt tblue37 Feb 2014 #61

You touch on something important- Bernie relates to the "rednecks" cali Feb 2014 #66

I agree the working class aspect is important, and often overlooked Armstead Feb 2014 #68

"A re-emphasis on economic progressive populism would do wonders in this day and age" YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #95

He's elected by a state treestar Feb 2014 #74

You're not adressing the point Armstead Feb 2014 #77

Why do we give up before we even try? YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #98

dunno. but Bern is awesome. nt dionysus Feb 2014 #81

On the issues I think Bernie is dead center with the American people. Enthusiast Feb 2014 #82

Glad to see this thread still rolling. Great job Armstead! nt adirondacker Feb 2014 #96

Have you seen Bernie's "South Forward" website? YoungDemCA Feb 2014 #100

I'll check it out Armstead Feb 2014 #102

The generation in charge of the party came of age between 1968 and 1984 Recursion Feb 2014 #101