General Discussion

X_Digger

(18,585 posts)

39. If you really want to see cognitive dissonance, show them the california jury instructions..

Sun Feb 9, 2014, 05:01 PM

Feb 2014

http://www.courts.ca.gov/partners/documents/calcrim_juryins.pdf#page=289

A defendant is not required to retreat. He or she is entitled to stand his or her ground and defend himself or herself and, if reasonably necessary, to pursue an assailant until the danger of (death/great bodily injury/<insert forcible and atrocious crime>] has passed. This is so even if safety could have been achieved by retreating.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

107 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Are SYG laws weapon agnostic? [View all] PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 OP

Pretty sure knives are included. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #1

Just as she would be without SYG Major Nikon Feb 2014 #4

The burden of proof would be on her. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #7

NRA/ALEC fantasyworld nonsense Major Nikon Feb 2014 #9

Congrats on the first Godwin style loss of the thread. nt NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #10

Congrats on the God-lose Major Nikon Feb 2014 #12

I'm familiar with it. You still lost. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #14

I lost because you don't agree Major Nikon Feb 2014 #16

LOL. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #30

Genius! Major Nikon Feb 2014 #33

Are you always this dense? NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #38

So you said "Godwin" but what you really meant was "Association fallacy" Major Nikon Feb 2014 #46

I said Godwin style. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #47

This keeps getting better and better Major Nikon Feb 2014 #63

You just keep heaping on the FAIL! NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #70

Impressive word salad Major Nikon Feb 2014 #71

You should take your own advice. nt NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #72

I like you Major Nikon Feb 2014 #74

Often misunderstood, as you demonstrated just now. Allow me to clarify it some for you. Electric Monk Feb 2014 #18

*yawn* NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #29

No need for the ad hominem link NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #43

Zimmy didn't get off using SYG. LAGC Feb 2014 #25

More right wing fantasyworld mythology Major Nikon Feb 2014 #28

Wrong. LAGC Feb 2014 #36

If you really want to see cognitive dissonance, show them the california jury instructions.. X_Digger Feb 2014 #39

Exactly. LAGC Feb 2014 #41

Never mind the actual criminal defense attorneys at DU who said it was straight self-defense. X_Digger Feb 2014 #42

Actual self defense attorneys at DU? kcr Feb 2014 #49

Did you mis-read my statement? We have a few criminal defense attorneys who post here. X_Digger Feb 2014 #50

Nope, didn't misread kcr Feb 2014 #51

When you have questions about law, do you prefer a reporter or a lawyer? X_Digger Feb 2014 #52

You know where I don't seek the advice and opinions of lawyers? kcr Feb 2014 #53

You know where I don't seek legal advice? From reporters / bloggers / talking heads. X_Digger Feb 2014 #55

Well, if you don't seek them there kcr Feb 2014 #56

I spoke to quite a few. I have family in the business, as well as friends and friends-of-friends. X_Digger Feb 2014 #57

Big surprise. People you choose to associate with kcr Feb 2014 #60

Don't take my word for it, ask a defense attorney yourself. X_Digger Feb 2014 #62

I don't have to ask a defense attorney kcr Feb 2014 #67

She could have said she liked the color of his eyes.. X_Digger Feb 2014 #73

Except that she said it did. kcr Feb 2014 #78

So do you think california's jury instructions make similar cases there "SYG"? X_Digger Feb 2014 #81

Yes, I do kcr Feb 2014 #83

Lol, except california doesn't have SYG. Quite a quandry, eh? n/t X_Digger Feb 2014 #86

lol, omgz!1 kcr Feb 2014 #88

Worked yourself right into a corner, lol. X_Digger Feb 2014 #90

I admitted no such thing. I'm saying the opposite, in fact. kcr Feb 2014 #92

...anonymously Major Nikon Feb 2014 #69

And here I thought you were a Major. Imagine my disappointment. X_Digger Feb 2014 #76

In the mean time...... here's three shovels....... rdharma Feb 2014 #80

Have anything actually substantive to contribute, or are you just going to snark in passing? X_Digger Feb 2014 #82

Take your pick! nt rdharma Feb 2014 #93

So how about it? Anything substantive? X_Digger Feb 2014 #95

Something substantive? I see you decided to take a pick. rdharma Feb 2014 #98

As I expected. Snark without substance. *sigh* I had such high hopes this time. n/t X_Digger Feb 2014 #100

Get a "strong holster" for your pick and keep it safely stored. nt rdharma Feb 2014 #101

I just rang up the Almighty on the red phone Major Nikon Feb 2014 #85

Swing and a miss! Oh so close. X_Digger Feb 2014 #87

Did you not read what the attorney wrote? Major Nikon Feb 2014 #97

I read it, and it doesn't apply to this case. X_Digger Feb 2014 #99

Aww, where'd ya go? X_Digger Feb 2014 #103

Once again, the revelation of inconvenient truths has caused the ill-prepared to flee friendly_iconoclast Feb 2014 #106

Bias: Major Nikon Feb 2014 #45

He got off because the SYG law changed the definition of self-defense in Florida. Hoyt Feb 2014 #102

Burden of proof is fucked up? MattBaggins Feb 2014 #35

In making a rape victim justify her efforts to escape - yes. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #40

Sure. Iggo Feb 2014 #2

"exist so you can..." cherokeeprogressive Feb 2014 #3

You have a better explanation? Major Nikon Feb 2014 #5

How about this PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #6

Good lord man NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #8

Now, now: blueridge3210 Feb 2014 #11

You can't just finish someone off - it's murder PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #15

A gun doesn't always kill. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #21

Maybe I missed it, but I read the FL SYG statute and it does not seem to say that deadly AlinPA Feb 2014 #20

It's buried in 0776.012 and 0776.041. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #23

Thanks, I'll look for that. AlinPA Feb 2014 #24

Under florida's law you can start a fight and then kill your opponent if you are getting your ass Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #22

There are two types of force - NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #26

nontheless, you can start a fight and then legally kill the person you attacked. Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #31

Only if you were in imminent risk of death and could not escape. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #32

yes. Some people (here included) conflate syg laws with rkba - but they are separate. Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #13

Agree. It's not a RKBA issue at all. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #17

Yes PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #19

Yes, it is.. X_Digger Feb 2014 #27

It is not flame bait PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #34

And another canard.. X_Digger Feb 2014 #37

I can't legally carry a sword, folding baton, etc. But any yahoo can get a gun toting permit. Hoyt Feb 2014 #44

Only a nutjob would openly carry a sword in public..... claiming it was for "self defense". rdharma Feb 2014 #84

That's the way I feel about gunz. People claim self-defense, but it's usually something else Hoyt Feb 2014 #91

I'm not sure about drowning someone or throwing them off a building ... spin Feb 2014 #48

I'm confused. What does "agnostic" have to do with this thread? lob1 Feb 2014 #54

agnostic PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #58

Thanks, PowertothePeople. I never heard the word used that way. lob1 Feb 2014 #61

I'm interested in the answers to this question: freshwest Feb 2014 #59

I am a fan of the burning alive SYG PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #64

I'm a Wham and Zoolander fan (a little) but I don't see a SYG there... n/t freshwest Feb 2014 #66

True, but the idea is PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #68

Teabaggers would love that option, the whole world is a violent riot in their eyes. Too much TV! n/t freshwest Feb 2014 #75

Yup, that is what RKBA and SYG have created; PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #77

Honestly, the media has accomplished this just as well. NutmegYankee Feb 2014 #79

I believe most such laws simply specify the "use of lethal force." Lizzie Poppet Feb 2014 #65

I've always liked the M-79 w/ M-576 rounds for self-defense....... rdharma Feb 2014 #89

Uh-huh... Lizzie Poppet Feb 2014 #94

Oh, darned! I thought I could get me some luv from serious gun enthusiasts....... rdharma Feb 2014 #96

I believe the concept is, if you have a right to be where you are, Skip Intro Feb 2014 #104

Doesn't specify specific weapons madville Feb 2014 #105

What? And ruin a perfectly good anti-gun rant in GD? Eleanors38 Feb 2014 #107