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TorchTheWitch

(11,065 posts)
12. And the law doesn't allow someone to assume they see a weapon
Mon Feb 17, 2014, 02:52 AM
Feb 2014

The law also doesn't allow you to shoot someone who has threatened you with a weapon but for whatever reason retreats as Dunn claimed in one of his multiple stories - that Davis was getting back into the car when Dunn shot him (ie: Davis was not a threat at the time because according to Dunn he was getting back into the car and thus retreating. And seeing as there was a ton of evidence that there was no weapon I don't believe the jury believed there ever was. The defense tried to claim that during the time the car of teenagers left the parking spot and when they came back that they could have stashed a weapon in the bushes, except that independent witnesses testified that the only time any of them got out of the car was when they realized that Davis was badly hurt, two of them got out of the car and went to Davis's side to try to help him - no weapon, and no one from the car trying to stash a weapon in shrubbery or a trash bin or whatever. Further, no weapon was discovered anywhere near the scene. Dunn was never shot at, and his actions of getting out of his car, and circled behind it making a huge target of himself in order to continue shooting at the fleeing car. Had he believed they had a gun he would never have made such a target of himself. Also, Dunn's actions after leaving the scene and going back to his hotel show that though he claims he was terrified that these gun toting kids were going to come after him he parked right in front of the hotel, left his gun in the car and took his dog out for a walk. He also never called the police to tell them that a car full of kids with a gun were driving around threatening people and he was terrified they were coming after him. On top of that, his own fiance - a DEFENSE witness, on rebuttal testimony swore that at no time did Dunn ever tell her he saw that the kids in the car had a gun or some other gun-like thing that he believed was a gun.

So, where does SYG come in to this case? It doesn't. There is simply FAR too much evidence that proved not only that there was no gun or gun-looking thing but that Dunn at no time believed that they had a gun or a gun-looking thing. Further, even with SYG language included in Florida's self-defense law, it says that there must be an immediate threat of imminent death or serious bodily harm. Again, the evidence showed clear as a bell that there never was an immediate threat of imminent death or serious bodily harm. This is likely why the first thing the jury asked for was to see the dummy and the sticks after watching testimony from the medical examiner that proved that Davis was shot while sitting in the back passenger seat in the car and that he was shot when his door was closed. Even with Dunn changing his story to try to fit the ME's findings in claiming that he shot Davis while Davis was BACK in the car that means that he had retreated and was no longer a threat at the time that Dunn fired at him.

In this case, SYG was not at issue - Dunn was never threatened with imminent death or severe bodily harm. There was no gun or gun-looking thing, the law doesn't allow him to assume a weapon exists, nor does it allow him to shoot anyone when they are in retreat (assuming that Davis ever got out of the car which he didn't and which other evidence showed).

The SYG law in Florida provides that a person does not have a duty to retreat when in a public place they have a right to be when they are threatened with imminent death or severe bodily harm. Dunn was not ever threatened with imminent death or severe bodily harm even according to his own claims concerning what occurred that he testified to. Florida's self-defense law including SYG do not allow a person to assume a "thing" that did not exist in the first place is a weapon, nor does it allow a person to kill someone who is in retreat (as Dunn testified that he shot Davis when he got back into the car and was therefore in retreat and no longer an imminent threat), nor does it allow for someone to continue to shoot at a car full of people that is in retreat and when there are other people in that car that were at no time any threat.

Show me where the SYG law had anything at all to do with this case. If you're going to make the claim you should be able to back it up.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

This article is BS. DesMoinesDem Feb 2014 #1
Really? LiberalAndProud Feb 2014 #2
If the stand your ground law was used DesMoinesDem Feb 2014 #9
SYG was in the jury instructions, per the SYG law. jeff47 Feb 2014 #11
Hogwash Major Nikon Feb 2014 #16
Fact. DesMoinesDem Feb 2014 #18
It was considered by the jury, it HAD to be, so obviously it could have been a factor: Fred Sanders Feb 2014 #21
it was murder, pure and simple heaven05 Feb 2014 #30
Trying to pass off your opinions as fact doesn't do much for your credibility Major Nikon Feb 2014 #22
This shit again? X_Digger Feb 2014 #23
Que the amateur lawyer gun apologist Major Nikon Feb 2014 #24
How do you have an "intruder" on a street, Major? X_Digger Feb 2014 #26
Unless the defendant waives such a hearing. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2014 #37
And the law doesn't allow someone to assume they see a weapon TorchTheWitch Feb 2014 #12
The jury didn't just ask for the dummy with the sticks, did they? kcr Feb 2014 #13
here we go again TorchTheWitch Feb 2014 #14
Jury instructions included SYG as per the law kcr Feb 2014 #15
Did you leave out the center bit? X_Digger Feb 2014 #25
Technically, he was leftynyc Feb 2014 #41
The defense didn't "technically" use SYG, but Diamonique Feb 2014 #3
Juror instructions included consideration of SYG in their deliberations... DonViejo Feb 2014 #4
Thanks for posting this. russspeakeasy Feb 2014 #6
Did you read the full article?... DonViejo Feb 2014 #5
Fuck Ron Paul, and ALEC too nt geek tragedy Feb 2014 #7
ALEC supports the TPP. Whose side are you on? nm rhett o rick Feb 2014 #8
This message was self-deleted by its author Fred Sanders Feb 2014 #20
The prosecutors overcharged mmm413 Feb 2014 #33
The top charge should have been second degree murder, then rocktivity Feb 2014 #36
The jury instructions included the SYG language because he claimedself-defense. nt tblue37 Feb 2014 #39
Makes a statement that it is all right to shoot up a person Downwinder Feb 2014 #10
Now that's not necessarily true. A Simple Game Feb 2014 #17
Insanity is legalizing self induced ANGER as a perfectly acceptable state of mind that establishes Fred Sanders Feb 2014 #19
this is so fucked up! gopiscrap Feb 2014 #27
ok ppl settle down kamron Feb 2014 #28
Common sense should rule Lamonte Feb 2014 #29
Makes you wonder that if you are a young black man maxrandb Feb 2014 #31
Quoted for truth: Blue_Tires Feb 2014 #32
Long live the "beyond a reasonable doubt" standard! Vattel Feb 2014 #34
"Because the “stand your ground” law creates an affirmative defense for criminal defendants" it is bettyellen Feb 2014 #35
Reverse the skin color of the victim and shooter guyfromla Feb 2014 #38
Food For Thought chwaliszewski Feb 2014 #40
Has this scenario been happening? Jerry442 Feb 2014 #42
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