General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: George Zimmerman: God Is The 'Only Judge That I Have To Answer To' [View all]Tommy_Carcetti
(44,587 posts)I don't believe the court reporter even picked up that particular line, and even if she did say it, it could have any number of meanings. As you saw, she wasn't exactly that skilled in her abilities to clearly express herself. But you appear to believe that Jeantel fabricated much of her testimony to help the state's case. Again, I would ask why on earth then she would testify to a nearly all white jury that Trayvon called Zimmerman a "creepy ass cracker", especially given the undeniable racial undertones of this case? And even if you don't want to believe a word Jeantel said, her cellphone records are undeniable--she was on the phone with Trayvon up to the point of the altercation with Zimmerman, and what sort of person talks audibly on a phone while planning a sneak ambush of someone?
The jury's verdict was the jury's verdict, and without any evidence of actual jury misconduct, I'll accept it as legitimate. However, that doesn't mean I think it was 100% wrong.
Because this was a self-defense case and Zimmerman had admitted to the shooting, he was not without any affirmative burden in this case. He did have the duty to put forward a plausible argument of self-defense (not beyond a reasonable doubt, that would be the state's ultimate burden, but still he had some affirmative burden based on the nature of his case.) In this case, that means he essentially had to put forward some sort of logical sounding claim that he was ambushed by surprise and then had no choice but to use deadly force to end it because he thought his life was in danger. And I, and many other people, simply do not think he put forward any logical scenario where he was ambushed.
Many of the things you claimed created reasonable doubt I really would argue didn't matter in the greater picture. Yes, John Good said he thought he saw Trayvon on top, but it was only for a couple of seconds in the middle of the altercation. You also had Jayne Surdyka, who gave us the only 911 call that provided contemporary recorded evidence of the moment Zimmerman actually shot Trayvon. She testified seeing Zimmerman on top and believing that the voice crying for help was Trayvon. You had other witnesses also putting Zimmerman on top.
But really, in the end, you have to ask--is it likely that Zimmerman was actually ambushed by Trayvon. And Zimmerman's story is so illogical and full of holes that I simply cannot take it serious. And once his story is discarded as not being credible, then that's all she wrote. Guilty.
I know the jury's spoken and there's nothing else that can be done about that. But I really would ask you aside from the normal evidentiary burdens, what is your personal opinion on whether Zimmerman legitimately acted in self-defense? Including all of what we about Zimmerman both before and after the incident. There are some questions that need to be considered, namely:
1. Whether Zimmerman is a volatile person prone to anger, considering his past arrest for battery on a law enforcement officer, a prior restraining order taken out against him by a former girlfriend, and contentious incidents that have occurred since his acquittal, including an altercation with his former wife and father in law and an altercation with his live-in girlfriend?
2. Whether on the night of his shooting Zimmerman's emotional judgment had been clouded by the fact that he had a major argument with his wife and she had left the house as a result?
3. Why Zimmerman--who wasn't even on regular neighborhood watch duty that evening--felt the need to call police dispatch on Trayvon and claim he was "up to no good" despite the fact he had not actually observed Trayvon doing anything that appeared to be illegal?
4. Whether Zimmerman's comment, "these assholes, they always get away" indicates some level of dissatisfaction with the prior response from police and may have indicated an intent by Zimmerman to take the law into his own hands and at least attempt to detain Trayvon while police arrived?
5. Why Zimmerman felt the need to exit his car at any time during the entire incident, and even more importantly, why he felt the need to exit his car while armed with a handgun?
6. Whether Zimmerman's comment "fucking punks" indicated some level of frustration and anger Zimmerman had at Trayvon for whatever perceived violation he believes Trayvon committed?
7. Why Zimmerman changed his mind with dispatch and told police not to meet him at his car but instead to call him when they arrived (thus indicating that he might not be at his car)?
8. Why two minutes after hanging up with dispatch when he claimed he was heading back to his car and was "attacked" was not actually at his car given that it was only 100-150 feet from where he claimed to be at the time of hang up?
9. Why someone would need to cross through to the other side of street away from his car just to get a street address and then cross back and go towards his car to report the street address, when a street address was easily visible from where his car was parked?
10. Whether it is probable for someone who is being chased by a stranger for reasons unknown to that person and who then manages to escape his pursuer to almost immediately decide to double back and attack the same stranger he had tried so hard to escape?
11. Whether it is probable for someone planning a sneak ambush on somebody to remain audible on a phone up to the point of actual ambush?
12. Why did Zimmerman only suffer injuries that were described as minor and insignificant (to the point where Zimmerman refused emergency care) and then claim his head was bashed into concrete anywhere from 10 to 30 times (which would almost certainly result in much more severe injuries)?
13. Why did Zimmerman claim that he was the individual who could clearly be heard crying for help on the 911 call when he also claimed that Trayvon had his hand over his mouth?
14. When claiming he was being severely beaten by Trayvon and that the only way to stop the fight was to use his gun, why would he shoot then immediately before Trayvon had a chance to react at a gun being pointed at him?
Ask those questions to yourself honestly, and tell me even if you agree with the jury verdict (based on the burden of proof) how probable was it that Zimmerman was legitimately acting prudently and in genuine self-defense that evening.