General Discussion

Jeff In Milwaukee

(13,992 posts)

84. There's a big cultural difference

Thu Feb 27, 2014, 06:20 PM

Feb 2014

Take simply the number of U.S. officers who shot armed suspects in self defense, and you're going to get a larger number of dead suspects than in Germany. Because of our gun laws, we have a different class of criminals over here. And you could also argue that we a different class of cops.

A German cop doesn't assume that his next traffic stop is going to result in a bullet to the gut. Our cops are overly-aggressive and overly-violent -- but that's because they're dealing with a criminal element that is equally well-armed and equally aggressive.

I'm not trying to excuse the behavior of some genuinely bad cops, but given the environment that American cops are working in, I understand why they are the way they are.

Question is, what do we do about it?

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There are roughly 800,000 cops in the United States... [View all] Silent3 Feb 2014 OP

A few responses Scootaloo Feb 2014 #1

Is the impression that "government institutions... turn a blind eye"... Silent3 Feb 2014 #8

Don't ignore the hiring practices either! Beach Rat Feb 2014 #41

309 U.S. deaths by police action in 2013. 47 deaths by police action in the UK since 1922. pa28 Feb 2014 #2

Yes, but we have some of the best gun control around, and you have some of the worst. Donald Ian Rankin Feb 2014 #67

I think this hits the nail on the head... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #85

The percentage of bad cops approaches 100. All you have to do is judge it rationally. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #3

What have I tried to justify? Silent3 Feb 2014 #10

Do you really not realize that yes, this is the only thing that matters regarding this issue? Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #12

What also matters is whether cops, on the whole, do more harm than good. Silent3 Feb 2014 #13

No, it isn't. FFS, have we fallen so far down the rabbit hole that even this most fundamental Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #15

So it's not important if cops do more harm than good? Silent3 Feb 2014 #17

The Contract. You get power over me so long as I benefit, too. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #27

you have nothing to support your conclusions treestar Feb 2014 #62

It must be just awful living your entire life so in fear of bogey-men that Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #71

Are you saying there is no crime? treestar Feb 2014 #74

Bogey-man? Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #78

OK, let's say most cops are good. Kindly point them out to me. DisgustipatedinCA Feb 2014 #4

I work with a former cop AgingAmerican Feb 2014 #5

I think that it is about the only thing most Progressives and most Republicans 30cal Feb 2014 #7

"He also said that the force is 90% Republican.' HughBeaumont Feb 2014 #81

From a cops perspective it's us versus them. 30cal Feb 2014 #6

I have, once long ago, reported an assault to the police. Silent3 Feb 2014 #11

from the massive cop hatred on DU I can see why they TorchTheWitch Feb 2014 #88

The so-called "good cops" would be more convincing Heidi Feb 2014 #9

BJS maintains statistics on matters such as arrest-related deaths struggle4progress Feb 2014 #14

IOW, our police kill more Americans every year that the most successful terrorist attack in history. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #16

Something like 31000 a year die from guns here and another 33000 in traffic accidents struggle4progress Feb 2014 #19

Neither guns, motor vehicles, nor even terrorists are granted special license Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #20

It's a bundle of problems worth considering, and if you have any useful ideas, I'm sure struggle4progress Feb 2014 #21

There are literally thousands of useful plans out there. Lack of alternatives is nowhere near Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #22

BINGO! HangOnKids Feb 2014 #24

I'm a radical. Libertarian, Communist, left-wing, hippie, looney, racist, feminazi, purist, Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #36

I have an idea not sure if its a good one...all complaints against police are filed by and interview Drew Richards Feb 2014 #90

I think only larger police departments have something an Internal Affairs struggle4progress Feb 2014 #91

That doesn't appear to be true. Captain Stern Feb 2014 #38

You're right, I mis-read the reply. It doesn't change the point at all. n/t Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #40

It sort of DOES change your point Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #82

Not even close... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #79

This message was self-deleted by its author EX500rider Feb 2014 #80

My take, as someone who was a deputy some years back The Straight Story Feb 2014 #18

You were a cop. What a shock. n/t Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #37

And he offered some interesting information and solutions. nt msanthrope Feb 2014 #58

If you look at the big picture... MrScorpio Feb 2014 #23

There will be none of that fancified Big Picture gazing around here. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #30

Great reply. defacto7 Feb 2014 #32

14,612 homicides in the United States annually hfojvt Feb 2014 #33

I've read enough news accounts on DU to understand this is a big problem pacalo Feb 2014 #39

Could it be, perhaps, that what's wrong with our cops is... Silent3 Feb 2014 #56

I never said that the police don't need a lot of reforming, however, did I? Silent3 Feb 2014 #57

Germans and Americans will approach cops differently treestar Feb 2014 #61

There's a big cultural difference Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #84

314 million people (2012) / 800,000 = one per 392 people. Coyotl Feb 2014 #25

"a few bad apples spoils the barrel." is the full term, as Scootaloo said AZ Progressive Feb 2014 #26

Yay cops! stevil Feb 2014 #28

They're your enemies when you do need them as well. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #29

Example? stevil Feb 2014 #31

This message was self-deleted by its author Th1onein Feb 2014 #35

I can see the point on both ends of this argument. defacto7 Feb 2014 #34

Nowhere have I suggested that there aren't big problems to fix Silent3 Feb 2014 #54

My statement was general, not specific to you. defacto7 Feb 2014 #76

So you are willing to accept a 2% level of bad cops? MindPilot Feb 2014 #42

Like I said, queue the straw men. Silent3 Feb 2014 #47

Post removed Post removed Feb 2014 #43

Thank you for your cogent, closely COLGATE4 Feb 2014 #44

You are welcome. eom PowerToThePeople Feb 2014 #45

With the ALL CAPS response title, I thought you were being sarcastic. Silent3 Feb 2014 #48

It is probably twice that for total public criminal law enforcement FarCenter Feb 2014 #46

I'm not sure what you're arguing for, since the larger the number... Silent3 Feb 2014 #49

US law enforcement officers per 10,000 people looks about average FarCenter Feb 2014 #53

I'm sure all the dead victims and the families left behind appreciate your statistic. Rex Feb 2014 #50

I don't have any statistics DefenseLawyer Feb 2014 #51

It's not the number, it's whether criminal cops are treated like criminals. DetlefK Feb 2014 #52

It wouldn't be wrong to say that there's something wrong with the military, or with the police. Silent3 Feb 2014 #55

Cops as the base of the percentage seems wrong, indeed percentages seem minimally useful HereSince1628 Feb 2014 #59

There's nothing in what I wrote to suggest that simple percentages are the be-all... Silent3 Feb 2014 #65

Percentages, like anecdotes must be considered carefully and compared to something HereSince1628 Feb 2014 #69

Where's the threshold between appropriately sensitive and unrealistically idealistic? Silent3 Feb 2014 #75

Yes, exactly. It's a critical issue, and not really a matter of statistics per se HereSince1628 Feb 2014 #86

agreed, keep in perspective treestar Feb 2014 #60

When it happens to you then your silly op means nothing! L0oniX Feb 2014 #63

The "when it happens to you" perspective is the most important one... Silent3 Feb 2014 #64

Depends of how compassionate a person is about the victim. L0oniX Feb 2014 #66

So the only way to properly express compassion... Silent3 Feb 2014 #68

Seems like you have a list of reasons to be compassionate about the cops. L0oniX Feb 2014 #72

What does what I'm saying have to do with being "compassionate" about cops... Silent3 Feb 2014 #73

so many police because of the legal seizures of cash and assets from their 'war on drugs.' Sunlei Feb 2014 #70

Couple of things.... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #77

It isn't just an issue of mental illness...it's the problem of cops dealing with noncompliance HereSince1628 Feb 2014 #87

That's true... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #89

Bad cops are a sign of poor leadership in a community. haele Feb 2014 #83