General Discussion

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)

14. The one I saw was an NBC/CBS poll, pitting her against Repubs airc.

Fri Feb 28, 2014, 03:00 PM

Feb 2014

Since there is no other Dem being allowed in the race at this point, they should realize that it isn't Dems they need to get her elected, both parties can always pretty much count on their parties' base, it will be Independents who decide the election. And many left leaning Independents won't vote for a Corporate candidate on either side.

If there is no choice in the primaries, and that seems to the be the practice now, I know I won't be supporting any corporate candidate, or anyone who voted for the Iraq war. And I know I am not alone.

Sick to death of being told that Corporate Welfare is a 'liberal value', or cuts to SS are not really cuts, or that going around the world droning people is a liberal value, these are right wing values and I don't support Right Wing policies. If I did I would support the real thing, not the 'lite' version.

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Has the Left Surrendered? - BillMoyers.com [View all] MattSh Feb 2014 OP

my wife and I are as left/liberal as always - but it is breathtaking to see how right-ward NRaleighLiberal Feb 2014 #1

Yes, as Bill Maher said.. whathehell Feb 2014 #5

I'm a liberal product of the Sixties also. No doubt about President Obama A Simple Game Feb 2014 #40

Citation needed! seattledo Feb 2014 #53

that might be putting words into his mouth.. iamthebandfanman Feb 2014 #62

Worse: Joe Lieberman was his "mentor"...he admits to that in one of his books. loudsue Mar 2014 #116

Agree. (Obama requested Lieberman as his mentor.) merrily Mar 2014 #133

TRUE...should have been another Signal as to where he was taking us. KoKo Mar 2014 #198

I wilfully ignored or rationalized away every signal. merrily Mar 2014 #199

You did not put words in his mouth. He's expressed admiration for Reagan merrily Mar 2014 #122

Methinks Reagan gets way too much credit rurallib Mar 2014 #157

and the Bush family hides in the shadows reddread Mar 2014 #160

Citation needed! It's called google.com, try it. A Simple Game Feb 2014 #93

So you admit to not having a source seattledo Feb 2014 #101

People posting on a political message board should be able to say merrily Mar 2014 #124

one of the hallmarks of DU (& one reason I've stuck around do long) Iris Mar 2014 #135

None of which contradicts anything that I said. merrily Mar 2014 #139

Wow, I get to have some comedy this morning. Reputable sources, how funny? A Simple Game Mar 2014 #154

Just google it. He was asked during the first campaign which President had influenced him sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #104

In the 2008 primary, he and Hillary both put Reagan on their top ten merrily Mar 2014 #121

Obama is soo FAR to The Right that he is ashamed to call himself a real DEMOCRAT. bvar22 Mar 2014 #180

. dionysus Mar 2014 #193

You are preaching to the choir, but sing it, sister. merrily Mar 2014 #200

So do you think the statement is false? What is your point, "really?" nm rhett o rick Mar 2014 #182

Hell, Obama is less liberal than Nixon. I never thought I'd see the day. nt Nay Feb 2014 #90

I take your point about Obama-and most Democratic politicians, for that matter, but merrily Mar 2014 #123

We have basically been turned into untouchables, the lowest caste in the Cleita Feb 2014 #17

"even though in members we are probably the majority." Tarheel_Dem Feb 2014 #41

You will see President Kucinich or Bernie Sanders if we get campaign finance reform Cleita Feb 2014 #45

But it doesn't show that they would vote for "President" Kucinich or Bernie Sanders. Tarheel_Dem Feb 2014 #51

Yes, the majority of the population, not only the majority of Dems. merrily Mar 2014 #126

Obama RAN as a Liberal... or at least a Working Class Populist in 2008, bvar22 Feb 2014 #84

Yep. merrily Mar 2014 #127

PLUS A BRAZILLION! Enthusiast Mar 2014 #155

not mistaken, lied to Doctor_J Mar 2014 #169

"...will now vote overwhelmingly liberal given the option" LiberalLovinLug Mar 2014 #188

yep. Phlem Mar 2014 #181

Thou thinketh WRONG. We ARE the majority without whom 'you guys' wouldn't come close to winning sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #108

This. Thanks. ancianita Mar 2014 #117

And, despite all the energy put into falsely declaring it a failure, merrily Mar 2014 #128

Just so everyone knows to take your grandiose proclamations with a HUGE grain of salt..... Tarheel_Dem Mar 2014 #208

We ARE the majority. And without Liberals, 'you guys' to quote you, could not win an election. sabrina 1 Mar 2014 #216

But HRC didn't say that "RT is now viewed by 50 mil US households". Sabrina did! Tarheel_Dem Mar 2014 #217

Your premise is false. Kucinich had electibility issues that had nothing to merrily Mar 2014 #125

your assertion is baseless reddread Mar 2014 #161

Really? Phlem Mar 2014 #185

Merrily's assertion is right on the money. Enthusiast Mar 2014 #194

no more than I can see a black man or a woman being unelectable reddread Mar 2014 #195

But John Edwards was electable? n/t reddread Mar 2014 #196

No, and he didn't win the primary, either. merrily Mar 2014 #204

He wasnt there to win anything n/t reddread Mar 2014 #219

that news was out in 2007 reddread Mar 2014 #220

The general election was my issue, not the primary. merrily Mar 2014 #202

Got paid? I wish. (I missed the part where Kucinich won the Dem primary, let alone merrily Mar 2014 #201

you can apply with this outfit if thats your kind of work reddread Mar 2014 #221

I know, I love how that insistence treestar Mar 2014 #172

Liberals, even in the majority, have an uphill battle against the corporate-centrists and rhett o rick Mar 2014 #184

Most of the corporate centrists who run are already in the 1%. merrily Mar 2014 #205

True you have to convince people happy with their economic situation treestar Mar 2014 #227

We are in a class war and those among us that favor corporations and corporation sponsored rhett o rick Mar 2014 #229

You'd think so wouldn't you? But that doesn't seem to be their goal. Far from it. Tarheel_Dem Mar 2014 #203

That insistence continues because polling reinforces it again and again. merrily Mar 2014 #206

Polling, like the ones where they vote? treestar Mar 2014 #228

Your rude emoticon so noted. Your side definitely has Citizens United on your side. rhett o rick Mar 2014 #183

Even here on DU if one suggests a candidate that is to the left and is INdemo Feb 2014 #55

I can't/won't speak for anyone else, but from my experience, age often NRaleighLiberal Feb 2014 #58

Bingo ...The younger generation too. INdemo Feb 2014 #85

yes...we've found that, also. And finally tuned it out..... KoKo Feb 2014 #100

Bingo again! The whole follower thing is stunning to us.... NRaleighLiberal Feb 2014 #102

"This instrument can teach" zeemike Mar 2014 #156

Those DARK DAYS OF J. EDGAR HOOVER............. KoKo Mar 2014 #197

Yes, that was a tactic we won't be falling for anymore. In fact if I see that from now on, THAT is sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #109

It was the same here in VA when a very viable Dem challenged Eric Cantor. Nay Mar 2014 #151

The WORST example of this happened in the Arkansas Democratic Primary, 2010. bvar22 Mar 2014 #186

I remember that, and as long as the national Dems do stuff like this (or Nay Mar 2014 #191

That election told me that the Democratic party today really is the LiberalArkie Mar 2014 #226

That's the approved meme. merrily Mar 2014 #207

Some of the Left buys into the "Not as bad" rationale of the 3rd Way Centrists. Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2014 #2

...^ 840high Feb 2014 #7

Yup...I'm not buying though... truebrit71 Feb 2014 #9

Then we'd be conservative Democrats and I don't buy that for a NY second Warpy Feb 2014 #78

+1 harun Feb 2014 #87

I think many on the Left are beginning to examine the "lesser evil" theory versus merrily Mar 2014 #209

Yes. rrneck Feb 2014 #3

The Social Threads of our Society are Pulling Apart...Our Commonality is KoKo Feb 2014 #26

Yep. You can see it happen right here. rrneck Feb 2014 #63

We stopped supporting our Unions and our Unions got Infiltrated and Corrupted KoKo Feb 2014 #72

We lost the hard hats. rrneck Feb 2014 #74

Excellent Point...when Labor loses the Average Laborer who does KoKo Feb 2014 #77

If you write it, I'll read it. nt rrneck Feb 2014 #80

Not "we." I never stopped supporting unions. Politicians stopped. merrily Mar 2014 #129

this ^^^ Iris Mar 2014 #137

A couple of points: JaneyVee Feb 2014 #4

In my state the TeaBaggers had bags of money/strong ideological support KoKo Feb 2014 #23

IMO, we won't get money dotymed Feb 2014 #59

I think America will get to the point when Third Party as Counterbalance KoKo Feb 2014 #95

the electorate is going to have to mature into post-partisan politics reddread Mar 2014 #153

Anyone jumping in had better be a saint.... daleanime Feb 2014 #44

That's another problem why newbie people are reluctant to run. KoKo Feb 2014 #52

They could be a saint or they could be tough, but they better know where the money merrily Mar 2014 #136

Saint? Gary 50 Mar 2014 #167

You and I don't disagree..... daleanime Mar 2014 #178

I agree. Gary 50 Mar 2014 #192

Sorry swilton Feb 2014 #56

+1 million treestar Feb 2014 #65

The system has changed. merrily Mar 2014 #130

It's difficult to run against the corporate power structure of the DEmocratic Party machine. rhett o rick Mar 2014 #187

I don't agree that 80% of democrats 'want' Hillary for president. Those polls were Hillary V sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #6

What poll said "80 of Democrats want Hillary for president"? red dog 1 Feb 2014 #10

The one I saw was an NBC/CBS poll, pitting her against Repubs airc. sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #14

I, too, "won't be supporting any corporate candidate, or anyone who voted for the Iraq War" red dog 1 Feb 2014 #18

I would focus on Congress, which in the end is how to return power to the people. sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #39

^^THIS^^ SomethingFishy Feb 2014 #42

And would allow other steps to be taken. daleanime Feb 2014 #48

+ 1 red dog 1 Feb 2014 #89

Replace Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, for one thing. Maybe with Eliot Spitzer. ancianita Mar 2014 #118

state and local offices too justabob Feb 2014 #110

Yes, you are right, we need to be all over the place, electing only Progressive Dems and in the sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #112

Not many liberal Dems get a chance to run. merrily Mar 2014 #210

Not only did she vote for it, she dug her heels in, denying that closeupready Feb 2014 #38

Agreed. And add to that the people calling themselves liberal aren't really liberal. cui bono Feb 2014 #13

The OP touches on this. Maedhros Feb 2014 #21

"Liberal" and Democrat are interchangeable only in the RW lexicon. merrily Mar 2014 #211

I agree. HappyMe Feb 2014 #15

They started selling Hillary before the 2012 Presidential election. merrily Mar 2014 #132

The Democrats know they have to throw the unwashed masses Cleita Mar 2014 #158

"We're Eisenhower Republicans here," says Bill Clinton in a devastating Reed quote, red dog 1 Feb 2014 #8

The Harper's piece.... Bigmack Feb 2014 #11

I know...I read it and thought to myself...What's New! But that Harper's KoKo Feb 2014 #96

It's a good refresher jsr Mar 2014 #224

"social issues and identity politics at the expense of the economic questions" geek tragedy Feb 2014 #12

Point out where Moyers, now boxed and labeled by you, states that human rights for anyone sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #43

I doubt very much you've been appointed as spokesperson for geek tragedy Feb 2014 #67

Where is the link I requested? You made claims re Moyers, and btw, how do you know that sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #70

"how do you know that Moyers is 'heterosexual?'" geek tragedy Feb 2014 #73

Correction, YOU'RE done here. And just what is the significance of searching to find out sabrina 1 Feb 2014 #79

but the truth about themselves n/t reddread Mar 2014 #166

Not that it matters, but many homosexuals of his day married and had children. merrily Mar 2014 #131

Sickening, isn't it, to actually see this kind of thing creeping onto Democratic forums now. sabrina 1 Mar 2014 #162

... merrily Mar 2014 #213

Sickening, isn't it, to actually see this kind of thing creeping onto Democratic forums now. sabrina 1 Mar 2014 #162

I read and saw the same thing, GT Number23 Feb 2014 #105

Ah, that makes sense. I cringe whenever I see that geek tragedy Feb 2014 #106

Most people with a knowledge of history and who are not narow, thoughtless and selfish Number23 Feb 2014 #107

I see your point treestar Mar 2014 #170

they do that, but the solution is to end systemic racism geek tragedy Mar 2014 #176

ah here comes the Moyers bashing. he's white, so his criticism of Obama Doctor_J Mar 2014 #171

1) Moyers apparently didn't say this, so that was my error; 2) your comment geek tragedy Mar 2014 #177

I agree, but noone wants to admit to or listen to the problems Puzzledtraveller Feb 2014 #16

The Left has always identified with the truth and reality. Rex Feb 2014 #19

What left? Comrade Grumpy Feb 2014 #20

The American Left wants economic and social justice, Maedhros Feb 2014 #22

This. n/t jtuck004 Feb 2014 #24

Yep, Classic Red here too... socialist_n_TN Feb 2014 #64

+1 Blue_Tires Feb 2014 #66

Being allied with the Democratic Party makes you a Democrat, not necessarily merrily Mar 2014 #145

Is it by design that "social issues and identity politics" suck almost all the air from politics? nt proverbialwisdom Feb 2014 #25

most likely mopinko Feb 2014 #30

In the sense that polarization sucks the air out Debate and Discussion... KoKo Feb 2014 #32

No, but thanks for asking Iliyah Feb 2014 #27

yes, and the article makes a strong case (The Harper's piece) cali Feb 2014 #29

I don't think support for Hillary Clinton demonstrates that the left has surrendered... C0RYH0FFMAN Feb 2014 #28

We haven't been able to do that with Obama. grasswire Feb 2014 #91

What do you mean by 'we'? Obama ran as an opponent of marriage equality, we moved Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #225

There is are separate groups here supernova Feb 2014 #31

, blkmusclmachine Feb 2014 #33

Commie! adirondacker Feb 2014 #49

To me....much of the Dem leadership is nothing more than con men and hucksters. Give people a few... yourout Feb 2014 #34

No. They are just too afraid to break away from the home they know, jtuck004 Feb 2014 #35

Well....Dems sure could use a spine replacement! SoapBox Feb 2014 #36

k and r. bbgrunt Feb 2014 #37

I will NEVER surrender heaven05 Feb 2014 #46

The biggest issue we have is that the right has gone so far right... Lobo27 Feb 2014 #47

Hey Bill! You can always try these guys, I hear they're taking over Senate & House seats everywhere. Tarheel_Dem Feb 2014 #50

I take it academics wasn't your strong suit brentspeak Feb 2014 #68

Ooooh, insults from some random internet dude. I'm crushed! Tarheel_Dem Feb 2014 #75

Quite the sexist photobucket account you dredged that up from. nt adirondacker Feb 2014 #76

And so they should, since the dems don't want to touch the real problems!n/t sadoldgirl Feb 2014 #83

None of this will change until... freebrew Feb 2014 #54

once in a while it would be nice to vote FOR someone and not just against the repub dembotoz Feb 2014 #57

Then do that, merrily Mar 2014 #214

I thought we weren't going to show asses on magazine covers in GD anymore? aikoaiko Feb 2014 #60

This old New Deal/Great Society/War-On-Poverty Democrat hasn't surrendered! bvar22 Feb 2014 #61

"genuinely left-wing movement." Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2014 #69

Never and those that want us to can sit and spin TheKentuckian Feb 2014 #71

A little Petty might do us all some good... adirondacker Feb 2014 #81

What's that Cracker know about self-determination? Eleanors38 Feb 2014 #111

Depends on the definition of "left" sadoldgirl Feb 2014 #82

Don't worry, the 1% is covered... adirondacker Feb 2014 #86

thank you for that caution grasswire Feb 2014 #94

This is fucking crazy! L0oniX Feb 2014 #88

She's the Comfortable Choice..."The Known of the Unknowns" of which KoKo Feb 2014 #98

Many have traded civility for corruption Corruption Inc Feb 2014 #92

Republicans are political geniuses, run laps around Dems WhaTHellsgoingonhere Feb 2014 #97

Well...Some think the Two Parties have MERGED....so KoKo Feb 2014 #99

EZ to be a "genius" when there's no opposition. Eleanors38 Feb 2014 #113

Actually, Republicans owe their success to the takeover of the Beltway Media.... Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #189

they have long-term money mdbl Mar 2014 #218

about the money WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2014 #223

If you can get a "left winger" to swallow the Drone Program for 8 years... Bonobo Feb 2014 #103

I don't swallow it, but I don't know how to stop it, either. merrily Mar 2014 #134

Well it's true that it would require a fairly radical action. Bonobo Mar 2014 #138

Your leaving the country, though, did not stop the drone killing. merrily Mar 2014 #140

I agree. It is beyond any individual. Bonobo Mar 2014 #141

Which year did you move out of the country? merrily Mar 2014 #142

End of 2009. When I realized the electing a Dem didn't change what I wanted it to. Bonobo Mar 2014 #143

Oh, I thought you meant you had moved because of the drones. merrily Mar 2014 #144

Well I had wanted to move back to Japan for a long time. Bonobo Mar 2014 #146

And "off the table" did come very quickly. both merrily Mar 2014 #148

Oh, how they wish! ReRe Mar 2014 #114

K&R. JDPriestly Mar 2014 #115

I am a real lefty: in the 20% who recognize that Clinton JimDandy Mar 2014 #119

Also, politics seems to have become a religion. merrily Mar 2014 #120

K&R² Solly Mack Mar 2014 #147

The Truth Teamster Jeff Mar 2014 #149

du rec. xchrom Mar 2014 #150

y'all have got to read hedges' "death of the liberal class." tomp Mar 2014 #152

RW rhetoric to the contrary, the power structure of the Democratic Party merrily Mar 2014 #215

if you read the book you won't be able to say that. tomp Mar 2014 #222

and this is what my other thread was talking about..... TeamPooka Mar 2014 #159

No, it only been systematically banned from mainstream media. gtar100 Mar 2014 #164

In many ways, collectively yes, individually no stupidicus Mar 2014 #165

politics is now corporate business, voters are captive customers in a monopoly of pragmatic_dem Mar 2014 #168

RE: You're first sentence, I would disagree....... socialist_n_TN Mar 2014 #173

Thanks, and agree, it's like BP saying they care about the environment, more slogan than policy- nt pragmatic_dem Mar 2014 #174

Yes, more slogan than policy..... socialist_n_TN Mar 2014 #175

The coup de grace will be after the election... kentuck Mar 2014 #179

I think it will be after the Mid-Terms..but...you are probably correct.... KoKo Mar 2014 #190

The answer to this part is simple flamingdem Mar 2014 #212