General Discussion

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)

262. The sheer numbers mean that you are most probably wrong

Sun Mar 9, 2014, 06:05 PM

Mar 2014

Bicycle accidents are only 2% of all vehicular accidents, many many more people are involved in auto accidents than bicycle ones. The sheer numbers argue that helmets in cars would save more lives than on bicycles.

Race car drivers wear helmets and the cars are often far more strongly protected than even the safest street vehicle and often have far more restricted vision thanks to that protection (roll cage).

Helmets can be and are designed to fit close to the head and without a bill. There is no significant impairment of vision with most bicycle helmets these days and again, helmets can be designed to the requirements of the specific application, be that on a bicycle or in a car.

If helmets were mandated in cars there would be dozens if not hundreds of manufacturers competing with each other to produce the most ergonomically friendly helmet possible since the market for such helmets would be vast.

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Wear a helmet. It's better than the alternative... [View all] MrScorpio Mar 2014 OP

K and R bigwillq Mar 2014 #1

Yes! Stop unplanned pregnancies now! randome Mar 2014 #2

Very true. Xyzse Mar 2014 #5

Yes for motorcycles, No for bikes. former9thward Mar 2014 #16

Well, I haven't had a head injury but I have cracked a helmet Gormy Cuss Mar 2014 #17

I have a coworker that had an inattentive driver make a left turn in front of him. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #18

Why, so you could spam me? former9thward Mar 2014 #30

I think you are wrong about that last part. CSStrowbridge Mar 2014 #34

I don't think, I know. Dawgs Mar 2014 #40

Hmmm, someone with 129 posts jumping in to defend the poster. former9thward Mar 2014 #41

And someone with 18,000+ posts, too. LanternWaste Mar 2014 #76

Congratulations. former9thward Mar 2014 #78

FYI: pointing out a post count is the weakest form of argument. JJChambers Mar 2014 #187

I agree. former9thward Mar 2014 #190

DU has a rule against one DUer defending the position of another DUer? enlightenment Mar 2014 #229

No it doesn't. former9thward Mar 2014 #230

More posts make you smarter or something? EX500rider Mar 2014 #226

Neither. former9thward Mar 2014 #232

Then why exactly did you point it out? n/t EX500rider Mar 2014 #254

ah the proof by insult hfojvt Mar 2014 #238

No, to defuse your BS "anonymous" comment. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #61

No, I don't want your spam. former9thward Mar 2014 #66

Have a nice day. Go ride a bike without a helmet. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #71

Thanks, I will. former9thward Mar 2014 #77

Must be something in the water in Arizonia... Thor_MN Mar 2014 #82

Where's Arizonia? blueamy66 Mar 2014 #116

The opposite corner from Coloradoaniana. n/t A HERETIC I AM Mar 2014 #216

Or Natural Selection at work MoonRiver Mar 2014 #168

Could be the brains that suggest not wearing a helmet aren't worth protecting. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #270

Every year in this country around 19,000 cyclists are killed or injured in reported road accidents.. EX500rider Mar 2014 #228

I bet many of the dead and injured hfojvt Mar 2014 #241

you're a shill for Big Helmet! dionysus Mar 2014 #267

Yeah, you found me out Thor_MN Mar 2014 #269

It's actually against the site rules to do what you are advocating. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #97

No, I knew he would never come out of his armchair bunker. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #101

Yeah, the 'derp, didn't happen to me' thing was pretty bad logic. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #103

I have to turn down clients. former9thward Mar 2014 #109

Apparently, you don't advise them to ride without helmets. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #113

They don't come to me for bike advice. former9thward Mar 2014 #117

Obviously, or you would be on the street. Thor_MN Mar 2014 #118

We don't care about your Psychic business. cui bono Mar 2014 #135

We? former9thward Mar 2014 #137

ZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzz . . . tabasco Mar 2014 #227

Where did I say that? former9thward Mar 2014 #235

I posted about my helmet use (#107) and put my real name on it. Jim Lane Mar 2014 #114

No one is obligated to use a pseudonym. n/t Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #140

I DID rickyhall Mar 2014 #20

Seriously? sakabatou Mar 2014 #21

Seriously. former9thward Mar 2014 #31

By this logic, we should bring back lawn darts. eggplant Mar 2014 #37

Everyone should fill out an organ card. former9thward Mar 2014 #45

And seatbelts! Who needs 'em?! Kids were fine before childseats too!!! lol n/t EX500rider Mar 2014 #231

Try reading the rest of the thread you're in here. There are multiple examples given. nt Electric Monk Mar 2014 #38

How did youth survive? former9thward Mar 2014 #42

So more youth survive today because of common-sense protections. randome Mar 2014 #58

Maybe you should go to Europe. former9thward Mar 2014 #60

On some subjects, yes. On other subjects no. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #100

To the ignore bin with you. eggplant Mar 2014 #86

Ohhh the humanity! former9thward Mar 2014 #89

Some of them DIDN'T survive. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #98

I was not an "exception. former9thward Mar 2014 #102

And ONLY 35,000 people per year because of compatible bumpers, crash standards, safety glass, AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #105

Some didn't, duh treestar Mar 2014 #159

Neither one of my children has had to go the funeral of a childhood playmate because ScreamingMeemie Mar 2014 #204

My first girl friend in high school was killed in a car accident. former9thward Mar 2014 #206

I think you're smart enough to figure it out. ScreamingMeemie Mar 2014 #207

Not all of them did. n/t Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #141

Really? former9thward Mar 2014 #143

135-155 a year. Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #150

I was asking about deaths pre 1990s where there was little helmet use. former9thward Mar 2014 #173

my dads best friend died in 1947 riding a motorcycle without a helmet. some of them died. roguevalley Mar 2014 #162

This is about bikes not motorcycles. former9thward Mar 2014 #174

The dead ones didn't. Hissyspit Mar 2014 #166

How many died because they were not wearing a helmet? former9thward Mar 2014 #175

Anecdotal evidence? Series? Major Nikon Mar 2014 #171

How many, since you are an authority? former9thward Mar 2014 #176

How many is enough for you? Major Nikon Mar 2014 #183

Those stats don't answer any questions. former9thward Mar 2014 #184

23,000 < 21yrs old traumatic brain injuries in one year Major Nikon Mar 2014 #185

Please read your links carefully. former9thward Mar 2014 #189

Reading my link more carefully for you: Major Nikon Mar 2014 #192

From your link: former9thward Mar 2014 #193

More like every traumatic brain injury is a head injury Major Nikon Mar 2014 #194

Cheers! former9thward Mar 2014 #195

From your quote: Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #196

You didn't even read what you just quoted Major Nikon Mar 2014 #197

Yes, if I bump my head against something and go to the ER former9thward Mar 2014 #198

That doesn't fit the definition Major Nikon Mar 2014 #199

"You can die from TBI and millions of people do every year." former9thward Mar 2014 #200

The CDC says 50,000 people in the US alone die from TBI each year Major Nikon Mar 2014 #208

Ok, so you made it up. former9thward Mar 2014 #209

Kinda like how you made up your original assertion Major Nikon Mar 2014 #211

We survived pretty well before seatbelts too NickB79 Mar 2014 #201

You would know more about FR than I would. former9thward Mar 2014 #205

"...someone will pipe up and make claim that "they know someone" Contrary1 Mar 2014 #22

Exactly. former9thward Mar 2014 #32

Are you kidding? Try wrecking a bike at 50 MPH on a downhill run. Hoyt Mar 2014 #24

Where were all these serious injuries before helmets? former9thward Mar 2014 #33

What? You think there were none? Ohio Joe Mar 2014 #65

You don't know the difference between a motorcycle and a bike? former9thward Mar 2014 #69

At 50MPH? Ohio Joe Mar 2014 #70

I don't ride bikes at 50 mph. former9thward Mar 2014 #81

what is the common speed? Ohio Joe Mar 2014 #88

There is no common speed. former9thward Mar 2014 #91

yet helmets are not needed Ohio Joe Mar 2014 #96

The fwd speed in motorcyles/bikes is not as relevant as the height you head falls.. EX500rider Mar 2014 #236

Well the "study" is nonsense. former9thward Mar 2014 #239

There was no "equating" EX500rider Mar 2014 #246

No they don't teach your physics. former9thward Mar 2014 #248

if you say so... EX500rider Mar 2014 #253

They were more commonly called 'fatalities' then. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #108

I would like to see the stats. former9thward Mar 2014 #111

For motorcycles, there are serious multi-national studies going back to WWII. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #112

I have never been on a motorcycle. former9thward Mar 2014 #115

I stay off the road on my bicycle. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #120

I get your point. former9thward Mar 2014 #122

They are definitely uncomfortable. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #124

I'll post as an anonymous person claiming head injury Victor_c3 Mar 2014 #28

I had 13 stitches taken in my head drmeow Mar 2014 #35

My 10 yr old son was riding with his cousin in the neighborhood bigbrother05 Mar 2014 #36

Then I'm sure you wear helmets in your car. former9thward Mar 2014 #44

No, but we drive Volvos bigbrother05 Mar 2014 #99

Whether I think car seats are really needed or not does not matter. former9thward Mar 2014 #106

Oh for FUCK'S SAKE Hissyspit Mar 2014 #167

Ask a medic. former9thward Mar 2014 #177

Anyone that rides a bike on the road without a helmet is dumb. Dawgs Mar 2014 #39

Holland is the dumbest country on the planet then Fumesucker Mar 2014 #47

Apparently. n/t Dawgs Mar 2014 #50

Yeah and not just Holland. former9thward Mar 2014 #53

Agree. n/t Dawgs Mar 2014 #62

Lived in Germany for more than 8 years bigbrother05 Mar 2014 #104

TDF was late in requiring helmets Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Mar 2014 #257

Biking in Holland vs the US is like a day vs night experience MrScorpio Mar 2014 #55

I don't remember learning to ride a bicycle Fumesucker Mar 2014 #63

Any country in Europe I have been in does not wear helmets. former9thward Mar 2014 #72

In spite of that, not wearing a bike helmet in this country is risky business MrScorpio Mar 2014 #83

Riding a bike, period, is risky. Live and Learn Mar 2014 #164

Or just minimize the risk. Hissyspit Mar 2014 #202

Amsterdam has very few cars in the city. It's essentially a biking city. KittyWampus Mar 2014 #146

You would think that in a country with actual universal coverage that helmets would be mandatory Fumesucker Mar 2014 #147

Better safe than sorry, I'd think Scootaloo Mar 2014 #49

Tell a medic about your theory. former9thward Mar 2014 #51

Your argument assumes I'm saying safety measures are 100% effective Scootaloo Mar 2014 #95

Wrong, wrong, wrong. progressoid Mar 2014 #52

As usual you are mixing statistics. former9thward Mar 2014 #64

As "usual"? progressoid Mar 2014 #93

I did as well. wickerwoman Mar 2014 #59

I and all my friends never wore a seat-belt as a child.. LanternWaste Mar 2014 #75

And there were many injuries that seat belts could have prevented. former9thward Mar 2014 #84

It does follow wickerwoman Mar 2014 #94

My husband and my son catrose Mar 2014 #182

People have fallen on sidewalks and cracked their skulls and died. You think pavement is soft? CBGLuthier Mar 2014 #79

I have had many bike spills when young. former9thward Mar 2014 #87

Actually, I had a head injury. cate94 Mar 2014 #90

I'm not anonymous, and here's my story. Jim Lane Mar 2014 #107

Nice post. n/t Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #145

It is a violation of the DU TOS to post personal identification information. former9thward Mar 2014 #180

As an attorney, you've surely heard of estoppel. Jim Lane Mar 2014 #213

A helmet saved me, I believe central scrutinizer Mar 2014 #130

I know someone who DIDN'T avoid a head injury (without a helmet).... mike_c Mar 2014 #133

People use bikes to commute in major cities. They should absolutely wear a helmet. n/t cui bono Mar 2014 #134

Do you realize what getting hit by a car on a bike is like? former9thward Mar 2014 #136

Not all hit-by-car-on-bike accidents are equal. Jim Lane Mar 2014 #212

Well, good luck to you. former9thward Mar 2014 #222

You have heard of seatbelts and airbags, right? Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #139

Somehow I doubt you ride bikes. former9thward Mar 2014 #142

You are quite the skeptic. Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #149

Good luck to you! former9thward Mar 2014 #172

That would be true of helmets worn in cars too Fumesucker Mar 2014 #221

Because the helmet is the sole protection on bicycles Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #258

The sheer numbers mean that you are most probably wrong Fumesucker Mar 2014 #262

Sorry, but you're just being silly. Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #263

You were the one arguing that helmets in cars would make occupans less safe Fumesucker Mar 2014 #264

No. Ms. Toad Mar 2014 #266

You only mentioned negative points regarding helmet use in cars, no positive ones Fumesucker Mar 2014 #271

When we were growing up, there were no cell phones. KittyWampus Mar 2014 #144

I don't know this guy personally, but I don't think it's anonymous: kentauros Mar 2014 #148

If my 16 y.o. son had been wearing a bike helmet he wouldn't have a seizure disorder now Hekate Mar 2014 #152

Some years back when I lived in Boulder, Co, SheilaT Mar 2014 #154

my sister hit a truck with a motorcycle and lived because of her helmet. she lost a leg but lived. roguevalley Mar 2014 #161

That poster has certainly gotten a LOT of attention tonight, hasn't he? Smug in his ignorance... Hekate Mar 2014 #163

I simply posted I don't think helmets are necessary in bikes. former9thward Mar 2014 #179

BS. You love the attention. Hekate Mar 2014 #186

Then you should all put me on ignore. former9thward Mar 2014 #191

I know. Motorcycles, bikes, you still splatter when you hit the ground. I guess roguevalley Mar 2014 #188

Except this is about bikes not motorcycles. former9thward Mar 2014 #178

"I and all my friends rode bikes in our youth and no one ever got a head injury" EX500rider Mar 2014 #225

In Oregon, they're mandatory for minors, optional for adults (bicycles); mandatory for motorcyclists Lizzie Poppet Mar 2014 #234

I never go fast. former9thward Mar 2014 #237

It doesn't take much speed. If your bike stops/flips suddenly (hitting a rock the wrong way) or Arugula Latte Mar 2014 #245

My, my death all around us. former9thward Mar 2014 #249

Because you survived not wearing a helmet that proves that helmets don't matter. Arugula Latte Mar 2014 #251

Then use ignore. former9thward Mar 2014 #252

thanks for that hfojvt Mar 2014 #242

Seriously? You think head injuries from bike accidents don't really happen? Arugula Latte Mar 2014 #243

I never said there were no injuries, head or otherwise. former9thward Mar 2014 #250

Here you go. Why don't you contact this boy's family and tell them that their son didn't really die: Arugula Latte Mar 2014 #244

Per bicycles I didn't need a helmet as a kid. Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Mar 2014 #256

Well I am not a competitive cycler. former9thward Mar 2014 #259

My mom always insisted I wear a helmet while riding my bike, and so I did.... Humanist_Activist Mar 2014 #268

Yeah, yeah! A good brain bucket saved my life when I was 17. In_The_Wind Mar 2014 #3

That is why I don't ride motorcycles anymore liberal N proud Mar 2014 #4

And not just any helmet, a good helmet Marrah_G Mar 2014 #6

Exactly! When I first started riding motocross another rider told me, "If you've got a $25 head ... 11 Bravo Mar 2014 #10

I've used a variant of that Jim Lane Mar 2014 #110

I wonder if the rider survived. Beacool Mar 2014 #7

That's motorcycles for you. Oakenshield Mar 2014 #12

I've had motorcycles at three different points in my life. tridim Mar 2014 #15

Yeah, cars kill a shitload of occupants every year too. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #27

You're being juvenile. Oakenshield Mar 2014 #56

I am being juvenile because you can't be bothered to actually read my post. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #92

No, you're being juvenile because.... Oakenshield Mar 2014 #121

Smaller isn't the issue. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #123

My husband rides in an obnoxious fluorescent yellow jacket and helmet REP Mar 2014 #127

Tell him that is a VERY good idea... EX500rider Mar 2014 #240

It was a gruesome pic. Beacool Mar 2014 #125

All the gear, all the time. cloudbase Mar 2014 #8

Agreed! People opposing helmet laws are pig headed morons Pretzel_Warrior Mar 2014 #9

To wear like that, did he slide a quarter mile with his weight on the back part of his head? Electric Monk Mar 2014 #11

I rode bicycles without one for years. And horses. raven mad Mar 2014 #13

I agree...political idiots like Sean Hannity would have all our children Rex Mar 2014 #14

I thought it was going to be a picture of Hannity... Contrary1 Mar 2014 #19

Two things held true every time I got on a motorcycle... rrneck Mar 2014 #23

Always wear my helmet, always wear a seatbelt. AtheistCrusader Mar 2014 #25

I know someone who died from a bike accident...car hit him..his head hit ground. Stuart G Mar 2014 #26

How many expected this? Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #29

if people value their lives heaven05 Mar 2014 #43

In Michigan they lifted Helmet Laws. mstinamotorcity2 Mar 2014 #46

No helmet-stupid people doing stupid things packman Mar 2014 #48

I was going to be a Devil's Advocate and discuss the slippery slope tavalon Mar 2014 #155

Having once upon a time been a fireman in my primordial life... Javaman Mar 2014 #54

It's really odd that my exposure to brains outside of heads didn't cause me to have PTSD tavalon Mar 2014 #156

you are lucky just to see brains. Javaman Mar 2014 #170

Not a contest but, yeah, I saw most of that, tavalon Mar 2014 #223

you were lucky to see the ones that lived. Javaman Mar 2014 #265

So basically Sean Hannity doesn't value life. npk Mar 2014 #57

At the very least, he doesn't value the President's life. Quel surprise. n/t winter is coming Mar 2014 #119

I think Hannity is very intimidated by the President npk Mar 2014 #126

It's a coping mechanism tavalon Mar 2014 #157

Those who disagree with Mr. Scorpio Nitram Mar 2014 #67

as an EMR we go on calls for ATV's alot, littlewolf Mar 2014 #68

I cannot for the life of me remember if I was wearing a helmet tavalon Mar 2014 #158

I admit to riding without one before in states that it wouldn't get me pulled over shedevil69taz Mar 2014 #73

In high school a friend of mine was riding a motorcycle and hit by a car he was thrown and landed on kimbutgar Mar 2014 #74

Better yet, don't drive the noisy motorcycle in the first place. nt valerief Mar 2014 #80

Most motorcycles aren't any louder than most cars REP Mar 2014 #128

Not in the real world. Motorcycles are annoyingly loud and you know it. valerief Mar 2014 #131

I drive a car. Why would I lie? REP Mar 2014 #132

Straight-piped Harleys and "performance exhaust" crotch rockets IDemo Mar 2014 #210

I agree that most are Major Nikon Mar 2014 #220

I didn't put an aftermarket exhaust that is louder on my Harley to be dickish shedevil69taz Mar 2014 #233

It would have been the back of his head, not his face. KamaAina Mar 2014 #85

He would have been killed if not for the helmet, most of his head would have been shaved off. nt bluestate10 Mar 2014 #151

Nobody likes a pissing contest more than I do... Bigmack Mar 2014 #129

I just spent $500 plus to upgrade to the safest I could find BadGimp Mar 2014 #138

There wasn't much left upstairs in bikers who didn't wear helmets and managed to survive Warpy Mar 2014 #153

K&R JoeyT Mar 2014 #160

Looks like it will buff out. Enthusiast Mar 2014 #165

Proud member of being a biker since 1969......and wearing a helmet. raven mad Mar 2014 #169

I advocate wearing a helmet as a pedestrian as well. blueamy66 Mar 2014 #181

Around 1992 I was in a bicycle accident in New Brunswick, NJ.... Junkdrawer Mar 2014 #203

DU: The only place you'll see such a fight over wearing a helmet. flvegan Mar 2014 #214

Trust me, the helmet squabble extends far and wide IDemo Mar 2014 #215

I had 6 Harley drivers pass me on the interstate. One of B Calm Mar 2014 #217

Not ME. I'M a better rider... Junkdrawer Mar 2014 #218

Mr. Scorpio - a bicycle helmet saved my daughter's face, hedgehog Mar 2014 #219

I would be brain damaged or dead without my DiverDave Mar 2014 #224

My helmet, boots, and gloves save me several times a year. ileus Mar 2014 #247

Don't you find it funny how "pro-life" people can be "anti-helmet"? alp227 Mar 2014 #255

helmets also keep Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #260

A friend was riding his bike down the street, and someone in a parked car opened the car door ... kwassa Mar 2014 #261