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Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)

246. Perhaps because a "huge steel swastika" is not part of the history of the Holocaust?

Reply to COLGATE4 (Reply #243)

Mon Mar 10, 2014, 10:04 AM

Mar 2014

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About that cross at Ground Zero... [View all] Bonobo Mar 2014 OP

This atheist says so what? hack89 Mar 2014 #1

This atheist says put it in a church if you like it so much. Bonobo Mar 2014 #2

Why do you care AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #9

Why does it have to be about me personally? Bonobo Mar 2014 #10

It is beautiful yeoman6987 Mar 2014 #11

Maybe it should be put on top of the new tower in that case! Bonobo Mar 2014 #12

lol. yeoman6987 Mar 2014 #13

So all you see is hatred AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #15

When people who feel isolated by such things talk about their experience they are attacked Fumesucker Mar 2014 #21

I don't want to attack a soul AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #35

"I don't want to atttack a soul" - "Joyless existence of certain atheists" Fumesucker Mar 2014 #40

I am sorry AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #42

One or two posters on DU constitute a faction of atheism? You are an analyst right? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #44

Central Asia AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #80

Someone who disagrees with you on this is automatically "joyless"? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #47

You poor fool. Don't you realize your happiness is actually sadness? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #63

Thank you sir, may I have another? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #68

My faith AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #83

You've actually resorted to preaching Christianity. Is this a joke? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #105

I think we may have been epically Poed Fumesucker Mar 2014 #126

Interesting question AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #140

You're pretty good Fumesucker Mar 2014 #156

No someone who is joyless is joyless AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #75

And you are capable of telling in a post or two who is "joyless" and who is not? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #82

No not most people AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #95

Just *those* people Fumesucker Mar 2014 #103

Don't care AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #104

The OP was pointing out that another poster had used an incorrect picture Fumesucker Mar 2014 #113

Again AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #116

Feel the love... Fumesucker Mar 2014 #122

It's all that joy. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #128

I have nothing but love in my heart AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #136

Brilliant troll, man Fumesucker Mar 2014 #139

That doesn't mean I have to be polite to disruptors however LostOne4Ever Mar 2014 #224

Duplicate Fumesucker Mar 2014 #118

What is the point of feeling "isolated" by anything? treestar Mar 2014 #76

What is the "point" of any emotion? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #79

Some people find it comforting, some don't, it makes some uncomfortable treestar Mar 2014 #235

You still miss the point of the original dispute Fumesucker Mar 2014 #240

No, you don't get it. Religion is irrational by definition 2banon Mar 2014 #203

Oh lawdy lawd... Lost_Count Mar 2014 #24

You would NOT advocate for a Muslim symbol there I bet. Bonobo Mar 2014 #26

LOL AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #30

What utter bollocks. You get your talking points from Fox News. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #41

No from AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #88

No, I'm saying you literally have your talking points from Fox News... Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #102

Good lord AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #108

You just blamed the 9/11 attacks on Islam. Do you not remember that, Mr. Tolerance? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #124

I blamed it on AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #130

You said: "I would not advocate a symbol of the faith that made 9/11 happen." Bonobo Mar 2014 #145

A symbol of the faith AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #148

"I would not advocate a symbol of the faith that made 9/11 happen" Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #158

No I didn't AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #162

Your words were crystal clear. Marr Mar 2014 #271

Ha ha. If that is a straw man, you have encased it it solid titanium. Bonobo Mar 2014 #54

What is the symbol of Fundamentalist Faith as that is what made 9/11 happen? uppityperson Mar 2014 #84

Wow. Now I'm dead against the inclusion of that cross. Marr Mar 2014 #270

That would indeed be a rare piece... Lost_Count Mar 2014 #222

That's absurd treestar Mar 2014 #74

No, THAT is absurd. Reductio ad absurdum to be exact. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #77

Because you're the one whining that it needs to be "put in a church if you like it so much!" MADem Mar 2014 #185

dunno bout you, but i'm atheist and don't feel threatened when passing by churches and religious dionysus Mar 2014 #201

I never understood the "Don't know about you, but listen to me" thing. Bonobo Mar 2014 #202

you shared your opinion, and prompted responses by making it an OP. i responded with my opinion... dionysus Mar 2014 #204

Yeah, I get it, but I don't understand the useless "I dunno about you" thing. Bonobo Mar 2014 #205

it's just something i put in front of sentences sometimes, especially when i am stoned. i didn't dionysus Mar 2014 #206

God, I want to be stoned. Bonobo Mar 2014 #208

d'oh!!! now i feel bad! dionysus Mar 2014 #209

Yar, it sucks. Bonobo Mar 2014 #211

you're in japan, right? big city like tokyo? dionysus Mar 2014 #212

Nope, quite the opposite. Bonobo Mar 2014 #214

well, i hope it's nice and not freezing like here. no offence meant with my posts. dionysus Mar 2014 #219

Every time I have to see a cross... Scruffy Rumbler Mar 2014 #250

Do you think prayer in public schools "gives millions of people comfort"? DefenseLawyer Mar 2014 #265

This atheist agrees Warpy Mar 2014 #58

^ this ^ defacto7 Mar 2014 #207

Yep. And just ignoring these little incursions into the public sphere only encourages it. /nt Marr Mar 2014 #273

...^ that 840high Mar 2014 #19

I think it should stay NoGOPZone Mar 2014 #3

True, put it so it looks like an "X". nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #6

Yeah, that's what I said in the first thread on this cross. Turn it upside down Nay Mar 2014 #8

I met Fr Jordan several times at the site. He was very comforting during those days. hrmjustin Mar 2014 #4

Huh, the cross piece changed direction. uppityperson Mar 2014 #5

It must be a miracle. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #7

The many threads about this item prove that it really is part of the 9/11 story. Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #14

This^ AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #18

I know you are aware by now that this is over including a plaque to honor non Christians who died Fumesucker Mar 2014 #135

+1 Marr Mar 2014 #274

The number of threads proves nothing of the sort. morningfog Mar 2014 #188

It absolutely belongs there badtoworse Mar 2014 #16

Thank you. 840high Mar 2014 #17

What was prominent? The photo I showed that is NOT the same as the erected monument? Bonobo Mar 2014 #20

How do you know that? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #22

By looking at the photos. Have a look yourself. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #23

Actually, on edit, you are right they aren't the same. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #25

Which begs the question (or answers the question) Bonobo Mar 2014 #29

Check my other post. The cross was from a different beam. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #32

Good catch, but I posted a photo disseminated by a DU'er falsely as the same cross. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #38

On second review, they aren't the same because your first photo is incorrect... Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #28

Is so, then ok, but a DU'er posted the one that I posted as "original". Bonobo Mar 2014 #34

As I've argued elsewhere, what matters is not that a cross is there... Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #37

Perhaps, but it is clearly being venerated as a religious symbol. Bonobo Mar 2014 #48

But wouldn't adding a plaque LostOne4Ever Mar 2014 #225

Here are the 2, looks like the same one. I have no problem with it, only with what people try to uppityperson Mar 2014 #91

I worked at 111 Broadway (around the corner from the WTC) and I was there on 9/11 badtoworse Mar 2014 #31

Are you a Christian? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #33

I am one person who believes that many thousands took comfort from that cross badtoworse Mar 2014 #66

I think all personal bias is relevant, be it Atheism or Christianity. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #71

It's obviously a religious symbol. In this instance, it doesn't matter. badtoworse Mar 2014 #223

Which cross? They are two different ones made with an obvious difference once you notice Fumesucker Mar 2014 #53

I noticed that and edited my post. The second picture looks like the cross that stood for years. badtoworse Mar 2014 #60

Just to make it a little easier to see the difference Fumesucker Mar 2014 #27

Apparently it is a different cross. And I don't think it matters. It's a red herring. Bonobo Mar 2014 #36

It seems the entire basis of this thread is that the crosses were not the same. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #39

No, that picture in the OP was originally posted by another DUer in a couple of other threads Fumesucker Mar 2014 #43

I have another argument (in addition to it debunking a DU'ers wrong photo) Bonobo Mar 2014 #45

I'm not in favor of being an historical erasure because religious symbols can be dangerous. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #50

So we should just load the place up with every religious symbol as a sort of counterbalance, eh? Bonobo Mar 2014 #52

Anyone who comes forward saying their religion or non-religion is relevant gets a place. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #56

the cross is pertinent to the whole incident Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #46

A swastika is an inanimate object and is very offensive to a lot of people Fumesucker Mar 2014 #49

I was referring to, common objects seen in our society Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #57

A Confederate flag is not that uncommon in many parts of the USA Fumesucker Mar 2014 #59

fine... Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #64

Exactly our point Fumesucker Mar 2014 #70

funny, of all the time I have spent Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #72

You keep making foolish generalizations Fumesucker Mar 2014 #78

most arent Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #85

So what? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #90

on the other side of the coin Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #99

So you agree you shouldn't be attacking the feelings of a minority? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #107

The majority? stevil Mar 2014 #121

Some people.... stevil Mar 2014 #115

Anyone who goes to the Holocaust Memorial Museum will see plenty of swastikas. Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #92

Indeed, are the swastikas considered holy and comforting by most of those who visit? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #97

Fucking hell stevil Mar 2014 #132

The cross is there because it was considered holy and made people feel comforted.. Fumesucker Mar 2014 #137

Nope, it's there because it stood at Ground Zero for more than a decade, Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #155

I'm starting to think you are a Poe too.. Fumesucker Mar 2014 #161

Why stevil Mar 2014 #160

It causes "dyspepsia, depression, headaches, anxiety, and mental pain and anguish" Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #173

There is medication AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #192

Much of which defacto7 Mar 2014 #215

WTF? AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #218

Did you mean to say defacto7 Mar 2014 #221

As I recall the Holocaust Museum doesn't COLGATE4 Mar 2014 #243

Perhaps because a "huge steel swastika" is not part of the history of the Holocaust? Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #246

Are you serious? After Germany surrendered I COLGATE4 Mar 2014 #247

OK, if you are concerned that the Holocaust Memorial Museum does not display enough swastikas, Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #248

You are deliberately missing the point. COLGATE4 Mar 2014 #262

Museums commonly have both indoor and outdoor exhibits. Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #263

The artifact isn't being preserved as part of an COLGATE4 Mar 2014 #264

Your response (to which this exchange has been COLGATE4 Mar 2014 #249

"I would suggest counseling as they have some serious issues." Bonobo Mar 2014 #51

no, not agressive Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #55

Maybe the "issue" is the society is fucked up.. Fumesucker Mar 2014 #61

Context is everything. Bonobo Mar 2014 #62

there shouldn't be any different in seeing Niceguy1 Mar 2014 #67

I could not understand your post. Bonobo Mar 2014 #69

Can somebody strap a mindwalker_i Mar 2014 #65

Huge atheist here, it seems more like a historical item to me. nt Logical Mar 2014 #73

Which cross? They are two different ones made with an obvious difference once you notice Fumesucker Mar 2014 #86

Really? Bonobo Mar 2014 #89

He's just being Logical n/t Fumesucker Mar 2014 #93

A priest can do that on anything, doesn't mean anything. Nt Logical Mar 2014 #152

Should priests be able to keep historical items out of museums by sprinkling holy water on them? nt Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #178

And I'm severely atheist Capt. Obvious Mar 2014 #242

I don't have a problem since the site is still a cemetery... Historic NY Mar 2014 #81

since i don't believe in god it doesn't really bother me JI7 Mar 2014 #87

That cross is the most disrespectful and tackiest thing I have ever seen. Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #94

Pure parody AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #96

Yeah like these.... Historic NY Mar 2014 #196

Holy Shit! Is this Crucifix porn? WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2014 #98

This OP makes me want to vomit. WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #100

Well said AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #101

I'm sure the non-xtians would perished on 9/11 would agree with that. Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #111

Seriously AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #112

People who perished on 9/11 weren't only xtians. Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #120

I can't speak for other Christians AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #134

Too much information, dude. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #142

Just being as absurd AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #144

Wha WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #114

"It will be a Religious War, a sort of Christian Jihad..." Bonobo Mar 2014 #125

YES, I'm quite convinced that very nearly ALL of the non-xtians sibelian Mar 2014 #229

Thanks for replying to this... Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #232

You are most welcome. sibelian Mar 2014 #233

This message was self-deleted by its author LostOne4Ever Mar 2014 #237

You left out Islam, FYI. Because you think Islam caused 9/11. Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #164

No AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #166

Why didn't you mention Islamic symbolism in your post? Gravitycollapse Mar 2014 #172

To piss you off AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #177

Two word response. Bonobo Mar 2014 #106

Bless you. WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #109

Being lectured by you to not discuss hot-button issues. Bonobo Mar 2014 #119

I am AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #123

"...dollars to donuts that you are as white and waspy as the day is long." WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #129

"It will be a Religious War, a sort of Christian Jihad." Yep. Bonobo Mar 2014 #133

LOL AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #138

Jesus Saves? AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #110

Bergeron scores. WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #117

Lobbing a molotov cocktail into GD is the whole damn point of many folks Fumesucker Mar 2014 #141

"Do you not think 9/11 and religion are emotional for those who disagree with you also?" WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #143

What do you think this is? Fumesucker Mar 2014 #147

So your hobby AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #150

No, my hobby is arguing with stupid people on the internet about senseless stuff, just like yours is Fumesucker Mar 2014 #167

I am just here to AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #171

Dude you're cracking me up.. Fumesucker Mar 2014 #180

Maybe I will get in AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #184

No rules, just right.. Fumesucker Mar 2014 #191

I am AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #195

Is this Bill O'Reilly? Marr Mar 2014 #278

"It might be work for you but it's stupid although entertaining hobby for a lot of us." WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #159

Looks like you got spare time today. Bonobo Mar 2014 #169

"confrontational entertainment" WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #181

You. Unironic BS'er. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #183

Perfect. WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #189

Dude.. I just had someone arguing with me that helmets in cars would be actually dangerous Fumesucker Mar 2014 #176

I agree. +1000 ChromeFoundry Mar 2014 #199

Uh oh ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2014 #252

Suppressing everyone is not the answer. Fighting to make it more inclusive is. liberal_at_heart Mar 2014 #127

I don't disagree. Bonobo Mar 2014 #131

A question. stevil Mar 2014 #146

Ummm, I don't think so. Bonobo Mar 2014 #151

Do you work in a cemetery and mass grave? AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #153

What? Do you? nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #165

At various times in the last twenty years AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #168

If Ground Zero is a mass grave, then I guess all faiths should be equally represented. No? nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #170

You act like I have a problem with that AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #174

Dude, I asked you directly if an Islamic icon would be ok and you said "No." nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #186

And???? AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #190

LOL. It isn't ok, but you don't care. Got it. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #193

See how easy that is AnalystInParadise Mar 2014 #194

Like shootin' fish in a barrel, I think. Hassin Bin Sober Mar 2014 #197

OK stevil Mar 2014 #179

Perfect flamebait. WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #149

And you took the bait! nt Logical Mar 2014 #154

Perfect irony. Bonobo Mar 2014 #157

Announcing your purpose, yeah? WilliamPitt Mar 2014 #163

If anyone should know flamebait on DU Fumesucker Mar 2014 #182

He's in BS self-delusion mode apparently today. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #187

Well I think it should go in the museum but I respect others who believe differently. hrmjustin Mar 2014 #175

I think there is more to this story than we know goldent Mar 2014 #198

They did this MO_Moderate Mar 2014 #245

Got a link to back that up? bunnies Mar 2014 #261

A link? MO_Moderate Mar 2014 #266

You claimed that American Atheists is suing out of "fear" and "hatred". bunnies Mar 2014 #267

They're doing it because their suggested, inclusive plaque was excluded, while this Marr Mar 2014 #280

The so-called cross gave comfort MO_Moderate Mar 2014 #281

I'm agnostic and I don't give a shit. This is not an important issue. phleshdef Mar 2014 #200

indeed. nt Cali_Democrat Mar 2014 #210

Don't understand why people are mad at the OP LittleBlue Mar 2014 #213

Agreed and no, it is not high on my meter either. Bonobo Mar 2014 #216

It's a fricken piece of broken building, people! defacto7 Mar 2014 #217

The building was made out of crossed I-beams. Deep13 Mar 2014 #220

this is a rather facile response. there was lots of debris, but they chose this piece for a reason. unblock Mar 2014 #255

I always heard the finding of the cross was a miracle. Deep13 Mar 2014 #260

I do not like sockpuppets. Enthusiast Mar 2014 #226

Who is a sockpuppet here? nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #230

Sorry. I can't name names. I would have thought it was obvious. Enthusiast Mar 2014 #234

Ah, you're right. Upon closer "analysis", I got it. nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #236

As an atheist, I don't mind that the cross is there LostOne4Ever Mar 2014 #227

Silly you. It is the persecution that counts. Atheists just wanted more symbols. djean111 Mar 2014 #231

Nailed it... marions ghost Mar 2014 #241

This is wrong marions ghost Mar 2014 #228

The display of a torture device @ the site of 911. Ironic, imo, elehhhhna Mar 2014 #238

More proof positive bible-god is lame. JNelson6563 Mar 2014 #239

You seem to have grown in your sensitivity to these issues. thucythucy Mar 2014 #244

I think the analogy is a bit strained, but... Bonobo Mar 2014 #251

All analogies are strained to a certain extent. thucythucy Mar 2014 #276

I liken the whole thing to people finding Jesus in their toast ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2014 #253

wtf? Why in the hell JanMichael Mar 2014 #254

Let me put it this way, I don't give a flying fig what the atheists think of this cross. Beacool Mar 2014 #256

But what about their "dyspepsia, symptoms of depression, and headaches" Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #258

I'm fed up with people who complain about everything that they don't like. Beacool Mar 2014 #259

Well, aesthetically speaking. Xyzse Mar 2014 #257

How inspiring! aka-chmeee Mar 2014 #268

Is this memorial on public grounds? If so, I really don't see the argument. Marr Mar 2014 #269

Cui bono? Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2014 #272

As a Christian OwnedByCats Mar 2014 #275

It looks like you will be going into a church, EvilAL Mar 2014 #277

Bingo marions ghost Mar 2014 #279