General Discussion

Adam051188

(711 posts)

113. you are a skilled straw-man fabricator. that's a compliment. high paying job in today's world. ;^p

Mon Mar 17, 2014, 04:30 PM

Mar 2014

I think a we, as a people, are in the midst of something that could be called a societal breakdown fueled by income inequality, a burgeoning police state, and a corporate media intent on dividing, confusing, and obscuring.

i like your comparison between knowing and trusting your neighbors and coworkers and "voiding our bowels together". beautiful.

maybe I'm a "hair on fire doomsaying" guy but I don't believe people have ever been as socially isolated as they are in american suburbs today. by "isolated" i don't mean physically, i mean mentally and emotionally. people don't want to connect and be open with eachother out of fear of judgement/rejection/etc...I'm sure the rebuttal to this is that I'm just projecting, and i'm sure not everyone feels this way. But I don't think I'm the only one either.

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Americans are the loneliest, most isolated people [View all] Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 OP

Geography has more of an effect on the culture than we might presume. randome Mar 2014 #1

How so? Would traveling outside of the country help us change the isolation lifestyle? nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #2

It would have a subtle effect, I would think. randome Mar 2014 #3

True. Maybe we would notice the radical difference. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #4

What are the stats on Canada? They live more like Europoeans. SleeplessinSoCal Mar 2014 #32

Don't know. But Canada is made up of larger 'states'. randome Mar 2014 #47

Canada's entire population doesn't even reach California's 38 million. SleeplessinSoCal Mar 2014 #142

I saw a movie by Michael Moore Beringia Mar 2014 #57

I think that was Bowling for Columbine. roody Mar 2014 #169

well the geography of the center hfojvt Mar 2014 #9

If you live in Germany, you immediately notice that the system is completely different. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #12

Really? hfojvt Mar 2014 #15

Even here on DU, when we hear someone is broke or in need of money, we basically say... randome Mar 2014 #17

I'm a recent member from over Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #64

welcome to du--quite an alphabet soup you have!! I think the closest thing we have to what niyad Mar 2014 #213

Well I grew up in Montana zeemike Mar 2014 #26

I think things have changed here dramatically. :( nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #85

Tell me about it notadmblnd Mar 2014 #93

I don't think Montana has an overwhelming effect. randome Mar 2014 #14

the rest of the country hfojvt Mar 2014 #19

Good stats. randome Mar 2014 #20

well some did hfojvt Mar 2014 #23

Yes, thousands of influences, the country's ideology, its laws, who has the most power, etc. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #42

I think it works both ways though. wickerwoman Mar 2014 #63

Decline of religion, marriage, women's rights, etc. randome Mar 2014 #76

My grandpa was born in northern Spain, where villages were isolated from other villages Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #117

I think this is the core difference. Having worked in Europe, one is certainly exposed to RKP5637 Mar 2014 #86

That matters less than population density Spider Jerusalem Mar 2014 #150

Don't we have Canada.... llmart Mar 2014 #154

Capitalism needs to detach workers from their support networks. tblue37 Mar 2014 #206

+1. n/t Laelth Mar 2014 #233

Noam Chomsky on this: woo me with science Mar 2014 #5

SO true! Chomsky is spot on. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #6

+10000 dotymed Mar 2014 #48

Agree with Chomsky--this situation has been created & promoted marions ghost Mar 2014 #98

And the shows aren't much better than Ow, My Balls! nt valerief Mar 2014 #208

Mobile devices have usurped the television for pushing advertising. People are glued to their japple Mar 2014 #146

I've noticed this too. The less and less one does something, the less the habit of it... Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #226

I haven't watched TV in several decades, and I am neither lonely nor isolated. Zorra Mar 2014 #168

As with so many things, Chomsky's absolutely right about this. n/t Raksha Mar 2014 #229

There's a definite lack of real, personal contact here. sinkingfeeling Mar 2014 #7

Yup there are superficial & sporadic contacts, but few "for-life, give-your-all" friendships, family Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #8

Churches might work against society in your worldview.. MicaelS Mar 2014 #18

Did I say churches should be prohibited? I merely said they've turned right wing and quite fascist Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #133

Not all churches Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #34

Big difference in friendliness between US & Germany/Ireland/Scotland/England/France Divernan Mar 2014 #88

Yes, I went by myself to a concert at Edvard Grieg's home in Bergen, Norway Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #108

Every day the same message: We are all in this alone. nt Demo_Chris Mar 2014 #10

Yessssssssssssssssssssssssssssss! Enemies all around us, you have only yourself to handle it, you Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #11

Chillingly insightful. nt Union Scribe Mar 2014 #13

While the article contains many valid points, I think it's important to remember that Sheldon Cooper Mar 2014 #16

Yep. People have "alone time" all over the world. But isolation (what we have here) is not Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #24

Lol Shankapotomus Mar 2014 #141

I enjoy my solitude, but... meaculpa2011 Mar 2014 #21

Isolation doesn't always equate with loneliness BlueSky3 Mar 2014 #31

Perhaps only someone who has lived elsewhere would notice the isolation in the U.S. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #45

A "good" lifestyle? BlueSky3 Mar 2014 #51

The Japanese are known for their "introversion" yet have very close friends and family, neighbors Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #52

There are plenty of isolated individuals here in Japan Art_from_Ark Mar 2014 #152

There have always been isolated people, just as there has always been cancer. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #164

Unfortunately, there is decreasing reverence for the elderly in Japan Art_from_Ark Mar 2014 #167

The greater the influence of capitalism, the less reverence for the elderly. I'd hate to think they Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #171

There is another growing social phenomenon in Japan Art_from_Ark Mar 2014 #174

So they're trailing behind us, but are definitely there. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #175

That's basically what they say here in Japan Art_from_Ark Mar 2014 #177

Unrelated, but here's a very brief explanation of differences between American and Japanese Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #179

Yeah, those differences can make it very frustrating Art_from_Ark Mar 2014 #185

I'd seen a hugely long documentary on the respect required for communicating in Japan Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #191

Maybe we do Art_from_Ark Mar 2014 #193

My brother, who now lives in Spain (but was raised here), traveled to Japan for business Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #202

Influenced by us, perhaps? Cal33 Mar 2014 #231

I agree. Too much discourse and "conventional wisdom" is framed by extroverts Populist_Prole Mar 2014 #112

This...is so true! pipi_k Mar 2014 #131

I'm with you. Blue_In_AK Mar 2014 #132

I spent seven years in a town that is widely deemed "a good place to raise kids" Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #109

I've noticed that many lonely people cannot stand their own company Skittles Mar 2014 #151

I have driven cross country alone... meaculpa2011 Mar 2014 #197

fascinating article justabob Mar 2014 #22

Agree with you, Sarah. As Americans, we are expected to ALWAYS be ON. closeupready Mar 2014 #25

Exactly. Always expected to do things as 1 isolated, helpless unit. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #56

Yes. Spot on article. Skidmore Mar 2014 #27

Like in "The Killing Fields" - remember that part where closeupready Mar 2014 #36

Yes, in this case we've substituted capitalism for family, neighbors, of-the-heart friendships, etc. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #61

Isolating them emotionally, you mean? nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #38

Yes. If you are removed from those who could support you, Skidmore Mar 2014 #49

Well, in much of Europe (where there are better govt social support systems), people also have Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #54

"However, it makes a workforce of individuals that can be treated like widgets" woo me with science Mar 2014 #198

Americans are also more distrustful and more fearful. Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #28

Wow. I never get lonely or feel isolated. No wonder my multiple personalities Zorra Mar 2014 #29

You totally made my day! JustAnotherGen Mar 2014 #33

Awesome! Zorra Mar 2014 #35

LOL SunSeeker Mar 2014 #209

Corporate dislocation and suburbanization ErikJ Mar 2014 #30

Well said. YoungDemCA Mar 2014 #216

Live alone yet don't feel lonely or isolated. Since I stopped driving, though, feel more connected. pinto Mar 2014 #37

Yes, I was happier when I didn't have to drive Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #41

This article is from 2001, but it still rings true Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #39

What a great article and post. Thank you. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #50

Excellent. woo me with science Mar 2014 #101

Its pretty much true... yuiyoshida Mar 2014 #40

Many Americans are descended from immigrants who came by themselves or with 1 or 2 others FarCenter Mar 2014 #43

DU rec n/t Catherina Mar 2014 #44

Just because one lives alone... Helen Borg Mar 2014 #46

If that's true, why is "solitary" a punishment in jail? Why is it that putting people by themselves jtuck004 Mar 2014 #58

we all need to be around people SOME Celebration Mar 2014 #147

It depends. If they are introverts because they are happy with the solitude, proud of jtuck004 Mar 2014 #156

anything taking to an extreme can be a pathology Celebration Mar 2014 #199

I agree with you. I've noticed that a few here have said they prefer to be alone, despite the fact Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #205

Some are. :) nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #203

"Solitary" is not just lack of contact with other people. Helen Borg Mar 2014 #219

Perhaps I should have bolded... jtuck004 Mar 2014 #224

The article merely discusses the person found dead to make the point of the rest of the Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #225

Worlds greatest discoverers and scientists ErikJ Mar 2014 #65

But it was a mission, which is a temporary period of time, and they went elsewhere to do this Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #212

K and R n/t JimDandy Mar 2014 #53

I think the only thing worse than forced isolation Orrex Mar 2014 #55

Socialization in places where people are close, tight and warm, is not forced. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #59

I'm not sure that I agree with the premise, to be honest Orrex Mar 2014 #69

I wasn't born here, so I'm commenting on what I noticed and added this article. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #70

So it's simply your own witnessing based on anecdote? Orrex Mar 2014 #72

No. Actually I performed a 25-year study. LOL! omg. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #87

Yeah, that's about what I figured. Orrex Mar 2014 #90

you are a skilled straw-man fabricator. that's a compliment. high paying job in today's world. ;^p Adam051188 Mar 2014 #113

"the only thing worse than being alone is wishing you were" Skittles Mar 2014 #182

I kinda put myself into forced isolation. Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #60

The wealthier we are AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #62

Very interesting observation. Do you think it's because of the physical separation of homes? Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #67

When I lived in a poor neighborhood AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #74

You grew up in a real neighborhood. What a pleasure. Kids nowadays don't go play outside. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #75

My parents couldn't keep us in the house AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #80

LOL! I also grew up "outside." We went inside to eat, shower, sleep, do homework or if we were in Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #83

The cheaper the energy, the less we need other people The2ndWheel Mar 2014 #81

A consequence of progress in general, hm? A valid point, too. randome Mar 2014 #92

I have this wonderful friend who just turned 94. toby jo Mar 2014 #66

Good point (about TV). I wonder why we Americans were so willing to isolate ourselves for it? Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #68

tv is addictive and we are raised on it. magical thyme Mar 2014 #99

When my husband and I got home from work in Spain... Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #115

I can't speak to working in Spain, but here in the U.S. magical thyme Mar 2014 #126

I think you're right. Work here in the U.S. is a hostile environment that leads to exhaustion and Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #129

Anyone ever read Walden n/t sailfla Mar 2014 #71

Yup, where he decided to live 2 years out in the wild alone? Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #77

My son's experience living for a year in 2 very remote, tiny Indonesian villages. Divernan Mar 2014 #73

Not surprised at all, Americans are bred to be competitive and combative, it's what RKP5637 Mar 2014 #78

I agree they're raised that way. I'd be interested in hearing more of your thoughts on this. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #79

No, just my ramblings on DU. Part of my background is in the social sciences and out of RKP5637 Mar 2014 #107

Ok. I also find that in other countries there are introverts (for ex., the Japanese) but they have Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #110

This might not be the best word, but I've heard some describe American behavior as RKP5637 Mar 2014 #124

What worries me is that Americans might not even have real cliques? Just the illusions of cliques? Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #127

And especially in older age. There are IMO doubtless millions of heartbreaking stories that RKP5637 Mar 2014 #135

It's horrifying. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #137

Agree--competition is definitely rewarded & sociopaths take full advantage marions ghost Mar 2014 #94

"But often in the past I found myself investing in friends that were really just competitors." Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #136

With ya marions ghost Mar 2014 #157

I think MSM fear mongering has played a role in people isolating themselves. notadmblnd Mar 2014 #82

That's such a good point. I hadn't thought of how the MSM instills fear which leads to further Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #84

Yup - everything is to be feared. Plus, the self-defense industry chrisa Mar 2014 #95

Except then all you get is to share the problems... marions ghost Mar 2014 #97

Fear-mongering, yes! Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #119

Rugged individualism! moondust Mar 2014 #89

Do you think the more successful a country is, the more broken down its social ties? Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #111

I don't know about "country." moondust Mar 2014 #144

Good post. YoungDemCA Mar 2014 #217

Absolutely. If we all got together, we could write the definitive book on why our society is broken Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #222

Too true. It breaks down society. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #221

There's more to it than that. nt meaculpa2011 Mar 2014 #214

I guess I'm the oddball. I like my life the way it is. riderinthestorm Mar 2014 #91

No you don't. You think you do, but that's the real tragedy. Orrex Mar 2014 #103

The question about "confidants" seems relevant marions ghost Mar 2014 #114

I have no confidante. I write in my journal about hopes, fears, dreams. riderinthestorm Mar 2014 #161

Yup, when we die, only we die for ourselves. However, having a confidant used to be a vital part Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #163

I don't think of it as "others having answers" marions ghost Mar 2014 #200

Once I realize how sad and lonely I am...what is the next step? Rex Mar 2014 #121

I can enjoy solitude for days at a time, but eventually it depresses me Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #122

Exactly. Here's a good article about isolation and what it does... Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #165

That's the way I read it. Le Taz Hot Mar 2014 #158

Some of us just are not very social LostOne4Ever Mar 2014 #96

Not the same as being "social" necessarily marions ghost Mar 2014 #100

What I mean - in the countries I lived in, even introverts had tight relationships with family Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #104

exactly right geretogo Mar 2014 #102

I'd be very interested in hearing more of your observations. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #166

observations geretogo Mar 2014 #218

Thank you for taking the time to type this out. I feel exactly the same way. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #220

Oddly, the article you link is about Facebook and loneliness and does not cite Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #105

It includes Facebook in the article and title, but isn't exclusively an analysis of Facebook Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #106

No, the title is 'Is Facebook Making Us Lonley'. No nation is compared to another Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #116

Did you read only the title? Or did you read the entire article's assertion as to isolation in the Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #118

It's about modern society, it is for a US audience Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #138

Within all societies are extroverts, introverts, loneliness and happiness, but all societies are Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #140

Defend against? This is not combat, kid. I will not combat you. Sorry. Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #211

You apparently have not read through the threads here. You should. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #223

Suicide is what Japanese people do instead of murder Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #125

I feel so guilty about being happy. deaniac21 Mar 2014 #120

Only about that? How about feeling guilty about not having read the article? :) nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #123

I think many Americans think if a stranger starts talking to them, that raccoon Mar 2014 #128

Yes, and on the other hand, they think if they say "hi" to someone daily, that's a true friend, Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #130

I live in Ecuador. Puglover Mar 2014 #134

I have thought about moving out of America, if I can ever get enough money shenmue Mar 2014 #143

I'm sorry you are lonely. Puglover Mar 2014 #145

Thank you. shenmue Mar 2014 #148

I'm so sorry. Maybe it helps to hear that this is a nationwide problem nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #178

I am in the same boat as you. Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #186

K&R Solly Mack Mar 2014 #139

When you are an introvert in a society that expects you to be an extrovert, it's tough. alarimer Mar 2014 #149

Pretty much this Fumesucker Mar 2014 #155

There's a difference between introversion and social isolation. Look at the Japanese... Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #162

But the thing is, I pretty much hate my fellow Americans. alarimer Mar 2014 #187

Well, maybe it's the system of life here that you detest, and the way people are affected nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #190

Fumesucker and Alarimar, you are right. Manifestor_of_Light Mar 2014 #230

This is a well commented op, and a needed one. fleabiscuit Mar 2014 #153

I agree. The greater the insecurity, the higher the isolation. And may I add: Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #160

No, I think you make a good point here YoungDemCA Mar 2014 #215

And here I thought it was just me . . . . . n/t Dem_in_Nebr. Mar 2014 #159

Keep this in mind when you are discussing the best ways... Shandris Mar 2014 #170

I agree with you. The whole country is hurting. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #172

Thanks for this thread...! WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2014 #173

I'm so sorry. Perhaps there's something we can do. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #176

Oh, I know it sounds sad so let me explain (of course, you may still be sad for me :) WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2014 #188

Thank you for explaining. It's definitely a societal problem. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #189

Another thing: being an outlier (GLBT for example) is impossible in many "close" communities riderinthestorm Mar 2014 #180

Yes, but I've heard that being an outlier can create a closely-knit group? Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #181

If you have close friends, you can organize Dirty Socialist Mar 2014 #183

That's exactly the #1 thing the corporatists don't want us to do - organize nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #192

I know this is true, but I absolutely roody Mar 2014 #184

It depends on the people I'm around. Manifestor_of_Light Mar 2014 #194

K and R. Interesting ideas. LuckyLib Mar 2014 #195

The outsourcing of manufacturing has contributed greatly to this isolation. Enthusiast Mar 2014 #196

Thanks for the awesome post. Job loss does destroy extended families, friends, neighborhoods, Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #201

I think some "massive overhaul" or other is bound to happen -- rather sooner Cal33 Mar 2014 #207

Yes. I think too many of us became like cattle, just moving forward on to the slaughter - Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #210

Past Histories and Experience 4Q2u2 Mar 2014 #204

Recommended. H2O Man Mar 2014 #227

Thank you for posting this. Raksha Mar 2014 #228

k&r for the truth, however depressing it may be. n/t Laelth Mar 2014 #232