General Discussion

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)

58. What HAS been going on, as you see it?

Wed Mar 19, 2014, 03:51 AM

Mar 2014

And why should the ONLY acceptable position be "Putin is not only wrong, there was no reason for his emergence in power and no history that led to his horrible choices...he's just personally evil and that's all that matters"?

What is so terrible about pointing out that, up until 1954, the Crimea was, in fact, part of Russia? You do realize that a person can make that observation without actually DEFENDING anything Putin has done.

We're all anti-Putin. It's just that some of us don't feel we have to say stuff that sounds like Reagan's "tear down this wall" speech in order to prove that.

And there ARE major forces in American politics that are, in fact, trying to push us into war over this(as many of the same forces are still trying to push us into a war with Iran, even though a war with Iran would have to also become a war with Russia since Russia would have to jump in on Iran's side). That prospect should terrify everyone.

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NOBODY on DU is pro-Putin...nobody here ever has been. [View all] Ken Burch Mar 2014 OP

Nor Is Anyone Pro-War, Sir The Magistrate Mar 2014 #1

Putin kardonb Mar 2014 #18

A more corporate iamthebandfanman Mar 2014 #20

China is better off FreeJoe Mar 2014 #91

at least iamthebandfanman Mar 2014 #92

Don't get me confused with someone that supports the Chinese government FreeJoe Mar 2014 #94

The "rebuilding the old Soviet Union" schtick is ridiculous. Democracyinkind Mar 2014 #68

I think it's fair to say that the US competes vis-a-vis imperialist ventures, since the thirties. delrem Mar 2014 #32

Beside The Point, Sir The Magistrate Mar 2014 #78

My comment was exactly to the point you expressed. nt delrem Mar 2014 #90

Two sides of the coin perhaps? ozone_man Mar 2014 #99

When One Recognizes That, Sir The Magistrate Mar 2014 #105

Single-issue reacting is not the same as thinking. BlueStreak Mar 2014 #2

Nah, they love the guy. name not needed Mar 2014 #3

No, nobody loves the guy. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #4

Those are different sets of people. jeff47 Mar 2014 #7

Um... Both the current President and Prime minister are serious homophobes newthinking Mar 2014 #23

From Russia With Love Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #27

I am simply saying it is dishonest to act like Russia's attitudes towards Gay rights are different newthinking Mar 2014 #42

What I am saying is I am tired of people using my rights as a chess piece. Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #44

Sorry, your position is actually doing what you are accusing others of newthinking Mar 2014 #47

Actually, yours is. Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #49

He is actually making a vaild point. Supporters of LGTB rights should be criritcal of Democracyinkind Mar 2014 #61

His point is shrouded. Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #69

Well, I agree with the last part. Democracyinkind Mar 2014 #71

I agree with you! Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #74

I couldn't agree more. nt Democracyinkind Mar 2014 #75

That isn't what is happening here. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #50

Why do you insist on telling others what the "truth" is? Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #52

Is it "trashing Ukraine" to point out that Crimea WAS historically part of Russia? Ken Burch Mar 2014 #33

Depends On How Far You Go In History, Sir The Magistrate Mar 2014 #88

I appreciate the information. Thank you. n/t. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #95

Are there really people defending Russia's actions on here? cui bono Mar 2014 #6

+1 n/t jaysunb Mar 2014 #8

i don't see any cheerleading, but renegade000 Mar 2014 #30

There's no contradiction between saying that the U.S. has done worse things Ken Burch Mar 2014 #31

it's not a contradiction, it's a red herring renegade000 Mar 2014 #56

It's not a red herring just to point out that the U.S. has no moral authority in world affairs Ken Burch Mar 2014 #62

oh boy... renegade000 Mar 2014 #76

If Dennis was president, he'd make the necessary moral changes in U.S. policy and rhetoric FIRST Ken Burch Mar 2014 #97

Not really. People are trying to shut down discussion around the events that they don't like newthinking Mar 2014 #46

There have been a few. Tommy_Carcetti Mar 2014 #86

+1! Cha Mar 2014 #9

+1. William769 Mar 2014 #21

But everyone loves gay rights! Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #28

You don't have to support a confrontational policy towards Russia from outside to be pro-LGBTQ Ken Burch Mar 2014 #34

I didn't say anything remotely close to your strawman. Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #39

YOU said that everyone supports gay rights "when it suits them". Ken Burch Mar 2014 #45

And I meant it....again! Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #48

by "when it suits them" you meant "they DON'T support RUSSIAN LGBTQ people". Ken Burch Mar 2014 #53

Don't call me a liar and don't tell me "what I mean!" Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #59

Not a strawman...the logical surmise from your post. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #67

You did call me a liar; now twice. Behind the Aegis Mar 2014 #70

The second is a "No True Scotsman" uriel1972 Mar 2014 #73

BTA is right though... uriel1972 Mar 2014 #72

Could've fooled me. NuclearDem Mar 2014 #5

Exactly.. and saying it isn't so doesn't change what's been going on. Cha Mar 2014 #10

What HAS been going on, as you see it? Ken Burch Mar 2014 #58

No "We" aren't all anti-Putin.. you're wrong. here's a thread just last night with Putin Propaganda Cha Mar 2014 #63

Is Russia entitled to Eastern Ukraine? -nt Anansi1171 Mar 2014 #83

Good points flamingdem Mar 2014 #11

I think Snowden and Greenwald itsrobert Mar 2014 #12

These "no body" says (fill in the blank) posts are ridiculous BainsBane Mar 2014 #13

Well Said, Ma'am The Magistrate Mar 2014 #14

I actually find the "NO ONE HERE SUPPORTS PUTIN!1" posts almost as hilarious as the actual Number23 Mar 2014 #16

There are no Pro-Putin posts and you know it. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #37

So if there are no pro-Putin posts, why do we keep seeing posts denying their existence? Number23 Mar 2014 #38

Because false accusations must be denied. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #41

This subthread is seriously orwellian newthinking Mar 2014 #51

Accusations of "falseness" must be denied over and over and over again Number23 Mar 2014 #64

THAT post must indeed win the Orwell Award! Bravo! nt Bonobo Mar 2014 #57

Bizarre! It's like .. Cha Mar 2014 #55

Thank You! Tarheel_Dem Mar 2014 #17

+1000(nt) LostOne4Ever Mar 2014 #35

I oppose ANYBODY militarily intervening anywhere. Ken Burch Mar 2014 #40

Well said BB! Cha Mar 2014 #54

Crimea River mackerel Mar 2014 #15

Yeah, I usually alert only for egregious posts Warpy Mar 2014 #19

Some people seem to have learned international affairs from "Game of Thrones". Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #22

Robert Parry is right. vlakitti Mar 2014 #24

Putin has the power not to invade the Ukraine... uriel1972 Mar 2014 #25

A question would be, if Crimea wants to be part of Russia, and Russia wants Crimea Skip Intro Mar 2014 #26

Putin... bpollen Mar 2014 #29

There were people giving him credit for the Syria settlement treestar Mar 2014 #36

not so simple politicman Mar 2014 #66

Love the sin. Hate the sinner. mathematic Mar 2014 #43

You might want to talk to the people on MIRT instead of making "pronouncements" MADem Mar 2014 #60

This is, I think, a lost cause. Democracyinkind Mar 2014 #65

Most of that I agree with, but not "all of us here stand with LGBTQ people in Russia and etc" Donald Ian Rankin Mar 2014 #77

"My last territorial demand in Europe."? uriel1972 Mar 2014 #79

The "I don't know what" is universal. Donald Ian Rankin Mar 2014 #80

The least awful option... uriel1972 Mar 2014 #81

That only counts when voting, silly! djean111 Mar 2014 #82

Not *quite* true. Tommy_Carcetti Mar 2014 #84

Could you at least wait a couple months before you try snooper2 Mar 2014 #85

You should try speaking for yourself and only yourself. My other advice is this: do not Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #87

I'm pro-putin JJChambers Mar 2014 #89

I'm not even pro-poutine KamaAina Mar 2014 #93

And more: Tommy_Carcetti Mar 2014 #96

With regard to the Pro-Putin wars Capt. Obvious Mar 2014 #98

Well, yes, except for the ones who have actually praised Putin. nt Tommy_Carcetti Mar 2014 #100

Yes, the huge contingent of DU Capt. Obvious Mar 2014 #101

The OP claimed there were no Putin apologists on DU whatsoever. Tommy_Carcetti Mar 2014 #106

I have no shot at winning my office pool Capt. Obvious Mar 2014 #107

True. However, my eyes are on the U.S.'s penchant for paying for coups, as was done to my country Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #102

"NOBODY"? Seriously? so you're ready to vouch for every single DUer? jazzimov Mar 2014 #103

NOBODY uses declaratives on DU. OilemFirchen Mar 2014 #104

..... Tommy_Carcetti Mar 2014 #108