Is it time for a "fatwa" from Skinner?

[MellowDem]

234. Obama is ideologically right of center...

As is the Democratic Party as a whole, based on worldwide ideological spectrums. Sure, he's a Democrat, but Democrats and the Democratic Party are not progressive overall.

Gallup has done polls for years on the self-identified ideological makeup of each party. Democrats come out now as 40 percent liberal, 40 percent moderate, and 20 percent conservative.

Republicans come out as 80 percent conservative, 14 percent moderate and 1 percent liberal.

The parties are not two sides of a coin. Conservatism rules in this country and has for decades, the Democratic and Republican Party have both shifted significantly right. I don't think these are disputed observations.

For progressives like me, the goal isn't winning elections for a moderately conservative right of center party that stinks less than the whacko right. The goal is to convince the US as a whole and the parties as well to shift to the left, to convince them progressive ideas work best. Given who has the money and power in politics, and the way the game is rigged, I don't expect electioneering to do it, only a fundamental shift in culture will.

I don't mind compromise in politics, I just mind having to compromise between moderate and extreme conservatism only, and often no compromise at all from extreme conservatives.

I find a libertarian identifying as a centrist independent as strange. Libertarianism is a very ideological extreme on the political spectrum. It's like saying you're a Marxist. It's a utopian ideology based on theories that have no empirical grounding. That doesn't sound very centrist to me as I understand the word. I'd rather libertarians own up to the very extreme beliefs of their ideology, and many do, than pretend to be centrist.

Ultimately, libertarianism serves conservatism as Marxism serves socialism. Social issues are used as wedge issues that come and go. Some conservatives are already switching gears on gay marriage to "states rights and small government". Economic views are where you get to the real meat of an ideology, and that's where libertarianism shows it's just a subset of conservative ideology.