General Discussion

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)

39. I think the party is shooting itself in the foot

Sat Mar 29, 2014, 11:24 AM

Mar 2014

by thinking of third party candidates as 'enemies'. If you're a third party type on the left, chances are you're already strongly in synch with the Dem party platform in most ways already. If you're going to caucus with anyone, it'll be Dems.

Is the party simply about 'the Party', or is it about achieving the goals for the people? If you've got uncontested R seats, and you can't get a D to run, encourage the third party types. And if the party is thinking of running a candidate, seriously evaluate which of the candidates is actually better, and be willing to support 3rd party types who happen to be better in terms of support for the party stated goals, even if they're unwilling to have the D label.

One of the best politicians out there in terms of supporting Democratic goals is Bernie Sanders, who doesn't run as a Democrat. But he caucuses with them, and constantly pushes the party to be better. It would be a waste of time and resources for the Party to seriously back a Dem challenger against him. But it doesn't matter if he's a 3rd party - he's a better Dem than most of the people who do sport the (D).

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Does anyone here really think people bashing the president will vote for the GOP in 2014, 2016? [View all] Logical Mar 2014 OP

Well, I will state here and now that I will not vote Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #1

Great point! n-t Logical Mar 2014 #2

+1000000000. Absolutely. djean111 Mar 2014 #6

Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner. Scuba Mar 2014 #22

Maybe not vote for repugs but stay home . . . brush Mar 2014 #45

THAT^^^^^^ is where the damage is done. And there are plenty here who are Squinch Mar 2014 #58

Pretty much the same thing DFW Mar 2014 #92

Good point. Auntie Bush Mar 2014 #232

except when the crosstabs were run, we saw that in 2010 Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #65

I agree with doing things to get them motivated to vote brush Mar 2014 #69

It's got to circle back to involvement. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #91

Good ideas brush Mar 2014 #96

We also need to get working on those too young to vote. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #106

While I agree with a lot of what you have written ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #135

Welcome to Du. Phlem Mar 2014 #120

The point that many may miss is ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #125

Well, most of the things they complained about in2010 have been done. They can't get 100% kelliekat44 Mar 2014 #199

I think its part of the GOP voter supression strategy. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #77

Great analysis brush Mar 2014 #81

^^this^^^ mopinko Mar 2014 #90

Absolutely. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #162

So the GOP is saying AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #97

Read it again. Not what I said. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #136

Yes ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #139

Ah, I see AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #145

If that's what you wish to take from my statement ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #148

And... AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #149

Make light if you wish ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #152

I am curious AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #154

Depends. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #159

No ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #160

So its just one big conspiracy AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #190

Let's imagine that you think Abortion is Murder ... JoePhilly Mar 2014 #161

Limbaugh's AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #191

I believe this too Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #164

Exactly. n/t FSogol Mar 2014 #172

yes, no one is looking behind the curtain Skittles Mar 2014 #174

One guy in this forum plainly said that he was not going to vote. That he'd stay home and eat French Number23 Mar 2014 #175

please link to that post grasswire Mar 2014 #178

Find it yourself. Then you can see all of the "context" and "profile" you want Number23 Mar 2014 #182

You cited it. You find it. (If it exists) grasswire Mar 2014 #184

I've already found it. Hence the citation. Not surprised that point seemed to escape you. Number23 Mar 2014 #196

so I guess there is no such thing, eh? grasswire Mar 2014 #211

The last time you accused me of posting nonsense a considerable number of people informed Number23 Mar 2014 #217

translation: you got nothing. grasswire Mar 2014 #218

Translation: FIND IT YOURSELF. Number23 Mar 2014 #219

that's not how message boards work. grasswire Mar 2014 #220

5 posts in and you've still GOT NOTHING Number23 Mar 2014 #221

No, YOU got nothing. grasswire Mar 2014 #223

"You erased your previous post when challenged" Number23 Mar 2014 #233

and now I see that you have deleted your own message in that thread. grasswire Mar 2014 #222

You are just about the most full of it poster here. I don't delete my posts Number23 Mar 2014 #230

We'll Said mrchips Mar 2014 #101

And there it is again, the false statement that Democrats stayed home. If Dems had stayed home in sabrina 1 Mar 2014 #115

^^^^This^^^^ Phlem Mar 2014 #122

Are you actually contending that . . . brush Mar 2014 #123

I'm not contending anything, I am stating FACTS, facts drawn from the statistics on who stayed home sabrina 1 Mar 2014 #131

Prove they did. Union Scribe Mar 2014 #140

Where are the links . . . brush Mar 2014 #141

Here you go! Union Scribe Mar 2014 #142

They'll probably just lay low for a bit laundry_queen Mar 2014 #197

Exactly. It happens daily around here lately Glitterati Mar 2014 #244

That always happens in mid-term elections Spider Jerusalem Mar 2014 #198

Some will treestar Mar 2014 #3

You really think this board is mostly about bashing democrats? And I would be 80% of the active.... Logical Mar 2014 #4

It seems like it is sometimes treestar Mar 2014 #8

I think some posters need to take a month break. I agree, a little (way) over the top. nt Logical Mar 2014 #9

Even those who might vote 3rd party for a Presidential slot Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #10

This is a trouble with Democrats treestar Mar 2014 #28

I think the party is shooting itself in the foot Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #39

A party is a collection of people treestar Mar 2014 #53

Sure, 'some people' Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #66

I don't believe that about negotiation. treestar Mar 2014 #116

Third party canddates ARE the enemy - that's the way the American electoral system is set up. baldguy Mar 2014 #84

I don't see Sen Sanders pulling out of the race if Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #95

If Sanders mounts a challenge in 2016 to the Democratic presidential nominee in the general election baldguy Mar 2014 #110

Sanders is well established. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #167

I do. He's taken donations from most Democratic PACS for much of his career, including HILLPAC. MADem Mar 2014 #228

I didn't bother to reply to the last couple Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #231

He will not "poll better than Hillary." Most people just do not know who he is. MADem Mar 2014 #246

Some think this board AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #100

AMEN! Glitterati Mar 2014 #245

Yes, including some who even go on Fox pretending to be Dems. Scuba Mar 2014 #23

! WorseBeforeBetter Mar 2014 #59

I agree Andy823 Mar 2014 #144

I'm voting Santorum / Palin 2015! think Mar 2014 #5

Shit, I was wrong! n-t Logical Mar 2014 #7

Damn your blasphemy! demwing Mar 2014 #55

That election day is April 1, 2015 right? BuelahWitch Mar 2014 #87

Shhh!!! It's a secret! Don't forget your voter ID & a copy of your GOP RSVP invitation! think Mar 2014 #93

Apparently they are. Le Taz Hot Mar 2014 #11

What I learned this week - I guess the next time I send in an alert and it gets struck down Rex Mar 2014 #202

I think they are more likely to stay home in November or for their state primary. greatauntoftriplets Mar 2014 #12

I think the constant carping at Democrats will suppress voting frazzled Mar 2014 #13

I don't think anyone complaining about Obama would cause me not to vote democratic. And I have not.. Logical Mar 2014 #14

Well, that's you. You asked a question ... frazzled Mar 2014 #16

I agree with your opinion. The 'no use' attitude vote that 'all politicians are the same ' lumpy Mar 2014 #240

When you say "I have not been happy with Obama either" . . . brush Mar 2014 #51

Overall a good president, tried cooperation too long. Nt Logical Mar 2014 #194

yeah, but the incessant calls for loyalty, justabob Mar 2014 #57

Bullshit. The carping is to help pull the Party to the left, not abandon it. Scuba Mar 2014 #24

Thanks for cursing. frazzled Mar 2014 #30

You're welcome. When these red states start turning out 80-90% to vote for Republicans .... Scuba Mar 2014 #36

South Carolina is about 45-55 Democrat-Republican beerandjesus Mar 2014 #104

Also bullshit. beerandjesus Mar 2014 #102

+1,000 Scuba Mar 2014 #114

If you're so expert at winning over Republicans in South Carolina frazzled Mar 2014 #130

Yes lumpy Mar 2014 #241

Hey, cut me a little break! beerandjesus Mar 2014 #247

^^^^^ grasswire Mar 2014 #185

When the President is portrayed as a traitor to Democratic principles by betrayal it is damaging. lumpy Mar 2014 #242

point taken, but some of us question the intentions. grasswire Mar 2014 #243

I don't agree. cui bono Mar 2014 #214

Why would it work though? treestar Mar 2014 #31

It's not aimed at non-political voters, it aimed at those who are confused and think ... Scuba Mar 2014 #34

Since when has 'carping' achieved anything beyond ostracizing the ones doing it? Number23 Mar 2014 #176

"Carping" wasn't my word, but one used in the post to which I responded. Scuba Mar 2014 #179

I know that, but it describes the behavior perfectly. Which you seemed to agree when you used the Number23 Mar 2014 #180

Perhaps I should have used quotation marks. Scuba Mar 2014 #181

I think one line in your comment is particularly important Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #32

I absolutely agree with you ... frazzled Mar 2014 #49

I think we're simply arguing over first causes. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2014 #74

exactly justabob Mar 2014 #71

It may lead to discouragement Roselma Mar 2014 #15

Nope, the opposite. It stems from discouragement. It leads to a better Party. Scuba Mar 2014 #25

No, some will sit out instead. JaneyVee Mar 2014 #17

No, but they might stay home davidn3600 Mar 2014 #18

DLCers don't realize that just as the GOP is counting on their base of those who remember Jim Crow yurbud Mar 2014 #40

My Republican family members that I love can't get me to vote Republican. Autumn Mar 2014 #19

There is no shortage of people on the right to bash. GiveMeMorePIE Mar 2014 #20

You have a point treestar Mar 2014 #33

Yes I do, because a non-voting Democrat is basically giving half a vote to a Republican tarheelsunc Mar 2014 #21

No. But they might vote for Ralph Nader 2.0 so they can feel special. Nye Bevan Mar 2014 #26

While I'm disappointed in Obama for several reasons; deafskeptic Mar 2014 #27

No, but voting other 3rd party or not voting is half as bad. aikoaiko Mar 2014 #29

That's a blanket statement not applicable Le Taz Hot Mar 2014 #43

In terms of electoral votes you are correct which is most important. aikoaiko Mar 2014 #48

I voted for Obama but I didn't want more of DLC's "me too" neoliberal policies yurbud Mar 2014 #35

I would agree, up to a point... elzenmahn Mar 2014 #37

The self-described "moderates" have already proven that they are the ones who will sit it out. Marr Mar 2014 #38

You seem to be looking for a serious answer? So ok. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #41

Good post. Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #56

Yup. This pretty much covers it. DanTex Mar 2014 #61

What a great post . . . brush Mar 2014 #63

Perfect. SunSeeker Mar 2014 #79

+Infinity (nt) jeff47 Mar 2014 #121

Lol. Wow. Union Scribe Mar 2014 #137

Note quite a doomsday cult ... JoePhilly Mar 2014 #155

I swear some people must be watching too much apocalyptic nonsense. grasswire Mar 2014 #186

I didn't see to much of it during the last presidential election Bodhi BloodWave Mar 2014 #203

I laughed too Skittles Mar 2014 #173

It's like some sort of loopy Rapture nonsense. WorseBeforeBetter Mar 2014 #235

This message was self-deleted by its author Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #183

any low Dem turnout will be solely the fault of Dem leaders, they need to encourage Dem.. politicman Mar 2014 #209

The blame will rest on all of us. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #210

I doubt the bashing is bringing in votes for the DNC members, why can't the effort used towards Thinkingabout Mar 2014 #42

The DNC is their own worst enemy. Le Taz Hot Mar 2014 #44

if they used Dean's 50 state strategy Bodhi BloodWave Mar 2014 #204

Just for the record, Le Taz Hot Mar 2014 #46

Let's say a friend asks you about the Democrats. jeff47 Mar 2014 #124

Interesting that you would assume Le Taz Hot Mar 2014 #147

The question need not be literal. jeff47 Mar 2014 #227

Bashing Obama on DU will not get people to vote GOP or stay home, but stuff like this could Autumn Mar 2014 #47

If the main message people here is "the Democrats suck" ... Dems will stay home. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #67

If the message from the Democratic leadership and elected Democrats Autumn Mar 2014 #75

Except that's not their message ... that's YOUR interpretation of it. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #78

Yes that is my interpretation of it. Autumn Mar 2014 #80

Make sure to use it during your GOTV efforts. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #83

How silly is that. Autumn Mar 2014 #88

That is because that's what we are told here AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #150

If anything critical of the Presiden't policies is being halted or silenced in any way ... JoePhilly Mar 2014 #163

That has nothing to do with the... AgingAmerican Mar 2014 #195

Not everyone will vote, not unless its mandatory demwing Mar 2014 #50

That's something a RW racist would post. DRoseDARs Mar 2014 #52

Not really Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #60

There is no way on God's Green Earth you missed that lightning rod thread. DRoseDARs Mar 2014 #76

There are several that qualify Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #105

Some might say home. iandhr Mar 2014 #54

This attitude is EXACTLY what gave the state legislatures Gman Mar 2014 #62

Meanwhile, on the West Coast, 2010 saw great turn out and massive Democratic victories. Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #73

Because it's the west coast Gman Mar 2014 #85

Thanks for the civil response. I suggest actually looking at why it is different here. Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #98

as was said upthread... grasswire Mar 2014 #188

I am from Minnesota. Puglover Mar 2014 #205

Yes, any state that would elect Al Franken Gman Mar 2014 #206

My family is down in Iowa. Puglover Mar 2014 #207

North Carolina Democrats outvoted Republicans in straight-party voting... WorseBeforeBetter Mar 2014 #224

OK fine. $20 donated. Gman Mar 2014 #229

Awesome. WorseBeforeBetter Mar 2014 #234

I'm in Texas Gman Mar 2014 #236

I'll do what I can for Ms. Davis. WorseBeforeBetter Mar 2014 #238

I often donate to other out if state candidates Gman Mar 2014 #237

NO! However, chuckstevens Mar 2014 #64

I would never vote for a r, never. DiverDave Mar 2014 #68

I'd say that almost 100% of DU are harshly critical of Democrats on DU. Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #70

I work in a professional office where about half the people vote on a regular basis. FSogol Mar 2014 #72

No, but some here have stated that if the nominee in 2016 doesn't meet their purity standards, Beacool Mar 2014 #82

Sitting out because you are huffy you didn't get what you wanted, is like voting for the GOP. Whisp Mar 2014 #86

We don't ask whether the ten-year-old playing with matches... gulliver Mar 2014 #89

I Don't Mind Criticism mrchips Mar 2014 #94

Of course they don't, but they DO need to paint an impression NorthCarolina Mar 2014 #99

They might as well. They are subverting our GOTV efforts. jazzimov Mar 2014 #103

Wow Phlem Mar 2014 #109

Depends if that liberal wants anything done. jeff47 Mar 2014 #126

Hmm. Phlem Mar 2014 #143

Really? It's not that hard. jeff47 Mar 2014 #225

I understand the reasoning and the math but Phlem Mar 2014 #248

The proud hatred of the President from some Progressive dog Mar 2014 #107

God Phlem Mar 2014 #119

Yes, proud hatred, people who claim Progressive dog Mar 2014 #128

No. I don't. Laelth Mar 2014 #108

huh..... check out #103 Phlem Mar 2014 #112

Post #103 is wild speculation ... Laelth Mar 2014 #113

Agreed. Phlem Mar 2014 #117

Here's how it damages turnout. jeff47 Mar 2014 #127

That's a pretty generalized situation/response. Phlem Mar 2014 #146

If anyone asks me what I think of Democrats, this is what I do: grasswire Mar 2014 #189

There are Libertarian talking points on DU from time to time�points not in the Democratic Party... Tikki Mar 2014 #111

No, but they will depress turnout. jeff47 Mar 2014 #118

No, BUT, if they stay home and not vote. . . DinahMoeHum Mar 2014 #129

I think some 'DUers' are projecting what they most want. Rex Mar 2014 #132

No. Perhaps third party or not vote. JNelson6563 Mar 2014 #133

It has nothing to do with being able to be classy and sober about it. NYC_SKP Mar 2014 #134

I've been trying to recall how many times this question has been asked on DU over the years. Solly Mack Mar 2014 #138

Your post is 100% correct. It happens a lot. But people forget. n-t Logical Mar 2014 #166

They'll vote for Greens, or Socialist Workers, or Justice... SidDithers Mar 2014 #151

which is the same as voting GOP. nt BainsBane Mar 2014 #157

No, it's the same as not voting pintobean Mar 2014 #168

+1 pintobean Mar 2014 #169

Nailed it, Sid Number23 Mar 2014 #177

You've got it... blahdeblahblahblah Mar 2014 #193

You give them too much credit. joshcryer Mar 2014 #201

The fear is they don't show up LynnTTT Mar 2014 #153

Some will BainsBane Mar 2014 #156

probably not vote GOP, but it seems for some to is a mission to make as many other DUers as pissed dionysus Mar 2014 #158

Do I think they'll vote for the GOP? Yes, either directly or INDIRECTLY by voting for Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #165

Joined the Green party when Clinton was President noiretextatique Mar 2014 #170

no, unless they are real repuke trolls Skittles Mar 2014 #171

Some will vote for 3rd party candidates, allowing the Rethugs to divide and conquer. pnwmom Mar 2014 #187

yep, the ole bit nose to spite face flamingdem Mar 2014 #216

I suspect many of the Third Way types will vote republican if a progressive Zorra Mar 2014 #192

Many DUers will not vote for Clinton. joshcryer Mar 2014 #200

That would require logic and not knee-jerk responses from the "You're anti-Obama" brigade... truebrit71 Mar 2014 #208

You can criticize all you want Andy823 Mar 2014 #239

It's the same way I have to explain it to my "fiscally conservative, socially liberal" friends... Hippo_Tron Mar 2014 #212

Yes, I think some (not all) will vote Repub. n/t Tuesday Afternoon Mar 2014 #213

Oh, you Better Believe It. nt Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #215

Some trolls aren't "short lived"....You'd better believe it, too! nt MADem Mar 2014 #226

On DU? No MO_Moderate Mar 2014 #249