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TheBlackAdder

(29,981 posts)
34. A few retorts:
Sun Apr 6, 2014, 11:22 PM
Apr 2014

1) Each school system is different. Where you might teach a rewrite of "Twelfth Night," it might not be to the level I am actually referring to. In any event, the skills that I discussed with other students were skills that they and I are all lacking in, as intakes from various school districts and states. So, your state and school district might be pioneering on this one aspect, especially if it's at the AP levels my kids take and have taken, but standard track Academic Level and some Honors level high school programs, from multiple states, does not teach this. Many of the students taking English did not concentrate on it in high school. The point is, we're in college now and those skills are needed, especially when most every student I've conversed with state that they desire this training.

2) The Critical Methods courses in college teach the various literary devices and stylistic techniques. The analysis is expected at that level, not just summary input.

3) NJ State universities are relatively consistent in their approaches, possibly following some State D.o.E. edict.

4) As stated earlier, Critical Methods is an important concept and trait that is also needed with elective courses. Once critical analysis is mastered, there is no need to force 6-7 critical analysis papers each month with zero creative submissions. If one's goal is to work for a business or be a technical writer or op-ed, then critical analysis and news copy training is required and should be reinforced, but the regular English student wants to develop creative abilities. Unfortunately, you confuse the concept of critical analysis with the ability to think for oneself. In order for a person to think for oneself, they should not be confined to a rigid format that is expressly utilized by academia for peer-reviewed papers. Writing a five page critical analysis paper takes roughly one to two hours because it's the same thought processes and methods. Creating a unique conceptual work that is solid can take many days. Critical analysis forces a narrow skill set onto the student and it gradually affects their ability to creatively write--especially when they aren't taught creative writing skills or allowed to develop them. As someone mentioned above, it's probably easier for a professor to grade the same set of papers than to receive varying forms and structures that may or may not appeal to the professor, since personal taste would then enter into the grading equation.

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Proud holder of an English degree here... GreenEyedLefty Apr 2014 #1
+1000 Tom Ripley Apr 2014 #16
Yes, "corporatizing" does seem to be a factor. nt TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #28
+1... Blue_Tires Apr 2014 #37
"What are you going to do with that?" deutsey Apr 2014 #43
Bravo!!!! Well said!!! BIG K&R!! riderinthestorm Apr 2014 #2
That's a function of the AP curriculum, though. knitter4democracy Apr 2014 #32
That same mindset permeates the N.J. Collegiate English Departments. TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #35
I disagree. knitter4democracy Apr 2014 #42
R#1 & K for, I are an English (lit) major, & when *was* it not a poor choice for the marketplace?!1 UTUSN Apr 2014 #3
If you want a useful resource for grammar and usage, you could visit tblue37 Apr 2014 #7
Thanks. I "get" lie/lay and those basics. I wanted (back then) to be grammatically worthy of UTUSN Apr 2014 #10
I have a Masters in English. MineralMan Apr 2014 #4
Actual writing of poetry and plays would be in the Fine Arts FarCenter Apr 2014 #5
True. MineralMan Apr 2014 #6
Real and useful writing can be taught directly, without an English Departments many detours FarCenter Apr 2014 #8
During my graduate studies, MineralMan Apr 2014 #15
IIRC, the only time freshmen saw an English professor was a once a week lecture in the auditorium FarCenter Apr 2014 #29
With the exception of playwriting and music, most BFA & MFA limit Creative Writing skills. TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #11
I'm of the opinion that writers and other artists don't have LuvNewcastle Apr 2014 #9
College provides an environment where artists/writers can interact with one another KittyWampus Apr 2014 #20
Got my degree in literature. Igel Apr 2014 #12
One of my goals, as a continuing education student, is to obtain your skill level or higher. TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #18
You make some good points rjsquirrel Apr 2014 #13
Thanks. TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #17
What misspellings do you find? uppityperson Apr 2014 #19
Great post TransitJohn Apr 2014 #14
Thanks John. TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #22
Great post! I'm not an English major and I think it shows. :) However... Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #21
Most University English Departments MineralMan Apr 2014 #23
Yes, I read the OP and that's what it said, but that's why I asked the why of it. Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #24
The publication they require is academic publication. MineralMan Apr 2014 #25
Bingo! I couldn't have written it better. nt TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #27
As an English novice, a continuing ed student, I'll give it a shot... TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #26
Thank you. Very interesting explanation of how English departments tend to go nowadays Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #30
What an excellent post. idendoit Apr 2014 #31
A few thoughts from this high school English teacher: knitter4democracy Apr 2014 #33
A few retorts: TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #34
My replies to your retorts. ;) knitter4democracy Apr 2014 #41
I was a literature major, but this is an example of why I chose a creative writing emphasis. nomorenomore08 Apr 2014 #36
Um, an English Literature degree is not the same thing as a creative writing degree. 6000eliot Apr 2014 #38
Many people who obtain English degrees are not doing so to get some crappy job. bemildred Apr 2014 #39
Media & Communication also rank in the bottom tier of paying professions. nt TheBlackAdder Apr 2014 #40
Right, but you can get a job. nt bemildred Apr 2014 #44
They're at least partly right... Orsino Apr 2014 #45
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