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In reply to the discussion: The rise of the evolutionary psychology douchebag [View all]seabeyond
(110,159 posts)64. here are a few, cause not like i havent put this out before, in the past.
Does evolutionary psychology have any problems?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024508721
Yes. Here are what I see as a few of the major problems currently faced by evolutionary psychology:
1. Evolutionary psychology is attempting to elucidate the functional organization of the brain even though researchers currently cannot, with very few exceptions, directly study complex neural circuits. This is like attempting to discover the functions of the lungs, heart, etc., without being able to conduct dissections. Although psychological evidence indisputably reveals that cognition has structure, it is less clear that it does so with sufficient resolution to provide convincing evidence of functional design. Can the current state of the art in cognitive psychology successfully cleave human nature at its joints? Maybe, maybe not. Despite these reservations, it is worth noting that virtually every research university in the world has a psychology department. Grounding psychology in an explicit framework of evolved function cannot help but improve attempts to unveil the workings of the brain. It is far easier to find something if you have some idea of what it is you are looking for.
2. The domains of cognition proposed by evolutionary psychologists are often pretty ad hoc. Traditionally, cognitive psychologists have assumed that cognitive abilities are relatively abstract: categorization, signal detection, recognition, memory, logic, inference, etc. Evolutionary psychology proposes a radically orthogonal set of 'ecologically valid' domains and reasoning abilities: predator detection, toxin avoidance, incest avoidance, mate selection, mating strategies, social exchange, and so on. These latter domains and abilities are derived largely from behavioral ecology. Although mate selection surely involves computations that are fundamentally different from predator detection, it is not so clear that the organization of the brain just happens to match the theoretical divisions of behavioral ecology. The concept of 'object' is obviously quite abstract, yet it is equally obvious that it is an essential concept for reasoning about mates, predators, kin, etc. The same goes for other 'abstract' abilities like categorization and signal detection. Ecologically valid reasoning about domains such as kinship may require cognitive abilities organized at higher levels of abstraction like 'recognition.' On the other hand, numerous experiments show that reasoning can be greatly facilitated when problems are stated in ecologically valid terms. Negating if-p-then-q statements becomes transparently easy when the content of such statements involves social exchange, for example. The theoretical integration of more abstract, informationally valid domains with less abstract, ecologically valid domains remains a central problem for evolutionary psychology.
3. Evolutionary psychology (and adaptationism in general) has devoted considerable theoretical attention to the issue of design, the first link in the causal chain leading from phenotype structure to reproductive outcome, but has lumped every other link into the category 'reproductive problem.' This failure to theorize about successive links can lead to spectacular failures of the 'design' approach. Three examples: 1) evidence of design clearly identifies bipedalism as an adaptation, but what 'problem' it solved is not at all obvious, nor does the 'evidence of design' philosophy provide much guidance (though more detailed functional analyses of bipedalism are further constraining the set of possible solutions). 2) Language shows clear evidence of design, and there are several plausible reproductive advantages to having language, so why don't many other animals have language? 3) It can be very difficult to determine whether simple traits are adaptations simply because there is insufficient evidence of design. Menopause may be an adaptation, but it has too few 'features' to say based on evidence of design alone (some 'features' of menopause, like bone loss, seem to indicate that it is not an adaptation). Very simple traits will not always yield to a 'design analysis,' simply because there isn't enough to grab onto.
*
6. Finally, even the best work in evolutionary psychology remains incomplete. Two examples: 1) evolutionary psychologists have made several predictions about mate preferences, and these predictions have been verified in a broad range of cross-cultural contexts. However, the empirical data have not been subjected to many alternative interpretations. It is possible that they can be accounted for by other theories, and it will be difficult to be fully convinced that the evolutionary interpretation is correct until it withstands challenges from competing paradigms. The record on this account, however, is quite good so far. Competing theories such as the "social role", "structural powerlessness" and "economic inequality of the sexes" hypotheses have been tested in a number of studies and have received little, if any, support. 2) The cheater detection hypothesis, on the other hand, has withstood a blizzard of competing hypotheses, but it has been confirmed in only a very limited number of cross-cultural contexts: Europe, and one Amazonian group. Adaptations must be universal, and the variation seen in even the limited cross-cultural cheater detection studies suggests that further studies are warranted.
http://www.anth.ucsb.edu/projects/human/epfaq/problems.html
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024508721
Yes. Here are what I see as a few of the major problems currently faced by evolutionary psychology:
1. Evolutionary psychology is attempting to elucidate the functional organization of the brain even though researchers currently cannot, with very few exceptions, directly study complex neural circuits. This is like attempting to discover the functions of the lungs, heart, etc., without being able to conduct dissections. Although psychological evidence indisputably reveals that cognition has structure, it is less clear that it does so with sufficient resolution to provide convincing evidence of functional design. Can the current state of the art in cognitive psychology successfully cleave human nature at its joints? Maybe, maybe not. Despite these reservations, it is worth noting that virtually every research university in the world has a psychology department. Grounding psychology in an explicit framework of evolved function cannot help but improve attempts to unveil the workings of the brain. It is far easier to find something if you have some idea of what it is you are looking for.
2. The domains of cognition proposed by evolutionary psychologists are often pretty ad hoc. Traditionally, cognitive psychologists have assumed that cognitive abilities are relatively abstract: categorization, signal detection, recognition, memory, logic, inference, etc. Evolutionary psychology proposes a radically orthogonal set of 'ecologically valid' domains and reasoning abilities: predator detection, toxin avoidance, incest avoidance, mate selection, mating strategies, social exchange, and so on. These latter domains and abilities are derived largely from behavioral ecology. Although mate selection surely involves computations that are fundamentally different from predator detection, it is not so clear that the organization of the brain just happens to match the theoretical divisions of behavioral ecology. The concept of 'object' is obviously quite abstract, yet it is equally obvious that it is an essential concept for reasoning about mates, predators, kin, etc. The same goes for other 'abstract' abilities like categorization and signal detection. Ecologically valid reasoning about domains such as kinship may require cognitive abilities organized at higher levels of abstraction like 'recognition.' On the other hand, numerous experiments show that reasoning can be greatly facilitated when problems are stated in ecologically valid terms. Negating if-p-then-q statements becomes transparently easy when the content of such statements involves social exchange, for example. The theoretical integration of more abstract, informationally valid domains with less abstract, ecologically valid domains remains a central problem for evolutionary psychology.
3. Evolutionary psychology (and adaptationism in general) has devoted considerable theoretical attention to the issue of design, the first link in the causal chain leading from phenotype structure to reproductive outcome, but has lumped every other link into the category 'reproductive problem.' This failure to theorize about successive links can lead to spectacular failures of the 'design' approach. Three examples: 1) evidence of design clearly identifies bipedalism as an adaptation, but what 'problem' it solved is not at all obvious, nor does the 'evidence of design' philosophy provide much guidance (though more detailed functional analyses of bipedalism are further constraining the set of possible solutions). 2) Language shows clear evidence of design, and there are several plausible reproductive advantages to having language, so why don't many other animals have language? 3) It can be very difficult to determine whether simple traits are adaptations simply because there is insufficient evidence of design. Menopause may be an adaptation, but it has too few 'features' to say based on evidence of design alone (some 'features' of menopause, like bone loss, seem to indicate that it is not an adaptation). Very simple traits will not always yield to a 'design analysis,' simply because there isn't enough to grab onto.
*
6. Finally, even the best work in evolutionary psychology remains incomplete. Two examples: 1) evolutionary psychologists have made several predictions about mate preferences, and these predictions have been verified in a broad range of cross-cultural contexts. However, the empirical data have not been subjected to many alternative interpretations. It is possible that they can be accounted for by other theories, and it will be difficult to be fully convinced that the evolutionary interpretation is correct until it withstands challenges from competing paradigms. The record on this account, however, is quite good so far. Competing theories such as the "social role", "structural powerlessness" and "economic inequality of the sexes" hypotheses have been tested in a number of studies and have received little, if any, support. 2) The cheater detection hypothesis, on the other hand, has withstood a blizzard of competing hypotheses, but it has been confirmed in only a very limited number of cross-cultural contexts: Europe, and one Amazonian group. Adaptations must be universal, and the variation seen in even the limited cross-cultural cheater detection studies suggests that further studies are warranted.
http://www.anth.ucsb.edu/projects/human/epfaq/problems.html
Were Prehistoric Statues Pornographic?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024508681
JI: You take issue with this interpretation. Who is responsible for spreading it, journalists or scientists?
AN: People are fascinated by prehistory, and the media wants to write stories that attract readersto use a cliché, sex sells. But when a New York Times headline reads "A Precursor to Playboy: Graphic Images in Rock," and Discover magazine asserts that man's obsession with pornography dates back to "Cro-Magnon days" based on "the famous 26,000-year-old Venus of Willendorf statuette ... GG-cup breasts and a hippopotamal butt," I think a line is crossed. To be fair, archaeologists are partially responsiblewe need to choose our words carefully.
JI: Having studied Upper Paleolithic figurines closely, what did you find?
AN: They are incredibly varied beyond the few figurines seen over and over again: the Venus of Hohle Fels, the Venus of Willendorf, and the Venus of Dolní Věstonice. Some are male, some are female; some are human, some are animals or fantastical creatures; some wear items of clothing, others do not. A recent study by my doctoral student Allison Tripp and her colleague Naomi Schmidt demonstrated that the body shapes of female figurines from around 25,000 years ago correspond to women at many different stages of life; they're a variety of shapes and sizes. All of this suggests that there are multiple interpretations.
JI: Aren't other interpretations of paleo art just as speculative as calling them pornographic?
AN: Yes, but when we interpret Paleolithic art more broadly, we talk about "hunting magic" or "religion" or "fertility magic." I don't think these interpretations have the same social ramifications as pornography. When respected journalsNature for exampleuse terms such as "Prehistoric pin-up" and "35,000-year-old sex object," and a German museum proclaims that a figurine is either an "earth mother or pin-up girl" (as if no other roles for women could have existed in prehistory), they carry weight and authority. This allows journalists and researchers, evolutionary psychologists in particular, to legitimize and naturalize contemporary western values and behaviors by tracing them back to the "mist of prehistory."
JI: Will we ever understand what ancient art really means?
AN: The French, in particular, are doing incredible work analyzing paint recipes and tracing the movement of the ancient artists as they painted. We may never have the knowledge to say, "This painting of a bison meant this," but I am confident that a detailed study of the corpus of Ice Age imagery, including the figurines, will give us a window on to the "lived life" in the Paleolithic.
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/new_scientist/2012/11/prehistoric_pornographic_art_venus_statues_and_other_cave_art_weren_t_paleolithic.html
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024508681
JI: You take issue with this interpretation. Who is responsible for spreading it, journalists or scientists?
AN: People are fascinated by prehistory, and the media wants to write stories that attract readersto use a cliché, sex sells. But when a New York Times headline reads "A Precursor to Playboy: Graphic Images in Rock," and Discover magazine asserts that man's obsession with pornography dates back to "Cro-Magnon days" based on "the famous 26,000-year-old Venus of Willendorf statuette ... GG-cup breasts and a hippopotamal butt," I think a line is crossed. To be fair, archaeologists are partially responsiblewe need to choose our words carefully.
JI: Having studied Upper Paleolithic figurines closely, what did you find?
AN: They are incredibly varied beyond the few figurines seen over and over again: the Venus of Hohle Fels, the Venus of Willendorf, and the Venus of Dolní Věstonice. Some are male, some are female; some are human, some are animals or fantastical creatures; some wear items of clothing, others do not. A recent study by my doctoral student Allison Tripp and her colleague Naomi Schmidt demonstrated that the body shapes of female figurines from around 25,000 years ago correspond to women at many different stages of life; they're a variety of shapes and sizes. All of this suggests that there are multiple interpretations.
JI: Aren't other interpretations of paleo art just as speculative as calling them pornographic?
AN: Yes, but when we interpret Paleolithic art more broadly, we talk about "hunting magic" or "religion" or "fertility magic." I don't think these interpretations have the same social ramifications as pornography. When respected journalsNature for exampleuse terms such as "Prehistoric pin-up" and "35,000-year-old sex object," and a German museum proclaims that a figurine is either an "earth mother or pin-up girl" (as if no other roles for women could have existed in prehistory), they carry weight and authority. This allows journalists and researchers, evolutionary psychologists in particular, to legitimize and naturalize contemporary western values and behaviors by tracing them back to the "mist of prehistory."
JI: Will we ever understand what ancient art really means?
AN: The French, in particular, are doing incredible work analyzing paint recipes and tracing the movement of the ancient artists as they painted. We may never have the knowledge to say, "This painting of a bison meant this," but I am confident that a detailed study of the corpus of Ice Age imagery, including the figurines, will give us a window on to the "lived life" in the Paleolithic.
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/new_scientist/2012/11/prehistoric_pornographic_art_venus_statues_and_other_cave_art_weren_t_paleolithic.html
Deepening the History of Masculinity and the Sexes
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12558815
McElvaine bases his understanding of modern American masculinity on "deep history"sociobiologist E. O. Wilson's term for the evolution of the human species. 2 Under this view, contemporary cross-cultural masculine and feminine traits are part of a universal human cognitive structure shaped by the two million years spent as Pleistocene hunter-gatherers. Evolution of psychological design is a slow process. The 10,000 years since the scattered appearance of agriculture is a very small stretch in evolutionary terms, about 1 percent of human history. Therefore, as the argument goes, it is improbable that the species evolved complex cognitive adaptations to agriculture, let alone to industrial or post-industrial society. With this periodization in place, evolutionary psychologythe vanguard of sociobiological thought and scholarship central to McElvaine's bookexamines the recurring environmental demands faced by male hunters as opposed to female gatherers, which leads to the explanation of late-twentieth-century violent hypermasculinity, for instance, as a trace of what heretofore would have been called "pre-historic" thought. 3 What this boils down to is finding gender difference in human nature, a concept McElvaine in no way shies away from. Eve's Seed speaks routinely of the human "biogram"another sociobiological termwhich includes, according to McElvaine, a "propensity" for both war and love.
In addressing his study's central question of why "the subordination of women to men is something approaching a cross-cultural universal," McElvaine argues that throughout history men have excluded and taken power from women in overcompensating for their primordial envy of female capacity to carry, bear, and nourish a child (p. 1). This "non-menstrual syndrome" or "notawoman" definition of manhood, as McElvaine calls it alternately in his penchant for label-making, stems from the psychoanalyst Karen Horney's 1926 essay "The Flight from Womanhood" and the anthropologist Ashley Montague's book The Natural Superiority of Women (1953). 4 In support of this thesis, McElvaine turns to anthropological findings of such hunter-gatherer practices of a husband simulating childbirth while his wife is in labor and tribal elders making boys perform fellatio, including the ingestion of "masculine milk," as a rite of passage. The "womb envy" concept organizes the better part of McElvaine's book, including the last chapters on twentieth-century American manhood. U.S. presidents' propensity for womanizing and war making and the whole "macho man" complex, McElvaine reasons, can be explained by deep-seated trans-historical male anxiety exaggeratedly manifest in particularly insecure individual men.
The middle chapters of Eve's Seed survey some 94 centuries of human history, stretching from 8,000 B.C.E. and the invention of agriculture through the Middle Ages. Vitally important to early economic and political history (bringing such changes as the creation of substantial material surplus and the rise of large states and war), agriculturewhat McElvaine describes as the first of two "megarevolutions"also sparked a massive male "backlash," as the female invention of planting crops and animal husbandry undermined the male role as hunter. Among the masculinist responses, men took over agriculture and invented war, as women became relegated to increasing the population needed for the new social order. At the same time that men started to dominate agriculture, the "conception misconception" arose: the belief that men held all procreative power, with women being considered as simply the fertile field for the male seed. In addition to developing the association of women with inert matter and nature, the conception misconception "led," McElvaine writes, "to the assumption that The Creative ForceGodmust be male" (p. 135). But within his synthesis, Christianity also exemplified feminine virtues such as love and charity, which worked against such Roman values as controlled violence and the concentrated power of the state. To be sure, just as they had done with agriculture, men came to control the Church, although McElvaine underlines the mediating feminine influences in Christianity such as the twelfth-century veneration of the Virgin Mary.
McElvaine's second megarevolution began in the sixteenth century with the acceleration of geographic and social mobility and the rise of the marketplace, developments which produced a close equation between manhood and individualism and which culminated in the nineteenth-century United States. As in the other sections of Eve's Seed, this part draws from a good amount of earlier scholarship in making a clear and provocative argument. The highly mobile, possessive individual American man depended upon what McElvaine labels "the sexual bi-polar disorder," the radical separation of the masculine sphere of business and politics from feminine domesticity (p. 240). In one of his better examples of applying biohistory, McElvaine points out that since Hobbes, solitude and self-reliance have been considered man's natural state, but individualism is inconsistent with the masculine propensity toward association and cooperation formed during the sex's long preoccupation with hunting in groups. The last six chapters of the book concentrate on the twentieth-century United States and increasingly desperate attempts to express "real manhood" amidst feminine consumerism, corporate conformity, and feminist equality. While McElvaine's brief consideration of body building, the cult of John Wayne, and Rambo movies offers nothing new, his treatment of the mid-twentieth-century white middle-class embrace of African-American hypermasculine sexuality exhibits an uncommonly deft touch in extracting historical meaning from popular culture. In one interpretive flourish he examines bluesman Muddy Water's song "I Can't Be Satisfied" (1948) and the subsequent Rolling Stones' youth culture anthem "Satisfaction" (1965) as recent commentary on male insatiability, an age-old complex of unattainable sexual satisfaction magnified by an out-of-control consumer culture.
http://home.millsaps.edu/mcelvrs/RAH_Eves_Seed_3_03.htm
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12558815
McElvaine bases his understanding of modern American masculinity on "deep history"sociobiologist E. O. Wilson's term for the evolution of the human species. 2 Under this view, contemporary cross-cultural masculine and feminine traits are part of a universal human cognitive structure shaped by the two million years spent as Pleistocene hunter-gatherers. Evolution of psychological design is a slow process. The 10,000 years since the scattered appearance of agriculture is a very small stretch in evolutionary terms, about 1 percent of human history. Therefore, as the argument goes, it is improbable that the species evolved complex cognitive adaptations to agriculture, let alone to industrial or post-industrial society. With this periodization in place, evolutionary psychologythe vanguard of sociobiological thought and scholarship central to McElvaine's bookexamines the recurring environmental demands faced by male hunters as opposed to female gatherers, which leads to the explanation of late-twentieth-century violent hypermasculinity, for instance, as a trace of what heretofore would have been called "pre-historic" thought. 3 What this boils down to is finding gender difference in human nature, a concept McElvaine in no way shies away from. Eve's Seed speaks routinely of the human "biogram"another sociobiological termwhich includes, according to McElvaine, a "propensity" for both war and love.
In addressing his study's central question of why "the subordination of women to men is something approaching a cross-cultural universal," McElvaine argues that throughout history men have excluded and taken power from women in overcompensating for their primordial envy of female capacity to carry, bear, and nourish a child (p. 1). This "non-menstrual syndrome" or "notawoman" definition of manhood, as McElvaine calls it alternately in his penchant for label-making, stems from the psychoanalyst Karen Horney's 1926 essay "The Flight from Womanhood" and the anthropologist Ashley Montague's book The Natural Superiority of Women (1953). 4 In support of this thesis, McElvaine turns to anthropological findings of such hunter-gatherer practices of a husband simulating childbirth while his wife is in labor and tribal elders making boys perform fellatio, including the ingestion of "masculine milk," as a rite of passage. The "womb envy" concept organizes the better part of McElvaine's book, including the last chapters on twentieth-century American manhood. U.S. presidents' propensity for womanizing and war making and the whole "macho man" complex, McElvaine reasons, can be explained by deep-seated trans-historical male anxiety exaggeratedly manifest in particularly insecure individual men.
The middle chapters of Eve's Seed survey some 94 centuries of human history, stretching from 8,000 B.C.E. and the invention of agriculture through the Middle Ages. Vitally important to early economic and political history (bringing such changes as the creation of substantial material surplus and the rise of large states and war), agriculturewhat McElvaine describes as the first of two "megarevolutions"also sparked a massive male "backlash," as the female invention of planting crops and animal husbandry undermined the male role as hunter. Among the masculinist responses, men took over agriculture and invented war, as women became relegated to increasing the population needed for the new social order. At the same time that men started to dominate agriculture, the "conception misconception" arose: the belief that men held all procreative power, with women being considered as simply the fertile field for the male seed. In addition to developing the association of women with inert matter and nature, the conception misconception "led," McElvaine writes, "to the assumption that The Creative ForceGodmust be male" (p. 135). But within his synthesis, Christianity also exemplified feminine virtues such as love and charity, which worked against such Roman values as controlled violence and the concentrated power of the state. To be sure, just as they had done with agriculture, men came to control the Church, although McElvaine underlines the mediating feminine influences in Christianity such as the twelfth-century veneration of the Virgin Mary.
McElvaine's second megarevolution began in the sixteenth century with the acceleration of geographic and social mobility and the rise of the marketplace, developments which produced a close equation between manhood and individualism and which culminated in the nineteenth-century United States. As in the other sections of Eve's Seed, this part draws from a good amount of earlier scholarship in making a clear and provocative argument. The highly mobile, possessive individual American man depended upon what McElvaine labels "the sexual bi-polar disorder," the radical separation of the masculine sphere of business and politics from feminine domesticity (p. 240). In one of his better examples of applying biohistory, McElvaine points out that since Hobbes, solitude and self-reliance have been considered man's natural state, but individualism is inconsistent with the masculine propensity toward association and cooperation formed during the sex's long preoccupation with hunting in groups. The last six chapters of the book concentrate on the twentieth-century United States and increasingly desperate attempts to express "real manhood" amidst feminine consumerism, corporate conformity, and feminist equality. While McElvaine's brief consideration of body building, the cult of John Wayne, and Rambo movies offers nothing new, his treatment of the mid-twentieth-century white middle-class embrace of African-American hypermasculine sexuality exhibits an uncommonly deft touch in extracting historical meaning from popular culture. In one interpretive flourish he examines bluesman Muddy Water's song "I Can't Be Satisfied" (1948) and the subsequent Rolling Stones' youth culture anthem "Satisfaction" (1965) as recent commentary on male insatiability, an age-old complex of unattainable sexual satisfaction magnified by an out-of-control consumer culture.
http://home.millsaps.edu/mcelvrs/RAH_Eves_Seed_3_03.htm
Does Manosphere Blogger Vox Day Really Support the Murder and Mutilation of Women?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12556077
Vox starts out by arguing that depriving women of education makes solid evolutionary sense:
Educating women is strongly correlated with reducing their disposition and ability to reproduce themselves. Educating them tends to make them evolutionary dead ends. 40% of German women with college degrees are childless. Does PZ seriously wish to claim that not reproducing is intrinsically beneficial to women?
Instead of being educated, Vox goes on to argue, girls should be married off young so they can start popping out babies:
R]aising girls with the expectation that their purpose in life is to bear children allows them to pursue marriage at the age of their peak fertility, increase the wage rates of their prospective marital partners, and live in stable, low-crime, homogenous societies that are not demographically dying. It also grants them privileged status, as they alone are able to ensure the continued survival of the society and the species alike. Women are not needed in any profession or occupation except that of child-bearer and child-rearer, and even in the case of the latter, they are only superior, they are not absolutely required.
Next, he defends the practice of throwing acid in the face of independent women:
emale independence is strongly correlated with a whole host of social ills. Using the utilitarian metric favored by most atheists, a few acid-burned faces is a small price to pay for lasting marriages, stable families, legitimate children, low levels of debt, strong currencies, affordable housing, homogenous populations, low levels of crime, and demographic stability. If PZ has turned against utilitarianism or the concept of the collective welfare trumping the interests of the individual, I should be fascinated to hear it.
He offers a similar rationale for female genital mutilation, before launching into this bizarre racist attack on abortion rights:
F]ar more women are aborted than die as a result of their pregnancies going awry. The very idea that letting a few women die is worse than killing literally millions of unborn women shows that PZ not only isnt thinking like a scientist, hes quite clearly not thinking rationally at all. If PZ is going to be intellectually consistent here, then he should be quite willing to support the abortion of all black fetuses, since blacks disproportionately commit murder and 17x more people could be saved by aborting black fetuses than permitting the use of abortion to save the life of a mother. 466 American women die in pregnancy every year whereas 8,012 people died at the hands of black murderers in 2010.
http://manboobz.com/2012/06/06/does-manosphere-blogger-vox-day-really-support-the-murder-and-mutilation-of-women/#comments
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12556077
Vox starts out by arguing that depriving women of education makes solid evolutionary sense:
Educating women is strongly correlated with reducing their disposition and ability to reproduce themselves. Educating them tends to make them evolutionary dead ends. 40% of German women with college degrees are childless. Does PZ seriously wish to claim that not reproducing is intrinsically beneficial to women?
Instead of being educated, Vox goes on to argue, girls should be married off young so they can start popping out babies:
R]aising girls with the expectation that their purpose in life is to bear children allows them to pursue marriage at the age of their peak fertility, increase the wage rates of their prospective marital partners, and live in stable, low-crime, homogenous societies that are not demographically dying. It also grants them privileged status, as they alone are able to ensure the continued survival of the society and the species alike. Women are not needed in any profession or occupation except that of child-bearer and child-rearer, and even in the case of the latter, they are only superior, they are not absolutely required.
Next, he defends the practice of throwing acid in the face of independent women:
emale independence is strongly correlated with a whole host of social ills. Using the utilitarian metric favored by most atheists, a few acid-burned faces is a small price to pay for lasting marriages, stable families, legitimate children, low levels of debt, strong currencies, affordable housing, homogenous populations, low levels of crime, and demographic stability. If PZ has turned against utilitarianism or the concept of the collective welfare trumping the interests of the individual, I should be fascinated to hear it.
He offers a similar rationale for female genital mutilation, before launching into this bizarre racist attack on abortion rights:
F]ar more women are aborted than die as a result of their pregnancies going awry. The very idea that letting a few women die is worse than killing literally millions of unborn women shows that PZ not only isnt thinking like a scientist, hes quite clearly not thinking rationally at all. If PZ is going to be intellectually consistent here, then he should be quite willing to support the abortion of all black fetuses, since blacks disproportionately commit murder and 17x more people could be saved by aborting black fetuses than permitting the use of abortion to save the life of a mother. 466 American women die in pregnancy every year whereas 8,012 people died at the hands of black murderers in 2010.
http://manboobz.com/2012/06/06/does-manosphere-blogger-vox-day-really-support-the-murder-and-mutilation-of-women/#comments
Delusions of Gender: How Our Minds, Society, and Neurosexism Create Difference by Cordelia Fine:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/125531
A brilliantly researched and wickedly funny rebuttal of the pseudo-scientific claim that men are from Mars and women are from Venus.
Its the twenty-first century, and although we tried to rear unisex childrenboys who play with dolls and girls who like truckswe failed. Even though the glass ceiling is cracked, most women stay comfortably beneath it. And everywhere we hear about vitally important hardwired differences between male and female brains. The neuroscience that we read about in magazines, newspaper articles, books, and sometimes even scientific journals increasingly tells a tale of two brains, and the result is more often than not a validation of the status quo. Women, it seems, are just too intuitive for math; men too focused for housework.
Drawing on the latest research in neuroscience and psychology, Cordelia Fine debunks the myth of hardwired differences between mens and womens brains, unraveling the evidence behind such claims as mens brains arent wired for empathy and womens brains arent made to fix cars. She then goes one step further, offering a very different explanation of the dissimilarities between mens and womens behavior. Instead of a male brain and a female brain, Fine gives us a glimpse of plastic, mutable minds that are continuously influenced by cultural assumptions about gender.
Passionately argued and unfailingly astute, Delusions of Gender provides us with a much-needed corrective to the belief that mens and womens brains are intrinsically differenta belief that, as Fine shows with insight and humor, all too often works to the detriment of ourselves and our society.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/125531
A brilliantly researched and wickedly funny rebuttal of the pseudo-scientific claim that men are from Mars and women are from Venus.
Its the twenty-first century, and although we tried to rear unisex childrenboys who play with dolls and girls who like truckswe failed. Even though the glass ceiling is cracked, most women stay comfortably beneath it. And everywhere we hear about vitally important hardwired differences between male and female brains. The neuroscience that we read about in magazines, newspaper articles, books, and sometimes even scientific journals increasingly tells a tale of two brains, and the result is more often than not a validation of the status quo. Women, it seems, are just too intuitive for math; men too focused for housework.
Drawing on the latest research in neuroscience and psychology, Cordelia Fine debunks the myth of hardwired differences between mens and womens brains, unraveling the evidence behind such claims as mens brains arent wired for empathy and womens brains arent made to fix cars. She then goes one step further, offering a very different explanation of the dissimilarities between mens and womens behavior. Instead of a male brain and a female brain, Fine gives us a glimpse of plastic, mutable minds that are continuously influenced by cultural assumptions about gender.
Passionately argued and unfailingly astute, Delusions of Gender provides us with a much-needed corrective to the belief that mens and womens brains are intrinsically differenta belief that, as Fine shows with insight and humor, all too often works to the detriment of ourselves and our society.
Why Are Men So Violent?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12551994
It will not have gone unnoticed that men are more violent than women. Men perpetrate about 90 percent of the world's homicides and start all of the wars. But why? A recent article in a prominent science journal contends that evolution has shaped men to be warriors. More specifically, the authors claim that men are biologically programmed to form coalitions that aggress against neighbors, and they do so in order to get women, either through force or by procuring resources that would make them more desirable. The male warrior hypothesis is alluring because it makes sense of male violence, but it is based on a dubious interpretation of the science. In my new book, I point out that such evolutionary explanations of behavior are often worse than competing historical explanations. The same is true in this case. There are simpler historical explanations of male violence, and understanding these is important for coping with the problem.
A historical explanation of male violence does not eschew biological factors, but it minimizes them and assumes that men and woman are psychologically similar. Consider the biological fact that men have more upper-body strength than women, and assume that both men and women want to obtain as many desirable resources as they can. In hunter-gatherer societies, this strength differential doesn't allow men to fully dominate women, because they depend on the food that women gather. But things change with the advent of intensive agriculture and herding. Strength gives men an advantage over women once heavy ploughs and large animals become central aspects of food production. With this, men become the sole providers, and women start to depend on men economically. The economic dependency allows men to mistreat women, to philander, and to take over labor markets and political institutions. Once men have absolute power, they are reluctant to give it up. It took two world wars and a post-industrial economy for women to obtain basic opportunities and rights. This historical story can help to explain why men are more violent than women. The men who hold power will fight to keep it, and men who find themselves without economic resources feel entitled to acquire things by force if they see no other way. With these assumptions, we can dispense with the male warrior hypothesis, which is advanced by Melissa McDonald, Carlos Navarrete, and Mark Van Vugt, in the latest issue of Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society. These three psychologists imply that male violence is natural and inevitable, but all the evidence they offer can be explained by the simpler assumption that farming technologies allowed men co-opt power over the course of human history.
*
The male warrior hypothesis makes many predictions that don't pan out. There is no evidence that men prefer foreign women--the Western ideal is Barbie--and women often like effeminate men: David Bowie would not be sexier with an enormous beard. On the male warrior hypothesis, women should fear foreigners as much as men do, because foreign men are hardwired to attack them, but women are actually more sympathetic to foreigners. This may stem from their firsthand knowledge of discrimination. Women are also more cooperative than men, which makes little sense if men are innate coalition builders. There are dubious presuppositions as well. The warrior hypothesis assumes there was constant warfare in our evolutionary past, but some anthropologists argue that ancestral populations were too sparse for frequent contact. It also presupposes that warfare increases male fertility, when it may actually reduce fertility for all. Fertility is probably maximized when men are non-violent and share in childcare, but in many societies men beat their wives, neglect their children, and practice sex-selective infanticide against girls. The authors perpetuate the myth that evolution prefers men to be polygamous and females to be monogamous, but we see every variation in other species. In chimpanzees, both sexes seek multiple partners.
*
Violence is a complex problem, which no simple biological approach can diagnose or remedy. Factors such as political instability, population density, and income inequality are associated with massive differences in violence across cultures, and these differences are observed while gender ratios remain constant. Of course, men still hold most of the power in the world, and it is no surprise, then, that they perpetrate most of the violence. But that too is a historical fact, not a biological given. If we focus on biology instead of economic and historical variables, we will miss out on opportunities for progress.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/experiments-in-philosophy/201202/why-are-men-so-violent
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12551994
It will not have gone unnoticed that men are more violent than women. Men perpetrate about 90 percent of the world's homicides and start all of the wars. But why? A recent article in a prominent science journal contends that evolution has shaped men to be warriors. More specifically, the authors claim that men are biologically programmed to form coalitions that aggress against neighbors, and they do so in order to get women, either through force or by procuring resources that would make them more desirable. The male warrior hypothesis is alluring because it makes sense of male violence, but it is based on a dubious interpretation of the science. In my new book, I point out that such evolutionary explanations of behavior are often worse than competing historical explanations. The same is true in this case. There are simpler historical explanations of male violence, and understanding these is important for coping with the problem.
A historical explanation of male violence does not eschew biological factors, but it minimizes them and assumes that men and woman are psychologically similar. Consider the biological fact that men have more upper-body strength than women, and assume that both men and women want to obtain as many desirable resources as they can. In hunter-gatherer societies, this strength differential doesn't allow men to fully dominate women, because they depend on the food that women gather. But things change with the advent of intensive agriculture and herding. Strength gives men an advantage over women once heavy ploughs and large animals become central aspects of food production. With this, men become the sole providers, and women start to depend on men economically. The economic dependency allows men to mistreat women, to philander, and to take over labor markets and political institutions. Once men have absolute power, they are reluctant to give it up. It took two world wars and a post-industrial economy for women to obtain basic opportunities and rights. This historical story can help to explain why men are more violent than women. The men who hold power will fight to keep it, and men who find themselves without economic resources feel entitled to acquire things by force if they see no other way. With these assumptions, we can dispense with the male warrior hypothesis, which is advanced by Melissa McDonald, Carlos Navarrete, and Mark Van Vugt, in the latest issue of Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society. These three psychologists imply that male violence is natural and inevitable, but all the evidence they offer can be explained by the simpler assumption that farming technologies allowed men co-opt power over the course of human history.
*
The male warrior hypothesis makes many predictions that don't pan out. There is no evidence that men prefer foreign women--the Western ideal is Barbie--and women often like effeminate men: David Bowie would not be sexier with an enormous beard. On the male warrior hypothesis, women should fear foreigners as much as men do, because foreign men are hardwired to attack them, but women are actually more sympathetic to foreigners. This may stem from their firsthand knowledge of discrimination. Women are also more cooperative than men, which makes little sense if men are innate coalition builders. There are dubious presuppositions as well. The warrior hypothesis assumes there was constant warfare in our evolutionary past, but some anthropologists argue that ancestral populations were too sparse for frequent contact. It also presupposes that warfare increases male fertility, when it may actually reduce fertility for all. Fertility is probably maximized when men are non-violent and share in childcare, but in many societies men beat their wives, neglect their children, and practice sex-selective infanticide against girls. The authors perpetuate the myth that evolution prefers men to be polygamous and females to be monogamous, but we see every variation in other species. In chimpanzees, both sexes seek multiple partners.
*
Violence is a complex problem, which no simple biological approach can diagnose or remedy. Factors such as political instability, population density, and income inequality are associated with massive differences in violence across cultures, and these differences are observed while gender ratios remain constant. Of course, men still hold most of the power in the world, and it is no surprise, then, that they perpetrate most of the violence. But that too is a historical fact, not a biological given. If we focus on biology instead of economic and historical variables, we will miss out on opportunities for progress.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/experiments-in-philosophy/201202/why-are-men-so-violent
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fantastic angle. thank you for posting. i had not thought of it from that angle.
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#8
I read a theory that leopards helped us evolve, because they killed and we stole.
mainer
Apr 2014
#18
"they killed and we stole.""biologist called...equivalent of fast food". i interpret
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#19
Actually due to our ability to sweat, humans are better than most animals at running...
Humanist_Activist
Apr 2014
#83
hey, if i can convince my father, 76 and never voted dem, to vote obama and my husband,
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#9
and then there is all that. actual facts of the past. and what we can or cannot know. nt
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#11
Well crap, murder and violence in general is part of human evolution. But so are social contracts.
yellowcanine
Apr 2014
#6
it takes our social and gender roles now and tries to extrapolate them backwards
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#15
i know. i swear i can find it in the kid bible with dinos playing around as a pet. nt
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#16
it is not science. and per all the info in the OP i am not discounting cause i do not like
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#23
...you're using the fact that one evolutionary psychologist may have done something bad to attack
Donald Ian Rankin
Apr 2014
#24
google. educate yourself. i did not provide the vast documentaion provided on google that
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#29
this is not a fun game for me. and i have stuff to do. so... believe. i do not care. info is
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#32
I did some research on it. it isn't without controversy but it is a real field of science
arely staircase
Apr 2014
#84
and the rest of the scientific community reject them, because of the inadaquacies they take
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#89
you are wrong. but, you are just starting to read up on it. you can catch up at will
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#102
from my OP. i am aware it is in our universities, criminal system, govt, judical system.
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#112
My op already states it is in the universities. Hence, I know universities pay. Nt
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#122
Don't you get it? Facts be damned, she knows what's up and there's no changing her mind.
cleanhippie
Apr 2014
#115
well. firstly there was more than just one "done something bad" so what does that say about your
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#28
It was one psychologust doing one thing? Sounds like you did not read what you are commenting on....
bettyellen
Apr 2014
#41
actually no. a theory can be ridiculous and discredited. not "as good as it gets", LOL.
bettyellen
Apr 2014
#40
evo psych is largely a crock of shit, unlike Hubble peering into the past.....
bettyellen
Apr 2014
#49
well, you have to believe we KNOW there was no communication or tranmission back then, and we do not
bettyellen
Apr 2014
#58
"Stasis was much more the norm in those days" is a supposition that has been frequently disproved.
bettyellen
Apr 2014
#65
other than evo psych, tell me what other science is called a new religion in the NAME of science.
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#56
too interesting. i figured you were going to show me creationism, being a science. hm...
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#66
Are you claiming that evo psych is a scientific theory or just blurring the lines between
Chathamization
Apr 2014
#153
really? i give you an OP that explains the problems. you want a more scientific approach to the
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#78
seriously? now are you asking me to get the bunk studies of evo psych and them being discredited?
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#91
what opiate? continually asking for more info is just a game? no surprise there. gotta be games.
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#154
geez guys. everyone knows what scientific theory is and knows the use of theory as a word
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#48
the actual handling is the issue. why would we embrace a falsehood as a truth, when we know it is
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#42
that is not true. what do you mean, yup. where did ANYONE state chemicals do not effect brain. ONE
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#68
studies are coming out all on its own, no. and someone challenging that is a long way
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#93
the brain stuff is not really the domain of evolutionary psychologists, its more the domain of neuro
La Lioness Priyanka
Apr 2014
#72
right, but brain chemistry is not exactly what evolutionary psychologists are trained to do. nt
La Lioness Priyanka
Apr 2014
#81
As I understand it they are studying the relationship between mental function and chemistry.
rrneck
Apr 2014
#96
evolutionary biologist, i think is what the more basic scientific approach is. this field is respect
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#82
what the hell does it matter and why should i waste my time. you have made it clear you are not
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#94
i object also, but i believe in putting in the title given. and no, it is not. nt
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#85
I think that the issue is that the field is far too young, and involved psychology...
Humanist_Activist
Apr 2014
#95
i see a handful of men really invested in evo psych. and i am not surprised by a single man that is
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#104
I hVe scientists on my side and most of the population. The other side? Anti feminists. Anti women.
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#123
post 64. i give you the info. you refuse to read. i understand it is an illusion for SOME men to
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#133
evolution occurs at the genetic level, not at the level of the individual item of behaviour.
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#110
Post 123 dude. As I say, the only ones invested in evo psych in this thread are those anti feminist
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#124
MRAs are much closer aligned with conservative Fundies- unless your ONLY concern is porn? Nice try!
bettyellen
Apr 2014
#127
do you know the difference between the theory of evo and evo psych? do you understand why the fundie
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#131
a lot fo christian coalition men support evo psych. this author actually points out
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#136
and in this thread alone, beside the men that consistently fight against women issues, everyone
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#130
just about every thread that comes up. and no... i am not gonna point out what you are well aware
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#137
"It's an appealing fallacy, though." they are here in the thread, well invested in their evo psych
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#132
How do you know cooperation was not the start and with a hierarchy and power over
seabeyond
Apr 2014
#144
Just a reminder; MRA's are considered HATE groups by the Southern Poverty Law Center
ismnotwasm
Apr 2014
#155